Us against the "other" Journey fans....

[wildone]

Let's take stock at the end of Summer 2008 shall we?

Shouldn't take very long.

hmmmmm ok 3 churches 5 high schools and wow!!!....23 county fairs!!!great job guys

[Soto All The Way]

Yeah SJ how insensitive. I'm still hurting over this. The police won't give me my hibachi back. They keep calling it "evidence"

Listen you twit. You remind me of someone who sits around trying to pattern his life after someone else (who also used to sit around and pick fights on this board) because you think it'll make you relevent or cool or popular.

Guess what?

It doesn't. It only makes you look like the shriveled-up penis head you are.

Turn over a new leaf will ya? You bore me and I'm sure others on here.

Who the fuck are you to come here and pick a fight with Chief? What a frigen estrogen driven smackoff.....Get a life Tom.

e-

[Saint John]

Yeah SJ how insensitive. I'm still hurting over this. The police won't give me my hibachi back. They keep calling it "evidence"

Listen you twit. You remind me of someone who sits around trying to pattern his life after someone else (who also used to sit around and pick fights on this board) because you think it'll make you relevent or cool or popular.

Guess what?

It doesn't. It only makes you look like the shriveled-up penis head you are.

Turn over a new leaf will ya? You bore me and I'm sure others on here.

Who the fuck are you to come here and pick a fight with Chief? What a frigen estrogen driven smackoff.....Get a life Tom.

e-

Don't always agree with everything you have to say, but I've gotta admit that I love your delivery.

[Tomulator]

Yeah SJ how insensitive. I'm still hurting over this. The police won't give me my hibachi back. They keep calling it "evidence"

Listen you twit. You remind me of someone who sits around trying to pattern his life after someone else (who also used to sit around and pick fights on this board) because you think it'll make you relevent or cool or popular.

Guess what?

It doesn't. It only makes you look like the shriveled-up penis head you are.

Turn over a new leaf will ya? You bore me and I'm sure others on here.

Who the fuck are you to come here and pick a fight with Chief? What a frigen estrogen driven smackoff.....Get a life Tom.

e-

Listen up, you weasel-fucking, cheese-dicked, chicken-hearted, anal pollup.

I don't take orders or direction from you or ANYONE else on here. You can kiss my hairy ass and lick the smegma from my glans.

Got it?

[Tomulator]

Um yeah OK. I choose to run into 900 degree fires and I'm a coward. Go with that. Do you realize how stupid that statement was. I choose to try and save lives day after day and I'm a coward.


And what utterly brave daily job do you have? Computer programmer, trash man? Oh please enlighten me with your tales of daring do.



Ever heard the term "walk a mile in my shoes"? You wouldn't make it five feet asshole.

REAL heros don't draw attention to themselves by BRAGGING.

You're nothing.

[Rhiannon]

You're nothing.

I don't know who you are or what your story is, but how about knocking it off with all this toxic insecurity?? "You're nothing"? I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were the ultimate source in deciding who is nothing and who is something. Did someone die and make you Lord of the Universe and surrounding territories? I'm going to assume that is a no. Please rethink your snide one-liners exhibiting your astute command of the English language. Comments like that showcase only the fact that you have nothing better to do than berate people you don't know. Yeah, you have had 'mean' things said to you, but no amount of dropping f-bombs could possibly be as idiotic as telling someone "You're nothing."

Thanks.

[Tomulator]

You're nothing.

I don't know who you are or what your story is, but how about knocking it off with all this toxic insecurity?? "You're nothing"? I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were the ultimate source in deciding who is nothing and who is something. Did someone die and make you Lord of the Universe and surrounding territories? I'm going to assume that is a no. Please rethink your snide one-liners exhibiting your astute command of the English language. Comments like that showcase only the fact that you have nothing better to do than berate people you don't know. Yeah, you have had 'mean' things said to you, but no amount of dropping f-bombs could possibly be as idiotic as telling someone "You're nothing."

Thanks.

Blow me.

[Rhiannon]

Blow me.

Thank you for proving my point. Brilliant, simply brilliant.

[bluejeangirl76]

Blow me.

Thank you for proving my point. Brilliant, simply brilliant.

Agreed, blue radio. You can't argue with the sheer brilliance and ultimate maturity of "blow me", can you?
And to think, I might have come in here expectinging an adult discussion.
Clearly, he has us all beat to the ground. We're not worthy, we're not worthy.

(YEAH, RIGHT!!!)

[Saint John]

Blow me.

Thank you for proving my point. Brilliant, simply brilliant.

I gotta admit, I liked his answer. Simple and to the point.

[chf34jmac]

I think for sake of what Andrew dealt with this past weekend, I'll bow out of this one.
I do believe however that Tomulator has proven without any question which one of the two of us is the true Douchenozzle with his most recent attacks.

Happy Holidays.

[SF-Dano]

I am just curious why everyone seems to think the band will be playing county fairs this time around. Maybe I am a bit disconnected from the rest of the country since I have only gone to Journey concerts in California and Nevada. Since 2001 I have seen Journey at least once on every tour. Whether they be the headliner, a supporting act, or in a "Night with Journey" (solo) settting, they have never played anywhere other than arenas or amphitheaters at the shows I have attended. And they have been either been sold out or very nearly sold out shows. I believe it has been the same, from what I have read here over the years, in the Mid-West, South, and East Coast. If I am wrong about this, please feel free to correct me, as I know some will.

The thing is, this statement that they will be only on the "Casino/County Fair" circuit has been brought up every tour since Augeri joined the band. And at least to my experience it has never happened. I know on the "Under the Radar" tour, they intentionaly went and played some fairs or casinos to get to audiences that otherwise they had not played to in a while. But still when I saw them in Reno that year, they played in and filled an Arena that many of todays younger/popular acts play in.

Lastly, if I as a fan had the chance to see Journey at a fair simply for the price of admission, I would have no problem with that. I have seen some great bands perform in fair settings - Y&T, Cheap Trick, Ted Nugent, 38special, Huey Lewis, Doobie Bros, Tesla, Night Ranger, etc.

I am just glad that I still have the opportunity, no matter the forum, to enjoy the muscians and music I love. I don't think I will have these opportunities for a whole lot longer be it fairs, arenas, or amphitheaters, so I am enjoying while I can.

[Saint John]

I am just curious why everyone seems to think the band will be playing county fairs this time around. Maybe I am a bit disconnected from the rest of the country since I have only gone to Journey concerts in California and Nevada. Since 2001 I have seen Journey at least once on every tour. Whether they be the headliner, a supporting act, or in a "Night with Journey" (solo) settting, they have never played anywhere other than arenas or amphitheaters at the shows I have attended. And they have been either been sold out or very nearly sold out shows. I believe it has been the same, from what I have read here over the years, in the Mid-West, South, and East Coast. If I am wrong about this, please feel free to correct me, as I know some will.

The thing is, this statement that they will be only on the "Casino/County Fair" circuit has been brought up every tour since Augeri joined the band. And at least to my experience it has never happened. I know on the "Under the Radar" tour, they intentionaly went and played some fairs or casinos to get to audiences that otherwise they had not played to in a while. But still when I saw them in Reno that year, they played in and filled an Arena that many of todays younger/popular acts play in.

Lastly, if I as a fan had the chance to see Journey at a fair simply for the price of admission, I would have no problem with that. I have seen some great bands perform in fair settings - Y&T, Cheap Trick, Ted Nugent, 38special, Huey Lewis, Doobie Bros, Tesla, Night Ranger, etc.

I am just glad that I still have the opportunity, no matter the forum, to enjoy the muscians and music I love. I don't think I will have these opportunities for a whole lot longer be it fairs, arenas, or amphitheaters, so I am enjoying while I can.

Great post. These statements (county fairs, etc) are simply ridiculous. With the resurgence of DSB and the fact that (to me) they will have their best vocalist since Perry, I have no doubts that this tour will be at least as successful as the previous few. Add the fact that Arnel will have a lot of Asian press following and you might have the makings of something pretty darn big. I'm really looking forward to this tour. I'll hold back judgment til they actually play, but I must say that I think the potential is pretty astounding. This dude is the real deal.

[chf34jmac]

To answer your question - If you were the manager owner of an arena, would you spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a known band with an unknown singer? I'm a betting man so my guess is no.
Last year when the stuff went down with SA, the venues were already booked so the owners had no choice but to allow Journey to continue or risk losing tons of cash. JSS at least has some mainstream following here in the states so he wasn't a complete unknown unlike Mr. Pineda who's only following is in his home country. That is the wildcard to the whole issue. Can he draw the crowds?

[mistiejourney]

I am just curious why everyone seems to think the band will be playing county fairs this time around. Maybe I am a bit disconnected from the rest of the country since I have only gone to Journey concerts in California and Nevada. Since 2001 I have seen Journey at least once on every tour. Whether they be the headliner, a supporting act, or in a "Night with Journey" (solo) settting, they have never played anywhere other than arenas or amphitheaters at the shows I have attended. And they have been either been sold out or very nearly sold out shows. I believe it has been the same, from what I have read here over the years, in the Mid-West, South, and East Coast. If I am wrong about this, please feel free to correct me, as I know some will.

The thing is, this statement that they will be only on the "Casino/County Fair" circuit has been brought up every tour since Augeri joined the band. And at least to my experience it has never happened. I know on the "Under the Radar" tour, they intentionaly went and played some fairs or casinos to get to audiences that otherwise they had not played to in a while. But still when I saw them in Reno that year, they played in and filled an Arena that many of todays younger/popular acts play in.

Lastly, if I as a fan had the chance to see Journey at a fair simply for the price of admission, I would have no problem with that. I have seen some great bands perform in fair settings - Y&T, Cheap Trick, Ted Nugent, 38special, Huey Lewis, Doobie Bros, Tesla, Night Ranger, etc.

I am just glad that I still have the opportunity, no matter the forum, to enjoy the muscians and music I love. I don't think I will have these opportunities for a whole lot longer be it fairs, arenas, or amphitheaters, so I am enjoying while I can.

Journey, when in the Bay Area, has played either the Shoreline Amphetheater or the Concord Pavillion. I saw them in Marysville (Sacramento) at an amphetheater there. There were three times that I saw them in a non-amphetheater venue: early in SA's tenure at San Jose State, once in Turlock at a county fair and once in Sacramento (again, early in SA's tenure) at some sort of "field" with one row of bleachers and seats down at stage level (still big).

Frankly, it's always fun if a "big name" plays at a fair because it's nice to catch a small venue now and then. Heck, REO sells out the mid-west, but played the San Mateo County fair on August 11th of this year. My son had the audacity to get married that day, so I missed it

[fightingilliniJRNY]

Last year when the stuff went down with SA, the venues were already booked so the owners had no choice but to allow Journey to continue or risk losing tons of cash.

Pretty sure that works the other way around. Journey had to continue and fulfill their contract with the venue, or they lost a lot of money. Enter JSS.

[fightingilliniJRNY]

I am just curious why everyone seems to think the band will be playing county fairs this time around. Maybe I am a bit disconnected from the rest of the country since I have only gone to Journey concerts in California and Nevada. Since 2001 I have seen Journey at least once on every tour. Whether they be the headliner, a supporting act, or in a "Night with Journey" (solo) settting, they have never played anywhere other than arenas or amphitheaters at the shows I have attended. And they have been either been sold out or very nearly sold out shows. I believe it has been the same, from what I have read here over the years, in the Mid-West, South, and East Coast. If I am wrong about this, please feel free to correct me, as I know some will.

The thing is, this statement that they will be only on the "Casino/County Fair" circuit has been brought up every tour since Augeri joined the band. And at least to my experience it has never happened. I know on the "Under the Radar" tour, they intentionaly went and played some fairs or casinos to get to audiences that otherwise they had not played to in a while. But still when I saw them in Reno that year, they played in and filled an Arena that many of todays younger/popular acts play in.

Lastly, if I as a fan had the chance to see Journey at a fair simply for the price of admission, I would have no problem with that. I have seen some great bands perform in fair settings - Y&T, Cheap Trick, Ted Nugent, 38special, Huey Lewis, Doobie Bros, Tesla, Night Ranger, etc.

I am just glad that I still have the opportunity, no matter the forum, to enjoy the muscians and music I love. I don't think I will have these opportunities for a whole lot longer be it fairs, arenas, or amphitheaters, so I am enjoying while I can.

Good post. I've been saying for months that it is naive to think that Journey's next show will be in front of 1,000 people and they will be competing with the Ferris Wheel for that crowd. They are going to draw. Hook up with a big act again, and they will draw big.

[chf34jmac]

Well yes that too is correct. Journey would have had to pay back the money paid out up front to them. The arena owners still stood to lose exponentially more money in lost ticket sales concessions, swag etc.

[fightingilliniJRNY]

Well yes that too is correct. Journey would have had to pay back the money paid out up front to them. The arena owners still stood to lose exponentially more money in lost ticket sales concessions, swag etc.

Right. But the venue wasn't thinking "Hmm. Do we still let Journey perform even though the switched lead singers?"

I think we're saying the same thing though.

[chf34jmac]

No but it wouldn't surprise me to find out that some of these larger venues attach a rider to the contract stating that if Journey doesn't draw "X" amount of people, they would be required to forfeit some of their advance to cover loss.

[Saint John]

To answer your question - If you were the manager owner of an arena, would you spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a known band with an unknown singer? I'm a betting man so my guess is no.
Last year when the stuff went down with SA, the venues were already booked so the owners had no choice but to allow Journey to continue or risk losing tons of cash. JSS at least has some mainstream following here in the states so he wasn't a complete unknown unlike Mr. Pineda who's only following is in his home country. That is the wildcard to the whole issue. Can he draw the crowds?

Good points, Jeff. However, Irving Azoff has as much "street cred." as anyone in the business. The mere fact that his management team backs a singer makes any venue a "go." I do agree that Journey will have to prove to fans 2 things: 1) The ticket is worth it. That is, that the double bill initially warrants one going to the concert. 2) Once at the show, Arnel will have to sing well enough to entice fans to check out the new album and make them want to come back. Whether or not he does 1, both or none of those 2 things remains to be seen.

[mistiejourney]

No but it wouldn't surprise me to find out that some of these larger venues attach a rider to the contract stating that if Journey doesn't draw "X" amount of people, they would be required to forfeit some of their advance to cover loss.

Would this still apply if they are playing with 2 or 3 other name bands? Say if Journey pulled out of the DL concert, DL still has a huge fanbase, would J still be liable?

[chf34jmac]

Yes they would. The number "X" amount of ticket sales is based on what is projected fan turnout from both bands.

[bluejeangirl76]

JSS at least has some mainstream following here in the states so he wasn't a complete unknown unlike Mr. Pineda who's only following is in his home country. That is the wildcard to the whole issue. Can he draw the crowds?

My feeling is no, absolutely not. Any crowd that would be drawn would be on the Journey name only.
No one is going to a thing like that to specifically hear Arnel. Journey knows this, that's why they have no reservations about picking up a new singer off YouTube. They know the majority of the people are just going to hear the 10 songs they like that their local classic rock staion plays all day, not to mention also going to hear whoever Journey is sharing the bill with.

If we were talking about Steve Perry and a reunion it would be a whole different issue, but we're not. We're talking about more or less the same thing Journey's been doing for years now - a Greatest Hits carousel. And that's it. Arnel isn't going to "draw" anything. People are going to go toward the name Journey and they might go "is that guy that sounds like the guy with the nose still there?" And if they're far enough back, they won't notice and it won't matter because 3/4 of the audience will be standing there going "When are they gonna play that one song... 'Small Town Girl'?"

[fightingilliniJRNY]

My feeling is no, absolutely not. Any crowd that would be drawn would be on the Journey name only.
No one is going to a thing like that to specifically hear Arnel.

Hold on. You're saying that people came to a Journey show specifically to see Steve Augeri? Specifically to see Jeff Scott Soto. Hell, specifically to see Neal Schon? Of course they're drawn to the Journey name. That's the way it's been the past 10 years. I know that there are some people who were fans of Augeri before Journey, fans of Soto before Journey and fans of Neal Schon outside of Journey who might have come just to see those people. But those people have to number less than 100 at any given Journey show.

[SF-Dano]

I am just curious why everyone seems to think the band will be playing county fairs this time around. Maybe I am a bit disconnected from the rest of the country since I have only gone to Journey concerts in California and Nevada. Since 2001 I have seen Journey at least once on every tour. Whether they be the headliner, a supporting act, or in a "Night with Journey" (solo) settting, they have never played anywhere other than arenas or amphitheaters at the shows I have attended. And they have been either been sold out or very nearly sold out shows. I believe it has been the same, from what I have read here over the years, in the Mid-West, South, and East Coast. If I am wrong about this, please feel free to correct me, as I know some will.

The thing is, this statement that they will be only on the "Casino/County Fair" circuit has been brought up every tour since Augeri joined the band. And at least to my experience it has never happened. I know on the "Under the Radar" tour, they intentionaly went and played some fairs or casinos to get to audiences that otherwise they had not played to in a while. But still when I saw them in Reno that year, they played in and filled an Arena that many of todays younger/popular acts play in.

Lastly, if I as a fan had the chance to see Journey at a fair simply for the price of admission, I would have no problem with that. I have seen some great bands perform in fair settings - Y&T, Cheap Trick, Ted Nugent, 38special, Huey Lewis, Doobie Bros, Tesla, Night Ranger, etc.

I am just glad that I still have the opportunity, no matter the forum, to enjoy the muscians and music I love. I don't think I will have these opportunities for a whole lot longer be it fairs, arenas, or amphitheaters, so I am enjoying while I can.

Journey, when in the Bay Area, has played either the Shoreline Amphetheater or the Concord Pavillion. I saw them in Marysville (Sacramento) at an amphetheater there. There were three times that I saw them in a non-amphetheater venue: early in SA's tenure at San Jose State, once in Turlock at a county fair and once in Sacramento (again, early in SA's tenure) at some sort of "field" with one row of bleachers and seats down at stage level (still big).

Frankly, it's always fun if a "big name" plays at a fair because it's nice to catch a small venue now and then. Heck, REO sells out the mid-west, but played the San Mateo County fair on August 11th of this year. My son had the audacity to get married that day, so I missed it

Sounds like we have been to a few of the same shows. I used to live in Belmont and Redwood City, now in the Sacramento area. I think The Sac field show you saw was at "Hornet Field" wich is at Sacramento State (that was pre 2001 and Arrival's release I believe). I agree, if anything the crowds at the shows have gotten larger over the years not smaller. It was just a few years ago, Journey toured solo for their 30th anniversary. Granted what went down with tapegate at this time is a damn shame and disgrace, but the fact is I saw them twice that tour play to capacity crowds in "big" amphitheaters as a solo act.

The point about Pineda being unproven is valid, but I don't think the average fan last year really new of JSS carreer credits. He was new to them. However, the fact that they toured with Leppard that year can kind of skew the numbers. I think back to when SA was brought on, I really don't think many people knew of him either. But the venues they played were decent, and they got bigger each tour.

IMO the venues are going to look at what "Journey" has done on the road the last 5 or 6 years and see that they do have a track record of bringing in the crowds. And as St.J pointed out, Azzof and Co. do have some pull too. I wish they would have done more over the years, but that is for another discussion.

[bluejeangirl76]

My feeling is no, absolutely not. Any crowd that would be drawn would be on the Journey name only. No one is going to a thing like that to specifically hear Arnel.

Hold on. You're saying that people came to a Journey show specifically to see Steve Augeri? Specifically to see Jeff Scott Soto. Hell, specifically to see Neal Schon? Of course they're drawn to the Journey name. That's the way it's been the past 10 years.

Yes I know. That was my point. No one is going to see Arnel. He isn't drawing CRAP.
The question is probably closer to 'will the crowds keep bothering after seeing this circus?'
Or will they just go... "Aahhh Jesus, what is this? At least the other guy kinda had the nose..."

[fightingilliniJRNY]

My feeling is no, absolutely not. Any crowd that would be drawn would be on the Journey name only. No one is going to a thing like that to specifically hear Arnel.

Hold on. You're saying that people came to a Journey show specifically to see Steve Augeri? Specifically to see Jeff Scott Soto. Hell, specifically to see Neal Schon? Of course they're drawn to the Journey name. That's the way it's been the past 10 years.

Yes I know. That was my point. No one is going to see Arnel. He isn't drawing CRAP.
The question is probably closer to 'will the crowds keep bothering after seeing this circus?'
Or will they just go... "Aahhh Jesus, what is this? At least the other guy kinda had the nose..."

Hardly anybody solely went to see Augeri or JSS. The number is negligable. You could say that they, themselves, "aren't drawing CRAP." That was my point.

[bluejeangirl76]

My feeling is no, absolutely not. Any crowd that would be drawn would be on the Journey name only. No one is going to a thing like that to specifically hear Arnel.

Hold on. You're saying that people came to a Journey show specifically to see Steve Augeri? Specifically to see Jeff Scott Soto. Hell, specifically to see Neal Schon? Of course they're drawn to the Journey name. That's the way it's been the past 10 years.

Yes I know. That was my point. No one is going to see Arnel. He isn't drawing CRAP.
The question is probably closer to 'will the crowds keep bothering after seeing this circus?'
Or will they just go... "Aahhh Jesus, what is this? At least the other guy kinda had the nose..."

Hardly anybody solely went to see Augeri or JSS. The number is negligable. You could say that they, themselves, "aren't drawing CRAP." That was my point.

Unless I'm missing something, you're making the same point I was. Except I'm taking about the PRESENT situation and you're bringing the past into it. Okay fine I will rephrase - NONE of the perry replacements drew audiences by themselves. There. We agree. Except now the SA and JSS fans are gonna jump on me for that and that's what I was going around the block to avoid since those days are over now anyway.

We're talking about Arnel and the future and whether Journey from this day forward will continue to get audiences.
And I'm say IF they do (which is sketchy in my opinion) is won't have jack shit to do with Arnel. The original question I was replying to was "Can [Arnel] draw the crowds?" and my answer was no.

[Playitloudforme]

My feeling is no, absolutely not. Any crowd that would be drawn would be on the Journey name only. No one is going to a thing like that to specifically hear Arnel.

Hold on. You're saying that people came to a Journey show specifically to see Steve Augeri? Specifically to see Jeff Scott Soto. Hell, specifically to see Neal Schon? Of course they're drawn to the Journey name. That's the way it's been the past 10 years.

Yes I know. That was my point. No one is going to see Arnel. He isn't drawing CRAP.
The question is probably closer to 'will the crowds keep bothering after seeing this circus?'
Or will they just go... "Aahhh Jesus, what is this? At least the other guy kinda had the nose..."

Hardly anybody solely went to see Augeri or JSS. The number is negligable. You could say that they, themselves, "aren't drawing CRAP." That was my point.

Unless I'm missing something, you're making the same point I was. Except I'm taking about the PRESENT situation and you're bringing the past into it. Okay fine I will rephrase - NONE of the perry replacements drew audiences by themselves. There. We agree. Except now the SA and JSS fans are gonna jump on me for that and that's what I was going around the block to avoid since those days are over now anyway.

We're talking about Arnel and the future and whether Journey from this day forward will continue to get audiences.
And I'm say IF they do (which is sketchy in my opinion) is won't have jack shit to do with Arnel. The original question I was replying to was "Can [Arnel] draw the crowds?" and my answer was no.

I think you are correct. The SA & JSS versions rode piggy back with other major bands to ensure full venues. Not to say that the JSS version wasn't working it's lovely way to hosting their own...

I have serious reservations that this current version will be able to hold their own without help from other bands to fill the seats.