Jail Time

[Liam]

Like I said earlier...the guy who did the initial arrest was a nice guy...and I understand he was just doing his job. BUT...the guys at the County jail were just total shitheads. It's like they got knocked down from walkin' a beat to doing paperwork all night, so they're gonna make everyone else's lives as fucked as they can. So I'm gonna stick with that word for THEM. SHITHEADS.

[Saint John]

Gonna repost this as it's pertinent to the conversation and will clear up any misconceptions.


If a 160 pound male drinks a 5% beer (This percentage reflects most Canadian beers and Budweiser. Light beers are much less.) and has THREE in one hour his BAC is .05. Here's a cool site.


http://www.ou.edu/oupd/bac.htm

[StevePerryHair]

Like I said earlier...the guy who did the initial arrest was a nice guy...and I understand he was just doing his job. BUT...the guys at the County jail were just total shitheads. It's like they got knocked down from walkin' a beat to doing paperwork all night, so they're gonna make everyone else's lives as fucked as they can. So I'm gonna stick with that word for THEM. SHITHEADS.

It's okay Liam, I will agree that some in law enforcement are shitheads and you have the right to feel that way if you were treated that way. I was just mad at such a blanket statement that does not describe the majority of those in law enforcement. It had nothing to do with you and what you are going through. I wish you the best and hope everything works out for you.

[strangegrey]

My husband is the sergeant of a traffic unit.

Oh, so your biased!
That makes you perfectly authorized to comment on this!? Give me a break!

I'm sure when it comes time for a traffic cop to give you a good ole fassioned fucking, you just pull out your get out of free jail card and say "My husband is on the job!"

RIght!?

I'll be the first person to recognize the important job that police do in the interests of public safety...And I'll throw back at you my own little self-justification on feeling entitled (just so you don't feel alone here ). I've had enough close family, neighbors and friends (all public servants not needing to enter the building, but did so to save people) die on 911 to make you depressed for 10 lifetimes....so spare me your self-righteous crap!

The fact of the matter is that "traffic cops" are most definitely the long arm of a very corrupt system. Your husband being a traffic cop seargent apparently has sucked enough ass to raise to a supervisory level....so It goes without saying that your husband has perpetuated his role in the abusive system of traffic enforcement. You've obviously been indoctrinated as to how important your husband's role is in society....but after writing enough unnecessary traffic tickets (and TRUST ME, you husband HAS), he's done society a huge disservice that FAR outweighs any good he could have done.......hope you sleep well at night knowing your livelihood is dependent on the backs of people that get fucked by the VTL....starting with the people your husband manages!

[StevePerryHair]

My husband is the sergeant of a traffic unit.

Oh, so your biased!
That makes you perfectly authorized to comment on this!? Give me a break!

I'm sure when it comes time for a traffic cop to give you a good ole fassioned fucking, you just pull out your get out of free jail card and say "My husband is on the job!"

RIght!?

I'll be the first person to recognize the important job that police do in the interests of public safety...And I'll throw back at you my own little self-justification on feeling entitled (just so you don't feel alone here ). I've had enough close family, neighbors and friends (all public servants not needing to enter the building, but did so to save people) die on 911 to make you depressed for 10 lifetimes....so spare me your self-righteous crap!

The fact of the matter is that "traffic cops" are most definitely the long arm of a very corrupt system. Your husband being a traffic cop seargent apparently has sucked enough ass to raise to a supervisory level....so It goes without saying that your husband has perpetuated his role in the abusive system of traffic enforcement. You've obviously been indoctrinated as to how important your husband's role is in society....but after writing enough unnecessary traffic tickets (and TRUST ME, you husband HAS), he's done society a huge disservice that FAR outweighs any good he could have done.......hope you sleep well at night knowing your livelihood is dependent on the backs of people that get fucked by the VTL....starting with the people your husband manages!

And you are not biased??? You obviously said you have first hand knowledge of the business, right?? So what make you such an unbiased expert here? I will tell you my husband does NOT take joy in writing tickets. MANY times he does not have the heart to. He will write warnings and he will give a much lesser "no seat belt" ticket before the big speeding ticket unless the person is completely abusive. You know nothing about him or what kind of person he is. You are making a blanket statement and including all traffic officers in it. And my husband sucked no ass to get where he is. He worked very hard and was passed up unfairly numerous times. You have your opinions, you've stated them, now move on. Stop threatening people and making a further ass of yourself.

[Liam]

Gonna repost this as it's pertinent to the conversation and will clear up any misconceptions.


If a 160 pound male drinks a 5% beer (This percentage reflects most Canadian beers and Budweiser. Light beers are much less.) and has THREE in one hour his BAC is .05. Here's a cool site.


http://www.ou.edu/oupd/bac.htm

Read the site...thanks. I guess it was unfortunate that I found a bar that actually serves Stella in this town. But...I'm rather curious to try the same breathalyzer machine right now and see what turns up. I'd probably blow about a .65 and I haven't drank anything but water since about 1:30 am (AT HOME. ).
The whole thing just pisses me off all around.

[Saint John]

Gonna repost this as it's pertinent to the conversation and will clear up any misconceptions.


If a 160 pound male drinks a 5% beer (This percentage reflects most Canadian beers and Budweiser. Light beers are much less.) and has THREE in one hour his BAC is .05. Here's a cool site.


http://www.ou.edu/oupd/bac.htm

Read the site...thanks. I guess it was unfortunate that I found a bar that actually serves Stella in this town. But...I'm rather curious to try the same breathalyzer machine right now and see what turns up. I'd probably blow about a .65 and I haven't drank anything but water since about 1:30 am (AT HOME. ).
The whole thing just pisses me off all around.

The night I got pulled over I had 14 or 15 Bud Lights and 3-5 shots over about a 5 hour period. I blew a .19.

[strangegrey]

Frank, I see you have had bad experiences but you have to know
that is like that in any professional....

First, one thing to address. Cops are not professionals. Lawyers are professionals, Doctors are professionals, Accountants are professionals. Law enforcement is not a 'profession'. It's a civil service job. A politician is not a profession....it's a civil service job.

You need to understand that there's another distinction here. There's assholes in every walk of life. If I had a quarter for every dickhead fireman that was no where near the WTC on the morning of Sept 11....but after the fact, milked the 911-sympathy train till he was blue in the face...I would be rich enough to spread the wealth to everyone on this board and no one would have to work another day in their lives.

With respect to the 'traffic cop' thing...it's not the *person* that is the problem...it's the system. Big difference. HOWEVER.....a person that perpetuates a role in a corrupt system is just as corrupt as the system itself. Don't use the sorry ass excuse that you have a wife and kids to support. Would you take a job shooting innocent people in the head if it meant you could get enough money to support your family? Probably not. Same issue here....just a tad less of a clear line.

[strangegrey]

....I will tell you my husband does NOT take joy in writing tickets.

Bwahahaha....now you're making me laugh. I'm sure he says something real cliche like "This hurts me more than it hurts you" as he's writing a simple 10-20mph speeding ticket that will result in a $100-400 fine (depending on locality) and a near cripling increase in the poor sap's insurance rates. Have you seen what a person pays for car insurance here in NYS? Some dumb ass traffic cop thinks he's protecting the public by nailing someone for a speeding ticket....when in fact that road is PERFECTLY safe for driving at that rate.....but the rate was carefully selected to net the highest amount of speeding violations. The local police benefit...they get their quotas up. They're doing their jobs right? The courts benefit, fine money is of course their one main receivable....and finally, the insurance companies have additional justification for higher premiums.

Who gets fucked here? The safe driver that happens to roll through a part of town that has an abnormally low speed limit. 100-400 dollars in fines...and 400-2000 increase in insurance premiums.

How about I stroll into your house, with the full authority of the government....and remove $2400 out of your wallets. Would it be more difficult for you to buy food for your children? pay the mortgage? pay your internet bill?

The justification for traffic laws is quite ambiguous when you take into consideration the consequences that are leveled against drivers...

I'm sure every Traffic flatfoot out there will try to use some level of 'public safety' as a justification of the work they do. In reality, they tell themselves that every day so they can sleep at night knowing full well their contributions to the corupt system actually ruin lives, not save them.

..Stop threatening people and making a further ass of yourself.

Go fuck yourself. I've issued one threat here....and that person deserved it...you weren't on the business end of that threat.

[Behshad]

Frank, I see you have had bad experiences but you have to know
that is like that in any professional....

First, one thing to address. Cops are not professionals. Lawyers are professionals, Doctors are professionals, Accountants are professionals. Law enforcement is not a 'profession'. It's a civil service job. A politician is not a profession....it's a civil service job.

You need to understand that there's another distinction here. There's assholes in every walk of life. If I had a quarter for every dickhead fireman that was no where near the WTC on the morning of Sept 11....but after the fact, milked the 911-sympathy train till he was blue in the face...I would be rich enough to spread the wealth to everyone on this board and no one would have to work another day in their lives.With respect to the 'traffic cop' thing...it's not the *person* that is the problem...it's the system. Big difference. HOWEVER.....a person that perpetuates a role in a corrupt system is just as corrupt as the system itself. Don't use the sorry ass excuse that you have a wife and kids to support. Would you take a job shooting innocent people in the head if it meant you could get enough money to support your family? Probably not. Same issue here....just a tad less of a clear line.

OK lets do a little math here then,,,, let say on that morning, there was 100.000 firemen that did what you suggest they did. this would give you $25000 . You're suggesting that all of us can quit our jobs and live on that , Frank!?

[strangegrey]

Advice to all who may find themselves in this same predicament.

Officer pulls you over, asks you to get out of your car, you get out. Officer asks "have you been drinking tonight sir?" You reply simply with "Officer, before I say or do anything I'd like to speak to my attorney."

Do not give the officer ANY evidence AT ALL. Do NOT say "yes I just had 2 beers." Do not tell him where you have been nor where you are going. The officer will not be happy and will try to intimidate you into giving up the evidence he needs to arrest you. DO NOT GIVE YOURSELF UP AT ALL, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO, YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO REMAIN SILENT, AND YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO REPRESENTATION. Again, the officer will not be happy. SUCKS TO BE HIM.

Officer asks, "sir I need you to to walk this white line, or , I need you to stand on one foot arms outstretched and try to touch your nose."

You reply, "Officer, before I say or do anything I'd like to speak to my attorney."


Do not blow into his machine, do not take a filed sobriety test. Repeat after me "Officer, before I say or do anything I'd like to speak to my attorney."

You should then request to be able to leave the scene. Car parked and you walking if need be. This should all be on the officers video camera tape for your attorney to later review. This will help remove the officers "probable cause" to arrest you. You were most likely pulled over for a minor traffic infringement and the officer is trying to turn that into something bigger, in this case a DUI.

You will be arrested of course, and that will suck, but it won't suck near as bad if you give yourself up, as the officer will have no evidence. Other than HIS word in his report. He'll write a report and say "bloodshot eyes, slurred speach, aroma of alchol ect.." Without the breathalyzer though, your attorney can serve you much better.

Let your attorney take care of the rest after a good friend or family member bails you out later that night or the next morning.

So once again. "Officer before I say or do anything I will need to speak to my attorney" and "I would like to be free to leave." This should be the extent of your conversation with the officer. Resist his questions repeatedly yet nicely. Don't be a dick or anything. Give him your license and papers, registration and insurance card. Do not answer any questions about your behavior or whereabouts. Do not do anything to furthur incriminate yourself. Your attorney will thank you and you will thank yourself later on.

If the officer asks to search your vehicle or your person the same quote applies. "Officer, before I say or do anything I'd like to speak to my attorney."

Again, the officer will not be happy and again SUCKS TO BE HIM. You have the right to remain silent and you have the right to representation. DO NOT GIVE UP YOUR RIGHTS. People have fought and died for these rights, USE THEM TO PROTECT YOURSELF. Let the professional attorneys work out the rest. You will be gald you did.


That quote can serve you well in a lot of situations with police officers. Use it when you feel threatened or intimidated by police, or perhaps when you may be guilty of something.

[b]" Officer, before I say or do anything, I'd like to speak to my attorney" and "I like to be able to leave now."

Otherwise, shut up. Clam up. PERIOD! It's nobodys business where you have been nor where you are going. Do not incriminate yourself folks, you are just making the cops job easier, thus making it harder on yourself. If the officer trys to lead you to believe he'll go easier on you if you talk to him HE IS LYING , PERIOD! Trust me please. Don't lose your rights.

Simply the best advice issued in this thread...bar none!

The fact of the matter is that when a police officer pulls you over, he's looking to get you to talk your way into more infractions. Most traffic cops have cameras/microphones in the cars now. Take your miranda rights VERY seriously...and dont give the police officer one inch to work with.

They're not there to be nice to you....they're there to screw you into of every possible VTL infraction they can drum up. Don't give them one little inch to work with.

[ieie]

What is VTL ?

[strangegrey]

OK lets do a little math here then,,,, let say on that morning, there was 100.000 firemen that did what you suggest they did. this would give you $25000 . You're suggesting that all of us can quit our jobs and live on that , Frank!?

Alright, I exagerated a LITTLE bit!
It was more the 'figure of speach' that meant to get the point across.

The fact of the matter is that there have been fireman that have crawled out from under every rock and stone post-911, looking for handouts...some are most certainly deserving...but the sad, cold hard truth is that the ones that are deserving, gave the ultimate sacrifice that morning. The point I was trying to make is that every walk of life has it's fair share of dickheads.....

But the fire-system (for lack of a better word) isn't broken/corupt as is the traffic-cop/traffic-court system

[strangegrey]

What is VTL ?

Vehicle Traffic Law. It's a book that is installed into every RMP (Radio Motor Patrolcar)....every traffic cop needs to know this in and out, so when it comes time to pull over poor ole Johnny and fuck him real hard with a stack of tickets....the cop can make sure he's checked every one to make sure he's not missing any.

When you get pulled over, you're usually waiting in the car for a good 10-20 minutes. The cop can run your license in 10 seconds. Usually, he's run it before he even pulls you over.

So all that time goes into the cop scouring the VTL....looking for other shit to tack on and screw you with. Then he writes out the tickets....and makes sure he dots all the I's....so there are no technical dismissals.

[heardonthestreet]

What did you get stopped for in the first place? They can't just stop you for nothing, can they?

[Saint John]

What did you get stopped for in the first place? They can't just stop you for nothing, can they?

Sure they can. It's usually the "you were swerving" or "went across the middle lines" bullshit. I was told my car (which was stopped at the time) was across the solid white pedestrian line. It wan't. Yes, I was bombed, but driving perfectly (per the other 3 people in the car, one of which had NOT been drinking...something I found out later when they told me I'd need a sober driver to take my car or I was facing a $500 towing fee ) Stopping a person is merely a matter of trumping up some subjective law. I was then told "There are only 2 kinds of people out at 1am...the good guys and the bad guys." To which I most certainly responded "Well can this good guy go home?" Unfortunately, it didn't happen.

[Panther]

Well...the BAC limit here used to be .15 which actually...I think was fair. But a .08.....THAT'S ONE FUCKING BEER unless you're a 250 lb. dude who had just eaten a shitload of hotwings.
Speaking of eating...that's another reason I think it was more of a "smear campaign". I ate Taco Bell right before I went to the bar...so I was more in the "nursing beer" mode 'cause I was way too full to eat. Now that kinda kills the hitting the bloodstream slowly argument because it would be processed through the stomach first which, thanks to all the grease and flour tortillias, would've soaked all that up. Even beside that, I didn't drink 2 beers within an hour. It was more like one an hour 'cause I started out with Sprite.
And, I must say, the CS cop was just doing his job and he was rather nice to me and more trying to find a way to get me through the loophole. He wasn't a over zealous rookie or anything so I DO believe that he meant it. He called me tonight to say happy Thanksgiving and to let me know that I was getting my licence back tomorrow. It was the County jail that really fucked me over.

Yeah, Liam, I remember the days of the .015 - almost seems like that was well before the cahnge to 60 on the roadways and the change from 18-21 in the age. ha After reading through this without the turkey induced drunk I had going on, I can see that there may have been problems. Anyone who pays attention in this state KNOWS that Harris County (were you in county for the pull over?) has more than its fair share of bad equipment and overloaded jail systems. You've all rights to bring up the apparent malfunction of equipment and request the calbration records for the machine (which should include the last test done on it). Make sure the serial numbers from the records and the machine match up. I'm sure your attorney will also recommend these things. Good luck with the case.
As for the purported "legal" advice posted here.... While it might work in some areas of the country, in others it will keep you from having to test on the spot - but a lot of jurisdictions have back-up clauses worked into the law regarding such. Some can/and will upon your booking, move to have injunction granted to take immediate blood test on the spot. For those of you well versed in the limits and abilities to drive, this is the LAST thing you would wish to happen, as usually the blow test will register lower than the blood samples (again, for average John Q. Public).
I'd like to reiterate to those pushing the "limit" as some sort of trap.... Think about this scenario.... That spring chicken, fresh 21 y/o, 250 punder behind the wheel of a vehicle after having had a six pack or more. The road is metered for 70 (think our wide open race track miles of interstate here in TX) and is driving within that "accepted" range of that mere 10-20 mph over the posted limit. Is he safe on the road with us? This is the John Q. Public I keep referring to, btw.

[SteveForever]

Liam,
instead of trying to rationalize, try to learn something from this experience. No one did this to you,
you put yourself in the position. Deal with it maturely.


You know better! I'm only saying this because I actually DO care.

[Andrew]

Cops are pigs...they are the instruments of the worlds most dastardly revenue gathering tool aside from the IRS.....the US traffic court system.

I think this may be the most IGNORANT statement I have every read here on MR.

I wish I knew a traffic cop so we could send him to kick his buns.

and then write him a traffic citation!!!!

Go fuck yourself you self righteous piece of shit....Please refrain from posting in response to anything I say and I'll do you the courtesy of letting you brew in your own self-loathing...but continue to involve yourself with anything to do with me and I will make your internet life a living hell....

you've been warned.

No Frank...YOU are being warned. This is completely and utterly unacceptible. And for the record, my best mate is a long serving police officer and I have the greatest respect for the difficult job he has.

[texafana]

Cops are pigs...they are the instruments of the worlds most dastardly revenue gathering tool aside from the IRS.....the US traffic court system.

I think this may be the most IGNORANT statement I have every read here on MR.

I wish I knew a traffic cop so we could send him to kick his buns.

and then write him a traffic citation!!!!

Go fuck yourself you self righteous piece of shit....Please refrain from posting in response to anything I say and I'll do you the courtesy of letting you brew in your own self-loathing...but continue to involve yourself with anything to do with me and I will make your internet life a living hell....

you've been warned.

No Frank...YOU are being warned. This is completely and utterly unacceptible. And for the record, my best mate is a long serving police officer and I have the greatest respect for the difficult job he has.

Hell yah Andrew!!!!

[strangegrey]

No Frank...YOU are being warned. This is completely and utterly unacceptible. And for the record, my best mate is a long serving police officer and I have the greatest respect for the difficult job he has.

Andrew (and anyone else that gives a shit), for the record, this post has NOTHING to do with Police Officers...and I've Pm'ed you the details so you have a frame of understanding. So one has nothing to do with the other, other than the fact that this issue found it's way into this thread discussing police.

As for police officers, I have several friends and family members that are either currently serving or have served. Some have paid the ultimate price when the towers fell on 911. My respect for what they do is unparalleled.

If you read my posts above, I make a VERY specific distinction between police officer and traffic cop. There's a difference. One protects and serves, the other writes citations to generate revenue for his/her municipality. Sorry if people don't want to see the distinction that I am writing to....thats fine. The fact of the matter is that I respect police officers, I don't respect someone that misuses his title as a police officer to harm (financially and legally) good people.

[AR]

I have a couple of stories about my old days and interactions with law enforcement. Politeness and respect got me out of 2 situations where I was in the wrong. Probably not a good idea to share those stories on an international site, but I'll be happy to tell some stories at the Bash II next week for those attending.

[Andrew]

Cops are pigs...they are the instruments of the worlds most dastardly revenue gathering tool aside from the IRS.....the US traffic court system.

I think this may be the most IGNORANT statement I have every read here on MR.

I wish I knew a traffic cop so we could send him to kick his buns.

and then write him a traffic citation!!!!

Go fuck yourself you self righteous piece of shit....Please refrain from posting in response to anything I say and I'll do you the courtesy of letting you brew in your own self-loathing...but continue to involve yourself with anything to do with me and I will make your internet life a living hell....

you've been warned.

No Frank...YOU are being warned. This is completely and utterly unacceptible. And for the record, my best mate is a long serving police officer and I have the greatest respect for the difficult job he has.

Hell yah Andrew!!!!

And don't think I'm not watching your posts also.

[Journey69]

Cops save lives, get over yourself. You'll have your chance in court.

Why the fuck do you always have to chime in with shit like this? I've held off on calling you out, but for Gods sake, the dude has had enough shit for one day. One more jab from you isn't what he needs right now.

Wait...you feel sorry for someone who drinks and then gets into a weapon (a car) and could possibly kill himself or someone else? How would you feel if that same person hit a friend of yours or your kid? Yah...poor him. Sorry, THAT's the mentality I got from him, we should feel sorry for him? puhlease... Drink all you want people, but why put yourself or someone else at risk by driving?

That was a brilliant statement, just because the legal limit is .08,how the hell does that make the car a weapon? Since when are you drunk at .08.. that's the legal limit,doesn't mean your even buzzed.. Most people are sober after 2 drinks..Beer isn't that strong.. What if they lowered it to .06..are you drunk..Give me a break,they are just cracking down on drinking in general.. Its all about money,if you blow a .08,the cop could let you off with a warning,but they don't..They nail you to the wall.. Money my friends,nothing more! My 21 yr cousin was killed three years ago from drinking and driving,I know all about it..Doesn't mean you can't be responsible.. There are just some cops itching to bust someone no matter what..

[Behshad]

Cops are pigs...they are the instruments of the worlds most dastardly revenue gathering tool aside from the IRS.....the US traffic court system.

I think this may be the most IGNORANT statement I have every read here on MR.

I wish I knew a traffic cop so we could send him to kick his buns.

and then write him a traffic citation!!!!

Go fuck yourself you self righteous piece of shit....Please refrain from posting in response to anything I say and I'll do you the courtesy of letting you brew in your own self-loathing...but continue to involve yourself with anything to do with me and I will make your internet life a living hell....

you've been warned.

No Frank...YOU are being warned. This is completely and utterly unacceptible. And for the record, my best mate is a long serving police officer and I have the greatest respect for the difficult job he has.

Hell yah Andrew!!!!

And don't think I'm not watching your posts also.

Thanks, drew! Im glad you said something to him before I did.

[Liam]

What did you get stopped for in the first place? They can't just stop you for nothing, can they?

They can and they did. I was stopped initially because I "made a rolling stop at a stop sign". NOPE. That was the person in front of me. I was even complaining about it to my friend saying something to the effect of "if that was me...I'd get nailed". Guess what...it was them and I got nailed. It was an excuse for a random test. Hands down.

[heardonthestreet]

What did you get stopped for in the first place? They can't just stop you for nothing, can they?

They can and they did. I was stopped initially because I "made a rolling stop at a stop sign". NOPE. That was the person in front of me. I was even complaining about it to my friend saying something to the effect of "if that was me...I'd get nailed". Guess what...it was them and I got nailed. It was an excuse for a random test. Hands down.

How very sad.

Just don't let them track you down to the Mr. Booze thread.

[Rhiannon]

They can and they did. I was stopped initially because I "made a rolling stop at a stop sign". NOPE. That was the person in front of me. I was even complaining about it to my friend saying something to the effect of "if that was me...I'd get nailed". Guess what...it was them and I got nailed. It was an excuse for a random test. Hands down.

"Wah wah wah... I'm Liam, I had to sleep on concrete and was cold. Wah wah."

I'm honored to have been one of the first people to find out about this... however, I still might would've felt better having you with me in that damned parking lot Wednesday morning.

[larryfromnextdoor]

"Wah wah wah...

[Liam]

I'm honored to have been one of the first people to find out about this... however, I still might would've felt better having you with me in that damned parking lot Wednesday morning.

TRUST ME, baby...I would've MUCH rathered being with ya in the parking lot. Hmm....that COULD sound sexual.