OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

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OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

Postby Enigma869 » Thu Dec 27, 2007 10:41 am

Okay...Thanks to my hometown Patriots chasing history Saturday night, the NFL has decided that the NFL Network broadcast of the Patriots/Giants game will be simulcast on both CBS and NBC (Incidentally, this is the first time since Super Bowl One that an NFL game is appearing on more than one network)! I know most of the country doesn't have the NFL Network, so I thought I would take the liberty of warning my fellow MR sports fans. The broadcasting team on NFL Network consists of Bryant Gumbel (yes, he's still alive), Deion Sanders, and Chris Collinsworth (too bad Chris can't get any jobs). This is BY FAR, the worst team of broadcasters you'll EVER listen to, in your life! Gumbel is ATROCIOUS! He says a whole lot of shit that simply isn't true, and usually seems VERY confused, througout most of the broadcast. I hope everyone who actually wanted to see this game is able to watch it. Enjoy the game, but don't say I didn't warn you about this crew that will probably make your ears bleed!


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Re: OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

Postby Moose » Thu Dec 27, 2007 10:51 am

Enigma869 wrote:Okay...Thanks to my hometown Patriots chasing history Saturday night, the NFL has decided that the NFL Network broadcast of the Patriots/Giants game will be simulcast on both CBS and NBC (Incidentally, this is the first time since Super Bowl One that an NFL game is appearing on more than one network)! I know most of the country doesn't have the NFL Network, so I thought I would take the liberty of warning my fellow MR sports fans. The broadcasting team on NFL Network consists of Bryant Gumbel (yes, he's still alive), Deion Sanders, and Chris Collinsworth (too bad Chris can't get any jobs). This is BY FAR, the worst team of broadcasters you'll EVER listen to, in your life! Gumbel is ATROCIOUS! He says a whole lot of shit that simply isn't true, and usually seems VERY confused, througout most of the broadcast. I hope everyone who actually wanted to see this game is able to watch it. Enjoy the game, but don't say I didn't warn you about this crew that will probably make your ears bleed!


John from Boston


The only thing worse would be replacing Deion with Joe Theisman. THAT would be even more dreadful. Your overall assessment is right on the mark.
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Re: OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

Postby Rick » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:03 am

Moose wrote:
Enigma869 wrote:Okay...Thanks to my hometown Patriots chasing history Saturday night, the NFL has decided that the NFL Network broadcast of the Patriots/Giants game will be simulcast on both CBS and NBC (Incidentally, this is the first time since Super Bowl One that an NFL game is appearing on more than one network)! I know most of the country doesn't have the NFL Network, so I thought I would take the liberty of warning my fellow MR sports fans. The broadcasting team on NFL Network consists of Bryant Gumbel (yes, he's still alive), Deion Sanders, and Chris Collinsworth (too bad Chris can't get any jobs). This is BY FAR, the worst team of broadcasters you'll EVER listen to, in your life! Gumbel is ATROCIOUS! He says a whole lot of shit that simply isn't true, and usually seems VERY confused, througout most of the broadcast. I hope everyone who actually wanted to see this game is able to watch it. Enjoy the game, but don't say I didn't warn you about this crew that will probably make your ears bleed!


John from Boston


The only thing worse would be replacing Deion with Joe Theisman. THAT would be even more dreadful. Your overall assessment is right on the mark.


Yep, Theisman is the most annoying one of all.
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Postby Liam » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:27 am

Well....this game doesn't matter to me...I got the Alamo Bowl to watch at the same time. I'm obviously going for Texas A&M...but I think Joe Pa's going to out-coach us easily. Oh well...if I get bored with the Ags getting slaughtered...I'll switch over to the Pats/Giants game. :lol:
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Re: OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

Postby Ms_M » Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:32 pm

Enigma869 wrote:Okay...Thanks to my hometown Patriots chasing history Saturday night, the NFL has decided that the NFL Network broadcast of the Patriots/Giants game will be simulcast on both CBS and NBC (Incidentally, this is the first time since Super Bowl One that an NFL game is appearing on more than one network)! I know most of the country doesn't have the NFL Network, so I thought I would take the liberty of warning my fellow MR sports fans. The broadcasting team on NFL Network consists of Bryant Gumbel (yes, he's still alive), Deion Sanders, and Chris Collinsworth (too bad Chris can't get any jobs). This is BY FAR, the worst team of broadcasters you'll EVER listen to, in your life! Gumbel is ATROCIOUS! He says a whole lot of shit that simply isn't true, and usually seems VERY confused, througout most of the broadcast. I hope everyone who actually wanted to see this game is able to watch it. Enjoy the game, but don't say I didn't warn you about this crew that will probably make your ears bleed!


John from Boston


Thanks for the warning... "Giant Gumball", as I refer to him, is a drag broadcasting sports. I thought he was better at it before he did the Today show, but I could be mistaken. I think I'll grout the tub or something equally thrilling Saturday night.
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Postby Greg » Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:46 pm

I have to agree with Enigma on this one. NFL Network's broadcasters are horrible! I wished they could hire Pat Summerall to do the play by play. I realize he might be retired, but heck, it's not like he'd have to do that many games each season.

I don't mind Joey T. I realize I'm a homer when it comes to past and present Redskins, but I'd rather hear Theismann than Gumbel.
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Re: OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

Postby ebake02 » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:06 pm

Rick wrote:
Moose wrote:
Enigma869 wrote:Okay...Thanks to my hometown Patriots chasing history Saturday night, the NFL has decided that the NFL Network broadcast of the Patriots/Giants game will be simulcast on both CBS and NBC (Incidentally, this is the first time since Super Bowl One that an NFL game is appearing on more than one network)! I know most of the country doesn't have the NFL Network, so I thought I would take the liberty of warning my fellow MR sports fans. The broadcasting team on NFL Network consists of Bryant Gumbel (yes, he's still alive), Deion Sanders, and Chris Collinsworth (too bad Chris can't get any jobs). This is BY FAR, the worst team of broadcasters you'll EVER listen to, in your life! Gumbel is ATROCIOUS! He says a whole lot of shit that simply isn't true, and usually seems VERY confused, througout most of the broadcast. I hope everyone who actually wanted to see this game is able to watch it. Enjoy the game, but don't say I didn't warn you about this crew that will probably make your ears bleed!


John from Boston


The only thing worse would be replacing Deion with Joe Theisman. THAT would be even more dreadful. Your overall assessment is right on the mark.


Yep, Theisman is the most annoying one of all.


He's not near as bad as Tony Kornheiser. Kornheiser is by far the worst out of all of them.
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Re: OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

Postby Enigma869 » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:13 pm

ebake02 wrote:He's not near as bad as Tony Kornheiser. Kornheiser is by far the worst out of all of them.


I agree that Tony Kornheiser is dreadful, but I'm telling you...Gumbel is as bad as bad gets. The big difference is Kornheiser is a color commentator, so he pipes in here and there. Gumbel is the play by play guy, so you can't escape the guy. The funny thing is that he does a sports magazine show on HBO that really isn't bad, so I don't know what the guy's deal is on the NFL Network. He is clearly NOT cut out to be doing play by play. I've been listening to football games for well over 30 years, and Gumbel is the worst I've ever heard...including Theisman and Kornheiser!


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Postby Enigma869 » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:16 pm

Greg wrote:I have to agree with Enigma on this one. NFL Network's broadcasters are horrible! I wished they could hire Pat Summerall to do the play by play. I realize he might be retired, but heck, it's not like he'd have to do that many games each season.



You can't be serious Greg???? Summerall???? Back in the day, Summerall was as good as ANYONE doing play by play. That said, the guy started fading fast his last several years. Half the time, Summerall didn't know what teams he was watching, and the other half, I think he was shitfaced out of his mind!



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Postby Greg » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:19 pm

Enigma869 wrote:
Greg wrote:I have to agree with Enigma on this one. NFL Network's broadcasters are horrible! I wished they could hire Pat Summerall to do the play by play. I realize he might be retired, but heck, it's not like he'd have to do that many games each season.



You can't be serious Greg???? Summerall???? Back in the day, Summerall was as good as ANYONE doing play by play. That said, the guy started fading fast his last several years. Half the time, Summerall didn't know what teams he was watching, and the other half, I think he was shitfaced out of his mind!



John from Boston


I'll take a drunk Pat Summerall calling play by play over Bryant Gumbel any day of the week.
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Postby conversationpc » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:38 pm

Greg wrote:I'll take a drunk Pat Summerall calling play by play over Bryant Gumbel any day of the week.


Mediocrity and suckitude run in the Gumbel family.
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Postby Rockindeano » Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:01 pm

conversationpc wrote:
Greg wrote:I'll take a drunk Pat Summerall calling play by play over Bryant Gumbel any day of the week.


Mediocrity and suckitude run in the Gumbel family.


Hey! Not so fast! The Brothers Gumbel were terrific when they were on Family Guy. Remember, "Gumbel to Gumbel?" Peter got so pissed at the FCC for canceling Gumbel to Gumbel he just snapped.
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Postby Liam » Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:15 pm

Rockindeano wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Greg wrote:I'll take a drunk Pat Summerall calling play by play over Bryant Gumbel any day of the week.


Mediocrity and suckitude run in the Gumbel family.


Hey! Not so fast! The Brothers Gumbel were terrific when they were on Family Guy. Remember, "Gumbel to Gumbel?" Peter got so pissed at the FCC for canceling Gumbel to Gumbel he just snapped.


:lol: And Chris was a part of the "Make a Wish" foundation. Great episode.
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Postby Rockindeano » Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:35 pm

Greg wrote:
Enigma869 wrote:
Greg wrote:I have to agree with Enigma on this one. NFL Network's broadcasters are horrible! I wished they could hire Pat Summerall to do the play by play. I realize he might be retired, but heck, it's not like he'd have to do that many games each season.



You can't be serious Greg???? Summerall???? Back in the day, Summerall was as good as ANYONE doing play by play. That said, the guy started fading fast his last several years. Half the time, Summerall didn't know what teams he was watching, and the other half, I think he was shitfaced out of his mind!



John from Boston


I'll take a drunk Pat Summerall calling play by play over Bryant Gumbel any day of the week.


Hey Greg, wanna hear something that will make you bust up? Go down to an area sports bar that has the golf arcade game called, "Golden Tee." Pat Summerall does the voice over. I bust up at he and fuckin Peter Jacobsen. Hell, PJ makes more on this game than he did on the Tour!
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Postby NealIsGod » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:35 am

Man, what I wouldn't give to see the Pats go down to the Giants on 3 networks. :lol:
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Postby Rockindeano » Fri Dec 28, 2007 1:58 am

John from Boston, I would love to see your face when your beloved Pats go down in the playoffs. It will happen.
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Postby jrnychick » Fri Dec 28, 2007 2:40 am

Gotta agree with you John from Boston. Greg Gumbel sucks it big time! What a horrible job they do on the NFL network. I think a drunk Pat Somerall might be fun to listen to! :D
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Postby Greg » Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:00 am

Rockindeano wrote:
Greg wrote:
Enigma869 wrote:
Greg wrote:I have to agree with Enigma on this one. NFL Network's broadcasters are horrible! I wished they could hire Pat Summerall to do the play by play. I realize he might be retired, but heck, it's not like he'd have to do that many games each season.



You can't be serious Greg???? Summerall???? Back in the day, Summerall was as good as ANYONE doing play by play. That said, the guy started fading fast his last several years. Half the time, Summerall didn't know what teams he was watching, and the other half, I think he was shitfaced out of his mind!



John from Boston


I'll take a drunk Pat Summerall calling play by play over Bryant Gumbel any day of the week.


Hey Greg, wanna hear something that will make you bust up? Go down to an area sports bar that has the golf arcade game called, "Golden Tee." Pat Summerall does the voice over. I bust up at he and fuckin Peter Jacobsen. Hell, PJ makes more on this game than he did on the Tour!


LOL!!! That's funny! I'm playing that game the next time I see it. Speaking of video games, maybe the NFL network should just take sound clips from the older Madden games (that featured John Madden and Pat Summerall) and just insert those as play by play for the NFL Network. Can't be much worse than what they already have.
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Re: OT: NFL Network WARNING!!!!!

Postby lights1961 » Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:15 am

Enigma869 wrote:Okay...Thanks to my hometown Patriots chasing history Saturday night, the NFL has decided that the NFL Network broadcast of the Patriots/Giants game will be simulcast on both CBS and NBC (Incidentally, this is the first time since Super Bowl One that an NFL game is appearing on more than one network)! I know most of the country doesn't have the NFL Network, so I thought I would take the liberty of warning my fellow MR sports fans. The broadcasting team on NFL Network consists of Bryant Gumbel (yes, he's still alive), Deion Sanders, and Chris Collinsworth (too bad Chris can't get any jobs). This is BY FAR, the worst team of broadcasters you'll EVER listen to, in your life! Gumbel is ATROCIOUS! He says a whole lot of shit that simply isn't true, and usually seems VERY confused, througout most of the broadcast. I hope everyone who actually wanted to see this game is able to watch it. Enjoy the game, but don't say I didn't warn you about this crew that will probably make your ears bleed!


John from Boston


GO GIANTS!! Chris Collinsworth is THE WORST ANNOUNCER EVER!!! If NFL WAS SMART THEY
would have AL AND JOHN in the BOOTH for the history making event.

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Postby Enigma869 » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:22 am

Rockindeano wrote:John from Boston, I would love to see your face when your beloved Pats go down in the playoffs. It will happen.



Dean...ANYTHING can happen, and NOTHING in the NFL would surprise me. If you've read my posts, througout the NFL season, I have predicted all along that the Patriots would lose a game or three, along the way. To be honest with you, without the whole "Spygate" fiasco, the Patriots wouldn't be 15-0 right now. This team has always thrived on the whole disrespect card and when EVERYONE started questioning the legitimacy of their championships, I knew they were going to go on a roll! Ask Tomlinson and his big mouth ("I think the Patriots live by the motto if you're not cheating, you're not trying) how disrespecting the Patriots worked out for him and the Chargers 3 days after getting diaherra of the mouth!

I can tell you this...If they do manage to stay undefeated, it will be the most remarkable thing I've ever seen in sports. The Miami Dolphins didn't have ESPN and three networks broadcasting their games, and they certainly didn't have one quarter of the media the Patriots have swarming around them every day. As for your playoff prediction, I honestly think the only team capable of beating the Patriots in the playoffs are the Colts. The Colts are the only team who can keep up with the Patriots and match them touchdown for touchdown (assuming Marvin Harrison is healthy). I would be quite surprised if a team other than the Colts beat this group. The reality is that the last time two number one seeds made it to the Super Bowl was way back in 1993, so it's not very likely we're going to be watching the Dallas/NE Super Bowl that so many people are predicting!

One final thing Dean...I grew up about 8 miles from Fenway Park and saw a WHOLE LOT OF LOSING, as a kid, with many of Boston's sports teams! I certainly don't think it's my birth right to have my team win championships. Prior to 2004, I had to deal with EVERY obnoxious Yankees fan on the planet, because the Red Sox ALWAYS found a way to lose! It's fun to be able to give it back to them...even if it is just temporary!


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Postby Slander » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:49 am

NealIsGod wrote:Man, what I wouldn't give to see the Pats go down to the Giants on 3 networks. :lol:


Amen brother! I am so sick about hearing how Great the Patriots are! Oh really do people realize Miami went unbeaten without their hall of fame quarterback Bob Griese most of the way. Could you imagine Brady going down? Where would the Pats be? These group of Patties would be beaten handially by the 72 dolphins or 85 bears. The Patriots are a fraud and also a testament to how watered down the NFL has become.
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Postby Tom Jrnyfn » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:54 am

Slander wrote:
NealIsGod wrote:Man, what I wouldn't give to see the Pats go down to the Giants on 3 networks. :lol:


Amen brother! I am so sick about hearing how Great the Patriots are! Oh really do people realize Miami went unbeaten without their hall of fame quarterback Bob Griese most of the way. Could you imagine Brady going down? Where would the Pats be? These group of Patties would be beaten handially by the 72 dolphins or 85 bears. The Patriots are a fraud and also a testament to how watered down the NFL has become.


You're right, the NFL is a watered down piece of shit. What can you say about a leauge that only has a few decent teams.
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Postby Slander » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:07 am

Tom Jrnyfn wrote:
Slander wrote:
NealIsGod wrote:Man, what I wouldn't give to see the Pats go down to the Giants on 3 networks. :lol:


Amen brother! I am so sick about hearing how Great the Patriots are! Oh really do people realize Miami went unbeaten without their hall of fame quarterback Bob Griese most of the way. Could you imagine Brady going down? Where would the Pats be? These group of Patties would be beaten handially by the 72 dolphins or 85 bears. The Patriots are a fraud and also a testament to how watered down the NFL has become.


You're right, the NFL is a watered down piece of shit. What can you say about a leauge that only has a few decent teams.


Maybe it's wishful thinking on my part but I feel that if the Patriots lost in the playoffs it would prove what a fraud the league has become. It's a damn shame. Mark my words in this forum. Someone in the playoffs will be able to RUN the football on the Patties. They are weak at stopping the run.
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Postby Slander » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:10 am

Enigma869 wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:John from Boston, I would love to see your face when your beloved Pats go down in the playoffs. It will happen.

The Miami Dolphins didn't have ESPN and three networks broadcasting their games, and they certainly didn't have one quarter of the media the Patriots have swarming around them every day.
John from Boston


AND THEY DIDN'T HAVE THEIR STARTING QUARTERBACK BOB GRIESE MOST OF THE WAY......Take Brady out of the equasion where would your beloved Patties be? The bottom line is the Patriots are THE SUPREME TEAM of the worst NFL EVER. CONGRATS ON BEING KINGS OF THE CRAP HEAP.
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Postby squirt1 » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:14 am

The NFL caved to Congress. If this happens again,call your reps.
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Postby Enigma869 » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:30 am

Slander wrote:Amen brother! I am so sick about hearing how Great the Patriots are! Oh really do people realize Miami went unbeaten without their hall of fame quarterback Bob Griese most of the way. Could you imagine Brady going down? Where would the Pats be? These group of Patties would be beaten handially by the 72 dolphins or 85 bears. The Patriots are a fraud and also a testament to how watered down the NFL has become.


It's one thing to be sick of hearing about how great any one team is. Nobody, including me, likes it. The reality is that it's the media that creates all hated teams, because of their endless coverage of one team or another. As for the Patriots being "beaten handily" by the 72 Dolphins or 85 Bears...You're simply talking out your asshole! The reality is that NOBODY knows what team would beat another, from a different era. I know this...the players of 2007 are far bigger and far faster than human beings were 35 years ago! That's a fact! I will give the 72 Dolphins credit for winning with a backup QB, and that's about it! The 72 Dolphins had one guy on their team over 270lbs (and he was 272), and they had a PUSSY schedule! Their opponents winning percentage the year the vaunted Dolphins went undefeated was a whopping THIRTY FIVE PERCENT! I think this season's version of the Dolphins would have been .500 if they were able to play that pussy of a schedule! That team was a FRAUD, with Griese or without him! Those old fucks need to stop waxing poetic about how great their team was and accept the reality that they were the beneficiaries of the easiest schedule on the planet! As for the NFL being watered down...There are more teams in the NFL with over 10 wins this season, than there were in 1972. Even though there are more teams in 2007, if you do it on a percentage basis, the win-loss records of the 72 NFL was no better than the 2007 NFL!

As far as the 85 Bears...I can speak about that team, with much more knowledge, as I saw most of their games. The 85 Bears team was the best defense that I ever saw in my life. That said, Mike Ditka (who coached the damn team) said they would have a shitload of trouble with this year's Patriots team! The 85 Bears had a great defensive line and the great Mike Singletary at linebacker, but they had NOBODY in their secondary. If you think that piss-poor secondary was covering the likes of Randy Moss, Wes Welker, and Donte Stallworth, you're delusional! Also, the 85 Bears team was not a very prolific offense. They relied upon the great Walter Payton, who was at the end of his career, in 1985. Their leading receiver in 1985 was Payton (a running back) with 49 catches! Willie Gault and Dennis McKinnon were the Bears' starting wide receivers. They had 33 and 31 catches, respectively, and had 1200 yards receiving, between both of them! McKinnon caught 7 touchdowns, and Gault had a whopping ONE! That is an embarrassing receiving core! Jim McMahon had a whopping 2300 yards passing and 15 touchdowns during that season! Just for some perspective on that, Joey Harrington and Damon Huard will both have more passing yards than McMahon had in 1985, so let's not make McMahon anything more than he was...a VERY average QB! While I respect the hell out of the 1985 Bears defense, their offense would NEVER score enough points to have any shot against this year's Patriots team! As I've said numerous times, I'm VERY okay with the world hating the Patriots. Just don't make completely moronic statements that are based on nothing but your imagination! At least bring some facts to the table!


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Postby Enigma869 » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:32 am

Slander wrote:AND THEY DIDN'T HAVE THEIR STARTING QUARTERBACK BOB GRIESE MOST OF THE WAY......Take Brady out of the equasion where would your beloved Patties be? The bottom line is the Patriots are THE SUPREME TEAM of the worst NFL EVER. CONGRATS ON BEING KINGS OF THE CRAP HEAP.



Just because I forgot to mention it before...YOU ARE A FUCKING MORON!



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Postby Enigma869 » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:39 am

Slander wrote: Mark my words in this forum. Someone in the playoffs will be able to RUN the football on the Patties. They are weak at stopping the run.



I guess it depends upon your definition of "weak". The fact of the matter is they have the 10th ranked rushing defense in the NFL, which means that there are 22 teams in the NFL who suck more against the run than the Patriots! The more important defensive stats, concerning the Patriots are that there are only TWO teams (Pittsburgh and Green Bay), in the entire NFL who have given up fewer rushing touchdowns, than the Patriots. The most important stat, concerning the Patriots "inferior" defense is that there isn't ONE SINGLE TEAM, in the entire NFL who gives up fewer points a game on defense, and scores more points on offense!


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Postby Slander » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:40 am

Enigma869 wrote:
Slander wrote: Those old fucks need to stop waxing poetic about how great their team was and accept the reality that they were the beneficiaries of the easiest schedule on the planet!
John from Boston


Those old fucks went back to back and won the super bowl again in 73 losing just two games. Oh yeah those old fucks also went to the Super Bowl in 71. 3 straight seasons of making it to the big one. Oh by the way. Your pussy schedule this year included the bills, jets, dophins, and the team with the longest losing streak currently in Pro Football-The Ravens. Get over yourself. The NFL has sucked for a long time because of expansion. Congrats to your Patties on being the KINGS of Crap. By the way nice run defense. What a joke. If the Patties can win with that run defense than it is even more evident that this league sux. GO PATS...XFL CHAMPS. I can't wait for CHEAT-A-CHECK TO HOIST THE VINCE MCMAHON TROPHY HIGH.
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Postby Slander » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:43 am

Enigma869 wrote:
Slander wrote: Mark my words in this forum. Someone in the playoffs will be able to RUN the football on the Patties. They are weak at stopping the run.



I guess it depends upon your definition of "weak". The fact of the matter is they have the 10th ranked rushing defense in the NFL, which means that there are 22 teams in the NFL who suck more against the run than the Patriots! The more important defensive stats, concerning the Patriots are that there are only TWO teams (Pittsburgh and Green Bay), in the entire NFL who have given up fewer rushing touchdowns, than the Patriots. The most important stat, concerning the Patriots "inferior" defense is that there isn't ONE SINGLE TEAM, in the entire NFL who gives up fewer points a game on defense, and scores more points on offense!


John from Boston



Fuck even the Dolphins Ronnie Brown ran for almost 100 yards in the first half of game against your beloved Patties. Rediculous. Oh yeah did you see Joe Addai on that screen pass. Your beloved peppermint patties are old and slow on defense. I think the LT, Fred Taylor, or Joe Addai could show the world what a fraud that geriatric dee is.
"But it ain't about how hard you hit... it's about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward." Rocky Balboa
Slander
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