Survivor vs. Bryan Adams

[Ehwmatt]

I *gasp* really like both and have seen both live once. I'm a huge Peterik fan and I love Sullivan's guitar playing so I gave the nod to Survivor here. Plus, I like having options when I pull out my Survivor catalogue - the Bickler/Jamison eras each have their own trademarks. BA is a great singer and fine songwriter in his own right and definitely does have the commercial advantage over Survivor, but I just prefer Survivor... BA gets a little homogeneous for me after too many songs in a row. I could listen to a few Survivor discs in one sitting, BA I have to take a break from after an album or so. The BA Live at Slaine(sp?) Castle DVD is an excellent primer for those of you who haven't caught his great live show. Everyone in his band really gets into every show I've seen and it's quite enjoyable... not sure if I can say the same for Survivor. Their show was great musically, but from a showmanship standpoint.. eh. Survivor's apparent neglect of PR is really frustrating... their website might be the worst band website in melodic rock. I found out they played in Akron, OH 45 minutes from me a week after they played there!

BTW, for those of you who are citing commercial/chart success as indicators of either band's superiority, isn't that a little superficial? I mean fuck, by those standards, Hannah Montana is the artist of the year and Nickelback is far superior to the JSS band.

[Gordon from Edinburgh]

Hey Survivor fags, I am ready to brawl today. let's tear this motherfucker up.

Cloud number nine DANCE MIX anyone? I love BA but he has put his fair share of excrement out there too.

[Spike]

BA gets a little homogeneous for me after too many songs in a row.

This just shows how subjective and personal musical choice is. I've been following this topic and, on a couple of occasions, nearly typed exactly the same thing to describe my experience with Survivor. All their songs sound alike to me, I just switch off after a while. Given a straight choice, I can only say that I prefer BA.

[Ehwmatt]

BA gets a little homogeneous for me after too many songs in a row.

This just shows how subjective and personal musical choice is. I've been following this topic and, on a couple of occasions, nearly typed exactly the same thing to describe my experience with Survivor. All their songs sound alike to me, I just switch off after a while. Given a straight choice, I can only say that I prefer BA.

Amen.

[kgdjpubs]

Bickler sucked and had one good song with them so quit tooting his horn. Jamison made that band a powerhouse name. Prior to him they were merely one hit wonders.

a little late coming in here, but a couple of posts to respond to...

for what it's worth, the majority of Vital Signs was written BEFORE Jimi Jamison joined the band. Bickler never got writing credits for anything in the 80s, and how much Jamison wrote on his albums is debatable at best. The writing team for Survivor was Peterik/Sullivan, more the former than the latter. The writing style changed once JJ was the singer (it was changing already), but Vital Signs would have basically sounded the same whether it was Dave Bickler, Jimi Jamison or Kevin Chalfant (yes, THAT one....guess who was #2 choice to replace Bickler).

[Rockindeano]

Hey Survivor fags, I am ready to brawl today. let's tear this motherfucker up.

Cloud number nine DANCE MIX anyone? I love BA but he has put his fair share of excrement out there too.

Cloud Number Nine is a great pop tune. Just because it got remixed and was used as a dance tune does not make it excrement. Don't Stop Believin' was done into a dance song too. Anyone here dare call that song excrement? Probably not. Hell, Cloud Number 9 is the equivalent to Suzanne from ROR.

And for the record, I NEVER said Survivor wasn't any good or they weren't talented. I just said they aren't as good as BA, in any area of the band. Fuck you Andrew and your fuckin Toto.

[kgdjpubs]

Andrew! Say it isn't SO!!! A wannabe Journey band over BA? GHAAA!!! Turn in your man card!!

Here's where it gets interesting...
Stack Survivor's catalogue against Journey's and I PERSONALLY think there are less fillers in the Survivor albums than there are with Journey's catalogue.
And you know what - I prefer Survivor's ballads over Journey's

There ya go!!

Agreed!

And "The search Is Over" tops even "Open Arms" and "Faithfully" as an all time great ballad.

I'm not as into ballads as much as harder Rocking music, but "The Search Is Over" is the perfect Rock ballad of all time.

ugh....Just about anything tops Open Arms (which rivals Bad English's When I See You Smile as the most groan-inducing), but Faithfully? The Search Is Over is probably, IMO, the worst ballad Survivor did. Not that it's bad, but they did SO much better. Bickler on it sounded ok from the early 90s when he came back (it was written for his voice), but Ever Since the World Began, Man Against the World or Across the Miles are much better songs.

[Gordon from Edinburgh]

Hey Survivor fags, I am ready to brawl today. let's tear this motherfucker up.

Cloud number nine DANCE MIX anyone? I love BA but he has put his fair share of excrement out there too.

Cloud Number Nine is a great pop tune. Just because it got remixed and was used as a dance tune does not make it excrement. Don't Stop Believin' was done into a dance song too. Anyone here dare call that song excrement? Probably not. Hell, Cloud Number 9 is the equivalent to Suzanne from ROR.

And for the record, I NEVER said Survivor wasn't any good or they weren't talented. I just said they aren't as good as BA, in any area of the band. Fuck you Andrew and your fuckin Toto.

Why you slaggin Andrew mate? I dropped that in to see how you would react.....quite calmly as it turns out - but even as a pop song its not up to much - i wish he would return to the days of Summer of 69 - i can NEVER get bored of that song - but i guess with a few exceptions, most of our favourite artists are past their peak.........- tell you what i do respect about him a lot tho - when he tours he does proper tours - i have been lucky enough to see him 6/7 times and when you live in little old Scotland, thats unusual for such a big artist to have been available that often. And, he is always magic in concert.

[Rockindeano]

Why you slaggin Andrew mate? I dropped that in to see how you would react

Aw, all in good fun. We have a long history with Toto, BA and such.

.....quite calmly as it turns out - but even as a pop song its not up to much - i wish he would return to the days of Summer of 69 - i can NEVER get bored of that song -

The new CD, 11, is supposed to go back to plugged in guitars.

tell you what i do respect about him a lot tho - when he tours he does proper tours - i have been lucky enough to see him 6/7 times and when you live in little old Scotland, thats unusual for such a big artist to have been available that often. And, he is always magic in concert.[/quote]

Actually, BA only tours 10-12 times per month. If you look at his schedule, it doesn't make much sense financially. For instance, he is doing Sacramento, CA, and then a few Tahoe shows and Vegas, then to Toronto for the One Voice show, and then to Denmark and Scandinavia. Last October, it was USA east coast 10 cities, and west coast 6 shows, then whoosh, over to Russia. He definitely is worldwide.

[kgdjpubs]

[
And for the record, I NEVER said Survivor wasn't any good or they weren't talented. I just said they aren't as good as BA, in any area of the band. Fuck you Andrew and your fuckin Toto.

BA has done some really good stuff, but the recent albums have been missing something. I'll pick Survivor as the better of the two (pretending that Reach doesn't exist, and the current incarnation of the band simply doesn't work), but just based on the entire catalogue, NOT the hits. Some of Survivor's best albums (Premonition, Too Hot To Sleep, etc) had absolutely no radio airplay.

nd as far as Toto, some great musicians without a doubt, but some awful lyrics on the most part. Sure, some good songs, but probably the worst luck with singers ever.

[Gordon from Edinburgh]

Why you slaggin Andrew mate? I dropped that in to see how you would react

Aw, all in good fun. We have a long history with Toto, BA and such.

.....quite calmly as it turns out - but even as a pop song its not up to much - i wish he would return to the days of Summer of 69 - i can NEVER get bored of that song -

The new CD, 11, is supposed to go back to plugged in guitars.

tell you what i do respect about him a lot tho - when he tours he does proper tours - i have been lucky enough to see him 6/7 times and when you live in little old Scotland, thats unusual for such a big artist to have been available that often. And, he is always magic in concert.

Actually, BA only tours 10-12 times per month. If you look at his schedule, it doesn't make much sense financially. For instance, he is doing Sacramento, CA, and then a few Tahoe shows and Vegas, then to Toronto for the One Voice show, and then to Denmark and Scandinavia. Last October, it was USA east coast 10 cities, and west coast 6 shows, then whoosh, over to Russia. He definitely is worldwide.[/quote]

He can tour pretty much anywhere then! I hope he comes back here i will be there like a shot.

[MarcelJordan]

[
And for the record, I NEVER said Survivor wasn't any good or they weren't talented. I just said they aren't as good as BA, in any area of the band. Fuck you Andrew and your fuckin Toto.

BA has done some really good stuff, but the recent albums have been missing something. I'll pick Survivor as the better of the two (pretending that Reach doesn't exist, and the current incarnation of the band simply doesn't work), but just based on the entire catalogue, NOT the hits. Some of Survivor's best albums (Premonition, Too Hot To Sleep, etc) had absolutely no radio airplay.

nd as far as Toto, some great musicians without a doubt, but some awful lyrics on the most part. Sure, some good songs, but probably the worst luck with singers ever.

Actually Premonition and THTS did HAVE airplay. The former, was how Stallone picked them for Tiger. For the latter, Didn't know it was love and Across the Miles also did.

[Joe Vana]

When's the last time Bryan Adams was asked to do a tv commercial?

More importantly, when's the last time Bryan Adams played for 20-million people in the same night???

Let's see, ESPN used Open Road, a new song at the time, for it's 50 states in 50 days campaign 2 years ago.

You do know the Survivor commercial was a joke on Survivor right?

By the way, I have no idea where you live, but you're about a pathetic sonofabitch. Jim Peterik over BA? You do know BA has triple the hits than Survivor right? I willing to bet he has sold quadruple or more than Survivor.

You lose on all fronts. Now get the fuck outta here until you can make a valid argument. Even I admit when I lose. You are fucking pathetic.

Fuckin Survivore OPENED for REO 5 years ago. REO...REO Speedwagon. That says it all right there.

I would have to agree with alot of your points...worldwide I would give the nod to Bryan Adams...he is a solo artist and by pure name alone can sell out a 5 to 7 thousand seater still....

Plus the man worked with Sting and Rod Stewart...his sales number would definately dwarf Survivor worldwide....

And I am a HUGE Survivor fan by the way, but facts are hard to dispute....

And he is my second favorite Canadian singer....Kim Mitchell is still the King for me....

JV

[Rockindeano]

I gotta say, Adams website is phenominal. Look at that site and then look at Survivor's or even Journey's. Adams site is a model site for rocknroll. I can guarantee you, they don't have a band picture and airbrush a member in and out like a certain band does.

PS- Bryan Adams is NOT a solo artist. It's the name of the band. He is NOT solo.

[Joe Vana]

I gotta say, Adams website is phenominal. Look at that site and then look at Survivor's or even Journey's. Adams site is a model site for rocknroll. I can guarantee you, they don't have a band picture and airbrush a member in and out like a certain band does.

PS- Bryan Adams is NOT a solo artist. It's the name of the band. He is NOT solo.

Well hopefully we can agree to disagree....I think of him as a solo artist...I can't name one member of his band....but Bryan I respect immensely...even as popular as he is I still think he never got his due....

Every vocal I ever heard him do was delivered masterfully....
JV

[kgdjpubs]

Actually Premonition and THTS did HAVE airplay. The former, was how Stallone picked them for Tiger. For the latter, Didn't know it was love and Across the Miles also did.

let me rephrase then...airplay? yes, hits? no...with maybe the possible exception of Poor Man's Son. Some of the best stuff from both of those albums (Summer Nights, Runway Lights on the former....Desperate Dreams, Didn't Know It Was Love, Across the Miles on the latter) was never heard much by the general public. Survivor had the songs, but the only two albums that really had airplay (Vital Signs and When Seconds Count) were the abberation of the band's sound. Vital Signs is fine for what it is, a pop album, but the real Survivor sound that was present on basically every other album (however highly diluted on WSC) was never heard by the average listener. In the end, it all boils down to management and labels. If Survivor had the management team that Journey had, they could have been very popular, and not just known for a couple of pop hits and "that $%^& tiger song".

[MarcelJordan]

Actually Premonition and THTS did HAVE airplay. The former, was how Stallone picked them for Tiger. For the latter, Didn't know it was love and Across the Miles also did.

let me rephrase then...airplay? yes, hits? no...with maybe the possible exception of Poor Man's Son. Some of the best stuff from both of those albums (Summer Nights, Runway Lights on the former....Desperate Dreams, Didn't Know It Was Love, Across the Miles on the latter) was never heard much by the general public. Survivor had the songs, but the only two albums that really had airplay (Vital Signs and When Seconds Count) were the abberation of the band's sound. Vital Signs is fine for what it is, a pop album, but the real Survivor sound that was present on basically every other album (however highly diluted on WSC) was never heard by the average listener. In the end, it all boils down to management and labels. If Survivor had the management team that Journey had, they could have been very popular, and not just known for a couple of pop hits and "that $%^& tiger song".

I agree with the management thing. More importantly, Scotti Bros. were a screwed up label. The band even admitted that.

[Journey/Survivor]

You do know the Survivor commercial was a joke on Survivor right?

It was obviously intended to be comical, but it's not intended to be a joke about Survivor or EOTT.

Dave Bickler sings the Budweiser "Real Men Of Genius" commercials which are quite clearly intended to be comical, but the guy who was put in charge of finding someone to sing them said that right from the very start he wanted Bickler to sing them because of what a great singer he is. He didn't hire him to make fun of him.

[Rick]

Dave Bickler sings the Budweiser "Real Men Of Genius" commercials

I didn't know that. Coolness.

[Journey/Survivor]

Bickler sucked and had one good song with them so quit tooting his horn. Jamison made that band a powerhouse name. Prior to him they were merely one hit wonders.

a little late coming in here, but a couple of posts to respond to...

for what it's worth, the majority of Vital Signs was written BEFORE Jimi Jamison joined the band. Bickler never got writing credits for anything in the 80s, and how much Jamison wrote on his albums is debatable at best. The writing team for Survivor was Peterik/Sullivan, more the former than the latter. The writing style changed once JJ was the singer (it was changing already), but Vital Signs would have basically sounded the same whether it was Dave Bickler, Jimi Jamison or Kevin Chalfant (yes, THAT one....guess who was #2 choice to replace Bickler).

Yes, your right about Survivor's second choice being Kevin Chalfant when they hired Jimi Jamison. I'm glad they went with Jamison, but Kevin Chalfant would have been a great choice too.

[MarcelJordan]

Bickler sucked and had one good song with them so quit tooting his horn. Jamison made that band a powerhouse name. Prior to him they were merely one hit wonders.

a little late coming in here, but a couple of posts to respond to...

for what it's worth, the majority of Vital Signs was written BEFORE Jimi Jamison joined the band. Bickler never got writing credits for anything in the 80s, and how much Jamison wrote on his albums is debatable at best. The writing team for Survivor was Peterik/Sullivan, more the former than the latter. The writing style changed once JJ was the singer (it was changing already), but Vital Signs would have basically sounded the same whether it was Dave Bickler, Jimi Jamison or Kevin Chalfant (yes, THAT one....guess who was #2 choice to replace Bickler).

Yes, your right about Survivor's second choice being Kevin Chalfant when they hired Jimi Jamison. I'm glad they went with Jamison, but Kevin Chalfant would have been a great choice too.

Not sure about this, but I think Frankie hinted that before JJ got in, Robin Mcauley was also in the running.

[Rick]

Bickler sucked and had one good song with them so quit tooting his horn. Jamison made that band a powerhouse name. Prior to him they were merely one hit wonders.

a little late coming in here, but a couple of posts to respond to...

for what it's worth, the majority of Vital Signs was written BEFORE Jimi Jamison joined the band. Bickler never got writing credits for anything in the 80s, and how much Jamison wrote on his albums is debatable at best. The writing team for Survivor was Peterik/Sullivan, more the former than the latter. The writing style changed once JJ was the singer (it was changing already), but Vital Signs would have basically sounded the same whether it was Dave Bickler, Jimi Jamison or Kevin Chalfant (yes, THAT one....guess who was #2 choice to replace Bickler).

Yes, your right about Survivor's second choice being Kevin Chalfant when they hired Jimi Jamison. I'm glad they went with Jamison, but Kevin Chalfant would have been a great choice too.

Poor Kevin just missed out all the way around. He's too talented not to be heading up some big band.

[Journey/Survivor]

BTW, for those of you who are citing commercial/chart success as indicators of either band's superiority, isn't that a little superficial? I mean fuck, by those standards, Hannah Montana is the artist of the year and Nickelback is far superior to the JSS band.

I had intended to say the same thing, only I was going to say that if sales were the only deciding factor in greatness then that would mean that people like Celin Dion, Michael Jackson and Madonna are better than Journey? And obviously on Journey's worst day they are a million times better than those others combined.

[Journey/Survivor]

[
And for the record, I NEVER said Survivor wasn't any good or they weren't talented. I just said they aren't as good as BA, in any area of the band. Fuck you Andrew and your fuckin Toto.

BA has done some really good stuff, but the recent albums have been missing something. I'll pick Survivor as the better of the two (pretending that Reach doesn't exist, and the current incarnation of the band simply doesn't work), but just based on the entire catalogue, NOT the hits. Some of Survivor's best albums (Premonition, Too Hot To Sleep, etc) had absolutely no radio airplay.

nd as far as Toto, some great musicians without a doubt, but some awful lyrics on the most part. Sure, some good songs, but probably the worst luck with singers ever.

Actually Premonition and THTS did HAVE airplay. The former, was how Stallone picked them for Tiger. For the latter, Didn't know it was love and Across the Miles also did.

Yep, "Poor Man's Son" reached #33 on the Billboard chart. And "Didn't Know It Was Love" and "Across The Miles" charted too.

Here in Cleveland "Desperate Dreams" got a lot of radio play too.

I forgot to say that Premonition also had "Summer Nights" that charted.

[Journey/Survivor]

I gotta say, Adams website is phenominal. Look at that site and then look at Survivor's or even Journey's. Adams site is a model site for rocknroll. I can guarantee you, they don't have a band picture and airbrush a member in and out like a certain band does.

PS- Bryan Adams is NOT a solo artist. It's the name of the band. He is NOT solo.

I don't even need to visit Bryan Adams website to know that it's no doubt much better run than Survivor's is, because Survivor's is run like crap. www.survivormusic.com

[Journey/Survivor]

Actually Premonition and THTS did HAVE airplay. The former, was how Stallone picked them for Tiger. For the latter, Didn't know it was love and Across the Miles also did.

let me rephrase then...airplay? yes, hits? no...with maybe the possible exception of Poor Man's Son. Some of the best stuff from both of those albums (Summer Nights, Runway Lights on the former....Desperate Dreams, Didn't Know It Was Love, Across the Miles on the latter) was never heard much by the general public. Survivor had the songs, but the only two albums that really had airplay (Vital Signs and When Seconds Count) were the abberation of the band's sound. Vital Signs is fine for what it is, a pop album, but the real Survivor sound that was present on basically every other album (however highly diluted on WSC) was never heard by the average listener. In the end, it all boils down to management and labels. If Survivor had the management team that Journey had, they could have been very popular, and not just known for a couple of pop hits and "that $%^& tiger song".

The Eye Of The Tiger album reached #2 on the Billboard charts.

Scotti Brothers was one of the worst record labels ever. Survivor would have been up there with Journey in the popularity department if they had had a decent record company backing them. Although the band sometimes made mistakes like turning down an offer to perform on Saturday Night Live and other shows that would have gotten them good publicity.
Back in the 80's Budweiser offered the band BIG money to do a radio commercial for them, but they turned it down too.

But without question Scotti Brothers screwed the band over by not spending any money to promote the band.

[MarcelJordan]

I gotta say, Adams website is phenominal. Look at that site and then look at Survivor's or even Journey's. Adams site is a model site for rocknroll. I can guarantee you, they don't have a band picture and airbrush a member in and out like a certain band does.

PS- Bryan Adams is NOT a solo artist. It's the name of the band. He is NOT solo.

I don't even need to visit Bryan Adams website to know that it's no doubt much better run than Survivor's is, because Survivor's is run like crap. www.survivormusic.com

It will remain pretty bad there, unless they allow free access to the forum. Bad as in ice age slow!

[kgdjpubs]

for what it's worth, the majority of Vital Signs was written BEFORE Jimi Jamison joined the band. Bickler never got writing credits for anything in the 80s, and how much Jamison wrote on his albums is debatable at best. The writing team for Survivor was Peterik/Sullivan, more the former than the latter. The writing style changed once JJ was the singer (it was changing already), but Vital Signs would have basically sounded the same whether it was Dave Bickler, Jimi Jamison or Kevin Chalfant (yes, THAT one....guess who was #2 choice to replace Bickler).

Yes, your right about Survivor's second choice being Kevin Chalfant when they hired Jimi Jamison. I'm glad they went with Jamison, but Kevin Chalfant would have been a great choice too.

Not sure about this, but I think Frankie hinted that before JJ got in, Robin Mcauley was also in the running.

Jim Peterik said that in one of Andrew's interviews a few years ago. Probably the first interview he did with Andrew...just go through the archives. Peterik said Chalfant was the guy, then they found JJ and that was it. Chalfant would have done well, but pushed Survivor well more into Journey territory than Jamison did. Chalfant probably has the better voice now, but he didn't really come into his own for a couple of years (his voice was still developing), so it was basically a no-brainer at the time.

[Journey/Survivor]

Dave Bickler sings the Budweiser "Real Men Of Genius" commercials

I didn't know that. Coolness.

Yep, he sings the "Real Men Of Genius" tv and radio commercials.

You know Jimi Jamison sang the theme song "I'm Always Here" for Baywatch.

[MarcelJordan]

Actually Premonition and THTS did HAVE airplay. The former, was how Stallone picked them for Tiger. For the latter, Didn't know it was love and Across the Miles also did.

let me rephrase then...airplay? yes, hits? no...with maybe the possible exception of Poor Man's Son. Some of the best stuff from both of those albums (Summer Nights, Runway Lights on the former....Desperate Dreams, Didn't Know It Was Love, Across the Miles on the latter) was never heard much by the general public. Survivor had the songs, but the only two albums that really had airplay (Vital Signs and When Seconds Count) were the abberation of the band's sound. Vital Signs is fine for what it is, a pop album, but the real Survivor sound that was present on basically every other album (however highly diluted on WSC) was never heard by the average listener. In the end, it all boils down to management and labels. If Survivor had the management team that Journey had, they could have been very popular, and not just known for a couple of pop hits and "that $%^& tiger song".

The Eye Of The Tiger album reached #2 on the Billboard charts.

Scotti Brothers was one of the worst record labels ever. Survivor would have been up there with Journey in the popularity department if they had had a decent record company backing them. Although the band sometimes made mistakes like turning down an offer to perform on Saturday Night Live and other shows that would have gotten them good publicity.
Back in the 80's Budweiser offered the band BIG money to do a radio commercial for them, but they turned it down too.

But without question Scotti Brothers screwed the band over by not spending any money to promote the band.

Well said and ALL entirely true. Solid Gold wasn't much help....