OT-Clemens Is Fucked

[Saint John]

It looks like "the rocket" is headed for a crash landing. I never could stand this guy. People need to realize the devastating effect guys like him had on the game. He may have cost someone a Cy Young, which in turn cost them incentive money. Illegitimate wins may have cost a team or teams a shot at the playoffs, and we've learned in baseball that just getting to the post season gives you a chance to win it all. He's part of a large contingent of players that have cost honest players money, cost franchises the potential opportunity to make the playoffs and perhaps win a championship, and lied about all of it. This man should never see the baseball hall of fame. I don't give a shit what he did pre-steroids, he compromised the integrity of the game, knowingly participated in cheating, created false records (along with many others), and lied about it. No way this guy should be in the hall of fame...ever.


NEW YORK (AP) -Brian McNamee has turned over physical evidence that Roger Clemens' former trainer believes will show the seven-time Cy Young Award winner used performance-enhancing drugs, McNamee's attorneys told The New York Daily News.


In the report, an anonymous source close to McNamee said the former trainer gave the Justice Department's BALCO investigators vials with traces of steroids and growth hormone, as well as bloodstained syringes and gauze pads.

McNamee's attorneys told the newspaper he has turned over the evidence to federal investigators but did not provide details of the evidence.

``This is evidence the government has that we believe will corroborate Brian in every significant way,'' one of McNamee's lawyers, Earl Ward, said in an article posted on the newspaper's Web site Tuesday.

McNamee told former Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell he injected Clemens with performance-enhancing drugs at least 16 times in 1998, 2000 and 2001. Clemens has vehemently denied ever using performance-enhancing drugs.

McNamee is scheduled to be interviewed by House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform lawyers Thursday in preparation for next week's congressional hearing following up on the Mitchell Report on doping in baseball.

The newspaper reported Justice Department officials have sent the evidence to a lab for testing. If the materials prove to contain traces of drugs and blood, prosecutors may attempt to get a court order for a DNA sample from Clemens.

``We will provide Congress with corroborative physical evidence that takes this case out of the he-said, she-said purview,'' another McNamee lawyer, Richard Emery, told the Daily News. ``From our point of view, this corroborates that Brian told the truth from Day One and Clemens has not.''

McNamee kept syringes, gauze pads and vials from the 2000 and 2001 seasons because he feared Clemens would deny illicit drug use if the matter was ever investigated, according to the anonymous source cited by the newspaper.

[Maui Tom]

Looks like Roger's "Greg Anderson" talked....

[Rhiannon]

Chipper Jones and John Smoltz would never do such a thing.

[Maui Tom]

Chipper Jones and John Smoltz would never do such a thing.

John wouldn't...Larry might....

[StoneCold]

Clemens ALWAYS came off smug. His trainer kept stuff from 2000 & 2001? Wow, talk about revenge for something.

[Saint John]

Clemens ALWAYS came off smug. His trainer kept stuff from 2000 & 2001? Wow, talk about revenge for something.

That part caught my eye as well. This McNamee clown should see the inside of a prison as well.

[Saint John]

Chipper Jones and John Smoltz would never do such a thing.

John wouldn't...Larry might....

I honestly don't think either would and the fact that they're both hurt somewhat often shows me that they play the game the honest way. One of the biggest benefits of steroids and especially HGH is faster recovery time from sore muscles and/or injuries. This whole steroid era makes Greg Maddux easily the best player of the last 20 or so years...maybe more.

[Rhiannon]

Chipper Jones and John Smoltz would never do such a thing.

John wouldn't...Larry might....

I honestly don't think either would and the face that they're both hurt somewhat often shows me that they play the game the honest way. One of the biggest benefits of steroids and especially HGH is faster recovery time from sore muscles and/or injuries. This whole steroid era makes Greg Maddux easily the best player of the last 20 or so years...maybe more.

Hell yes. Especially one 10 year stretch from 93-03.

[annie89509]

I make it a point to stay out of politics and sports discussions, but this is an eye-opening relevation! Didn't Clemens just met in closed Congress Sessions about the Mitchell Report, denying steroids use ... again, only this time he was testifying before Congress -- under oath. Boy, I'll say he's fu*ked!

[Journey/Survivor]

Yeah, they deliver the news paper to my house really early, so I already have the Thursday paper, and there's another article about proof that they have of Clemens having used steroids and HGH.

Clemens is a punk anyway, he deserves to get in some trouble.

[Gibby]

Clemens is a gigantic asshole. The guy is famous in MLB circles for abusing amphetamines on game days to pep up and give himself an edge. My brother managed a MLB clubhouse for 8 years. For some reason, amphetamine usage in baseball has never been made to be a big deal. Every major league clubhouse has large supplies of 'greenies' that some players will use and abuse to enhance their play. A short drive into Mexico from Arizona spring training facilities is where most of the amphetamines are purchased.

[NealIsGod]

Yeah, they deliver the news paper to my house really early, so I already have the Thursday paper

Damn, can you give me tomorrow's lottery numbers?

[Rhiannon]

Yeah, they deliver the news paper to my house really early, so I already have the Thursday paper

Damn, can you give me tomorrow's lottery numbers?

71-21-23-47-01... now turn around three times and spit to the East. Burn one white candle, and holding three chicken bones recite this incantation: "Today is yesterday's tomorrow. The lottery is retarded." Amen.

[WIX]

clemens was, and is always a total arrogant prick.

[strangegrey]

I have a serious problem with cheating in professional sports, period. Whether it's Roger Clemens (or any other NY Yankee similarly implicated by Mitchell), Bill Bilichick, Barry Bonds, etc.

What the governing bodies of professional sports fails to realize that the motivation for cheating extends beyond money...They have to realize that the motivation here is to step on the throats of legitimate participants/opponents to establish themselves a legacy. If it was just a fine, Clemens would pay it, so would Barry, Bill paid his slap on the wrist...And they go on doing what they do, figuring that the law of averages will work out in their favor.

I feel that for professional sports to get out from under this black cloud, the governing body of a sport, be it Bud Selig, Goodell, or whatnot....needs to take a bold step in cutting the out the motivation for cheating.

My solution is this:

* If you're remotely associated with cheating (via steroids or video camera), you should be immediately suspended from the sport pending a review from an independent board.

* If upon conclusion of a review, you are found to be innocent of charges, you are reinstated with no further action.

* If you are found to be guilty, the following actions should take place (without possibility of review/appeal):
1. You are immediately banned for life from the sport.
2. All awards, records, achievements are stripped from you and handed to the next person in line that you cheated to get past.
3. Any awards, titles won by a team that you played for are stripped from the team and handed to the next team in line.

The above seems extreme, but I gaurantee you, because of #3, there will never be cheating in sports ever again...because you will force the sport to self-police itself. No one will want to be on a team with someone doing steroids, or the head coach videotaping the oposing team to gain an unfair competitive advantage....because *that* person's legacy stands a chance at being tarnished. Think about it...you live your entire life with integrity in baseball, but the mere possibility that the pitcher on your team (by using steroids) can strip you of your HR Derby title will force you to keep that pitcher (and everyone else on the team) honest!

It sounds extreme, but at this stage, it's necessary...because Steroids and HGH are still rampant in the MLB and the NFL...and as we're begining to find out, a dynasty in football (even though it's close to economically impossible) might not be all that it laid out to be.



I've been a huge proponent of doing a soft reset of all records, titles and acolades in baseball back to the strike in 94. I feel that there's been enough cheating from 95 on to call everything conducted in the sport into question. I also feel Bud Selig needs to be thrown out on his ass. Because of ownership greed, bud selig has been allowed to remain and create this hoax of baseball we've watched since 94.

Unfortately the above, isn't going to happen....so the next best thing needs to happen....which is every action attached to a player needs to be called into question, whenever an individual player is found to be guilty of cheating. It may mean that the NY Yankees have to give back 4 rings, the red sox 2 rings, The Braves 1, Scott Brocius (whom I firmly believe never touched a steroid) would have to give back his 98 WS MVP title, just for being on the same team as Knoblauch, etc, etc. Clemens would have to return all his Cy Youngs, his place on the all-century team, his 2 WS rings, etc.

That would restore baseball's dignity. Anything other, is simply unacceptable.

[hoagiepete]

Looks like Roger's "Greg Anderson" talked....

I guess Clemens isn't willing to ante up like Bonds. What is Anderson getting paid to sit in the slammer anyway. It must be a huge sum.

[texafana]

Wake up, everyone in commercial sports cheat. At some point the entire NFL is going to go down in a ball of flame due to steroids, drugs, etc. Now days, it's simply about how much money you can make for yourself and your team before you get caught. And Joe Public has no problem with it....until someone gets caught.

[frfksakes]

Just a thought- but I'm not so sure "Clemens is fucked" over this (and I could really care less, either way).

I mean, how hard would it be for him to add steroid traces to the pads and syringe barrels (Perhaps they were even contaminated “accidentally” ).
The blood on the syringes, etc, could be from B-12 shots.

Unless he has something else, this might still just be his word against Clemens.

It looks like "the rocket" is headed for a crash landing. I never could stand this guy. People need to realize the devastating effect guys like him had on the game. He may have cost someone a Cy Young, which in turn cost them incentive money. Illegitimate wins may have cost a team or teams a shot at the playoffs, and we've learned in baseball that just getting to the post season gives you a chance to win it all. He's part of a large contingent of players that have cost honest players money, cost franchises the potential opportunity to make the playoffs and perhaps win a championship, and lied about all of it. This man should never see the baseball hall of fame. I don't give a shit what he did pre-steroids, he compromised the integrity of the game, knowingly participated in cheating, created false records (along with many others), and lied about it. No way this guy should be in the hall of fame...ever.


NEW YORK (AP) -Brian McNamee has turned over physical evidence that Roger Clemens' former trainer believes will show the seven-time Cy Young Award winner used performance-enhancing drugs, McNamee's attorneys told The New York Daily News.


In the report, an anonymous source close to McNamee said the former trainer gave the Justice Department's BALCO investigators vials with traces of steroids and growth hormone, as well as bloodstained syringes and gauze pads.McNamee's attorneys told the newspaper he has turned over the evidence to federal investigators but did not provide details of the evidence.

``This is evidence the government has that we believe will corroborate Brian in every significant way,'' one of McNamee's lawyers, Earl Ward, said in an article posted on the newspaper's Web site Tuesday.

McNamee told former Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell he injected Clemens with performance-enhancing drugs at least 16 times in 1998, 2000 and 2001. Clemens has vehemently denied ever using performance-enhancing drugs.

McNamee is scheduled to be interviewed by House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform lawyers Thursday in preparation for next week's congressional hearing following up on the Mitchell Report on doping in baseball.

The newspaper reported Justice Department officials have sent the evidence to a lab for testing. If the materials prove to contain traces of drugs and blood, prosecutors may attempt to get a court order for a DNA sample from Clemens.

``We will provide Congress with corroborative physical evidence that takes this case out of the he-said, she-said purview,'' another McNamee lawyer, Richard Emery, told the Daily News. ``From our point of view, this corroborates that Brian told the truth from Day One and Clemens has not.''

McNamee kept syringes, gauze pads and vials from the 2000 and 2001 seasons because he feared Clemens would deny illicit drug use if the matter was ever investigated, according to the anonymous source cited by the newspaper.

[Rockindeano]

If you aren't cheating, you aren't trying, and it's only cheating if you get caught.

Baseball- stealing signs, pine tar, emery boards, Vaseline and Roids.
Football- Videotaping, sign stealing, stick em, and Roids
Basketball- who cares
Hockey- curved stick(remember Marty McSorley in the Finals in 82?)
Golf- Doesn't matter because Tiger will still beat you down
Horse Racing- Supplements in the horse's blood, buzzers
Soccer- I wish somebody would cheat, because it sucks so bad
Nascar-body tampering, fuel tampering
NCAA sports- Academic pencil whipping- see Miami, Florida, Florida St, Ohio St, and Michigan

[Red13JoePa]

Dear Pat Gillick:

Roll out the red carpet and try to get Clemens to sign with the Phillies this year for the stretch run.

Red13JoePa.

[RedWingFan]

If you aren't cheating, you aren't trying, and it's only cheating if you get caught.

Baseball- stealing signs, pine tar, emery boards, Vaseline and Roids.
Football- Videotaping, sign stealing, stick em, and Roids
Basketball- who cares
Hockey- curved stick(remember Marty McSorley in the Finals in 82?)
Golf- Doesn't matter because Tiger will still beat you down
Horse Racing- Supplements in the horse's blood, buzzers
Soccer- I wish somebody would cheat, because it sucks so badNascar-body tampering, fuel tampering
NCAA sports- Academic pencil whipping- see Miami, Florida, Florida St, Ohio St, and Michigan

[larryfromnextdoor]

i dont know why.. but this entire Clemens thing has me stuck on a.m. radio..

the only thing on is Bobby Knight and Clemens.. ive listened to so much of both stories.. im sort of an expert on the theories..

it reminds me of the ollie north trials.. im just glued to it..

[caboshooter]

Roger Clemens's Stash?
Accuser releases photo "proof" of star pitcher's steroid contraband

FEBRUARY 7--Lawyers for Brian McNamee, the trainer who has accused ex-client Roger Clemens of using performance-enhancing drugs, today released photos purporting to show syringes, blood-specked gauze pads, and drug vials used by the embattled baseball star. The photos can be found on the following two pages (it is unclear what the significance is of the Miller Lite can seen in the below image). McNamee's lawyers have said that the items were turned over last month to federal investigators who have been probing the widespread use and distribution of illegal substances by professional athletes. McNamee has previously charged that he injected Clemens with steroids and human growth hormone on about 16 occasions between 1998 and 2001. He reportedly kept the used vials, syringes, and gauze as some kind of insurance policy were he to get caught distributing the drugs.

[NealIsGod]

That looks like Saint John's house on a typical Saturday night.

[Saint John]

That looks like Saint John's house on a typical Saturday night.

Dude, I've been trying to get a hold of HGH for over a year now. In small, proper doses that shit is supposed to be like the fountain of youth. Besides, it can't turn me into an irritable prick like Clemens because I already am!!!

[NealIsGod]

That looks like Saint John's house on a typical Saturday night.

Dude, I've been trying to get a hold of HGH for over a year now. In small, proper doses that shit is supposed to be like the fountain of youth.

Send a shipment to Perry and watch out!

[Saint John]

That looks like Saint John's house on a typical Saturday night.

Dude, I've been trying to get a hold of HGH for over a year now. In small, proper doses that shit is supposed to be like the fountain of youth.

Send a shipment to Perry and watch out!

I said the fountain of youth not a testicle transplant. I'm overtired and should probably go to bed now.