Should Journey Have Changed Their Name?

[Enigma869]

Actually, I can almost guarantee you Cleveland has turned out more good things than Boston. Alright, Boston has history from the early years of the country, but not much since.

By the way, you do know that on a national level it is well-known that Boston sports teams are given preferential treatment by the leagues, officials and media. The only Baseball team that might get as much or more preferential treatment is the Yankees. And what a classy move by that idiot George Mitchell who happens to be directly associated with the Red Sox to decide to announce that they were investigating Paul Byrd for HGH just before a pivotal playoff game between the Indians and Red Sox.

The Browns will compete for a possible Super Bowl birth in 2008. The Indians should be the front runners to win the World Series in 2008. And with LeBron James the Cavs have a great shot at going to the NBA Finals again this year.

Dude...you should stick to Jimi Jamison ball washing threads, because you know NOTHING about sports! Boston sports teams are given preferential treatment? Really? That worked out pretty well for the Red Sox, who prior to 2004 hadn't won a championship in over 80 years! Let's see...The Bruins haven't won a championship in over 35 years, and the Celtics haven't won a championship in 22 years! You're a fucking genius!

As for your suck ass Cleveland teams...the Indians won't even win their own division this season, let alone make it to the World Series! The Cleveland Cadeavars have consistently been one of the worst teams in the NBA, and LeBron James won't change that! They caught lightning in a bottle last year, and it won't happen again! Aside from James, their team SUCKS! As for the Browns...you're smoking crack if you seriously think they're going to the Super Bowl anytime soon, let alone 2008! The only way they're getting there is if they buy a ticket!

As for the famous people each city has turned out...post your Cleveland list, and I'll see if I can compete. My money is on Boston! Throw EVERYONE in there (dead or alive)...actors, musicians, journalists, poets, inventors, and anyone else you can think of! Hell, I'll even let you count Drew Carey as two people


John from Boston

[Journey/Survivor]

Actually, I can almost guarantee you Cleveland has turned out more good things than Boston. Alright, Boston has history from the early years of the country, but not much since.

By the way, you do know that on a national level it is well-known that Boston sports teams are given preferential treatment by the leagues, officials and media. The only Baseball team that might get as much or more preferential treatment is the Yankees. And what a classy move by that idiot George Mitchell who happens to be directly associated with the Red Sox to decide to announce that they were investigating Paul Byrd for HGH just before a pivotal playoff game between the Indians and Red Sox.

The Browns will compete for a possible Super Bowl birth in 2008. The Indians should be the front runners to win the World Series in 2008. And with LeBron James the Cavs have a great shot at going to the NBA Finals again this year.

Dude...you should stick to Jimi Jamison ball washing threads, because you know NOTHING about sports! Boston sports teams are given preferential treatment? Really? That worked out pretty well for the Red Sox, who prior to 2004 hadn't won a championship in over 80 years! Let's see...The Bruins haven't won a championship in over 35 years, and the Celtics haven't won a championship in 22 years! You're a fucking genius!

As for your suck ass Cleveland teams...the Indians won't even win their own division this season, let alone make it to the World Series! The Cleveland Cadeavars have consistently been one of the worst teams in the NBA, and LeBron James won't change that! They caught lightning in a bottle last year, and it won't happen again! Aside from James, their team SUCKS! As for the Browns...you're smoking crack if you seriously think they're going to the Super Bowl anytime soon, let alone 2008! The only way they're getting there is if they buy a ticket!

As for the famous people each city has turned out...post your Cleveland list, and I'll see if I can compete. My money is on Boston! Throw EVERYONE in there (dead or alive)...actors, musicians, journalists, poets, inventors, and anyone else you can think of! Hell, I'll even let you count Drew Carey as two people


John from Boston

Hey, write it down if you want, the Indians, Browns and Cavs will all get to or at least come very close to winning titles in the next year, i.e. World Series, Super Bowl and NBA Finals.

If I'm going to name all of the famous people who are from Cleveland I will need a couple of days, I can't add them all up in 1 night, and I don't want to spend all night on it either. Don't worry, I won't forget, I'll get you a list in the next 2 to 3 days.

[Enigma869]

If I'm going to name all of the famous people who are from Cleveland I will need a couple of days, I can't add them all up in 1 night, and I don't want to spend all night on it either. Don't worry, I won't forget, I'll get you a list in the next 2 to 3 days.

Alright...I've done my Boston homework, and here's the best I can come up with in just one night of work

Companies that are based in Boston area:

Staples
Reebok
Gillette
3Com
Bose
BJ's Wholesale Club
Boston Scientific
EMC
TJX Corporation (owners of Marshalls, Homegoods, TJ Maxx, and many others)
Converse
Monster.com
Dunkin' Donuts
CVS Pharmacy (started in Boston area, but has since relocated corporate offices to Rhode Island)
Biogen
Raytheon
Poloroid
New Balance
Fidelity Investments
Putnam Investments
Liberty Mutual
Houghton Mifflin


Musicians from Boston:

Steve Smith (of Journey)
Aerosmith (Probably the most legendary American rock band)
The Cars
J. Geils Band
Donna Summer
Bobby Brown (we try not to claim him)
Boston
James Taylor
Staind
Godsmack
Guster
Extreme
Letters to Cleo
New Edition
Steven Van Zandt (Springsteen's E. Street Band)

A Few Movies Filmed In Boston:

Good Will Hunting
The Departed
A Civil Action
The Perfect Storm
Legally Blonde
Fever Pitch
Gone Baby Gone
Mystic River

Famous People from Boston:

Jay Leno
Conan O'Brien
Steven Wright
Dane Cook
Jeffrey Lurie (Owns Philadelphia Eagles)
Robert Kraft (Owns Patriots)
Frank McCourt (Owns Los Angeles Dodgers)
J.P. Ricciardi (G.M. Of Toronto Blue Jays)
Uma Thurman
Michael Bloomberg (Damn traitor mayor of New York City)
William Bratton (LAPD Police Chief)
Marcia Cross (actress)
Denis Leary (comedian)
Geena Davis (actress)
Eliza Dushku (actress)
Patrick Ewing (longtime Center for Knicks)
Edward Norton (actor)
Steve Carrell
John F. Kennedy
John Adams
Sumner Redstone (ran Viacom)
John Quincy Adams
George Herbert Walker Bush
Ben Affleck
Matt Damon
Leonard Nimoy
Mark Wahlberg
Lesley Stahl (60 Minutes fame)
Mike Wallace (60 Minutes fame)
Barbara Walters
Howie Long (played for Raiders)
Tom Glavine
Matt Hasselbeck (QB of Seahawks)
John Cena (pro wrestler)
Samuel Adams (Think beer)
Susan B. Anthony
Jeff Bagwell (played 20 years for Astros)
Clara Barton (founded American Red Cross)
Leonard Bernstein (Classical conductor and composer)
Bette Davis (actress)
Rachel Dratch (Saturday Night Live)
James Dole (Think pineapples)
Ralph Waldo Emerson
Benjamin Franklin
Peter Gammons (ESPN)
Nathaniel Hawthorne (writer)
Oliver Wendell Holmes (writer)
Matt LeBlanc (was on the NBC show Friends)
Henry Wadsworth Longfellow (poet)
Rocky Marciano (Boxer)
Samuel Morse (think Morse Code)
Tip O'Neil (longest service Speaker of The House in U.S. History)
Edgar Allan Poe (poet)
Paul Revere
Henry David Thoreau (writer)
Samuel Wilson (think Uncle Sam)
Olympia Dukakis (actress)
Jasmine Guy (actress)
Jack Lemmon (actor)
F. Lee Bailey (attorney)
Jane Curtain (actress)
E.E. Cummings (author)
Alexander Graham Bell (we all know who he was)
Michael Chiklis (actor)
Theodore Geisel (better known as Dr. Seuss)
David E. Kelley (famed tv producer)
Ed McMahon (Johnny Carson's sidekick)
Kurt Russell (born in Massachusetts, but relocated to Maine)
Norman Rockwell (painter)

Top 20 hospitals in the country: (yes, I know you have the Cleveland Clinic, but that's only one)

Brigham and Women's Hospital
Massachusetts General Hospital
Children's Hospital
Dana Farber Cancer Institute

Finally, did I mention that we're home to Harvard and M.I.T., to say nothing of all the other great colleges in the number one college town in America!

Jesus...you were right, Jamison dude...that was A LOT of work! I'm sure I missed a whole lot of people, but that's the best I could do!


John from Boston

[Journey/Survivor]

If I'm going to name all of the famous people who are from Cleveland I will need a couple of days, I can't add them all up in 1 night, and I don't want to spend all night on it either. Don't worry, I won't forget, I'll get you a list in the next 2 to 3 days.

Alright...I've done my Boston homework, and here's the best I can come up with in just one night of work

Companies that are based in Boston area:

Staples
Reebok
Gillette
3Com
Bose
BJ's Wholesale Club
Boston Scientific
EMC
TJX Corporation (owners of Marshalls, Homegoods, TJ Maxx, and many others)
Converse
Monster.com
Dunkin' Donuts
CVS Pharmacy (started in Boston area, but has since relocated corporate offices to Rhode Island)
Biogen
Raytheon
Poloroid
New Balance
Fidelity Investments
Putnam Investments
Liberty Mutual
Houghton Mifflin


Musicians from Boston:

Steve Smith (of Journey)
Aerosmith (The number one selling U.S. Band of All Time)
The Cars
J. Geils Band
Donna Summer
Bobby Brown (we try not to claim him)
Boston
James Taylor
Staind
Godsmack
Guster
Extreme
Letters to Cleo
New Edition
Steven Van Zandt (Springsteen's E. Street Band)

A Few Movies Filmed In Boston:

Good Will Hunting
The Departed
A Civil Action
The Perfect Storm
Legally Blonde
Fever Pitch
Gone Baby Gone
Mystic River

Famous People from Boston:

Jay Leno
Conan O'Brien
Steven Wright
Dane Cook
Uma Thurman
Michael Bloomberg (Damn traitor mayor of New York City)
William Bratton (LAPD Police Chief)
Marcia Cross (actress)
Denis Leary (comedian)
Geena Davis (actress)
Eliza Dushku (actress)
Patrick Ewing (longtime Center for Knicks)
Edward Norton (actor)
Steve Carrell
John F. Kennedy
John Adams
Sumner Redstone (ran Viacom)
John Quincy Adams
George Herbert Walker Bush
Ben Affleck
Matt Damon
Leonard Nimoy
Mark Wahlberg
Lesley Stahl (60 Minutes fame)
Mike Wallace (60 Minutes fame)
Barbara Walters
Howie Long (played for Raiders)
Tom Glavine
Matt Hasselbeck (QB of Seahawks)
John Cena (pro wrestler)
Samuel Adams (Think beer)
Susan B. Anthony
Jeff Bagwell (played 20 years for Astros)
Clara Barton (founded American Red Cross)
Leonard Bernstein (Classical conductor and composer)
Bette Davis (actress)
Rachel Dratch (Saturday Night Live)
James Dole (Think pineapples)
Ralph Waldo Emerson
Benjamin Franklin
Peter Gammons (ESPN)
Nathaniel Hawthorne (writer)
Oliver Wendell Holmes (writer)
Matt LeBlanc (was on the NBC show Friends)
Henry Wadsworth Longfellow (poet)
Rocky Marciano (Boxer)
Samuel Morse (think Morse Code)
Tip O'Neil (longest service Speaker of The House in U.S. History)
Edgar Allan Poe (poet)
Paul Revere
Henry David Thoreau (writer)
Samuel Wilson (think Uncle Sam)
Olympia Dukakis (actress)
Jasmine Guy (actress)
Jack Lemmon (actor)
F. Lee Bailey (attorney)
Jane Curtain (actress)
E.E. Cummings (author)
Alexander Graham Bell (we all know who he was)
Michael Chiklis (actor)
Theodore Geisel (better known as Dr. Seuss)
David E. Kelley (famed tv producer)
Ed McMahon (Johnny Carson's sidekick)
Kurt Russell (born in Massachusetts, but relocated to Maine)
Norman Rockwell (painter)

Top 20 hospitals in the country: (yes, I know you have the Cleveland Clinic, but that's only one)

Brigham and Women's Hospital
Massachusetts General Hospital
Children's Hospital
Dana Farber Cancer Institute

Finally, did I mention that we're home to Harvard and M.I.T., to say nothing of all the other great colleges in the number one college town in America!

Jesus...you were right, Jamison dude...that was A LOT of work! I'm sure I missed a whole lot of people, but that's the best I could do!


John from Boston

I'm not done yet. But I'll respond to a few things really quick.

Funny thing is that you explained who certain people are that I already know who they are, and then you didn't explain who some are that I don't know who they are.

About the Hospitals, we not only have the world famous Cleveland Clinic, you know the hospital that kings, popes, actors and athletes go to, but we also have....
University Hospital, which usually ranks in the top 10 in the country
Rainbow Babies And Children's Hospital that is generally ranked as the #1 best children's hospital in the country.
Case Western Reserve Hospital that is well respected
Metro Hospital one of the best urban hospital's in the country, and they have the only level 1 trauma center for hundreds of miles in any direction.

I know that obviously Boston had famous and historical people from the early days of America, it would be silly to debate that Boston had a great deal of early history.

[finalfight]

Neal had a name, but no where NEAR the level he had intended all those years ago. I'm going to be doing a survey, of people, not internet based at all. I'll hold up three pictures. One of Schon, one of Perry, and one of Pineda... and ask people on the street, all ages, to name who it is in the picture. Let's see how many know Neal.

For starters outside of the Phillipines basically no-one is going to recognise Pineda yet, thats obvious. To be fair very few would recognise Cain, Valery or Castro either and the same goes for many bands. However I will give you the fact that no-one would recognise Schon - not even his own mother would recognise him at this point!

Brian May has been pimping out Queen for years now. We Will Rock You the musical followed by Nu-Queen with Paul Rogers. And May has the stones to berate Journey's decisions from behind the safety of a keyboard (and yes I see the irony)! And as for the Beatles catalogue - didn't Michael Jackson once own the rights to the majority of songs that they wrote? Hardly a good result if you ask me.

You've got to be fucking KIDDING ME.... are you even suggesting that Queen & the Beatles' music isn't pure classic... drugs are bad dude.

Um, no I didn't say anything about the quality of the original music at all. However your view on the use of drugs appears somewhat askew. Whilst i've never touched them I would bet there sure were alot of them being used during the creation of the music you so revere. Still think drugs are bad...? For the record I do!

It's 2008 and Journey's on the road again. Much as I love his music and voice Perry's not coming back. What more could you possibly want?

For them to have chosen integrity. I agree, Perry's not coming back. At this point, I don't care about that either. 10 years is too damn long to wait. I'm putting my concert money into Evanescence, Linkin Park, the Police. You can have the dirty dozen.

Evanescense, Linkin Park..! What are you 12? Your whole arguement just went up in smoke. I bet you responded to this thread whilst listening to your Daughtry album or whatever this weeks current fad is.

[Playitloudforme]

Neal had a name, but no where NEAR the level he had intended all those years ago. I'm going to be doing a survey, of people, not internet based at all. I'll hold up three pictures. One of Schon, one of Perry, and one of Pineda... and ask people on the street, all ages, to name who it is in the picture. Let's see how many know Neal.

For starters outside of the Phillipines basically no-one is going to recognise Pineda yet, thats obvious. To be fair very few would recognise Cain, Valery or Castro either and the same goes for many bands. However I will give you the fact that no-one would recognise Schon - not even his own mother would recognise him at this point!

Brian May has been pimping out Queen for years now. We Will Rock You the musical followed by Nu-Queen with Paul Rogers. And May has the stones to berate Journey's decisions from behind the safety of a keyboard (and yes I see the irony)! And as for the Beatles catalogue - didn't Michael Jackson once own the rights to the majority of songs that they wrote? Hardly a good result if you ask me.

You've got to be fucking KIDDING ME.... are you even suggesting that Queen & the Beatles' music isn't pure classic... drugs are bad dude.

Um, no I didn't say anything about the quality of the original music at all. However your view on the use of drugs appears somewhat askew. Whilst i've never touched them I would bet there sure were alot of them being used during the creation of the music you so revere. Still think drugs are bad...? For the record I do!

It's 2008 and Journey's on the road again. Much as I love his music and voice Perry's not coming back. What more could you possibly want?

For them to have chosen integrity. I agree, Perry's not coming back. At this point, I don't care about that either. 10 years is too damn long to wait. I'm putting my concert money into Evanescence, Linkin Park, the Police. You can have the dirty dozen.

Evanescense, Linkin Park..! What are you 12? Your whole arguement just went up in smoke. I bet you responded to this thread whilst listening to your Daughtry album or whatever this weeks current fad is.

What's saddest is you went back 3 pages to continue this pointless argument with me. Enough.

[ttango1]

www.nkotb.com


AS I recall these fools are from beantown as well.

[finalfight]

Neal had a name, but no where NEAR the level he had intended all those years ago. I'm going to be doing a survey, of people, not internet based at all. I'll hold up three pictures. One of Schon, one of Perry, and one of Pineda... and ask people on the street, all ages, to name who it is in the picture. Let's see how many know Neal.

For starters outside of the Phillipines basically no-one is going to recognise Pineda yet, thats obvious. To be fair very few would recognise Cain, Valery or Castro either and the same goes for many bands. However I will give you the fact that no-one would recognise Schon - not even his own mother would recognise him at this point!

Brian May has been pimping out Queen for years now. We Will Rock You the musical followed by Nu-Queen with Paul Rogers. And May has the stones to berate Journey's decisions from behind the safety of a keyboard (and yes I see the irony)! And as for the Beatles catalogue - didn't Michael Jackson once own the rights to the majority of songs that they wrote? Hardly a good result if you ask me.

You've got to be fucking KIDDING ME.... are you even suggesting that Queen & the Beatles' music isn't pure classic... drugs are bad dude.

Um, no I didn't say anything about the quality of the original music at all. However your view on the use of drugs appears somewhat askew. Whilst i've never touched them I would bet there sure were alot of them being used during the creation of the music you so revere. Still think drugs are bad...? For the record I d o!

It's 2008 and Journey's on the road again. Much as I love his music and voice Perry's not coming back. What more could you possibly want?

For them to have chosen integrity. I agree, Perry's not coming back. At this point, I don't care about that either. 10 years is too damn long to wait. I'm putting my concert money into Evanescence, Linkin Park, the Police. You can have the dirty dozen.

Evanescense, Linkin Park..! What are you 12? Your whole arguement just went up in smoke. I bet you responded to this thread whilst listening to your Daughtry album or whatever this weeks current fad is.

What's saddest is you went back 3 pages to continue this pointless argument with me. Enough.

Actually I have been asleep for the past seven hours. Would you prefer that people simply do not read anything between the time that they sign off and the new posts that are made? That way you could get away with slipping in snide comments about people being on drugs unnoticed.

This whole thread is pointless yet we both chose to post in it. Perhaps we should just agree to disagree and move on to something more productive?

[Playitloudforme]

This whole thread is pointless yet we both chose to post in it. Perhaps we should just agree to disagree and move on to something more productive?

Already moved on man. Fair enough.

[finalfight]

This whole thread is pointless yet we both chose to post in it. Perhaps we should just agree to disagree and move on to something more productive?

Already moved on man. Fair enough.

Cool. Sorry if I offended you. I guess we are both just extremely passionate about the music. For the record I liked Linkin Park's Reanimation record.

[Playitloudforme]

This whole thread is pointless yet we both chose to post in it. Perhaps we should just agree to disagree and move on to something more productive?

Already moved on man. Fair enough.

Cool. Sorry if I offended you. I guess we are both just extremely passionate about the music. For the record I liked Linkin Park's Reanimation record.

cool. I've met Chester in person, and he's the nicest guy. I just love my rock. Have a good one.

[Journey/Survivor]

This is going to be only part of my list of famous people from Cleveland Ohio.

Bob Hope-actor and comedian
Paul Newman-actor, car racing, food
Debra Winger-actress
Hal Holbrook-actor
Burgess Meredith-actor
Patricia Heaton-actress
Halle Berry-actress
Arsenio Hall-actor, comedian, talk show host
Drew Carey-actor, comedian, game show host
Alan Ruck-actor
Jim Backus-actor, comedian
Tim Conway-actor, comedian
John Lithgow-actor
Carol Kane-actress
Wes Craven-director
Joel Grey-actor, has actress daughter
Ruby Dee-actress
Ernie Anderson-actor, famous voice over/narrator
Fred Willard-actor
Franklin Cover-actor
Dorothy Dandridge-actress
Luke Perry-actor
Gene Reynolds-actor
Al Roker-network weather broadcaster
James Lovell-famous astronaut
Henry Mancini-famous composer
Margaret Hamilton-actress
Lillian Gish-actress
Anne Heche-actress
Sean Young-actress
Molly Shannon-actress
Phil Donahue-talk show host
Mike Douglas-talk show host
Steve Harvey-actor, comedian
Kaye Ballard-actress
Terrence Howard-actor
Teri Garr-actress
Jack Riley-actor
Langston Hughes-poet
George Szell-conductor, composer
Michael Symon-Chef
Dr. Oz
Harvey Pekar-comedian, writer
Jack Parr-talk show host
Joe Eszterhas-director
Martin Mull-actor
Frankie Yankovic-musician
Victor Schreckengost-artist
Harlan Ellison-writer
Steve Popovich-music producer
Andy Borowitz-comedian, TV writer
Don Novello-comedian, actor
Bill Watterson-writer, cartoonist
Robert Lockwood Jr.-musician
Screamin' Jay Hawkins-singer
Guy Lombardo-musician
Albert Ayler-musician
Joe Russo-director
Anthony Russo-director
Les Roberts-writer, producer
Michael Stanley-musician
Bobby Womack-singer
Monica Potter-actress
David Canary-actor
Steve Burton-actor
Ray Wise-actor
Nina Blackwood-MTV-VJ
Robert Patrick-actor
Kathryn Hahn-actress
Jack Weston-actor
Tom Batiuk-cartoonist
James Pickens Jr.-actor
Kym E Whitley-actress
LaWanda Page-actress
John Henton-comedian, actor
David Birney-actor
Adolphe Menjou-actor
Joe Lavano-musician
Vanessa Bayer-comedian, actress
Sean Kanan-actor

Tom Hanks and Dean Martin started their careers in Cleveland.



Paul Brown-historic coach
Don Shula-famous coach
Chuck Noll-famous coach
Cy Young-pitcher, Cy Young Award
John Heisman-football player, Heisman award

George Steinbrenner-ship builder, owns Yankees
Don King-Boxing promoter

George Stephanopolous-politics
James A Garfield-President Of the United States
Tim Russert-political analyst

Elliot Ness-the man who brought down Al Capone

Jim Tressel-Ohio State Football coach
Jesse Owens-historic olympian
John D Rockefeller-once the richest man in the world

Jerry Siegel & Joe Schuster-creators of Superman, the Daily Planet was styled after a Cleveland skyscraper
Tom Wilson-creator of Ziggy, and Calvin & Hobbs

LeCharles Bentley-NFL player
Chris Chambers-NFL player
Nate Clements-NFL player
London Fletcher-NFL player
Tim McGee-NFL player
Marion Motley-Hall Of Fame Football player
Tom Tupa-NFL player
Bob Golic-NFL player, actor
Mike Golic-NFL player, sports talk show host
Donte Whitner-NFL player
Troy Smith-former Heisman winner and current NFL player
Dave Zastudil-NFL player

Randy Lerner-one of the richest men in the world, owns Cleveland Browns, used to own MBNA credit card company

Ben Curtis-PGA pro

Joe Walsh-musician
Jim Brickman-musician
Marc Cohn-musician, married to Elizabeth Vargas from ABC Network
Sonny Geraci-musician
Macy Gray-singer
Maynard James Kennan-Rock band "Tool"
Trent Reznor-band "Nine Inch Nails," I think the whole band are from Cleveland, sadly
Eric Singer-musician
Pat Torpey-drummer
Michael cartelone-drummer
Ben Orr-musician
Ric Ocasik-musician
Neil Geraldo-musician, married to Pat Benetar
Kevin Valentine-musician
Eric Carmen-singer
Billy Morris-musician
Tracy Chapman-singer

Carl Stokes-former mayor of Cleveland, first black mayor of a major city in USA

I have a bunch more stuff, but I'm stopping for tonight, Ill get back to it on Saturday

I am not even going to bother naming a lot of actors, musicians, poets, inventors etc, etc from Cleveland, because it would take too long.

But I'm not done yet.

[annie89509]

Seems like we have quite a challenge going between JfromB and J/S. Anyone that would take this much time to list all these names just do not want to back down. Tomorrow is another day, let's see what the guys come up with then.

And I want to tell the teenager, SM, to ease up on OhSherrie. She's a long-time board member and contributor, and certainly entitled to her opinions. What's wrong with kids nowadays? They think they know it all and show no respect for their elders.

[Enigma869]

Funny thing is that you explained who certain people are that I already know who they are, and then you didn't explain who some are that I don't know who they are.

The only people who I didn't identify on that list who you may not have heard of would be Steven Wright (who is a fairly well known comedian), and Uma Thurman (actress). I can't imagine there is anyone else. For the record, I left off hundreds of people. For instance, when it came to athletes, I really only mentioned VERY well known athletes (i.e. guys who had 15+ year careers) or high profile guys from today (i.e. Matt Hasselbeck). I left off guys like Lofa Tatupu (starting linebacker for Seattle), and Stephen Cooper (starting linebacker for Chargers). I also left off about 200 NHL players, as a very large percentage of U.S. born hockey players are from the Boston area.

As for the hospital thing...I will give you the Cleveland Clinic, because it's a very well known and respected facility. That said, I re-checked my facts, and none of those other facilities you mention show up on top hospital lists, anywhere. For the record, I'm not saying they're not great facilities. Just saying they don't rank on any top hospital lists. My father in law is a surgeon, and as he has always told me...most physicians will tell you that collectively, Boston has the best collection of hospitals, in one city, and that if you're going to get sick, Boston is the city to be sick in. That's not to take away from other GREAT hospitals across the country, like Johns Hopkins (ALWAYS ranked VERY high in EVERYTHING), The Mayo Clinic, and UCLA Medical Center.

For the record, there were about 15-20 people on your list of people I've never heard of. I realize that you did identify what they were known for. Just making the point that there were some pretty obscure names on that list, so there


John from Boston

[Rockindeano]

Eric Carmen-singer

LOL. This guy is about as fruity as my Yoplait yogurt. What a fuckin Queen. He makes Kevin Cronin look Lou Ferrigno.

[Enigma869]

www.nkotb.com


AS I recall these fools are from beantown as well.

Jesus...did you have to remind me! For the record, I intentionally forgot them

I'll tell you what though...as "boy bands" go, they may have been the biggest this country has ever seen! I'm proud to say that I NEVER listened to their music and thought they were ridiculous! Teenage girls across America would strongly disagree with me, though. As ridiculous as they were, they made a crapload of money!


John from Boston

[Saint John]

New Kids On The Block are more masculine than KISS, Slaughter, Winger and Cheap Trick. I'd much rather see NKOTB than the 4 bands I mentioned. More chicks, hotter chicks and less nerds.

[Journey/Survivor]

Funny thing is that you explained who certain people are that I already know who they are, and then you didn't explain who some are that I don't know who they are.

The only people who I didn't identify on that list who you may not have heard of would be Steven Wright (who is a fairly well known comedian), and Uma Thurman (actress). I can't imagine there is anyone else. For the record, I left off hundreds of people. For instance, when it came to athletes, I really only mentioned VERY well known athletes (i.e. guys who had 15+ year careers) or high profile guys from today (i.e. Matt Hasselbeck). I left off guys like Lofa Tatupu (starting linebacker for Seattle), and Stephen Cooper (starting linebacker for Chargers). I also left off about 200 NHL players, as a very large percentage of U.S. born hockey players are from the Boston area.

As for the hospital thing...I will give you the Cleveland Clinic, because it's a very well known and respected facility. That said, I re-checked my facts, and none of those other facilities you mention show up on top hospital lists, anywhere. For the record, I'm not saying they're not great facilities. Just saying they don't rank on any top hospital lists. My father in law is a surgeon, and as he has always told me...most physicians will tell you that collectively, Boston has the best collection of hospitals, in one city, and that if you're going to get sick, Boston is the city to be sick in. That's not to take away from other GREAT hospitals across the country, like Johns Hopkins (ALWAYS ranked VERY high in EVERYTHING), The Mayo Clinic, and UCLA Medical Center.

For the record, there were about 15-20 people on your list of people I've never heard of. I realize that you did identify what they were known for. Just making the point that there were some pretty obscure names on that list, so there


John from Boston

I don't know who Steven Wright is, but I do of course know who Uma Thurman is.

Like I mentioned, I haven't bothered to name TONS of actors, athletes, musicians etc, etc.

Cleveland's University Hospital is usually ranked very high, in the not to distant past it was ranked in the top 5. I remember about ten years ago the Cleveland Clinic was ranked #1 in the country, and that same year University Hospital was ranked #5 in the country.

University Hospital is one of the very top hospital's in the country for curing and treating cancer.

Rainbow Babies And Children's Hospital is usually ranked as the #1 children's hospital in the country.

The state of Ohio has the most highly ranked hospitals in the country right now, and Cleveland has the most highly ranked hospitals in Ohio.

Name some of the Cleveland celebrities that you don't know who they are, and I'll tell you what their the most well known for.

I'm still not done with my list, but I should have it on by late tonight.

[weatherman90]

Robert Fleischman IS Journey.

[conversationpc]

New Kids On The Block are more masculine than KISS, Slaughter, Winger and Cheap Trick. I'd much rather see NKOTB than the 4 bands I mentioned. More chicks, hotter chicks and less nerds.

Big Gay Al agrees.

[Enigma869]

The state of Ohio has the most highly ranked hospitals in the country right now, and Cleveland has the most highly ranked hospitals in Ohio.

Sorry dude...Just because you insist upon something doesn't make it true! Here is US News and World Report's 2007 list. http://health.usnews.com/usnews/health/ ... orroll.htm Two Boston hospitals rank in the top 10 (which is the fewest number I've ever seen on this list), and only ONE hospital in the entire state of Ohio shows up in the 18 hospitals that are listed! I'm not going to get into a pissing contest over it. I know for a fact that in medical circles, Boston is considered the "medical hub" to many physicians who have never even stepped foot in the state of Massachusetts!

By the way...a plug for you...When I did some Cleveland research, I found out Sherwin-Williams is headquartered. What do you know...a company we've all heard of, calling "The Mistake By The Lake" home

Also, for anyone who cares...here is the list of our nation's top colleges:
http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandrevie ... _brief.php

For the record, 2 Boston colleges rank in the top 7, and 5 Boston colleges rank in the top 35! One single school in the entire state of Ohio is ranked in the top 50! Give it up Mr. Jamison...It's not even close! Listen, I admire your civic pride. Frankly, EVERYONE should love their hometown, but between Boston and Cleveland, it's just not close. There isn't anyone outside of Cleveland who would say Cleveland outranks Boston as an overall city! Did I mention that Boston invented "First Night" celebrations on New Year's Eve?? We were the first city in America to celebrate First Night, on New Year's Eve, back in the early 1970's, and now every major city in America has copied us and hosts their own "First Night". Also, the 4th of July Boston fireworks are on TV here in North Carolina! One more thing...You have Jacob's Field...We have Fenway Park!


John from Boston

[Journey/Survivor]

More Cleveland facts.

Cleveland's real nickname is "The Best Location In The Nation."

"Mistake on the lake" was what Cleveland Municipal Stadium was nicknamed. It wasn't until Johnny Carson strictly as a joke started referring to the city by that name that others started to call it that.

Cleveland is the only city in the United States to have been named as an "All American City" 5 different times.

In 2005 Cleveland and Pittsburgh were named as the two "Most Livable Cities" in America.

In several recent years Cleveland has been named "The Comeback City Of America."


Inventions and firsts from Cleveland....

First Street lights, also invented here
First Traffic Lights, also invented here
Gas Mask invented
Automatic Windshield Wipers invented here
American Made Standard Gasoline Automobile invented here
Diesel Engine invented here
Air Traffic Control Tower invented here
Live Savers Candy invented here
First Indoor Shopping Center/Mall in the country
Second Indoor Shopping Center/Mall in country
First Free Home Delivery Of Mail/First Mailman's Uniform
First Newspaper For African American's
First African American Cultural Center in America
First Ongoing Forum For Free speech
First Health Museum In America
Padded Bicycle Seat invented here
First Street Cars invented and used here
X-Ray Machine And Whole Body Scanner invented here
Modern Golfball invented here

Cleveland DJ Alan Freed creates name "Rock & Roll" to describe style of music
First Rock & Roll Concert ever held
First city other than Memphis to embrace Elvis Presley's music on a large scale
Elvis favorite city outside of Memphis
Cleveland Browns were Elvis favorite sports team of all
Cleveland Browns are Hank Aaron's favorite sports team of all


Not done yet. I'll be back late tonight.

[Journey/Survivor]

The state of Ohio has the most highly ranked hospitals in the country right now, and Cleveland has the most highly ranked hospitals in Ohio.

Sorry dude...Just because you insist upon something doesn't make it true! Here is US News and World Report's 2007 list. http://health.usnews.com/usnews/health/ ... orroll.htm Two Boston hospitals rank in the top 10 (which is the fewest number I've ever seen on this list), and only ONE hospital in the entire state of Ohio shows up in the 18 hospitals that are listed! I'm not going to get into a pissing contest over it. I know for a fact that in medical circles, Boston is considered the "medical hub" to many physicians who have never even stepped foot in the state of Massachusetts!

By the way...a plug for you...When I did some Cleveland research, I found out Sherwin-Williams is headquartered. What do you know...a company we've all heard of, calling "The Mistake By The Lake" home

Also, for anyone who cares...here is the list of our nation's top colleges:
http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandrevie ... _brief.php

For the record, 2 Boston colleges rank in the top 7, and 5 Boston colleges rank in the top 35! One single school in the entire state of Ohio is ranked in the top 50! Give it up Mr. Jamison...It's not even close! Listen, I admire your civic pride. Frankly, EVERYONE should love their hometown, but between Boston and Cleveland, it's just not close. There isn't anyone outside of Cleveland who would say Cleveland outranks Boston as an overall city! Did I mention that Boston invented "First Night" celebrations on New Year's Eve?? We were the first city in America to celebrate First Night, on New Year's Eve, back in the early 1970's, and now every major city in America has copied us and hosts their own "First Night". Also, the 4th of July Boston fireworks are on TV here in North Carolina! One more thing...You have Jacob's Field...We have Fenway Park!


John from Boston

I don't have time right now, but later tonight I will name the official website that I found the article about Ohio having the most highly ranked hospitals in America.

And like I mentioned in my last post, I'm not done yet.

Fenway is historic, but Jacob's Field is considered by many to be the best baseball stadium in the country. Almost everyone considers it to be one of the top 3 best Baseball stadiums in America.

Be back late tonight.

[Enigma869]

Fenway is historic, but Jacob's Field is considered by many to be the best baseball stadium in the country. Almost everyone considers it to be one of the top 3 best Baseball stadiums in America.

Just so I'm clear, I NEVER suggested "The Jake" sucked. I simply said it's NOT Fenway Park!

Here is ESPN's list

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/list/ballparks/010427.html


Hey, at least Jacob's Field made the top 10!

John from Boston

[Journey/Survivor]

My Cleveland facts continued.

A small list of movies filmed in Cleveland...

The Deer Hunter
A Christmas Story
Shawshank Redemption
Men In Black
Airforce One
Spiderman 3
Major League
Light Of Day
Planes, Trains And Automobiles
Welcome To Collinwood
Proximity


Rock & Roll Hall Of Fame in Cleveland
Inventors Hall Of Fame in nearby Akron Ohio
Football Hall Of Fame in nearby Canton Ohio

Cleveland hosted very first Monday Night Football game, the Browns defeated the Jets
As much as I hate him, Art Model was one of the original "masterminds" behind Monday Night Football

ABC's "Good Morning America" was styled after Cleveland's "Morning Exchange" morning show.
The second most popular and viewed music tv show of the 1960's and early 1970's "Upbeat" was created and filmed in Cleveland, only "American Bandstand" had more viewers at the time.

Cleveland has more lake beach-front than any other location in the world.

A short list of businesses created or based in Cleveland...
Sherwin Williams
Eaton Corporation
Hoover Vacuum invented in Cleveland, world headquarters in Canton Ohio
National City Bank headquarters
American Greetings headquarters
Forest City Enterprises
Stouffer Foods Company created and headquartered
Progressive Insurance Company
One of the largest NASA headquarters in the country
Jones day, one of the largest lawfirms in the world
Continental Airlines has major Hub in Cleveland

More NASA Astronauts are from Cleveland than any other city, Ohio has more astronauts than any other state. Some of them are......
John Glenn
Neil Armstrong
James A Lovell
Judy Resnik
There are 24 total astronauts from Ohio

Tom Hanks got his acting start in Cleveland, still names it as one of his favorite cities in the world.

LeBron James and Hugh Downs are from nearby Akron

More bands and musicians from Cleveland....
The James Gang
The O'Jays
Chrissy Hynde
Michael Stanley
Frankie Yankovic
Neil ZaZa
Beaucou

Tim Ripper Owens from nearby Akron

NBC anchorwoman Kelly O'Donnell from Cleveland

Cleveland has the 3 tallest skyscrapers located between New York City and Chicago

Greatest Football player in history, Jim Brown, played in, and still lives in Cleveland

Like I mentioned, I have not listed countless actors, athletes, and other famous people that are from Cleveland, it would take too long, plus I keep gradually remembering more and more every time I'm off-line.

Do a Google search of the words "Omeris: Americas Best Hospitals In Ohio," and the very first link will be the website that I found that says Ohio has the most high ranking hospitals in the country. The report is by U.S. News And World Report.

[Enigma869]

Okay Jamison dude...Here we go

Cleveland has Joe Walsh, Marc Cohn, Ric Ocasek (who was born in Baltimore and moved to Boston to form The Cars with all Boston boys), and Eric Carmen.
Boston has Aerosmith, Donna Summer (The Queen of Disco), Boston, and James Taylor.

Advantage: Boston (Aerosmith alone would outrank everyone on that Cleveland list)!

Cleveland has The Deer Hunter, Shawshank Redemption, Airforce One, and Major League
Boston has Good Will Hunting, The Departed, A Civil Action, and The Perfect Storm

Advantage: I'd give the edge to Cleveland just because I LOVE Major League, but it's probably a push with most movie fans!

Cleveland has Chris Chambers, Nate Clements, and London Fletcher
Boston has Tom Glavine (who will be in the hall of fame), Patrick Ewing (who becomes eligible for the HOF for the first time this year), Jeff Bagwell (who will be in the HOF), and Howie Long (who is in the hall of fame)

Advantage: This one isn't close! Boston, by a LANDSLIDE!

Cleveland has James Garfield
Boston has John F. Kennedy

Advantage: Again...Not even close. Boston wins in a LANDSLIDE!

Cleveland has Tim Russert (who I like), George Stephanopolous (who is a VERY bright guy), and Kelly O'Donnell (who I've never heard of)!
Boston has Barbara Walters (the most legendary female member of the media the world has ever seen), Lesley Stahl, and Mike Wallace.

Advantage: As good as both Russert and Stephanopolous are, they simply don't match the status of Walters and Wallace (who incidentally both graduated from the same high school). Boston wins again!

Cleveland is called "The Mistake By The Lake"
Boston is called "Beantown"

Advantage: Nobody! Both nicknames suck ass!

Cleveland has Sherwin-Williams, Stouffer Foods, Hoover Vacuum, Progressive Insurance, and National City (whose mortgage division went out of business)
Boston has Staples, Gillette, Reebok, Dunkin' Donuts, 3Com, and Bose

Advantage: Not close here. Boston wins in a landslide, and I didn't even mention the two largest investment companies in the world (Putnam Investments and Fidelity)

Cleveland has the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame (which is useless, given the inductees), and the Football Hall of Fame nearby
Boston has the Basketball hall of Fame (more accurately, it's in Springfield, Massachusetts, where the game was invented)

Advantage: This one is easy for me, because I'm a football junkie! Cleveland gets the nod!

Cleveland has Bob Hope, Phil Donahue, Paul Newman, Halle Berry (you get extra points for her), Drew Carey, Luke Perry, and Al Roker
Boston has Matt Damon, Jay Leno, Jack Lemmon, Ben Affleck, Conan O'Brien, Leonard Nimoy, Bette Davis, and Matt LeBlanc.

Advantage: I'm not much of a Hollywood type, so this one is tough for me. I would say Bob Hope is a legend, Drew Carey is pretty well known with his new gig, and Halle Berry is a Hollywood heavyweight. Leno is the host of The Tonight Show (for the record, I'm more of a Letterman fan), O'Brien is the next show of The Tonight Show, Affleck and Damon are Hollywood heavyweights, and Jack Lemmon and Bette Davis are legendary in Hollywood circles. I'll call this one a push!

Cleveland has Cleveland Community College
Boston has Harvard and M.I.T.

Advantage: DUH!

Cleveland has the Indians, Cavaliers, and Browns
Boston has the Red Sox, Patriots, Celtics, and Bruins

Advantage: Even though I give you a point just by virtue of not having the suck ass hockey team we have, this one also isn't close! Boston wins in a LANDSLIDE!

As for Jim Brown...It's a silly argument. First and foremost, I don't agree that any one guy is "The Best Player Ever". You can never say that in football, because the positions are all VERY different! Also, he isn't from Cleveland! I don't think you want to start talking about legendary players who played in Cleveland versus legendary players who played on Boston teams, because you'd lose that battle, badly!

As far as the whole "beach-front" property thing. The first point I'll make is that a beach to me is the ocean, not a lake. While I'll certainly grant you that one of the Great Lakes doesn't qualify as any ordinary lake, it's still not the ocean, and in Boston, we have this thing called the Atlantic Ocean, and Cape Cod!


As I said...I admire your civic pride, but I don't think you'll find too many people outside of Cleveland who would say it's a superior city to Boston! Boston competes with a lot of first class cities, but Cleveland isn't one of them!


John from Boston

[Journey/Survivor]

Few more Cleveland facts....

The Cleveland Orchestra is considered to be one of the very best in the entire world, and the very best in the United States.

The Cleveland Zoo was recently ranked the second best in the country.

Cleveland was the very first city to have a rapid transit or subway system that connected the airport to downtown.

Glidden is headquartered in Cleveland.

Cleveland has one of General Electrics two main headquarters.

Mr. Hero was started here in Cleveland. I know the inventors daughter.

"Buffalo wings" were actually first "created" in Cleveland. A business man in Buffalo was the person who decided to start selling them in mass quantities, and that's how they became known as "Buffalo Wings."

Hamburgers were invented in the Cleveland/Akron area, as was the waffle cone.

[Rhiannon]

Lamest argument in the history of the internet. Al Gore would be ashamed to know you were using his invetion for such nonsense.

[Journey/Survivor]

Okay Jamison dude...Here we go

Cleveland has Joe Walsh, Marc Cohn, Ric Ocasek (who was born in Baltimore and moved to Boston to form The Cars with all Boston boys), and Eric Carmen.
Boston has Aerosmith, Donna Summer (The Queen of Disco), Boston, and James Taylor.

Advantage: Boston (Aerosmith alone would outrank everyone on that Cleveland list)!

Cleveland has The Deer Hunter, Shawshank Redemption, Airforce One, and Major League
Boston has Good Will Hunting, The Departed, A Civil Action, and The Perfect Storm

Advantage: I'd give the edge to Cleveland just because I LOVE Major League, but it's probably a push with most movie fans!

Cleveland has Chris Chambers, Nate Clements, and London Fletcher
Boston has Tom Glavine (who will be in the hall of fame), Patrick Ewing (who becomes eligible for the HOF for the first time this year), Jeff Bagwell (who will be in the HOF), and Howie Long (who is in the hall of fame)

Advantage: This one isn't close! Boston, by a LANDSLIDE!

Cleveland has James Garfield
Boston has John F. Kennedy

Advantage: Again...Not even close. Boston wins in a LANDSLIDE!

Cleveland has Tim Russert (who I like), George Stephanopolous (who is a VERY bright guy), and Kelly O'Donnell (who I've never heard of)!
Boston has Barbara Walters (the most legendary female member of the media the world has ever seen), Lesley Stahl, and Mike Wallace.

Advantage: As good as both Russert and Stephanopolous are, they simply don't match the status of Walters and Wallace (who incidentally both graduated from the same high school). Boston wins again!

Cleveland is called "The Mistake By The Lake"
Boston is called "Beantown"

Advantage: Nobody! Both nicknames suck ass!

Cleveland has Sherwin-Williams, Stouffer Foods, Hoover Vacuum, Progressive Insurance, and National City (whose mortgage division went out of business)
Boston has Staples, Gillette, Reebok, Dunkin' Donuts, 3Com, and Bose

Advantage: Not close here. Boston wins in a landslide, and I didn't even mention the two largest investment companies in the world (Putnam Investments and Fidelity)

Cleveland has the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame (which is useless, given the inductees), and the Football Hall of Fame nearby
Boston has the Basketball hall of Fame (more accurately, it's in Springfield, Massachusetts, where the game was invented)

Advantage: This one is easy for me, because I'm a football junkie! Cleveland gets the nod!

Cleveland has Bob Hope, Phil Donahue, Paul Newman, Halle Berry (you get extra points for her), Drew Carey, Luke Perry, and Al Roker
Boston has Matt Damon, Jay Leno, Jack Lemmon, Ben Affleck, Conan O'Brien, Leonard Nimoy, Bette Davis, and Matt LeBlanc.

Advantage: I'm not much of a Hollywood type, so this one is tough for me. I would say Bob Hope is a legend, Drew Carey is pretty well known with his new gig, and Halle Berry is a Hollywood heavyweight. Leno is the host of The Tonight Show (for the record, I'm more of a Letterman fan), O'Brien is the next show of The Tonight Show, Affleck and Damon are Hollywood heavyweights, and Jack Lemmon and Bette Davis are legendary in Hollywood circles. I'll call this one a push!

Cleveland has Cleveland Community College
Boston has Harvard and M.I.T.

Advantage: DUH!

Cleveland has the Indians, Cavaliers, and Browns
Boston has the Red Sox, Patriots, Celtics, and Bruins

Advantage: Even though I give you a point just by virtue of not having the suck ass hockey team we have, this one also isn't close! Boston wins in a LANDSLIDE!

As for Jim Brown...It's a silly argument. First and foremost, I don't agree that any one guy is "The Best Player Ever". You can never say that in football, because the positions are all VERY different! Also, he isn't from Cleveland! I don't think you want to start talking about legendary players who played in Cleveland versus legendary players who played on Boston teams, because you'd lose that battle, badly!

As far as the whole "beach-front" property thing. The first point I'll make is that a beach to me is the ocean, not a lake. While I'll certainly grant you that one of the Great Lakes doesn't qualify as any ordinary lake, it's still not the ocean, and in Boston, we have this thing called the Atlantic Ocean, and Cape Cod!


As I said...I admire your civic pride, but I don't think you'll find too many people outside of Cleveland who would say it's a superior city to Boston! Boston competes with a lot of first class cities, but Cleveland isn't one of them!


John from Boston

Funny how you like to pick and choose the facts that matter to you.

Hey, did you hear about your Boston judge that just got caught driving around in a dress, high-heels and fishnet stockings?
Then again you guys did have one of the worst child molester/rapist Bishops in the country.

The Cleveland Browns have WAY MORE HISTORY than the Patriots do! It wasn't until recent years that the Patriots have accomplished much. And even then we can honestly wonder how many games and Super Bowls you would have won in recent years if it weren't for cheating?

Seriously, Browns history destroys that of the Patriots. If you want we can debate that, but it would be a waste of time on your end. No professional Football team has ever been as dominant as the Cleveland Browns were from the late 1940's through the early 1960's.

By the way, there is one other professional Football team besides the Dolphins that went undefeated in an entire season, and that was the 1948 Cleveland Browns.

The two main members of The Cars grew-up in Cleveland, Ric Ocasek and Ben Orr.

You mention community college for Cleveland, but don't bother to mention Cleveland State University.

You seem to be ignoring that Cleveland had CY YOUNG who is from Cleveland, and played part of his career for Cleveland. Cleveland had John HEISMAN, as in the HEISMAN TROPHY. I didn't put him on the list, but Cleveland has Hall Of Famer Tris Speaker.

Out of Baseball, Football and Basketball, the only clear advantage Boston has over Cleveland is in Basketball. But even then we would have to go back to before Cleveland had a Basketball team for most of that advantage. And Cleveland has LeBron James, who will finish his career as the best player either team has ever had. And he's from nearby Akron.

[Vladan]

Here is something for the record. American Football is for sissies!.

Watch the real deal in Australia, aint that right Andrew. Its called "NRL" no cheap body protection!, real damage, real toughness! real mans game!