RED 13: Like it or Hate it?

[Journey69]

Generations was above average by my standards. Just throwing that out there.

Generations was about as deep as a fucking puddle. I'd rather shit shards of glass than listen to any song on that album.

Faith in the Heartland: Classic
The Place in Your Heart: Good
A Better Life: Good
Every Generation: Okay
Butterfly (She Flies Alone): Good
Believe: Sucks
Knowing That You Love Me: Below Average
Out of Harms Way: Great
In Self Defense: Good
Better Together: Good
Gone Crazy: Good
Beyond the Clouds: Good
Never Too Late: Great

All really good songs.. nothing wrong with any of those..the rest were ass.. beyond the clouds,awesome song..

[STORY_TELLER]

You know, everyone seems to complain about the production, but is it really that bad? I don't hear anything bad about the mix. I mean sure, if you compare it to Arrival's production, it's substandard, but only by comparison and only because they recorded digitally. Even still, I don't hear anything that detracts from the songs themselves.

I'd say Red 13 sounds better than Infinity, Departure or Evolution (production wise that is). Very strange values on those albums (but that could have had to do with the recording technology at the facility they used at the time).

Am I the only guy likes "I Can Breathe"?

[STORY_TELLER]

of course I loved Red 13.

I immensely dig anything that's a bit different, and for Journey, Red 13 was quite a bit different.

"State of Grace" is one of my favorite Journey tracks.

Speaking of SoG, I was with one of my buddies a few weeks ago. He needed a lift to McDonald's, so we got ourselves some McChickens and sat in the parking lot, pigging out and listening to tunes. He was all like, "Hey man, play me some of your epic progadelic shit," and I just hit "shuffle" and flicked through a few songs, and we started listening to SoG.... He was bugging out, his eyes going all twitchy during the intro, with the all the drums going crazy and the spacey keys/guitar threading through it all... and he finally said "Dude, play me some normal music, like human beings listen to..." The way he said it, as Deen was going nuts in the background, was just really funny....

When I heard State of Grace, I immediately felt like Neal pulled that approach from his Electric World CD. Just had that entire vibe all throughout. Very new age feeling.

[7 Wishes]

Dude, if you think the production "quality" of Generations or Red13 is better than the exquisitely produced, sonically perfect "Infinity" record (25 years earlier, I might add), you need an appointment with an ENT immediately. Go NOW.

[Enigma869]

My standards are actually kind of high

The fact that you rank Journey's debut album as one of your favorites, think "Generations" is great, and have said on these very boards that Neal Schon is a "great" vocalist tells me that your version of "high" standards and mine are diametrically opposed!

alot of Journey hardcores are surprised when I rank Generations as one of my favorites

Gee, I can't imagine why!

I look for some slightly different things in my music than most other people do.

I'll definitely agree with you that "Generations" was "slightly different", but that's probably the most flattering thing I can say about it!

That said, my top three are the self-titled debut, Escape, and Frontiers.

Well, as Meatloaf sang about...Two out of three ain't bad


John from Boston

[STORY_TELLER]

Dude, if you think the production "quality" of Generations or Red13 is better than the exquisitely produced, sonically perfect "Infinity" record (25 years earlier, I might add), you need an appointment with an ENT immediately. Go NOW.

Well, I'm probably referring to the mix levels more than anything else. They did record it in Cain's home studio, didn't they? Even still, I don't hear anything that detracts detrimentally from the songs themselves. Could the production have been better? Sure. Make or break? Nah.

[lparn]

liked all of it except for "the time" wished they had played walking away from the edge live

[Just Sara]

Like it. Definitely like it.
WAFTE is by far the best track.

I actually always thought that Red 13 was one of the most underrated Journey albums. I agree that the title is completely random but the cover is beautiful and, in my opinion anyway, all of the songs are excellent. What a great way to introduce Augeri to the fans.

Bring on the disagreements!

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

Complete and utter shit. Embarrassing part of the catalog. I was also pissed they deviated from the one word titles. "Red 13"...sounds like a girl that had her first fucking period...how gay.

Beautiful wording....Never thought of it that way.....I liked it. Nothing great. State of Grace was a great power ballad.

e-

"State of Grace" is a flat-out rocker, not a power ballad. "Walking Away From the Edge" is a power ballad.

Personally i wouldnt call WAFTE a power ballad.. more of a theatre ballad - unless ive just madet that up lol

Good term actually, I call it a tragi-ballad, maybe even a dark ballad. Cetainly not a love ballad, its one of the few Journey songs which have hauntihngly deep words. I like, it , personally the best song from the augeri era.

I tend to skip the other red 13 tracks though!

[mriesenb]

Walking Away From The Edge is one of the best Journey ballads (if not the best) for me. Didn't care too much about the other songs.

[Vladan]

Red 13 = an abortion.

Well said Saint John!.

[Luvsaugeri]

I don't love it or hate it. But I do like it. I like most of it alot. WAFTE and SOG are my favoites. The Time is probably my least favorite but I still kind of like that song too.

[jrnychick]

I really like Red 13. I love that they broke out of the formula and tried something different.

[Vladan]

Anyone that says that Red 13 is crap is an idiot! The Time was an awesome track1 I also liked Red13/State of grace.. The last 2 were the weak links.. I loved how Augeri sang the Time.. Also,Generations was not crap..If Neal,Jon and Ross would have kept their yappers shut the album would have been great..Its like they had 3-4 quality songs and rushed the rest..

I see. So we have to like garbage to not be an idiot it appears sorry I don't like Red 13, simply because it was a rush job. Andrew stated it perfectly, but I also feel he was being nice about it.

You take the name Journey away from Red 13, and you release it - nobody would recognize this band, tell me that's a good album.

[conversationpc]

You take the name Journey away from Red 13, and you release it - nobody would recognize this band, tell me that's a good album.

It's a good album.

[Vladan]

You take the name Journey away from Red 13, and you release it - nobody would recognize this band, tell me that's a good album.

It's a good album.

Jonathan Cain should do lead on the next Journey album, throw in a bit of Neal and Ross too, but forget Arnel and Dean, they can sing back up! take another direction, and go places! don't stop beleivin

[conversationpc]

You take the name Journey away from Red 13, and you release it - nobody would recognize this band, tell me that's a good album.

It's a good album.

Jonathan Cain should do lead on the next Journey album, throw in a bit of Neal and Ross too, but forget Arnel and Dean, they can sing back up! take another direction, and go places! don't stop beleivin

Now THAT would be a bad Journey album...and since "Red 13" doesn't have any of that, it's yet another reason that "Red 13" is good.

[Vladan]

You take the name Journey away from Red 13, and you release it - nobody would recognize this band, tell me that's a good album.

It's a good album.

Jonathan Cain should do lead on the next Journey album, throw in a bit of Neal and Ross too, but forget Arnel and Dean, they can sing back up! take another direction, and go places! don't stop beleivin

Now THAT would be a bad Journey album...and since "Red 13" doesn't have any of that, it's yet another reason that "Red 13" is good.

That would a shocking album, but I feel there would a lot of people who would embrace it!. I guess isn't right to say hey "just because I think it's a bad album" doesn't nobody else likes it. Fair enough, honestly - to each their own.

My personal fav Journey album is ROR, then Frontier/Trial By Fire. Many dislike ROR - but it's well produced still, that's what I like. Cheers

[Saint John]

I really like Red 13. I love that they broke out of the formula and tried something different.

You're right, they tried something different and moved about 300 units.

[NealIsGod]

I got it free when I ordered a t-shirt from the Journey site a few years ago. Listened to it once or twice and forgot about it.

[jrnychick]

I really like Red 13. I love that they broke out of the formula and tried something different.

You're right, they tried something different and moved about 300 units.

So? Hannah Montana sells millions, and that doesn't make her work any good. I'm not looking at whether it was a successful business decision or not. I enjoyed hearing something different and more experimental from the band. That's all.

[Red13JoePa]

SOG is terrific, I Can Breathe is good.
WAFTE is overrated, the Kiss Me Softly of Red13 and The Time is for my coin the greatest piece of guitar rock Schon has committed to record in the Journey cannon.
Aggressive but structured, menacing, DIRTY guitars with many a hidden layer brought out upon multiple listenings. Vocally both SOG and The Time stand out more than anything Augeri had done to that point.

A note on the production complaints: My biggest one is that Castronovo's drums sound like they were recorded on a mini london jazz kit.
Lacked the monster thumping sound he had on Arrival and Generations.

[Deb]

I've never even heard Red 13.....and have no desire to. I have Arrival and Generations of the post Perry material.

John, how can you not even like A Better Life from Generations? That one's got Perry written all over it........soul, vocals, etc.

[Red13JoePa]

A Better Life is terrific, but I think it has SQUAT to do with perry.

[Deb]

A Better Life is terrific, but I think it has SQUAT to do with perry.

I know that goofball. the feel of it just sounds like it could have easily come off of a Perry solo cd. JMHO. What's funny is...... as I was typing that, I actually thought.....maybe I should clarify this for JoePa. Could have saved myself a post.

[STORY_TELLER]

A Better Life is terrific, but I think it has SQUAT to do with perry.

Perry wasn't involved, but Dean was clearly channeling him vocally on that tune.

I always thought Better Life was Neal and Jon's take on "Living on a Prayer" by Bon Jovi. Not sonically, but lyrically.

[Saint John]

Better Life is perhaps the most boring and redundant song I've ever heard. It just never takes off. It's 6 minutes of the same shit over and over. It should have been titled Groundhog Day.

[STORY_TELLER]

Better Life is perhaps the most boring and redundant song I've ever heard. It just never takes off. It's 6 minutes of the same shit over and over. It should have been titled Groundhog Day.

[Red13JoePa]

Better Life is perhaps the most boring and redundant song I've ever heard. It just never takes off. It's 6 minutes of the same shit over and over. It should have been titled Groundhog Day.

Go put on TBF and sache about in your knickers to Easy To Fall, will ya?

[Saint John]

Better Life is perhaps the most boring and redundant song I've ever heard. It just never takes off. It's 6 minutes of the same shit over and over. It should have been titled Groundhog Day.

Go put on TBF and sache about in your knickers to Easy To Fall, will ya?

I'd much rather fall asleep than commit suicide. Sorry to disappoint some of you.