NBA Finals East vs. West Prediction

[conversationpc]

Kobe is winning the MVP this season for one main reason...He's never won the thing before! Writers in ALL sports are notorious for giving a guy a "lifetime achievement award" if he's never won an MVP, even if there are more deserving candidates! Kobe has had a great season, but in terms of the "MVP", I'd give it to Garnett all day long! The Celtics had 24 wins last season, and somehow managed to win 66 this season, for the greatest one season turnaround in NBA history. Garnett was THE REASON for that huge turnaround, and I believe by definition, that makes him the MVP.

The Lakers would've been much worse off without Kobe than the Celtics would have been without Garnett, in my opinion. That's why Kobe was the winner.

[Enigma869]

The Lakers would've been much worse off without Kobe than the Celtics would have been without Garnett, in my opinion. That's why Kobe was the winner.

Yep...your opinion, and I disagree! Anyone can speculate about how bad the Lakers would have been without Kobe, but nobody will ever know, because Kobe is there. There is pretty compelling, empirical evidence of the difference Garnett made on the Celtics. He raised their win total by FORTY TWO in just one season. By very definition, that's as "valuable" as valuable gets! I believe Kobe is absolutely the "Offensive Player Of Year", in a landslide, but the MVP is a VERY different award. I never agreed when Alex Rodriguez won the MVP for a last place Texas Rangers team. If all the Rangers could do with AROD that season was to finish dead last, I'm not sure how "valuable" the guy really was, considering that they could have finished dead last without the guy!


John from Boston

[conversationpc]

The Lakers would've been much worse off without Kobe than the Celtics would have been without Garnett, in my opinion. That's why Kobe was the winner.

Yep...your opinion, and I disagree! Anyone can speculate about how bad the Lakers would have been without Kobe, but nobody will ever know, because Kobe is there. There is pretty compelling, empirical evidence of the difference Garnett made on the Celtics. He raised their win total by FORTY TWO in just one season. By very definition, that's as "valuable" as valuable gets! I believe Kobe is absolutely the "Offensive Player Of Year", in a landslide, but the MVP is a VERY different award. I never agreed when Alex Rodriguez won the MVP for a last place Texas Rangers team. If all the Rangers could do with AROD that season was to finish dead last, I'm not sure how "valuable" the guy really was, considering that they could have finished dead last without the guy!


John from Boston

Well, they also added Ray Allen and, though his overall numbers were down because of those two new guys, Paul Pierce was a better player this year as well, so it can't all be attributed to Garnett.

The Rodriguez comparison with a last place team is a bad comparison. The Lakers went from a non-playoff team to the best record in the West this year.

[Liam]

I'm gonna go with the Celtics on this one. And FUCK the Jazz. They took my team out....AGAIN.
The Spurs aren't doing so well either...so I will say Celts/Lakers. Celtics in 6.

[Enigma869]

Well, they also added Ray Allen

Ray Allen has been DREADFUL most of this season. Aside from winning a couple of games with some last second shots, he has played VERY poorly. As someone who watches all Celtics games, I can assure you that Ray Allen isn't the reason the Celtics won an additional 44 games this season!

Paul Pierce was a better player this year as well

I guess it depends upon what your definition of "better" is. Pierce had his lowest assists numbers in 8 seasons. He had his career low in rebounds, and his scoring total was the lowest it's been since his second season in the NBA!

so it can't all be attributed to Garnett.

After watching the Celtics this season, I can safely say that Garnett was THE BIGGEST reason for the Celtics turnaround. There is nobody else who is even a close second. The guy is a MONSTER, defensively, and always has been. The Celtics were the absolute worst defensive team in the NBA last season. They were the best defensive team in the NBA this season. Do I think it's just a coincidence that the Celtics rose to the top of the league in defense while Kevin Garnett won the "NBA Defensive Player Of The Year" ? Um, NO!

The Rodriguez comparison with a last place team is a bad comparison.

I never compared AROD winning the MVP on a last place team to Kobe winning it on a first place team. I simply said that the "Most Valuable Player" shouldn't just be automatically handed out to the guy with the best offensive numbers, and I stand by that statement. There is FAR more to winning the MVP than just scoring points.

The Lakers went from a non-playoff team to the best record in the West this year.

I'm not sure I even get your point here. I realize the Lakers weren't in the playoffs last season. That said, they finished 2 games over .500. The Celtics finished THIRTY FOUR games UNDER .500, without Garnett! I find it interesting that you're telling me the Celtics success can't all be attributed to Garnett, while you seem to be attributing all of the Lakers success to Kobe. It's even more interesting when you consider that Kobe was on that non-playoff team last season. I would say the Lakers complete heist of a trade for Pau Gasol is a HUGE reason they'll be heard from this season in the playoffs!


John from Boston

[RebornJrny]

I think another category they picked Kobe as MVP because he played all 82 games. Garnett missed 11 games and CP3 missed only 2 games. I'll probably consider CP3 next in MVP after Kobe. CP3 really helped his team a lot this season. But as a Laker fan I'm happy for Kobe finally getting his MVP after 11 years.

[conversationpc]

Ray Allen has been DREADFUL most of this season. Aside from winning a couple of games with some last second shots, he has played VERY poorly. As someone who watches all Celtics games, I can assure you that Ray Allen isn't the reason the Celtics won an additional 44 games this season!

Dreadful? His shooting percentages from the field, 3pt line, and free throw line are all at or above his career averages. His numbers are only down overall due to having three superstars on the team.

I guess it depends upon what your definition of "better" is. Pierce had his lowest assists numbers in 8 seasons. He had his career low in rebounds, and his scoring total was the lowest it's been since his second season in the NBA!

As I said above, all three guys' numbers were down this year due to the fact that they are all on the same team. If you have three 20 pt. + guys on the same team, their numbers are bound to go down.

Anyway, if you're going to use that argument, then Garnett also has only had only three seasons with lower rebounding totals, only two with less assists, to go along with lower blocks and steals according to his career averages.

There is FAR more to winning the MVP than just scoring points.

Exactly. Bryant has been one of the best defenders in the league for the last few years now. Was Garnett a better defender this year? Probably, but Bryant is no slouch in that area.

I'm not sure I even get your point here. I realize the Lakers weren't in the playoffs last season. That said, they finished 2 games over .500. The Celtics finished THIRTY FOUR games UNDER .500, without Garnett! I find it interesting that you're telling me the Celtics success can't all be attributed to Garnett, while you seem to be attributing all of the Lakers success to Kobe. It's even more interesting when you consider that Kobe was on that non-playoff team last season. I would say the Lakers complete heist of a trade for Pau Gasol is a HUGE reason they'll be heard from this season in the playoffs!

I never said all the Lakers' success was due to Kobe. The other players on that team stepped up this year, too, but I don't know too many knowledgeable pro-basketball fans who would say that the Lakers would be better off without Kobe than the Celtics would without Garnett.

[Enigma869]

Dreadful?

In some games, yes. In game six against Atlanta, the guy was launching one ridiculous shot after another and not even hitting the rim!

As I said above, all three guys' numbers were down this year due to the fact that they are all on the same team. If you have three 20 pt. + guys on the same team, their numbers are bound to go down.

We agree on this point. I agree if there are many superstars on one team, then all of their offensive numbers will inevitably go down. That said, Garnett was and is the one guy that makes that machine run. If you doubt that, watch a couple of Celtics games, and it will be VERY obvious what a dominant player Garnett is. He's the most dominant player I've ever seen, defensively. The guy doesn't have to score a point and can still dominate a game!

Bryant has been one of the best defenders in the league for the last few years now.

Kobe is a VERY good all around player and always has been. That said, he's not on the same planet with Garnett, when it comes to defense. They are two completely different players and really can't be compared. Garnett's game isn't offense and never has been. Kobe is an offensive machine. They're both great players and both first ballot hall of famers. I just believe that defense wins in ALL sports!

Was Garnett a better defender this year? Probably

Once again, we agree!

I don't know too many knowledgeable pro-basketball fans who would say that the Lakers would be better off without Kobe than the Celtics would without Garnett.

Well, as I said previously, we'll never know. One can speculate all we want, but we know what the Celtics were without Garnett last season. I also know that before Pau Gasol joined the Lakers, they were an okay team, but not dominant. After Gasol joined the team, the Lakers went 22-4 with Gasol in the lineup. When Gasol was hurt for 10 games, the Lakers went 5-5, including two home losses to both Charlotte and Memphis (teams the Lakers should beat without Kobe on the floor)! Keep in mind that Kobe played in all 10 of those games that Gasol was hurt and only managed to produce a .500 record. I'm not saying Kobe sucks. The guy is a GREAT, GREAT player! I'm simply saying that if you (objectively) look at the Lakers record this past season, Gasol was every bit (and in my opinion, moreso) as instrumental as Kobe was, and their record with Kobe and without Gasol certainly add some validity to my opinion!


John from Boston

[conversationpc]

Well, as I said previously, we'll never know. One can speculate all we want, but we know what the Celtics were without Garnett last season. I also know that before Pau Gasol joined the Lakers, they were an okay team, but not dominant. After Gasol joined the team, the Lakers went 22-4 with Gasol in the lineup. When Gasol was hurt for 10 games, the Lakers went 5-5, including two home losses to both Charlotte and Memphis (teams the Lakers should beat without Kobe on the floor)! Keep in mind that Kobe played in all 10 of those games that Gasol was hurt and only managed to produce a .500 record. I'm not saying Kobe sucks. The guy is a GREAT, GREAT player! I'm simply saying that if you (objectively) look at the Lakers record this past season, Gasol was every bit (and in my opinion, moreso) as instrumental as Kobe was, and their record with Kobe and without Gasol certainly add some validity to my opinion!

One thing that has to concern the rest of the league is that next year, Andrew Bynum will be back to full strength and in the lineup. He improved massively over last year and there's no reason to believe he won't improve again. I think that's why he hasn't come back this year from the injury. Keep him out and make sure, unlike early in Grant Hill's career, that the guy will recover from the ankle injury. The Lakers may be nearly unbeatable next year.

[Michigan Girl]

WOW~ Celts-Cav's...VERY ENTERTAINING-TOUGH GAME!!!! LOW SCORE...GREAT DEFENSE!!!
MISS YOU BIG BEN!!!!
You couldn't have asked Boston for a better game going right into
this series w/ the rested Cav's!!! The BIG LUG Illgauskas....THAT WAS WRONG!!!
James Misses....AAAAANNNNDDD POSEY goes to the line....2 possession game w/ 8.5
on the clock, James MISSES again!!....it looks like a WIN for BOSTON!!!!! 76-72!!!!

CONGRATS!!!

[RebornJrny]

Lebron went 2/17 FG, yikes!

[Michigan Girl]

Lebron went 2/17 FG, yikes!

ewe, I know!!! He'll come back fighting though!!:wink:

[Since 78]

Hang in there MG

[Michigan Girl]

Hang in there MG

EWE...it's LOOKING BAD...I'm crying right NOW!!!

[RedWingFan]

Hang in there MG

EWE...it's LOOKING BAD...I'm crying right NOW!!!

What happened to Billups? I noticed he hasn't been in the game and only has 2 pts.

[Michigan Girl]

Hang in there MG

EWE...it's LOOKING BAD...I'm crying right NOW!!!

What happened to Billups? I noticed he hasn't been in the game and only has 2 pts.

HAMSTRING!!!

[RedWingFan]

Hang in there MG

EWE...it's LOOKING BAD...I'm crying right NOW!!!

What happened to Billups? I noticed he hasn't been in the game and only has 2 pts.

HAMSTRING!!!

Hard to believe he'd be able to pull something being as lazy a player as he is.

[Michigan Girl]

Hang in there MG

EWE...it's LOOKING BAD...I'm crying right NOW!!!

What happened to Billups? I noticed he hasn't been in the game and only has 2 pts.

HAMSTRING!!!

Hard to believe he'd be able to pull something being as lazy a player as he is.

I like Chauncey, ALOT!!! UNTIL NOW!!

[RebornJrny]

I still believed Pistons can win this series. It will be a 7 game series and Pistons will win in 7. I want them to play the Celtics. It's going to be a good one.

[Since 78]

Hang in there MG

EWE...it's LOOKING BAD...I'm crying right NOW!!!

What happened to Billups? I noticed he hasn't been in the game and only has 2 pts.

HAMSTRING!!!

Hard to believe he'd be able to pull something being as lazy a player as he is.

I like Chauncey, ALOT!!! UNTIL NOW!!

Lewis has just been killin em and Howard's blocks, if It wasn't for Hamilton this would be really bad. Sorry MG

[Michigan Girl]

I still believed Pistons can win this series. It will be a 7 game series and Pistons will win in 7. I want them to play the Celtics. It's going to be a good one.

OH, YEAH...don't get me wrong...THE Pistons NEED to lose like this occasionally, for some reason
hearing negative things about themselves PUMPS them up????? You got me, I don't know why
they work this way!!! And not taking anything away from Orlando...they are playing AWESOME
tonight!!! We CANNOT defend them!!

[Michigan Girl]

Hang in there MG

EWE...it's LOOKING BAD...I'm crying right NOW!!!

What happened to Billups? I noticed he hasn't been in the game and only has 2 pts.

HAMSTRING!!!

Hard to believe he'd be able to pull something being as lazy a player as he is.

I like Chauncey, ALOT!!! UNTIL NOW!!

Lewis has just been killin em and Howard's blocks, if It wasn't for Hamilton this would be really bad. Sorry MG

No KIDDING!!!! I'm keeping the faith for this series (They do NOT look like the PISTONS tonight)...and THANKS!!!

[RebornJrny]

I still believed Pistons can win this series. It will be a 7 game series and Pistons will win in 7. I want them to play the Celtics. It's going to be a good one.

OH, YEAH...don't get me wrong...THE Pistons NEED to lose like this occasionally, for some reason
hearing negative things about themselves PUMPS them up????? You got me, I don't know why
they work this way!!! And not taking anything away from Orlando...they are playing AWESOME
tonight!!! We CANNOT defend them!!

Game over MG, just tell the guys to re-group

[Michigan Girl]

I still believed Pistons can win this series. It will be a 7 game series and Pistons will win in 7. I want them to play the Celtics. It's going to be a good one.

OH, YEAH...don't get me wrong...THE Pistons NEED to lose like this occasionally, for some reason
hearing negative things about themselves PUMPS them up????? You got me, I don't know why
they work this way!!! And not taking anything away from Orlando...they are playing AWESOME
tonight!!! We CANNOT defend them!!

Game over MG, just tell the guys to re-group

YEP>>>BTW...LOVE YOUR NEW AV!!! LAKERS~JAZZ!!!!

[RebornJrny]

I still believed Pistons can win this series. It will be a 7 game series and Pistons will win in 7. I want them to play the Celtics. It's going to be a good one.

OH, YEAH...don't get me wrong...THE Pistons NEED to lose like this occasionally, for some reason
hearing negative things about themselves PUMPS them up????? You got me, I don't know why
they work this way!!! And not taking anything away from Orlando...they are playing AWESOME
tonight!!! We CANNOT defend them!!

Game over MG, just tell the guys to re-group

YEP>>>BTW...LOVE YOUR NEW AV!!! LAKERS~JAZZ!!!!

Thanks! Its' time for MVP! MVP! MVP!

[Michigan Girl]

I still believed Pistons can win this series. It will be a 7 game series and Pistons will win in 7. I want them to play the Celtics. It's going to be a good one.

OH, YEAH...don't get me wrong...THE Pistons NEED to lose like this occasionally, for some reason
hearing negative things about themselves PUMPS them up????? You got me, I don't know why
they work this way!!! And not taking anything away from Orlando...they are playing AWESOME
tonight!!! We CANNOT defend them!!

Game over MG, just tell the guys to re-group

YEP>>>BTW...LOVE YOUR NEW AV!!! LAKERS~JAZZ!!!!

Thanks! Its' time for MVP! MVP! MVP!

VERY GRACIOUS....I thought he was going to cry!!!

[Michigan Girl]

Gosh, I HATE to sound repetitive....BUT UTAH has GOT to slow this game down....stick to the half court game!!
LA is TOO FAST for them!!! Just when you think they are going to do it ~BOOM they're off and running again!!
They're wearing themselves out and then they can't hit their shots!! They're losing their faith/confidence!!
Just my thoughts...maybe it will be a closer game after the half!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well less than two left....LOOKS like another Win for LA...KOBE played like an MVP, impressive
team player...JAZZ fought to the end!!! BUT, in my opinion didn't TRULY come alive until the middle
of the third...D. Williams, MAN, if they all had his drive tonight!!!! SORRY DNA!!!!

CONGRATS!!! 78 and RBJ

[Since 78]

Gosh, I HATE to sound repetitive....BUT UTAH has GOT to slow this game down....stick to the half court game!!
LA is TOO FAST for them!!! Just when you think they are going to do it ~BOOM they're off and running again!!
They're wearing themselves out and then they can't hit their shots!! They're losing their faith/confidence!!
Just my thoughts...maybe it will be a closer game after the half!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well less than two left....LOOKS like another Win for LA...KOBE played like an MVP, impressive
team player...JAZZ fought to the end!!! BUT, in my opinion didn't TRULY come alive until the middle
of the third...D. Williams, MAN, if they all had his drive tonight!!!! SORRY DNA!!!!

CONGRATS!!! 78 and RBJ

Thanks MG! SHOWTIME!!! They really are to fast for the Jazz right now. Well, on to Utah

[RebornJrny]

Gosh, I HATE to sound repetitive....BUT UTAH has GOT to slow this game down....stick to the half court game!!
LA is TOO FAST for them!!! Just when you think they are going to do it ~BOOM they're off and running again!!
They're wearing themselves out and then they can't hit their shots!! They're losing their faith/confidence!!
Just my thoughts...maybe it will be a closer game after the half!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well less than two left....LOOKS like another Win for LA...KOBE played like an MVP, impressive
team player...JAZZ fought to the end!!! BUT, in my opinion didn't TRULY come alive until the middle
of the third...D. Williams, MAN, if they all had his drive tonight!!!! SORRY DNA!!!!

CONGRATS!!! 78 and RBJ

Thanks MG. I hope Pistons will win the next game...Dang Fisher killed his former team tonight. I can sense a lot of booing in Salt Lake City on their next game.

[Enigma869]

Okay, I admittedly don't watch a whole lot of Cadeaver games, but they can't possibly suck this bad, can they? What the fuck is with LeBron? This dude better learn how to hit a shot, before calling himself the next Jordan! The guy's shooting percentage has been downright embarassing! Ilgauskas is the most awkward looking fuck I've ever seen on a basketball court. That said, the dude can shoot the rock. I've never seen such an awkward shot get knocked down so much!


John from Boston