So WTF Does Everyone Think of Pineda Now?

[The_Noble_Cause]

I think Arnel is great, but I really wish he'd work with a diction coach. I love NWA but, unfortunately, his accent comes through very stronly (and no I wasn't looking for it). I can't wait to hear the rest of the new music now.

Uh oh,m watch it Barb. The racists will come after you!

His diction on "Never Walk Away" is awful.
Really bad.

It's not racist to say that you hear an accent and it is distracting.
Andrew was warning us of this much since the day Arnel's hat was tossed in the ring.
Luckily, I don't hear it as much on "After All These Years", but NWA is pretty bad.

[strangegrey]

It's not racist to say that you hear an accent and it is distracting.
Andrew was warning us of this much since the day Arnel's hat was tossed in the ring.
Luckily, I don't hear it as much on "After All These Years", but NWA is pretty bad.

Of course it's not racist. You try making that argument to the mob of people that feel they need to aggressively defend a position that should be defended only by Arnel's singing and nothing else. Think about it. Is it well within the justification of someone to say "I dont like his voice, sounds too 'foreign'." Absolutely. Nothing racist about it. What we like is what we like...some people don't buy cars because they're foreign. Are they racist too? It's an asinine thing. I know a guy that wont buy a korean made car. He doesn't feel the quality is up to the Japanese and American standards. He's not racist. He's exercising HIS RIGHT as a consumer.

The racists that have ironically accused people not supportive of Arnel in journey, under the same logic, would label you a racist for not buying a Korean made vehicle.

A person's consumer choices are *their* choices...the problem is that these new carpetbaggers in the journey fan-base feel its some manifest destiny that arnel sing in Journey. whatever...they can feel whatever they want. So they dredge up the racist card in a desperate attempt to gain the upper-hand in a debate that they can't themselves win.

What is going to seal this debate is how this album sells (assuming they market Arnel as Arnel and not subdue him in an attempt to fool people) and how this tour sells....

we're all going to rightfully revisit this at the end of the summer...and we'll have better legs to stand on. Until then, you'll just see the racist card getting played by the real, true racists in this discussion.

[ttango1]

What is going to seal this debate is how this album sells (assuming they market Arnel as Arnel and not subdue him in an attempt to fool people) and how this tour sells....

That's the only thing I agree with in your entire statement. Do we agree that Vegas sold out when you said it wasn't going to?

[strangegrey]

What is going to seal this debate is how this album sells (assuming they market Arnel as Arnel and not subdue him in an attempt to fool people) and how this tour sells....

That's the only thing I agree with in your entire statement. Do we agree that Vegas sold out when you said it wasn't going to?

You have a right to disagree with everything I say. Trust me....I wont lose sleep over it.

As far as me offering up predictions on how Vegas would turn out, I dont recall ever saying such a thing. You must be confusing me with others. Also...(and correct me if I'm wrong here) but did the show sell out or was every seat filled. There's a difference, you know. I am well aware that ALOT of free tickets for that show were handed out. So really...did it sell out? or did they manage to fill the seats...

The ironing out of how Arnel will play out in Journey will take FAR more than a single show or a weeks sales totals. You're really going to have to be patient and see how it plays out. I've seen how this ends (many times)...you haven't. If you've been a Journey fan for longer than 1/2 a year, you might have a clue as well.

[pinkvelvet]

its just a band, they make music. You like it, then get the CD, if u dont like it then dont buy it, simple as that. Strangegrey, after reading your posts, you make it sound like your wife and children just left you and left you bitter for life. Seriously dude, its just a band. They dont give a rats ass whether u like it or not, its not worth the energy. You can post a whole book on here about what you think, its not going to make a difference.

[strangegrey]

its just a band, they make music. You like it, then get the CD, if u dont like it then dont buy it, simple as that. Strangegrey, after reading your posts, you make it sound like your wife and children just left you and left you bitter for life. Seriously dude, its just a band. They dont give a rats ass whether u like it or not, its not worth the energy. You can post a whole book on here about what you think, its not going to make a difference.

And the point I was making is that it doesn't make one difference to me either way. I type insanely fast. What i wrote last night took me 180 seconds tops. 3 minutes investment to express something I felt justified saying isn't a big deal. I have zero illusions about the idea that what I write will affect change in someone...that wasn't the point.

and trust me...my wife and my children have me quite happy. The fact that you people enjoy the company of a band with so much negative energy around it, should speak volumes about your residual happiness!

My reply to Dean mentioned this...perhaps it is time I stop posting here. I grew up on MelodicRock...but I see a whole lot of old, not so happy people in it right now. You might think I'm unhappy....and you're just reading me wrong. I'm not happy with what Journey has become...but dont think for one second, I lose sleep over it. Hardly. I sleep like a rock. I find happiness in real things. I don't need to latch onto music thats not even real in itself anymore.

So enjoy Arnel in Journey....I've been down this road with this band far longer than 99.999999% of you. I hope you get something out of it. Just don't bother me when the end game sounds familiar...I'm not the 'I told you so' type of person.

[Saint John]

I love ya Dan, but you need to practice what you preach.

Maybe so, but would Jesus agree with you belittling Dean? I guess I'm not the only one that "needs to practice what I preach."

[The_Noble_Cause]

I'll try to speak for Dean since he's banned. I suspect that he meant Jeremey has done nothing professional musically speaking (as far as I know...other than the recent writing credit).

Deano has made his views loud and clear already. He thinks Arnel is the better singer.
I also wouldn't put it past him to hold residual anger against Jeremey for Jeff's ousting.

Furthermore, Arnel Pineda has had multiple label backed releases, toured a few countries and has been part of professional bands for the better part of 20 years. Jeremey hasn't. Simple as that.

LOL
Talk about a distinction without difference.
When it comes to fronting a US rock band, both of the two names you just mentioned are karaoke nobodies.
If industry experience was truly the litmus test for fronting Journey, neither Jeremey or Arnels' names should ever have crossed fans' lips.

And for the record, Jeremey has collaborated and written original material outside of Frontiers.

[Jeremey]

I'll try to speak for Dean since he's banned. I suspect that he meant Jeremey has done nothing professional musically speaking (as far as I know...other than the recent writing credit).

Deano has made his views loud and clear already. He thinks Arnel is the better singer.
I also wouldn't put it past him to hold residual anger against Jeremey for Jeff's ousting.

Furthermore, Arnel Pineda has had multiple label backed releases, toured a few countries and has been part of professional bands for the better part of 20 years. Jeremey hasn't. Simple as that.

LOL
Talk about a distinction without difference.
When it comes to fronting a US rock band, both of the two names you just mentioned are karaoke nobodies.
If industry experience was truly the litmus test for fronting Journey, neither Jeremey or Arnels' names should ever have crossed fans' lips.

And for the record, Jeremey has collaborated and written original material outside of Frontiers.

I think the point to take away from all this is that Dean once again used my name to bait other members of this forum into attack mode. What he thinks of me, or what my professional accomplishments are, is irrelevant. I think it's obvious the issue here is that Dean's continuously used my name as a weapon of some goofy war, and he's been asked by both myself and the moderator of this site to put a stop to it and he hasn't.

The issues between this whole warring faction here have absolutely NOTHING to do with me. The fact that I'm brought into this argument continuously is what prevents me from being any further part of this community other than my limited comments here or there.

[Jeremey]

I'll try to speak for Dean since he's banned. I suspect that he meant Jeremey has done nothing professional musically speaking (as far as I know...other than the recent writing credit). Arnel has.

The better thing to do Dan, if you must speak for Dean in his absence, is just to explain why my name was brought into the argument. No one really is wondering what it is he has against me. The question I always hear, and ask myself, is why does he bring my name up all the time?

But to answer your question, well, I've been a professional musician (gigging and getting paid) for some time. I don't think comparing the music scene in the Phillipines and Hong Kong is a fair comparison to the american music scene. In fact, the music industry in those countries is a service industry. It's a part of tourist/business trade, and it's a very respectable way to make a living. But the fact remains it's quite a bit easier to make a splash in the Phillipines, then say, America.

Secondly, Arnel was giving folks thousands of miles away the opportunity to experience some really great music that they'd otherwise never to get to hear, LIVE. While I don't fault Jeremey one bit for his homage to the Journey years that included Perry, the fact remains that the same folks that see Frontiers actually get the chance to see the real thing...people in the Phillipines and China don't.

Until Steve Perry is touring again with Journey, the above statement is a non issue; it's factually inaccurate.

Furthermore, Arnel Pineda has had multiple label backed releases, toured a few countries and has been part of professional bands for the better part of 20 years. Jeremey hasn't. Simple as that.

Again, Arnel and myself are on pretty level playing ground professionally here in America.

Best lesson to take from all this is, once again, just leave me out of all this bullshit.

[Saint John]

TNC, let me start by saying that I think Jeremey has a fantastic voice, and that is something I have never waivered on. However, Arnel has had record deals, he's TOURED, he's played 4, 5, 6 shows in a week. When has Jeremey been tested by the rigors of the road? When has he sung 4 or 5 times in a week to a live audience? Could he handle "circus life" out on the road? There is simply a qualitative difference as far as voice and it's capabilities go, not to mention that Arnel also has much more experience on the road. At the very least, Jeremey's capabilities as far as the aforementioned criteria goes are "unknown." And while they may both be "karaoke nobodies" in the U.S., Arnel has at least done it elsewhere.

[The_Noble_Cause]

TNC, let me start by saying that I think Jeremey has a fantastic voice, and that is something I have never waivered on. However, Arnel has had record deals, he's TOURED, he's played 4, 5, 6 shows in a week. When has Jeremey been tested by the rigors of the road? When has he sung 4 or 5 times in a week to a live audience? Could he handle "circus life" out on the road? There is simply a qualitative difference as far as voice and it's capabilities go, not to mention that Arnel also has much more experience on the road. At the very least, Jeremey's capabilities as far as the aforementioned criteria goes are "unknown." And while they may both be "karaoke nobodies" in the U.S., Arnel has at least done it elsewhere.

To make the case for Arnel, on the grounds of anything other than his voice, is a futile endeavor. Save your breath.
If recent experience taught us anything, it's that the paramount criteria for Neal and Jon is someone who sounds like Perry.
All this other shit about touring experience or accomplishment is a waste of time, Arnel could be gone tommorow.

[Red13JoePa]

the paramount criteria for Neal and Jon is someone who sounds like Perry.

Something I've never had a prob1em with.
They wanted either a working perry, or someone who's 1ike him but has desire, wants to work, and isn't a diva.
It's what Augeri, Jeremey, and Pineda have been a11 about.

[Saint John]

Jeremey:

1) I said "I'll try to speak for Dean." Why your name was brought up I don't know. I just can't imagine why you would consider the Journey gig, fly there, audition and practically get the gig if you're not thick-skinned enough to ignore one "message board" detractor. Shit, you would have had thousands of Loons up your ass on the road. Maybe the more pertinent question is why are you bringing up Dean considering he's banned?

2) Like it or not, Journey, yes, the real Journey is and has been touring for years. Steve Perry is not and has never been Journey...merely a great part. He jacked a bunch of songs that pre-dated him that Fleischman sang (For You, Anytime, Winds Of March, and Wheel In The Sky immediately come to mind...I'm sure there are others as well). Yet I'm quite sure that people didn't care that Perry sang those songs. Besides, they have original tunes now, too. Something you were a part of...congrats.

3) Yes, you and Arnel are now on a level playing field in the U.S. He took the gig that you seemingly balked on. I'll venture to guess that he sings in front of more fans this year, moves more albums and sees more $$$. Advantage Arnel.

[Voyager]

The dude doesn't sound like a Perry clone at all but he's fuckin good, much better than I expected.

This statement baffles me. If you listen to the re-record samples at WalMart.com, Arnel emulates each and every note and nuance that Perry sang, attempting to clone him as closely as possible. Some people who didn't know it was a re-record might even think it was Perry. How can you say he doesn't sound like a Perry clone? That was the whole idea.

If recent experience taught us anything, it's that the paramount criteria for Neal and Jon is someone who sounds like Perry.

Exactly. If Arnel doesn't sound like a Perry clone, then that means Neal and Jon failed. However, I think Arnel does an exceptionally good job at cloning Perry - much better than anyone I've ever heard.

[conversationpc]

And for the record, Jeremey has collaborated and written original material outside of Frontiers.

...and very good material, I might add, especially "Rolling Away the Stone". Love that tune.

[Saint John]

And for the record, Jeremey has collaborated and written original material outside of Frontiers.

...and very good material, I might add, especially "Rolling Away the Stone". Love that tune.

That song is great. I actually introduced a few people on this board to that tune. Frontiers should throw in 2 or 3 originals (this being one of them!!!) and see what kind of reaction they get. I think this song would go over very well.

[Allied Forces]

And for the record, Jeremey has collaborated and written original material outside of Frontiers.

...and very good material, I might add, especially "Rolling Away the Stone". Love that tune.

That song is great. I actually introduced a few people on this board to that tune. Frontiers should throw in 2 or 3 originals (this being one of them!!!) and see what kind of reaction they get. I think this song would go over very well.

Hey, is there a way I could here this song? I'm sort of getting caught up in all you people with the back and forth stuff. Might be cool to hear what you all are talking about if possible. Thanks in advance, and no big deal if the song isn't for public consumption.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Hey, is there a way I could here this song? I'm sort of getting caught up in all you people with the back and forth stuff. Might be cool to hear what you all are talking about if possible. Thanks in advance, and no big deal if the song isn't for public consumption.

While we're at it, I'd really like a chance to hear Jeremey's take on "Winds of Freedom."
Read that blog entry too late and now the mp3 link is dead.

[Blueskies]

Hey, is there a way I could here this song? I'm sort of getting caught up in all you people with the back and forth stuff. Might be cool to hear what you all are talking about if possible. Thanks in advance, and no big deal if the song isn't for public consumption.

While we're at it, I'd really like a chance to hear Jeremey's take on "Winds of Freedom."
Read that blog entry too late and now the mp3 link is dead.

Sorry..I don't have Rolling Away The Stone
but heres Jeremey singing Winds Of Freedom
http://download.yousendit.com/4BF92B9222CB6D54

[Saint John]

While we're at it, I'd really like a chance to hear Jeremey's take on "Winds of Freedom."

For fucking what? I wouldn't want to hear Perry sing that song. Complete shit that Neal and Jon must've composed when the catalytic convertor on the bus was leaking.

[The_Noble_Cause]

For fucking what? I wouldn't want to hear Perry sing that song. Complete shit that Neal and Jon must've composed when the catalytic convertor on the bus was leaking.

Mainly because I'm curious to hear J's voice on a Journey demo.

Also, i never really understood the bile-raising hatred for WOF.
It's just an understated rah-Americana cheesefest like Liberty. No more, no less.

[Saint John]

For fucking what? I wouldn't want to hear Perry sing that song. Complete shit that Neal and Jon must've composed when the catalytic convertor on the bus was leaking.

Mainly because I'm curious to hear J's voice on a Journey demo.

Also, i never really understood the bile-raising hatred for WOF.
It's just an understated rah-Americana cheesefest like Liberty. No more, no less.

I heard it live and it's simply musically uninspired with a tempo that would make a sloth sleepy. Liberty had some pep to it.

[wednesday's child]

Jeremey:

...

3) Yes, you and Arnel are now on a level playing field in the U.S. He took the gig that you seemingly balked on. I'll venture to guess that he sings in front of more fans this year, moves more albums and sees more $$$. Advantage Arnel.

What the fuck is your problem?
Have you ever considered that the spitefulness you constantly accuse Perry of
(as opposed to the mutual respect that good musicians should have for each other)
is in the same rotted vein as that bullshit you just lobbed at Jeremey?

If the indelicate comparison is to be of accomplishments at time of hiring,
then post-hiring accomplishment is totally irrelevant, unless you're theorizing on
how much Jeremey would have made as Journey's vocalist.
You weren't, were you?

Worse, you were making the comparison on the crass basis of "$$$".
Arnel wasn't thrilled to be offered the gig because of the money he'd make.
Do we ourselves start comparing annual incomes now, and putting one another down
on that basis? That'll ony drive us all apart.

It's love of the music that draws us together.
That, and finding ways to express and share that love with others.
Jeremey's credentials and accomplishments in that regard are pretty fucking solid.



h.

[Jeremey]

3) Yes, you and Arnel are now on a level playing field in the U.S. He took the gig that you seemingly balked on. I'll venture to guess that he sings in front of more fans this year, moves more albums and sees more $$$. Advantage Arnel.

I can't see how anyone would want to even put an advantage of one person or another, like some competition...That's insane! I am getting what I want out of life on my own terms, and so is Arnel...Seems like we both made out pretty well, if you ask me. My short time with Journey was a life altering experience, and it's something that I'll never regret....But the eventual outcome worked out best for ALL parties. Besides...How do you know how much money I make? Or Arnel for that matter?

[Jeremey]

It's love of the music that draws us together.
That, and finding ways to express and share that love with others.
Jeremey's credentials and accomplishments in that regard are pretty fucking solid.



h.

Thank you very much!

[Saint John]

3) Yes, you and Arnel are now on a level playing field in the U.S. He took the gig that you seemingly balked on. I'll venture to guess that he sings in front of more fans this year, moves more albums and sees more $$$. Advantage Arnel.

I can't see how anyone would want to even put an advantage of one person or another, like some competition...That's insane! I am getting what I want out of life on my own terms, and so is Arnel...Seems like we both made out pretty well, if you ask me. My short time with Journey was a life altering experience, and it's something that I'll never regret....But the eventual outcome worked out best for ALL parties. Besides...How do you know how much money I make? Or Arnel for that matter?

Fair enough...statement humbly retracted.

[RPM]

I can't see how anyone would want to even put an advantage of one person or another, like some competition...That's insane! I am getting what I want out of life on my own terms, and so is Arnel...Seems like we both made out pretty well, if you ask me. My short time with Journey was a life altering experience, and it's something that I'll never regret....But the eventual outcome worked out best for ALL parties. Besides...How do you know how much money I make? Or Arnel for that matter?


Fair enough...statement humbly retracted.

Excellent post. and reply.

Ray

[stevew2]

It's love of the music that draws us together.
That, and finding ways to express and share that love with others.
Jeremey's credentials and accomplishments in that regard are pretty fucking solid.



h.

Thank you very much!

You kicked ass in Baltimore Jeremey. Thats cool you are going Nationwide. You wil do very well

[journeyMusic]

It's love of the music that draws us together.
That, and finding ways to express and share that love with others.
Jeremey's credentials and accomplishments in that regard are pretty fucking solid.



h.

Thank you very much!

You kicked ass in Baltimore Jeremey. Thats cool you are going Nationwide. You wil do very well

I agree Stevew2. Awesome show.Once again,you blew it away J-man.