It's official Rolie blows away Cain

[Lula]

gregg rolie is as yummy as a piece of cake! love his velvety smooth voice and no one can touch his organ

Hi Deano!

i wrote it, not dean. he doesn't think rolie is yummy

[annie89509]

Except Perry did take over the lead vocalist role from Rolie...and that was a pretty spectacular improvement.

And I know we all love Ross Valory and everything but not even his own mother would say he's a better bassist than Randy Jackson.

Well, with Perry, Journey changed their musical direction. I just can't imagine Perry singing Of A Lifetime, for exemple. To me, the first 3 albums are a completly different beasts. Anyway I could agree with you that Perry is a better singer than Rolie.

As for Randy Jackson being better than Ross... I would say... not in Journey. Valory is very impressive on the first 3 albums. I never understood the hipe about Jackson being better than Valory. Where does that come from ?

Actually, Steve did sing some of the early songs pre-dating him in the early concerts. Most of the time, in tandem with Gregg. At that point, they only had 1 album of songs from the new lineup to choose from, so they played a lot of the early songs, too. Not sure if Steve joined in for Of A Lifetime. Got to go check out the boots.

As for Randy vs Ross, I think the perception is Randy is a better player because of his being hired as sessions bassist for many famous artists over different genres of music. While Ross has exclusively played in rock bands. Anyone, correct me if I'm wrong.

[Rick]

gregg rolie is as yummy as a piece of cake! love his velvety smooth voice and no one can touch his organ

Hi Deano!

i wrote it, not dean. he doesn't think rolie is yummy

Thank God!

[larryfromnextdoor]

everytime i hear Black Magic Woman etc..... i think how many folks dont realize that was the voice of early journey...

As a kid growing up in San Fran, I always loved those Santana songs on the radio. Everybody in that band was a no name, though, but Carlos. Gregg has an excellent singing voice .... soft and smooth. You really can pick him out singing backup to Steve in the live concert boots (love the duets, too). Maybe, not a coincidence, that from ESCAPE on, they went with taped bg vox exclusively in concert.

they did a little of it on the Departure tour .. there is a version of TOO LATE where the background tape is bad off!!

[annie89509]

everytime i hear Black Magic Woman etc..... i think how many folks dont realize that was the voice of early journey...

As a kid growing up in San Fran, I always loved those Santana songs on the radio. Everybody in that band was a no name, though, but Carlos. Gregg has an excellent singing voice .... soft and smooth. You really can pick him out singing backup to Steve in the live concert boots (love the duets, too). Maybe, not a coincidence, that from ESCAPE on, they went with taped bg vox exclusively in concert.

they did a little of it on the Departure tour .. there is a version of TOO LATE where the background tape is bad off!!

Oh, didn't notice that, Larry. Got to go get those boots out.

[G.I.Jim]

You can all say what you want about Cain, but without him....Journey wouldn't be fucking Journey!!! Yeah they had some MILD success with a few of GR's songs with the band, but Cain is absolutely the cog that spins the Journey wheel. They wouldn't have EVER elevated themselves much more than they had without him.

Is Cain a perfect singer? No, he's a BACK-UP singer. He never claims to be the lead singer for Journey! Yes, Rolie is a better organist, but he has nowhere NEAR the talent on the piano or keyboards, OR songwriting that Cain has. Also, the Organ is about as dated in today's music, as the fucking saxaphone!

I'll apologize in advance, but all this Cain bashing is getting on my fucking nerves!!! If you don't like him, don't fucking listen to anything from Escape on, because he wrote or co-wrote all of it and is the reason they are what they are today! You don't have to like him as a person, but without him, Journey would NOT be Journey. It would sound like an extension of the Santana band. If I wanted to hear that shit, I'd just pop in Santana!!!

[STORY_TELLER]

gregg rolie is as yummy as a piece of cake! love his velvety smooth voice and no one can touch his organ

Hi Deano!

i wrote it, not dean. he doesn't think rolie is yummy

...ahem... I knew that. I wrote it to imply his manliness was questionable.

[DracIsBack]

Maybe I will be hard with Journey on this, but every member changes (exepted maybe for Perry and Pineda) in the history of Journey made the band a weaker one.
musically.

Dunbar was better than Smith in the early days (now both are legendary)
Rolie was better than Cain and still is.
Smith was better than London and Baird
Valory was better than Jackson
Smith is better than Castronovo
Perry was better than Augeri

At least, Valory is back since TBF, Pineda is as good or maybe even better than Augeri.

Cain is a good pop songwritter, probably better than Rolie. He writes great ballads and helped Journey to become very sucessfull, but with him, Journey lost a better keyboardist and a great vocalist.

Anyway, even with all thoses changes, Journey is still a great band.

I think you take the record for most personal subjective opinions expressed as though they are fact in one post! Not an "I thought", "I felt", "in my opinion" or "IMO" anywhere to be seen!

[Matthew]

You can all say what you want about Cain, but without him....Journey wouldn't be fucking Journey!!! Yeah they had some MILD success with a few of GR's songs with the band, but Cain is absolutely the cog that spins the Journey wheel. They wouldn't have EVER elevated themselves much more than they had without him.

Is Cain a perfect singer? No, he's a BACK-UP singer. He never claims to be the lead singer for Journey! Yes, Rolie is a better organist, but he has nowhere NEAR the talent on the piano or keyboards, OR songwriting that Cain has. Also, the Organ is about as dated in today's music, as the fucking saxaphone!

I'll apologize in advance, but all this Cain bashing is getting on my fucking nerves!!! If you don't like him, don't fucking listen to anything from Escape on, because he wrote or co-wrote all of it and is the reason they are what they are today! You don't have to like him as a person, but without him, Journey would NOT be Journey. It would sound like an extension of the Santana band. If I wanted to hear that shit, I'd just pop in Santana!!!

Well said. Agree with every word....

[Centaure]

Maybe I will be hard with Journey on this, but every member changes (exepted maybe for Perry and Pineda) in the history of Journey made the band a weaker one.
musically.

Dunbar was better than Smith in the early days (now both are legendary)
Rolie was better than Cain and still is.
Smith was better than London and Baird
Valory was better than Jackson
Smith is better than Castronovo
Perry was better than Augeri

At least, Valory is back since TBF, Pineda is as good or maybe even better than Augeri.

Cain is a good pop songwritter, probably better than Rolie. He writes great ballads and helped Journey to become very sucessfull, but with him, Journey lost a better keyboardist and a great vocalist.

Anyway, even with all thoses changes, Journey is still a great band.

I think you take the record for most personal subjective opinions expressed as though they are fact in one post! Not an "I thought", "I felt", "in my opinion" or "IMO" anywhere to be seen!

IN MY OPINION, every posts here are subjectif, so I don't think that we are always obligated to wrote those kind of word everytime. Isn't it ?

[conversationpc]

You can all say what you want about Cain, but without him....Journey wouldn't be fucking Journey!!! Yeah they had some MILD success with a few of GR's songs with the band, but Cain is absolutely the cog that spins the Journey wheel. They wouldn't have EVER elevated themselves much more than they had without him.

Is Cain a perfect singer? No, he's a BACK-UP singer. He never claims to be the lead singer for Journey! Yes, Rolie is a better organist, but he has nowhere NEAR the talent on the piano or keyboards, OR songwriting that Cain has. Also, the Organ is about as dated in today's music, as the fucking saxaphone!

I'll apologize in advance, but all this Cain bashing is getting on my fucking nerves!!! If you don't like him, don't fucking listen to anything from Escape on, because he wrote or co-wrote all of it and is the reason they are what they are today! You don't have to like him as a person, but without him, Journey would NOT be Journey. It would sound like an extension of the Santana band. If I wanted to hear that shit, I'd just pop in Santana!!!

[FishinMagician]

and tickner is a better guitarist than schon. hahahaah

[Centaure]

From Derek Sherinian... http://www.ytsejam.com/modules.php?name ... cle&sid=38

What do you think (if anything) about the following keyboardists?
Kevin Moore - I learned some things covering his parts in Dream Theater. I think that he sounded great on those records, and it puzzles me why he left in the first place. His playing is soulful.

Jordan Rudess - Jordan's technique is amazing. Very nice guy.

Keith Emerson - He will always be the king of rock keyboards period. On a showmanship level, no one was cooler than Emerson in his early days.

Rick Wakeman - He was also very cool. Not as cool as Emerson (IMHO) but Wakeman was an influence on me when I was younger, but I haven’t heard any new music in awhile from him.

Tony Banks - Nice textures

Jonathan Cain - More of a songwriter, but writes good pop keyboard parts.

Jens Johanssen - Jens is the only keyboardist that strikes fear or envy in me. I was a fan of Jens when I was younger. You can hear the fire in his playing. Jens is great.

We are not bashing Cain, he is what he is, a good songwriter who writes good keyboard parts. To say that he is a better piano player than Rolie is simply not true (IMO), and go tell Steve Smith that organ is a dated instrument...

Yes, Journey had a better commercial success, but we are talking about artistic success. There are a lot of music lovers who thought that when Jon was hired, Journey became too much commerical.

[conversationpc]

From Derek Sherinian... http://www.ytsejam.com/modules.php?name ... cle&sid=38

What do you think (if anything) about the following keyboardists?
Kevin Moore - I learned some things covering his parts in Dream Theater. I think that he sounded great on those records, and it puzzles me why he left in the first place. His playing is soulful.

Jordan Rudess - Jordan's technique is amazing. Very nice guy.

Keith Emerson - He will always be the king of rock keyboards period. On a showmanship level, no one was cooler than Emerson in his early days.

Rick Wakeman - He was also very cool. Not as cool as Emerson (IMHO) but Wakeman was an influence on me when I was younger, but I haven’t heard any new music in awhile from him.

Tony Banks - Nice textures

Jonathan Cain - More of a songwriter, but writes good pop keyboard parts.

Jens Johanssen - Jens is the only keyboardist that strikes fear or envy in me. I was a fan of Jens when I was younger. You can hear the fire in his playing. Jens is great.

We are not bashing Cain, he is what he is, a good songwriter who writes good keyboard parts. To say that he is a better piano player than Rolie is simply not true (IMO), and go tell Steve Smith that organ is a dated instrument...

Well, compared to those guys, he's definitely not in their league. Those guys are some of the best at what they do.

[S2M]

What about The Rocket Scientists?

Lana Lane's husband is a decent keyboardist....Erik Norlander.

[G.I.Jim]

From Derek Sherinian... http://www.ytsejam.com/modules.php?name ... cle&sid=38

What do you think (if anything) about the following keyboardists?
Kevin Moore - I learned some things covering his parts in Dream Theater. I think that he sounded great on those records, and it puzzles me why he left in the first place. His playing is soulful.

Jordan Rudess - Jordan's technique is amazing. Very nice guy.

Keith Emerson - He will always be the king of rock keyboards period. On a showmanship level, no one was cooler than Emerson in his early days.

Rick Wakeman - He was also very cool. Not as cool as Emerson (IMHO) but Wakeman was an influence on me when I was younger, but I haven’t heard any new music in awhile from him.

Tony Banks - Nice textures

Jonathan Cain - More of a songwriter, but writes good pop keyboard parts.

Jens Johanssen - Jens is the only keyboardist that strikes fear or envy in me. I was a fan of Jens when I was younger. You can hear the fire in his playing. Jens is great.

We are not bashing Cain, he is what he is, a good songwriter who writes good keyboard parts. To say that he is a better piano player than Rolie is simply not true (IMO), and go tell Steve Smith that organ is a dated instrument...

Yes, Journey had a better commercial success, but we are talking about artistic success. There are a lot of music lovers who thought that when Jon was hired, Journey became too much commerical.

You're quoting someone else, yet referring to my post. Either way, your right....Piano playing is all in the ear of the beholder. Coming from someone who's played piano and keyboards for over 30 years, it is MY opinion that Cain SPANKS ROLIE'S ASS AT PLAYING PIANO!!! Again, that's just my OPINION.

I'm a HUGE Steve Smith fan, but what have we heard from him in the last 12 years that has ANYTHING to do with melodic rock??? My Grandmother used to bake some awesome cookies too, but that has NOTHING to do with melodic rock, or todays music.

Yes, Journey became a more commercial success, but you know why??? Because they started writing what people wanted to hear, and people started buying albums. If you were a songwriter, or someone who played proffesionally in a band, would you want people to buy your albums? I think you would.


Tony Banks, and several of the other artists you mentioned, are AWESOME keyboardists (as well as some of my influences). How many of them are STILL writing kick-ass music that we're hearing today??? How many have even written (on their own), songs we've heard that were chart-toppers? Just saying...

Just trying to make some points here. Lately, it seems like I see nothing but threads about Perry VS Schon, this person sucks, that person sucks....JUST LISTEN TO THE CD AND ENJOY IT. IF YOU DON'T....DON'T LISTEN TO THE DAMN THING!!!

I'm not saying that you have to agree with me, or like the band. Just seems like there's getting to be a lot of bitching on here, after (again-MY opinion) the band has released one of the best albums it's released in a LONG time.

Peace!

[brandonx76]

What about The Rocket Scientists?

Lana Lane's husband is a decent keyboardist....Erik Norlander.

There's a band that gets better with every album. In the prog-arena, they do some great stuff and Erik has some very tasteful keyboard / synth sounds and playing throughout.

A lot of keyboardists mentioned, so I'll throw out one more - Vince DiCola. His Thread cd is an prog-AOR masterpiece

[Monstrock]

You guys are just basically comparing apples and oranges here. Both are great musicians and have great and significant contributions to the band.

[brandonx76]

I'm a HUGE Steve Smith fan, but what have we heard from him in the last 12 years that has ANYTHING to do with melodic rock??? My Grandmother used to bake some awesome cookies too, but that has NOTHING to do with melodic rock, or todays music.

Smith did the House of Blues gig w/Journey in 2005 (or whenever it was)

Smith should be in Journey, but it's Deen time right now, and I think him and Schon are friends. Sings his ass off as we all know, so I don't think it will ever happen - but it SHOULD, at least for a one off show.

Someone said he didn't sound as good as Aynsley...bullshit...Studio maybe (because Evolution was recorded like crap) go back and listen to the bootlegs from that era. A whole 'nother class of musician.

And as for Ross Valory vs. Randy Jackson - can we please stop debating this, this was Perry's 'My way or the highway' derailment. Jackson is certainly capable, but he's not Journey's bass player. Ross FTW

[Carlitto H@kk]

You guys are just basically comparing apples and oranges here. Both are great musicians and have great and significant contributions to the band.

Actually,
they are comparing a Fruit and, what did Lula call Rolie, Cake?
There. They are comparing a Fruit (Cain, of course) and a Cake (Rolie)

[Rick]

You guys are just basically comparing apples and oranges here. Both are great musicians and have great and significant contributions to the band.

Actually,
they are comparing a Fruit and, what did Lula call Rolie, Cake?
There. They are comparing a Fruit (Cain, of course) and a Cake (Rolie)

Holy shit that's funny.

[Monstrock]

You guys are just basically comparing apples and oranges here. Both are great musicians and have great and significant contributions to the band.

Actually,
they are comparing a Fruit and, what did Lula call Rolie, Cake?
There. They are comparing a Fruit (Cain, of course) and a Cake (Rolie)

[Lula]

You guys are just basically comparing apples and oranges here. Both are great musicians and have great and significant contributions to the band.

Actually,
they are comparing a Fruit and, what did Lula call Rolie, Cake?
There. They are comparing a Fruit (Cain, of course) and a Cake (Rolie)

a fruitcake? sorry, had to

still coming out for some music?

[Carlitto H@kk]

You guys are just basically comparing apples and oranges here. Both are great musicians and have great and significant contributions to the band.

Actually,
they are comparing a Fruit and, what did Lula call Rolie, Cake?
There. They are comparing a Fruit (Cain, of course) and a Cake (Rolie)

a fruitcake? sorry, had to

still coming out for some music?

A "FruitCake" only if they woulda shared the stage
for the "proposed" reunion years ago

And sorry to say, it doesn't look like
its gonna happen and I am heartbroken.

Just bad timing with my work schedule.
But hey, look at the bright side:
I'm sure jeff will play LA again some time
in the near future, right???

And it ain't like I'm holding out for him to come to
Utard cuz I know THAT isn't gonna happen

[Centaure]

Yes and commercial success and artistic success are surely two different fruits... Anyway people seems to think otherwise.

You can always decide to be a whore and make money, just to please the masses.

[conversationpc]

[Arkansas]

Well, from what I remember back then, Rolie hand-picked Cain. HH said no, but Rolie said yes. And the rest is history.

Keep in mind that Cain, although very talented, is also classicaly trained, and school'd, and whatever'd...not to mention that growing-up in the 70s when rock was young lends to being more educationally backgrounded. Whereas, Gregg Rolie had no training at all...was a sight reader...and also was a given talent in that he mostly played by ear in the revolutionary 60s where darned everything was free-form.

So 'blows who away' ? ...a professionally trained player or some naturally talented soul?

Geez. Ask Carlos Santana who's better? Or, ask John Waite. ???

It's apples and oranges. Give the nod wherever you want it, but it's really two different genres.


later~

[7 Wishes]

Cain is one of the best songwriters out there. Without Escape and Frontiers, Journey would have been just another 70's rock band with a few hits. Don't ever forget that.

[Journey/Survivor]

You can all say what you want about Cain, but without him....Journey wouldn't be fucking Journey!!! Yeah they had some MILD success with a few of GR's songs with the band, but Cain is absolutely the cog that spins the Journey wheel. They wouldn't have EVER elevated themselves much more than they had without him.

Is Cain a perfect singer? No, he's a BACK-UP singer. He never claims to be the lead singer for Journey! Yes, Rolie is a better organist, but he has nowhere NEAR the talent on the piano or keyboards, OR songwriting that Cain has. Also, the Organ is about as dated in today's music, as the fucking saxaphone!

I'll apologize in advance, but all this Cain bashing is getting on my fucking nerves!!! If you don't like him, don't fucking listen to anything from Escape on, because he wrote or co-wrote all of it and is the reason they are what they are today! You don't have to like him as a person, but without him, Journey would NOT be Journey. It would sound like an extension of the Santana band. If I wanted to hear that shit, I'd just pop in Santana!!!

I agree with much of what you said.

And it's been pissing me off with all of the unjustified Jonathan Cain bashing that has gone on here for the last couple of years.

I would disagree with saying that Journey wouldn't be Journey without Cain, simply because they were already JOURNEY in every sense when Rolie was in the band. But I agree that they wouldn't have become as huge as they did without Cain in the band. Rolie is a pretty good piano player, and decent on synth, but Cain wins those two categories. Rolie is the better organist, possibly the best ever in Rock. Although Cain's pretty darn good as an organist when he plays that style. Rolie's a good songwriter, but Cain definitely wins there too. Cain's a good backing vocalist, and an alright lead singer on his own material, but Rolie definitely wins there.

Their both great keyboardists/songwriters/singers and Journey is very fortunate to have had both of them in the band.

[Centaure]

Cain is one of the best songwriters out there. Without Escape and Frontiers, Journey would have been just another 70's rock band with a few hits. Don't ever forget that.

Who really knows what could have happen if Rolie stayed on board ???