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Michigan Girl wrote:Surviving Doors about to settle suitStory Highlights
Lawsuit pitted John Densmore, Jim Morrison heirs vs. Robby Krieger, Ray Manzarek
Densmore didn't want to play on reunion tour, said couldn't use Doors name
SAN FRANCISCO, California (AP) -- The end is near for a bitter legal dispute between the three surviving members of The Doors now that the California Supreme Court has refused to take up their case.
Doors members Ray Manzarek and Robby Krieger (both on right) may have to pay more than $5 million.
Keyboardist Ray Manzarek and guitarist Robby Krieger are on the hook for more than $5 million after they were found by lower courts to have improperly invoked The Doors' name and images during a 2003 concert tour. After the high court declined to hear their appeal on August 13, they'll have to pay up to drummer John Densmore, the parents of the deceased lead singer Jim Morrison and the parents of Morrison's deceased wife, Pamela Courson, who died in 1974.
The case goes back to 2002, when Densmore declined an offer from the other two to go on a concert tour as The Doors. Densmore said he didn't object to Manzarek and Krieger touring and singing The Doors' songs, as long as they didn't call themselves The Doors, use the group's distinctive logo or any other Morrison-era imagery.
"You can't call yourselves The Doors because you can't have The Doors without Jim Morrison," Densmore's attorney S. Jerome Mandel said.
Densmore and the parents sued Manzarek and Krieger in 2003 after the two began touring the country with Ian Astbury, former lead singer of The Cult, and calling themselves The Doors of the 21st Century.
Densmore complained that the phrase "of the 21st Century" was often little more than fine print in advertisements and that the new band displayed Morrison's image dozens of times during concerts. The tour grossed $8 million and netted $3.2 million, which went to the new band's company called Doors Touring, Inc. and none of which went to Densmore or the parents.
In 2005, a judge ordered the new band to stop using "The Doors" in any form and ordered Manzarek and Krieger to pay Densmore and the parents a combined $3.2 million, plus $2 million in legal costs.
An appeals court upheld the $3.2 million award, and is considering Manzarek and Krieger's appeal of the $2 million in legal costs as excessive.
"It's really disappointing," said lawyer Mark Poster, who represented Manzarek and Krieger. He said the two pursued the appeal so vigorously because a judge had overruled a jury decision in awarding Densmore damages.
The dispute stems from a 1970 agreement signed by the four original band members, including Morrison, that any business deal would require an unanimous vote of The Doors. The agreement was reached after Morrison and three others got into a "violent disagreement" over using "Light My Fire" in a Buick television commercial, according to the appeals court's decision in May backing Densmore.
"While the three partners had agreed to the commercial, Morrison vehemently disagreed and the commercial was not done," the appeals court wrote.
Since Morrison's death in Paris in 1971, the remaining band members and the parents split Morrison's share of the still-flourishing sale of The Doors' music and memorabilia. Each partner has veto power over business deals.
Seven years ago, for instance, General Motors offered the partnership $15 million to use "Light My Fire" to sell Cadillacs, and everyone but Densmore wanted to take the deal. Densmore also refused an endorsement deal offered by iPod maker Apple.
"Morrison had been adamant against doing commercials and Densmore wanted to honor Morrison's memory," the appeals court noted in its May ruling.
The Los Angeles-based band, which was inducted in 1992 into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, had a string of hits in the 1960s including "Break on Through," "L.A. Woman" and "Riders on the Storm."
Manzarek and Krieger now call themselves Riders on the Storm and continue to perform The Doors' songs live.
WOW!!!
EightyRock wrote:According to Friga, Perry could have stopped them from continuing on with the Journey name, too. Friga said he was too classy to do that, though.
Rick wrote:EightyRock wrote:According to Friga, Perry could have stopped them from continuing on with the Journey name, too. Friga said he was too classy to do that, though.
I'm glad Perry stood down on that, but how the hell could he even do that? There was a band named Journey before he sang with them. It would be like me quitting American and telling them they had to change their name. I don't get that.
RocknRoll wrote:Rick wrote:EightyRock wrote:According to Friga, Perry could have stopped them from continuing on with the Journey name, too. Friga said he was too classy to do that, though.
I'm glad Perry stood down on that, but how the hell could he even do that? There was a band named Journey before he sang with them. It would be like me quitting American and telling them they had to change their name. I don't get that.
Not sure of the exact, but I believe Cain said something to the effect that Perry could have tried to tie them up for years legally. I doubt Perry would have won, but he could have made it difficult. I think HH wanted them to fight it out knowing that Schon and company would win. Which is why I believe SP entered into the contract with the band so that they go could forward and the band agreed to it just to avoid any legal hassles from him and then he gets paid bigtime to boot.
Just my take on it.
Rick wrote:EightyRock wrote:According to Friga, Perry could have stopped them from continuing on with the Journey name, too. Friga said he was too classy to do that, though.
I'm glad Perry stood down on that, but how the hell is that even legally possible? There was a band named Journey before he sang with them. It would be like me quitting American and telling them they had to change their name. I don't get that.
EightyRock wrote:Rick wrote:EightyRock wrote:According to Friga, Perry could have stopped them from continuing on with the Journey name, too. Friga said he was too classy to do that, though.
I'm glad Perry stood down on that, but how the hell is that even legally possible? There was a band named Journey before he sang with them. It would be like me quitting American and telling them they had to change their name. I don't get that.
Who knows what they had agreed to, as far as the band name goes. There might have been a band named Journey in the early days but there wasn't any success of note prior to Perry joining the band. Now if he REALLY wanted to be clever, he should have renamed them Steve Perry and Journey after Escape hit #1. If he would have done that, GAME OVER, as far as Journey carrying on with "x" amount of new singers. Too bad he didn't retain more control for a longer time, then when they started tapegate he could have shut them down for good. Can you imagine being him and watching them drag the band's legacy through that horse shit? Those guys are lucky as hell that he wasn't more bloodthirsty or they'd be selling used cars by day and playing in local bars at night....cause let's face it....not many people know who the hell Jon Cain and Neal Schon are, other than some die hard Journey fans.
EightyRock wrote:Rick wrote:EightyRock wrote:According to Friga, Perry could have stopped them from continuing on with the Journey name, too. Friga said he was too classy to do that, though.
I'm glad Perry stood down on that, but how the hell is that even legally possible? There was a band named Journey before he sang with them. It would be like me quitting American and telling them they had to change their name. I don't get that.
Who knows what they had agreed to, as far as the band name goes. There might have been a band named Journey in the early days but there wasn't any success of note prior to Perry joining the band. Now if he REALLY wanted to be clever, he should have renamed them Steve Perry and Journey after Escape hit #1. If he would have done that, GAME OVER, as far as Journey carrying on with "x" amount of new singers. Too bad he didn't retain more control for a longer time, then when they started tapegate he could have shut them down for good. Can you imagine being him and watching them drag the band's legacy through that horse shit? Those guys are lucky as hell that he wasn't more bloodthirsty or they'd be selling used cars by day and playing in local bars at night....cause let's face it....not many people know who the hell Jon Cain and Neal Schon are, other than some die hard Journey fans.
StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
Rick wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
I respectfully disagree.
Maybe they should have been named "Journey - Featuring Steve Perry" when they hired him. Then all this wrangling would be moot.
StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
RocknRoll wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
I'll be waiting to hear your response next year![]()
BTW: Stockton/Malone. Best combination ever.
StocktontoMalone wrote:RocknRoll wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
I'll be waiting to hear your response next year![]()
BTW: Stockton/Malone. Best combination ever.
Next year?
RocknRoll wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:RocknRoll wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
I'll be waiting to hear your response next year![]()
BTW: Stockton/Malone. Best combination ever.
Next year?
Sorry, don't read anything into that.
I was just commenting that another year with Arnel on tour and probably with another CD in the mix, you just might be changing your tune
Deb wrote:As far as The Doors go, IMO I don't think they could have picked a better frontman to replace Jim Morrison than Ian Astbury. He's not Jim, but he sounds a lot like him and seems to have quite a similar stage presence about him. I really liked Ian fronting The Cult, they had some GREAT music. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Af1wuxRerV0
StocktontoMalone wrote:Rick wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
I respectfully disagree.
Maybe they should have been named "Journey - Featuring Steve Perry" when they hired him. Then all this wrangling would be moot.
Van Halen - feat. Sammy Hagar
AC/DC feat. Brian Johnson
Foreigner feat. Kelly Hansen
where does it end?
I'm sorry to break it to you(collective), but Journey IS/was SMFP....case closed.
Rick wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:Rick wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
I respectfully disagree.
Maybe they should have been named "Journey - Featuring Steve Perry" when they hired him. Then all this wrangling would be moot.
Van Halen - feat. Sammy Hagar
AC/DC feat. Brian Johnson
Foreigner feat. Kelly Hansen
where does it end?
I'm sorry to break it to you(collective), but Journey IS/was SMFP....case closed.
SMFPLove that.
StocktontoMalone wrote:Rick wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:Rick wrote:StocktontoMalone wrote:All kidding aside......it really ISN'T Journey. I like the music. That's not what I'm saying.....it just isn't JOURNEY. Journey IS Cain, Schon, and Perry. Anyone can play bass, and anyone can hit skins.....Songwriting, geetars, and vocals are a BAND. And that translates to Cain, Schon, and PERRY. Anything else is a facsimile thereof....booyah!
I respectfully disagree.
Maybe they should have been named "Journey - Featuring Steve Perry" when they hired him. Then all this wrangling would be moot.
Van Halen - feat. Sammy Hagar
AC/DC feat. Brian Johnson
Foreigner feat. Kelly Hansen
where does it end?
I'm sorry to break it to you(collective), but Journey IS/was SMFP....case closed.
SMFPLove that.
I'd love to take credit for that, Rick, but....it was all BJG with SMFP, she was PDQ FYI....
Deb wrote:As far as The Doors go, IMO I don't think they could have picked a better frontman to replace Jim Morrison than Ian Astbury. He's not Jim, but he sounds a lot like him and seems to have quite a similar stage presence about him. I really liked Ian fronting The Cult, they had some GREAT music. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Af1wuxRerV0
StocktontoMalone wrote:
I'm sorry to break it to you(collective), but Journey IS/was SMFP....case closed.
JRNYFan wrote:Deb wrote:As far as The Doors go, IMO I don't think they could have picked a better frontman to replace Jim Morrison than Ian Astbury. He's not Jim, but he sounds a lot like him and seems to have quite a similar stage presence about him. I really liked Ian fronting The Cult, they had some GREAT music. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Af1wuxRerV0
They don't even have Astbury now. They have the old singer of Fuel now -- Brett Scallions. Personally, I didn't like either choice. Astbury certainly looked the part though.
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