Rock N' Roll Hall of Fame

[7 Wishes]

Robert Fleischman, George Tickner, Randy Jackson, Prairie Prince.

They built the Journey legacy, and they should represent them at the ROR HOF.

[AJ]

[quote="7 Wishes"]Robert Fleischman, George Tickner, Randy Jackson, Prairie Prince.

They built the Journey legacy, and they should represent them at the ROR HOF.[/quote]


HAHAHA!!

Anyway...the band decides who goes in. I remember reading something about Timothy B. Schmidt getting in with The Eagles and he didn't come in until The Long Run album...their last until Hell froze over...but Henley and Frye believed he should be in. It is a no-brainer for Neal, Perry, Valory, Smitty, Cain, and Rolie. Dunbar should go because he was the original drummer and lasted 4 albums. I don't believe Tickner should, but could because of being an original member. Fleischman?? No freakin' way! Ditto RJ And PP. Augeri and Castronovo?? While longevity may make some say yes, I don't believe they should. I believe Jon and Neal would fight to get them in though, especially Deen. Even though I think the HOF is a major joke...it sure would make it much better for me if Journey was in there! Along with Styx, REO, Foreigner, etc.

[Journey/Survivor]

Isn't Rolie already in with Santana? I am at the wrong place, is there more than one HOF for Rock?

Yes, he is. I've even seen his autograph on the inductees wall in the HOF.

[Since 78]

ROLIE CO FORMED THE BAND FOR GOD SAKES. HE WAS THE BAND AT FIRST through all the sweat of just surviving... and you are borderline of putting him there??? NUTS. WOW how you forget the roots Iam just amazed. AMAZING. and INFINTY EVOLUTION AND DEPARTURE... are 30 times better than ESCAPE FRONTIERS and ROR.

Yeah, Rolie would HAVE to be in. After all, he was part of the band when they had four consecutive platinum-selling albums.

Thank You!!! There was a very successful Journey before Escape!

[mikemarrs]

kiss,styx,rush,journey,foreigner,boston,deep purple,alice cooper,etc.

if i put one that already got inducted i'm sorry but from this list i think every damn one of these bands deserve hall of fame induction......

[X factor]

Robert Fleischman, George Tickner, Randy Jackson, Prairie Prince.

They built the Journey legacy, and they should represent them at the ROR HOF.

I think these are the only 4 who should be inducted!!!

[ebake02]

I would rather see journey on Rock Honors than be inducted into the Hall of Fame. I think inductees from recent years shows what a joke the hall has turned into. It doesn't seem to be about talent anymore, it about how asses you kiss.

[artist4perry]

Robert Fleischman, George Tickner, Randy Jackson, Prairie Prince.

They built the Journey legacy, and they should represent them at the ROR HOF.

I think these are the only 4 who should be inducted!!!

I think any member past or present should be inducted. All have contributed. Let's face it, they would not be in the HOF without Rollie, Perry, Smitty, and Jon. The album sales would not have sustainted them.

[Arianddu]

Now here's a question - should Herbie Herberts be included?

[RossValoryRocks]

Now here's a question - should Herbie Herberts be included?

I think he should be. He got them all of their successes, minus Revelation, as their manager. He forced them to bring Perry in, which was the catalyst for the explosion of fame.

He deserves it.

[Michigan Girl]

Now here's a question - should Herbie Herberts be included?

I think he should be. He got them all of their successes, minus Revelation, as their manager. He forced them to bring Perry in, which was the catalyst for the explosion of fame.

He deserves it.

I concur!!!

[Enigma869]

Now here's a question - should Herbie Herberts be included?

NO...Herbie should not be included. Even though Herbie is EVERY bit as significant as the main players were, I don't know of any other band who had their manager inducted with them, so why should Herbie be any different? I'm quite sure that Journey isn't the only band who has a manager to thank for bringing them together. Again, I believe Herbert was VERY significant. Having said that, he isn't remotely resonsible for the unbelieveable singing ability that Perry had...He isn't remotely responsible for the unmatched song-writing talents of Friga, and I'm quite sure that Neal Schon knew how to shred a guitar, long before he ever even heard the name Herbie Herbert! Not to mention, the guy is a complete ASS!


John from Boston

[Arianddu]

Now here's a question - should Herbie Herberts be included?

NO...Herbie should not be included. Even though Herbie is EVERY bit as significant as the main players were, I don't know of any other band who had their manager inducted with them, so why should Herbie be any different? I'm quite sure that Journey isn't the only band who has a manager to thank for bringing them together. Again, I believe Herbert was VERY significant. Having said that, he isn't remotely resonsible for the unbelieveable singing ability that Perry had...He isn't remotely responsible for the unmatched song-writing talents of Friga, and I'm quite sure that Neal Schon knew how to shred a guitar, long before he ever even heard the name Herbie Herbert! Not to mention, the guy is a complete ASS!


John from Boston

Not disagreeing with you, just wondered what people thought.

[RossValoryRocks]

Now here's a question - should Herbie Herberts be included?

Not to mention, the guy is a complete ASS!


John from Boston

If HOF worthiness was determined by a person's personality then almost NO bands would be in the HOF.

Most performers of that level are asses at some point.

As for the rest Herbie almost single handedly changed how rock music was marketed, and while he isn't responsible for how good Steve Perry sang, or how well Jon Cain rights, or the fact that Neal Schon was a child prodigy on guitar, he was the one who put all those elements together. He is like a chef at a fine dining establishmen: While the chef didn't grow the spices, or raise the cow (or whatever fish, chicken or pork) he is the one who blends them to make the dish come out just right!

In the end, Herbie belongs for his contribution to the INDUSTRY as much as he does for what he did with Journey.

[Enigma869]

If HOF worthiness was determined by a person's personality then almost NO bands would be in the HOF.

I wasn't arguing to the contrary. For the record, I never stated that Herbie doesn't belong in the HOF as a member of Journey, because he was an ass. I was simply stating what a dick the guy has always been. I don't think he belongs in the HOF as a member of Journey (which was the question posed) because he wasn't a member of Journey, period! I don't know of one other manager who has been inducted with a band, and Herbie isn't any different, as far as I'm concerned!

Most performers of that level are asses at some point.

Agreed, and I would include every member of Journey!

As for the rest Herbie almost single handedly changed how rock music was marketed

I'm sure if this is remotely valid, then Herbie will someday be recognized for his contributions, but NOT as a member of a band that he wasn't a member of!

while he isn't responsible for how good Steve Perry sang, or how well Jon Cain rights, or the fact that Neal Schon was a child prodigy on guitar, he was the one who put all those elements together. He is like a chef at a fine dining establishmen: While the chef didn't grow the spices, or raise the cow (or whatever fish, chicken or pork) he is the one who blends them to make the dish come out just right!

Again, as I said in my original post, I don't dispute Herbie's significance to Journey. Anyone who knows the history of the band understands that. Having said that, if he had decided to bring in Jonathan Cain as the lead singer, instead of Steve Perry, I'm quite sure that you and I wouldn't be having this discussion on a Journey message board, because nobody would have ever heard of them with Cain's god-awful voice! I realize that Herbie brought these talented men together, and I am certainlygrateful for that. I simply believe that talented people succeed, eventually in life, regardless of who ultimately "discovers" his or her talent!

In the end, Herbie belongs for his contribution to the INDUSTRY as much as he does for what he did with Journey.

This is a completely different argument that I'm sure many would agree with. There are many broadcasters in the baseball HOF for their contribution to the game, but they are not inducted as a member of a certain team (even if they broadcasted one team's games for 40 years). If the HOF has a "Manager's Wing" (for lack of a better phrase), then Herbie should be considered. I simply don't believe and will never believe that he, or any other manager should be inducted as a band member. To suggest otherwise is just plain silly, to me!


John from Boston

[Don]

How about producers? Mutt Lange should get some of the credit for the success of Leppard and AC DC. Dude has helped get a lot of acts in through the door to stardom.

[lights1961]

herbie should be in as a managers hall of fame but not the bands hall of fame.

Rick

[S2M]

Keep in mind Rolie was not part their greatest commercial success with the beginning of the Escape era.

I agree with this, which is why Rollie is VERY borderline for me. I personally wouldn't include him, simply because I don't think his contributions to the band Journey warrant his inclusion. You could argue that he was an original member and was part of the band when they first realized commerical success, but he departed pretty quickly, after Journey was hitting it big. I'd at least listen to an argument for Rollie's inclusion. Arguing for Augeri and Castronovo is just plain dopey...even if you're related to them!


John from Boston

ROLIE CO FORMED THE BAND FOR GOD SAKES. HE WAS THE BAND AT FIRST through all the sweat of just surviving... and you are borderline of putting him there??? NUTS. WOW how you forget the roots Iam just amazed. AMAZING. and INFINTY EVOLUTION AND DEPARTURE... are 30 times better than ESCAPE FRONTIERS and ROR.




Rick

First of all, when a band is 'made' like Journey was....like NSync was....like Backstreet Boys were - there is no 'co-founding members'....Neither Neal, Greg, nor Valory FOUNDED the band.....Herbie FOUNDED the band....the band members were just ORIGINAL members. Let's not give credit where credit is not due, k?

[Enigma869]

First of all, when a band is 'made' like Journey was....like NSync was....like Backstreet Boys were - there is no 'co-founding members'....Neither Neal, Greg, nor Valory FOUNDED the band.....Herbie FOUNDED the band....the band members were just ORIGINAL members. Let's not give credit where credit is not due, k?

I agree. Contrary to how "successful" some have claimed Journey was before "Infinity", it doesn't change the fact that they sold 8 records outside of The Bay Area, and were about to be fired by their record label, because of the dreadful performance of their first three releases! That's a fact, regardless of the "Journey was a legend in their own mind" propaganda that some try to spread! The reason I say I wouldn't argue against Rollie's inclusion is that he was at least a member of the band, as they began their ascent...was an original member...and in the band longer than 20 minutes! In spite of the longevity that guys like Castronovo and Augeri enjoyed, it doesn't changed the fact that neither guy is remotely significant in the epic saga that is Journey!


John from Boston