OT: The Missing Cymbal Hit?

[texafana]

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=9HrYEExSsrY

Please watch this video and keep an eye on the drums and an ear on the audio from the 2:20 mark on.

While Dean is playing the drums, there appears to be a "cymbal" hit in the music but I don't see either of Deen's hands strike a cymbal. It happens right slightly before the 2:30 mark. I've watched it a dozen times and had some family look at it and we don't see a cymbal strike. Can someone please have a close look and post your opinion? Thanks.

I've saved a copy incase it uh...dissapears.

[Moon Beam]

I can see him hitting the gold looking cymbal on the low right.

[T-Bone]

Yay... Here comes "Drum-Gate"

[texafana]

I can see him hitting the gold looking cymbal on the low right.

Please look again and verify. Right after the first "whoahhhhh" you hear the crash, but his arms do not appear to be hitting a crash cymbal. His left hand is clearly staying near the snare, his right hand is playing the large ride cymbal. Or at least that's what it looks to me. We need a drummer to verify this!

[Moon Beam]

Yay... Here comes "Drum-Gate"

Nope not by me you won't see it Sir.
The topic starter asked a question and I replied with what I saw.



texafana I hear what your saying but I have no explanation for
your cymbal sound search.

[Arkansas]

I noticed this same thing when I first watched the vid. Very interesting.
Maybe he just hit his ride a little harder, but it sure does sound like a crash.




later~

[cinkidd]

I see the same thing. Not to mention that the "vocals" seem a bit off too. Not sure if it is some kind of "feedback" or tick of the placement of mics but you can tell that some of the vocals are just a bit off. Listen to the vocals at the 1:50 - 2:15 mark, and again at 2:25 - 2:57 mark.

Rich the Off Guy

Edited to post the times.

[etcetera]

I do recognize a mysterious faint crash...an echo, maybe?

[ebake02]

Maybe uploading the video to youtube screwed up the audio and video. It's probably out of sync or something. I can't imagine the band would be dumb enough to do that again.

[Liquid_Drummer]

for me it is at 2:32.. As a drummer of 26 years I can tell you I hear a cymbal but he isnt hitting any thing other than the ride to his right.. They do play to a click track for a lot of the show from what I hear so maybe that have a few things sequenced up.. I have no idea why a cymbal would be there.. It is a little weird.. Drumgate..... Doubtful.


The video is not out of sync by the way.... It is part of a backing track they use for layerd harmonies probably. Why a cymbal would be there.... It is possible that he has some electronic pads and it was triggered from him hitting other things.. He is beating the shit out of that snare and I can tell you from experience that electronic pads can fire when you hit other things if the sensitivity threshold is too low.... But I can also say that it would be strange to have a cymbal set to a pad when you have plenty of cymbals.. Jon could have triggered it...

The volume level of this cymbal hit is lower than the cymbals he is hitting that can be seen which shows what we are hearing is coming from a wedge monitor or side fill monitors and not the kit...

[UncleKG]

Certainly you can't call it "drumgate," because Deen obviously plays 99.8% of the stuff you hear through the live mix. Having said that, I think there is a cymbal crash sampled in. What I don't understand is, what's the purpose of just that one crash being there? Unless they just nitpicked the arrangement to the point of saying, "We want the fullness provided by having Deen stay on the ride cymbal, but that crash is on the original studio track, so we've got to have it played that way live." Really makes no sense, but the crash is certainly there.

I'll mark this one down to "things that make you go hmmm...." and also, "minutiae that can take up WAY too much time if you worry about it."

[texafana]

Thanks Liquid_Drummer, I think it's obvious now that there is indeed a cymbal crash but Deen isn't playing it. I mean if they would go to that length to sequence in a cymbal crash, well...let's just say they would do anything to make sure the show goes over well. wow...

[Liquid_Drummer]

Yeah.. Thats like OCD to be that concerned with such a litte thing.. A little cymbal hit that no one is going to notice or care if it is there or not.... Cant explain it..

[bluejeangirl76]

Maybe uploading the video to youtube screwed up the audio and video. It's probably out of sync or something.

This is my guess without even watching it. YouTube + users who don't convert/format properly = poor quality out of sync videos. If we're going to start looking for trouble, effing YouTube isn't the place to do it. I'm gonna need better evidence.

Deen's drumming is just fine. Next case.

[Deb]

I've saved a copy incase it uh...dissapears.

[Saint John]

I've saved a copy incase it uh...dissapears.

Hopefully, it stays and you disappear. Who gives a fucking shit about a phantom cymbal sound...whether it was triggered by Deen, Jon, accidentally, or Kevin fucking Cronin?

[UncleKG]

It was a valid question. While watching the video, it's definitely a moment that makes you have to rewind it a few times. If it were a video of Arnel pulling the mic away while the voice kept going through the mix, it would be analyzed more than the Zapruder film.

[stevew2]

Maybe Friga had gas, I hear it barely.Maybe that dude Kevin added it in along with the taped vocal harmonies

[separate_wayz]

Deen uses Zildjian cymbals -- a combination of Zildjians, Zildjian K's, and Zildjian A Custom's. Here is his set-up:

http://www.zildjian.com/en-US/products/ ... istID=1062

I think the tip of Deen's right stick glances the Zildjian 20" Medium Thin Crash cymbal, which is stacked over the ride cymbal. Look at it closely.

Given the quality of youtube audio and video, there could be less there than meets the eye (and ear).

Also, Deen also uses a Roland trigger pad (for the rim shots on 'Send Her My Love', for example). This is pretty standard stuff for drummers nowadays. The trigger pad, if it were set for a crash cymbal, could have been triggered by an acoustic drum or cymbal (it happens).

[SusieP]

Yeah, I hear it and don't see him hit.

What amazes is me most is how you noticed that!
Amazing powers of observation there.

Maybe Ross did it. He was standing at the front of Deen through some of that.
Maybe he had something long and pointy with which to reach over and hit the cymbal. [stevew2 told me to post that.]

[stevew2]

Yeah, I hear it and don't see him hit.

What amazes is me most is how you noticed that!
Amazing powers of observation there.

Maybe Ross did it. He was standing at the front of Deen through some of that.
Maybe he had something long and pointy with which to reach over and hit the cymbal. [stevew2 told me to post that.]

lol Ross proballably does, .Most bass players are hung like donkeys. You know it wasnt Friga,he couldnt reach the cymbal if he was standing next to it {If ya know what I mean}

[SusieP]

Yeah, I hear it and don't see him hit.

What amazes is me most is how you noticed that!
Amazing powers of observation there.

Maybe Ross did it. He was standing at the front of Deen through some of that.
Maybe he had something long and pointy with which to reach over and hit the cymbal. [stevew2 told me to post that.]

lol Ross proballably does, .Most bass players are hung like donkeys. You know it wasnt Friga,he couldnt reach the cymbal if he was standing next to it {If ya know what I mean}

Gregg Rolie could. And he could have reached it from the wings. I am talking about them holding a long stick, of course.
And Greg's arms are way longer than Friga's.

[stevew2]

I bet gregg could kick his ass to

[bluejeangirl76]

Yeah, I hear it and don't see him hit.

What amazes is me most is how you noticed that!
Amazing powers of observation there.

Maybe Ross did it. He was standing at the front of Deen through some of that.
Maybe he had something long and pointy with which to reach over and hit the cymbal. [stevew2 told me to post that.]

lol Ross proballably does, .Most bass players are hung like donkeys. You know it wasnt Friga,he couldnt reach the cymbal if he was standing next to it {If ya know what I mean}

Gregg Rolie could. And he could have reached it from the wings. I am talking about them holding a long stick, of course.

That's true. If you ever go to see The Gregg Rolie Band, stand way in back.
I still have a faint black eye. I never saw it coming.
It was like... "I got a black magic wo-..." *sproing* *FWAACK!*

[Rhiannon]

Yeah, I hear it and don't see him hit.

What amazes is me most is how you noticed that!
Amazing powers of observation there.

Maybe Ross did it. He was standing at the front of Deen through some of that.
Maybe he had something long and pointy with which to reach over and hit the cymbal. [stevew2 told me to post that.]

lol Ross proballably does, .Most bass players are hung like donkeys. You know it wasnt Friga,he couldnt reach the cymbal if he was standing next to it {If ya know what I mean}

Gregg Rolie could. And he could have reached it from the wings. I am talking about them holding a long stick, of course.

That's true. If you ever go to see The Gregg Rolie Band, stand way in back.
I still have a faint black eye. I never saw it coming.
It was like... "I got a black magic wo-..." *sproing* *FWAACK!*

True. I thought somebody was lumberjacking behind the stage. It was just Rolie and one of the members of his band.

[Liquid_Drummer]

Ive watched it quite a few times and as a drummer of many years I can assure everyone that the video is in sync just fine. This crash cymbal must be a sample, part of a backing track (in that song I cant see why you could need one at that part). He does not hit a cymbal and you hear it clearly. It is lower volume that the other hits which to me says its part of the backing tracks and what we are hearing is coming from monitors....

Dont know why its there but it is....

Remove tin foil hats and resume your day.. There isnt anything to this. We know they use some backing tracks and as long as Arnel isnt lipping I dont care..

[Jeremey]

Who else is singing in that video? Is Deen singing too? Listen to "Oh girl, you stand by me." There's two voices there. Since the camera is right by Deen I'm guessing it's picking up Deen's voice with his mic turned off.

[Liquid_Drummer]

Ive watched it quite a few times and as a drummer of many years I can assure everyone that the video is in sync just fine. This crash cymbal must be a sample, part of a backing track (in that song I cant see why you could need one at that part). He does not hit a cymbal and you hear it clearly. It is lower volume that the other hits which to me says its part of the backing tracks and what we are hearing is coming from monitors....

Dont know why its there but it is....

Remove tin foil hats and resume your day.. There isnt anything to this. We know they use some backing tracks and as long as Arnel isnt lipping I dont care..

[SusieP]

Yeah, I hear it and don't see him hit.

What amazes is me most is how you noticed that!
Amazing powers of observation there.

Maybe Ross did it. He was standing at the front of Deen through some of that.
Maybe he had something long and pointy with which to reach over and hit the cymbal. [stevew2 told me to post that.]

lol Ross proballably does, .Most bass players are hung like donkeys. You know it wasnt Friga,he couldnt reach the cymbal if he was standing next to it {If ya know what I mean}

Gregg Rolie could. And he could have reached it from the wings. I am talking about them holding a long stick, of course.

That's true. If you ever go to see The Gregg Rolie Band, stand way in back.
I still have a faint black eye. I never saw it coming.
It was like... "I got a black magic wo-..." *sproing* *FWAACK!*

Loving your sound effects there, BJG!

[Don]

Who else is singing in that video? Is Deen singing too? Listen to "Oh girl, you stand by me." There's two voices there. Since the camera is right by Deen I'm guessing it's picking up Deen's voice with his mic turned off.

Could that be some kind of reverberation?