Faithfully (FTLOSM Tour) Beacon, NYC

[Onestepper]

Uhm...sorry, but the change in his voice became noticeable the second I put on Frontiers. Anyone that thinks there wasn't a change needs to have their ears cleaned out.

I'll never really understand the point of "His voice changed"! Who gives a fuck! Every singer's voice changes. If you don't believe this, go grab some Elton John recordings from the early 70's, and then listen to Elton perform those songs today. It doesn't even sound like the same guy, AT ALL! He still sounds good, and can still sing the music. It's simply not close to the original key it was recorded in. I know this...When I heard TBF, I knew it was Perry singing! So, in spite of his coke habit, his drunken binges, and his steroid habit, I somehow managed to hear Perry's voice there!


John from Boston

Yeah when he sang Don't Stop Believing after the baseball game, it was apparent that it was him too. Doesn't mean it was good. If you think he can still sing the Journey songs, great. I don't think he can. Hope I'm wrong. I DO give a F*ck if he still has a voice. On TBF, his voice was pretty wrecked. Emotional, yeah, but jeez, Eddie Vedder's emotional too. Doesn't mean I like his voice or that it's any good.

I guess I read that differently than you....I got the impression John meant who gives an eff(although I like his way better) about the change in the voice. I personally LOVE Trial By Fire....every bit of it. I know a lot of people don't and that's ok!!!

The original discussion was about the difference in his voice between the Escape and Frontiers records. Not sure how someone took away that people were complaining about his voice change. Its amazing how shit gets twisted on this board for no reason.

[Ehwmatt]

If coke and booze explained it all, someone explain to me how the fuck The Eagles still sound so good.

Because they're the motherloving Eagles, and Henley nor Frye ain't exactly doing vocal acrobatics. In fact, the grittier they sound, the better.

Henley's range is pretty underrated imo. Frey is definitely a classic grittier rock singer - that's his Detroit/Motown influence shining through. But still, they sound pretty much exactly the same. Even Walsh still sings well. Schmit had some skiing accident or something that's making them downtune his songs right now I think, but he still shines when he's in form too. He sings kinda high

Henley's a great singer.
Schmidt had an accident and now they tune down? Wha?????????
What happened? That guy's gotta great high voice. Frey sucks. Could never stand him.

I was looking for a live vid on YouTube of "I Don't Want To Hear Anymore" from Long Road out of Eden. I found a few that were all fantastic but clearly dropped 1/2 step from F to E. On the comments people kept mentioning he had a skiing accident or something along those lines that hurt his high range... I dunno, maybe I've got it all fucked up, but whatever it is it's supposed to be temporary. He still sounds great anyway. Look for one of those vids, maybe u can get the scoop... I'm listening to Bill Champlin's new album right now, don't wanna break the rhythm

[Michigan Girl]

Uhm...sorry, but the change in his voice became noticeable the second I put on Frontiers. Anyone that thinks there wasn't a change needs to have their ears cleaned out.

I'll never really understand the point of "His voice changed"! Who gives a fuck! Every singer's voice changes. If you don't believe this, go grab some Elton John recordings from the early 70's, and then listen to Elton perform those songs today. It doesn't even sound like the same guy, AT ALL! He still sounds good, and can still sing the music. It's simply not close to the original key it was recorded in. I know this...When I heard TBF, I knew it was Perry singing! So, in spite of his coke habit, his drunken binges, and his steroid habit, I somehow managed to hear Perry's voice there!


John from Boston

Yeah when he sang Don't Stop Believing after the baseball game, it was apparent that it was him too. Doesn't mean it was good. If you think he can still sing the Journey songs, great. I don't think he can. Hope I'm wrong. I DO give a F*ck if he still has a voice. On TBF, his voice was pretty wrecked. Emotional, yeah, but jeez, Eddie Vedder's emotional too. Doesn't mean I like his voice or that it's any good.

I guess I read that differently than you....I got the impression John meant who gives an eff(although I like his way better) about the change in the voice. I personally LOVE Trial By Fire....every bit of it. I know a lot of people don't and that's ok!!!

I give a F because I think that guy was such a better singer before the roughage. Oh well. I think TBF was the worst Perry/Journey album out of all of them. A few good moments but mostly pretty unmemorable. I'd rather listen to Arrival than TBF.

Are we gonna get into the Just the Rain and Trial By Fire discussion again?

(those songs stink!)

NO!!

[brywool]

The original discussion was about the difference in his voice between the Escape and Frontiers. Not sure how someone took away that people were complaining about his voice change. Its amazing how shit gets twisted on this board for no reason.

I was complainin'

Okay, I'll stop now. Can we just talk about his hair? It's soooo silky and smooth. I think he's a Breck Girl.

Okay.... DISCUSS!!

[Michigan Girl]

I guess I read that differently than you....I got the impression John meant who gives an eff(although I like his way better) about the change in the voice. I personally LOVE Trial By Fire....every bit of it. I know a lot of people don't and that's ok!!!

The original discussion was about the difference in his voice between the Escape and Frontiers. Not sure how someone took away that people were complaining about his voice change. Its amazing how shit gets twisted on this board for no reason.

[Onestepper]

The original discussion was about the difference in his voice between the Escape and Frontiers. Not sure how someone took away that people were complaining about his voice change. Its amazing how shit gets twisted on this board for no reason.

I was complainin'

Okay, I'll stop now. Can we just talk about his hair?

Oh, sorry...missed that. I hated his hair on the Frontiers tour. So, now I'm complaining, and all the world is right

[brywool]

The original discussion was about the difference in his voice between the Escape and Frontiers. Not sure how someone took away that people were complaining about his voice change. Its amazing how shit gets twisted on this board for no reason.

I was complainin'

Okay, I'll stop now. Can we just talk about his hair?

Oh, sorry...missed that. I hated his hair on the Frontiers tour. So, now I'm complaining, and all the world is right

I'm a guy and I went "Dude, what did you do and what's that crap on your upper lip???" DORK. Looked like NUMBER 7 from Super Cuts.

[Rhiannon]

Henley's range is pretty underrated imo. Frey is definitely a classic grittier rock singer - that's his Detroit/Motown influence shining through. But still, they sound pretty much exactly the same. Even Walsh still sings well. Schmit had some skiing accident or something that's making them downtune his songs right now I think, but he still shines when he's in form too. He sings kinda high

Ok, how about they just rock, they're the Eagles... no reasons needed?

[Ehwmatt]

Henley's range is pretty underrated imo. Frey is definitely a classic grittier rock singer - that's his Detroit/Motown influence shining through. But still, they sound pretty much exactly the same. Even Walsh still sings well. Schmit had some skiing accident or something that's making them downtune his songs right now I think, but he still shines when he's in form too. He sings kinda high

Ok, how about they just rock, they're the Eagles... no reasons needed?

I'll buy that for a dollar

[kgdjpubs]

Right. I've got that DVD and he's phenomenal on it. The Frontiers tour- he was still singing well. One thing to notice about that tour and not so much on the Japanese shows which were AT THE BEGINNING OF THE TOUR- the band sped everything up DRASTICALLY. I would bet that had to do with Perry's voice. Perry's always been about the groove of a song. He's a drummer and I've heard him talk about never wanting to sacrifice the groove of the song. There's no way that he'd let the band race through tunes the way they did in later shows on that tour unless he had a reason.

It's possible that the speed of songs on the Frontiers tour was simply a manifestation of the band royally hating each other and trying to get off the stage as soon as possible.

When you put on Frontiers, it was totally noticeable that something had changed in his technique or just in his instrument. He's said that he consciously changed it. I don't believe that at all, but IF HE DID, then he royally screwed himself vocally because as things went on from Frontiers, he got raspier and lost range. It was most noticeable during the ROR tour and of course during the Bill Graham deal and his solo tour.

I think it MAY have been intentional on the album (especially since the Japan video sounds very clear), but there was more going on than just Perry wanting to sound different. He wasn't lying. He radically changed his vocal style between Escape and Raised on Radio, but his voice was changing also.

[Abitaman]

Best show I have this tour is the New Burnswick show, (Don't know if I spelled that right). Have about 5 or 6 show from FTLOSM tour, some dvds. For the most part he does good, but not the greatness of Frontiers and earlier. Some shows were scarry, in how hoarse he sounded. If Perry comes out with new songs, I don't care if it is in the Journey caliber or not, I just want the man to sing!

[Enigma869]

Ok, how about they just rock, they're the Eagles... no reasons needed?

The Eagles are the greatest American rock band, EVER! No band has put together a bigger catalog of classic music!


John from Boston

[bluejeangirl76]

I was complainin'

Okay, I'll stop now. Can we just talk about his hair? It's soooo silky and smooth. I think he's a Breck Girl.

Okay.... DISCUSS!!

Oh GOD yes! The hair!

I wanna play in it. *sigh*

Wait a minute.... 1978-1981: long lovely hair (that I still want to play in) and the voice of a fucking angel.... 1983: SuperCuts and the vocal rubicon (ha!).... I'm pretty sure we have the mystery solved here.

[Rhiannon]

Ok, how about they just rock, they're the Eagles... no reasons needed?

The Eagles are the greatest American rock band, EVER! No band has put together a bigger catalog of classic music!

*Ding, ding*... We have a winner!

[Deb]

Best show I have this tour is the New Burnswick show, (Don't know if I spelled that right). Have about 5 or 6 show from FTLOSM tour, some dvds. For the most part he does good, but not the greatness of Frontiers and earlier. Some shows were scarry, in how hoarse he sounded. If Perry comes out with new songs, I don't care if it is in the Journey caliber or not, I just want the man to sing!

Agreed! That's the one that has the acapella "Let It Be Me" and an amazing "Stand Up" didn't even really notice that song much on the FTLSM cd until I heard it live......love it! Toronto is pretty good too.

I'll take his emotive vocals on Let It Be Me over any of his pre Escape stuff any day.....but then it is so not about range for me.

[brywool]

Best show I have this tour is the New Burnswick show, (Don't know if I spelled that right). Have about 5 or 6 show from FTLOSM tour, some dvds. For the most part he does good, but not the greatness of Frontiers and earlier. Some shows were scarry, in how hoarse he sounded. If Perry comes out with new songs, I don't care if it is in the Journey caliber or not, I just want the man to sing!

Agreed! That's the one that has the acapella "Let It Be Me" and an amazing "Stand Up" didn't even really notice that song much on the FTLSM cd until I heard it live......love it! Toronto is pretty good too.

I'll take his emotive vocals on Let It Be Me over any of his pre Frontiers stuff any day.....but then it is so not about range for me.

No, it'a about Eric Martin, isn't it?
Yeah, that Let it Be Me thing was WAYYYYYY cool.

[Michigan Girl]

Best show I have this tour is the New Burnswick show, (Don't know if I spelled that right). Have about 5 or 6 show from FTLOSM tour, some dvds. For the most part he does good, but not the greatness of Frontiers and earlier. Some shows were scarry, in how hoarse he sounded. If Perry comes out with new songs, I don't care if it is in the Journey caliber or not, I just want the man to sing!

Agreed! That's the one that has the acapella "Let It Be Me" and an amazing "Stand Up" didn't even really notice that song much on the FTLSM cd until I heard it live......love it! Toronto is pretty good too.

I'll take his emotive vocals on Let It Be Me over any of his pre Escape stuff any day.....but then it is so not about range for me.

Thank you!!!

[Deb]

Best show I have this tour is the New Burnswick show, (Don't know if I spelled that right). Have about 5 or 6 show from FTLOSM tour, some dvds. For the most part he does good, but not the greatness of Frontiers and earlier. Some shows were scarry, in how hoarse he sounded. If Perry comes out with new songs, I don't care if it is in the Journey caliber or not, I just want the man to sing!

Agreed! That's the one that has the acapella "Let It Be Me" and an amazing "Stand Up" didn't even really notice that song much on the FTLSM cd until I heard it live......love it! Toronto is pretty good too.

I'll take his emotive vocals on Let It Be Me over any of his pre Frontiers stuff any day.....but then it is so not about range for me.

No, it's about Eric Martin, isn't it?
Yeah, that Let it Be Me thing was WAYYYYYY cool.

Me loves my soul and R&B influenced singers!

[brywool]

Best show I have this tour is the New Burnswick show, (Don't know if I spelled that right). Have about 5 or 6 show from FTLOSM tour, some dvds. For the most part he does good, but not the greatness of Frontiers and earlier. Some shows were scarry, in how hoarse he sounded. If Perry comes out with new songs, I don't care if it is in the Journey caliber or not, I just want the man to sing!

Agreed! That's the one that has the acapella "Let It Be Me" and an amazing "Stand Up" didn't even really notice that song much on the FTLSM cd until I heard it live......love it! Toronto is pretty good too.

I'll take his emotive vocals on Let It Be Me over any of his pre Frontiers stuff any day.....but then it is so not about range for me.

No, it'a about Eric Martin, isn't it?
Yeah, that Let it Be Me thing was WAYYYYYY cool.

Me loves my soul and R&B influenced singers!

My PM thing doesn't appear to be working.... how did you make your av?

[Deb]

Best show I have this tour is the New Burnswick show, (Don't know if I spelled that right). Have about 5 or 6 show from FTLOSM tour, some dvds. For the most part he does good, but not the greatness of Frontiers and earlier. Some shows were scarry, in how hoarse he sounded. If Perry comes out with new songs, I don't care if it is in the Journey caliber or not, I just want the man to sing!

Agreed! That's the one that has the acapella "Let It Be Me" and an amazing "Stand Up" didn't even really notice that song much on the FTLSM cd until I heard it live......love it! Toronto is pretty good too.

I'll take his emotive vocals on Let It Be Me over any of his pre Frontiers stuff any day.....but then it is so not about range for me.

No, it'a about Eric Martin, isn't it?
Yeah, that Let it Be Me thing was WAYYYYYY cool.

Me loves my soul and R&B influenced singers!

My PM thing doesn't appear to be working.... how did you make your av?

Ya, I didn't get a pm? http://www.gifninja.com/ConvertVideoToGif.aspx

Got a bunch waiting in the wings to use.....some EM ones too.

[bluejeangirl76]

http://www.gifninja.com/ConvertVideoToGif.aspx

I figured it had to be one of those... I love gif ninja. I've used that one a lot.

[Tomulator]

Awesome insights, Bry. Thanks. I agree that something happened to his voice between Escape and Frontiers. My guess is alcohol. And then especially during the ROR era. He even appeared drunk in an interview or two. If that's the case I guess I can see why he harbors some animosity toward other members. While they were all probably doing the same thing he's the only guy that had his "instrument" damaged. That said, I thought he did a lot of obnoxious and unnecessary screaming during a lot of the ROR shows. You literally hear him shredding his voice. To this day I don't understand why he felt the need to do that.

Was Perry a heavy drinker? I'd never heard that. I DID hear from some sources that he really liked Coke. Not sure if that's true or not. The alcohol would explain the weight gain during the Street Talk days. I think some of the screaming was just to hit the notes. Then there were songs like Back Talk that they were doing on tour as well. Geez, on the recording of BT, you can hear the shredding going on and why they felt the need to play that song live... the song was one of their worst. I do remember him screaming other stuff though too and it was unnecessary. However, I don't think that stuff would leave him with permanent damage, but he does have damage to his chords.

I don't see anything wrong with liking Coke. It's pleasant tasting, refreshing over ice, has a nice "fizzy" quality that tickles my throat. It's true that it's loaded with sugar but, aren't all colas?

[annie89509]

No, came out in 83 and Perry kept it off of Frontiers (DOH!)

Ah, yes. I had forgotten about that, because as we all know, it never saw the light of day, until the "Vision Quest" soundtrack.


John from Boston

Both OTY and Ask the Lonely were kept off Frontiers for movie soundtracks. ATL for the JohnTravolta/OlivaNewtonJohn (name of movie escapes me at the moment). I wouldn't say it was SP that kept it off -- he would always have final say, yes -- but I would think it would have been HH's idea, to make more money with the movie residuals.

[brywool]

No, came out in 83 and Perry kept it off of Frontiers (DOH!)

Ah, yes. I had forgotten about that, because as we all know, it never saw the light of day, until the "Vision Quest" soundtrack.


John from Boston

Both OTY and Ask the Lonely were kept off Frontiers for movie soundtracks. ATL for the JohnTravolta/OlivaNewtonJohn (name of movie escapes me at the moment). I wouldn't say it was SP that kept it off -- he would always have final say, yes -- but I would think it would have been HH's idea, to make more money with the movie residuals.

I remember that for ATL it WAS Perry's decision. OTY may not've been.

[bluejeangirl76]

No, came out in 83 and Perry kept it off of Frontiers (DOH!)

Ah, yes. I had forgotten about that, because as we all know, it never saw the light of day, until the "Vision Quest" soundtrack.


John from Boston

Both OTY and Ask the Lonely were kept off Frontiers for movie soundtracks. ATL for the JohnTravolta/OlivaNewtonJohn (name of movie escapes me at the moment). I wouldn't say it was SP that kept it off -- he would always have final say, yes -- but I would think it would have been HH's idea, to make more money with the movie residuals.

I remember that for ATL it WAS Perry's decision. OTY may not've been.

Did anyone happen to confirm what I said yesterday? (I didn't look) I was almost sure that OTY wasn't even recorded until after Frontiers, therefore never would have been on it regardless.

[annie89509]

My understanding (I could be wrong) is that both OTY and ATL were written for Frontiers. "Management" held it back to shop for movie soundtracks. Open Arms made a lot of money for them as a track on Heavy Metals (among other movies). Journey completed Frontiers with Trouble Child and BackTalk, which made Steve Smith very happy as he had writing credit on both those songs.

It's true, OTY and ATL were each released as singles after Frontiers (after 1983), as well as in the soundtrack albums of those movies. VisionQuest came out in 1984 and the Travolta/NewtonJohn movie in '85 or '86. Those 2 songs didn't get on the radio and become hits until after the movie releases, so most people associate them as "later" songs from Journey.

Come to think of it, the above source of info is from one of HH's interviews, I believe.

[bluejeangirl76]

It's true, OTY and ATL were each released as singles after Frontiers (after 1983), as well as in the soundtrack albums of those movies. VisionQuest came out in 1984 and the Travolta/NewtonJohn movie in '85 or '86. Those 2 songs didn't get on the radio and become hits until after the movie releases, so most people associate them as "later" songs from Journey.

I'm going by the Kenny story (as told both in BTM and a few random radio interviews), where the song wasn't finished yet, and they went to visit him and played it for him... that was certainly after Frontiers came out. I'm not claiming to be right, but that's the story as best as I recall it.

[brywool]

My understanding (I could be wrong) is that both OTY and ATL were written for Frontiers. "Management" held it back to shop for movie soundtracks. Open Arms made a lot of money for them as a track on Heavy Metals (among other movies). Journey completed Frontiers with Trouble Child and BackTalk, which made Steve Smith very happy as he had writing credit on both those songs.

It's true, OTY and ATL were each released as singles after Frontiers (after 1983), as well as in the soundtrack albums of those movies. VisionQuest came out in 1984 and the Travolta/NewtonJohn movie in '85 or '86. Those 2 songs didn't get on the radio and become hits until after the movie releases, so most people associate them as "later" songs from Journey.

Come to think of it, the above source of info is from one of HH's interviews, I believe.

They were Frontiers candidates, weren't they? I've always heard that...

From Time 3 liner notes:

ONLY THE YOUNG
(S. Perry-J. Friga-N. Schon) From "Vision Quest" soundtrack
Originally recorded for the "Frontiers" album and pulled off at the last minute, this song finally reached the Top Ten in 1985, hitting #9 when released as a single off the Geffen Records soundtrack album. The experience of playing the song to 16-year old Kenny Sykaluk the night before he died left Perry deeply affected ("As soon as I stepped out of that hospital room I lost it," said Perry. "Nurses had to take me to a room by myself.") and he used it as the concert opener throughout the "Raised On Radio" tour.

ASK THE LONELY
(S. Perry-J. Cain) From "Two Of A Kind" soundtrack
The other track pulled off "Frontiers" after the album had already been
sequenced, this song received a fair amount of radio airplay once it was released on the soundtrack album. "It's just a love song," said Perry. "The guy can write love songs in his sleep," said Cain.

[Jana]

Herbie Herbert said OTY and ATL were originally on Frontiers and were pulled off. He said Steve Smith wanted Back Talk on because he wrote it and Troubled Child was put on also instead. He didn't like Back Talk. From what I remember he wanted OTY and ATL on the album.







"Arnel makes me a better guy just knowing him" - Jonathan Cain

[hoagiepete]

I couldn't help but think of Deen's version of the song when I heard it.