Seperate Ways 1986 ROR Tour!

[Deb]

I didn't say that I preferred this tempo, but pitch-wise it shows the range was absolutely still there. Many bands speed up hit songs for effect live.

Again, Jeremy, if you're here please tell these few negative Nellie's what a performace this is.

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

How about if you put up a decent song to judge by? This one is crap!

K, how about this one?! http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=jubogiBaUhQ

Good gawd, is there such a thing as ear porn?! That "chasing thuuuuuuuuuuunder" is pure vocal excellence.

LOL, sorry my inner loon escaped again.....

[Rick]

I didn't say that I preferred this tempo, but pitch-wise it shows the range was absolutely still there. Many bands speed up hit songs for effect live.

Again, Jeremy, if you're here please tell these few negative Nellie's what a performace this is.

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

Okay it SUCKED! That better?

Not better, but consistant with your normal attitude. I liked you better when I thought you were a guy. You're not, right?

You came on to this board with an attitude and if anyone disagrees with you, you either call them names, tell them they have an attitude, tell them they're not creative, tell them they're negative nellies, and evidently you prefer guys. And all of that is just in this thread.

[Jana]

I didn't say that I preferred this tempo, but pitch-wise it shows the range was absolutely still there. Many bands speed up hit songs for effect live.

Again, Jeremy, if you're here please tell these few negative Nellie's what a performace this is.

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

How about if you put up a decent song to judge by? This one is crap!

K, how about this one?! http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=jubogiBaUhQ

Good gawd, is there such a thing as ear porn?! That "chasing thuuuuuuuuuuunder" is pure vocal excellence.

LOL, sorry my inner loon escaped again.....

Awwwh, one of my favorites. Now, that's some great singing. Thanks.

[Don]

Here's my opinion on it.

Separate Ways is a very difficult song to sing, especially during the chorus. I've definitely run out of steam before during the chorus, because of the timing and the melody make it tough to catch your breath.

Is this a great performance? Not necessarily what I would call a great performance.

But we need to look at something that I think is a misconception here that may address why Perry is giving a choppy and clipped delivery here. From what I can tell, his pitch is great, and he hits some amazing notes here.

I read a lot that speeding up a song is easier for a singer. Some people may think this, but for me it makes the song a hell of a lot more difficult to sing.

For example: Try running 2 blocks at an easy jog. Now run that same two blocks at an all out sprint. Which was easier? I think most people would agree that the easy jog is less strenuous and a lot less stressful than the sprint. Sure, you get there quicker while sprinting, but you just wore your ass out.

Same thing with singing. Singing a song at it's optimum pacing and tempo is the ideal way to perform a song live. Breath support is the biggest thing to worry about during the pacing of a performance. If you are at an all out sprint, you're going to run out of breath and rush words, and eventually lose the breath support you need to project a song properly. If you sing at a normal tempo, you may have to hold notes a little longer, but how many times are those notes going to be as long as the ending scream of Sep Ways or the bridge of After The Fall? Rarely is that few seconds the singer is saving going to make any difference in their voice. And if they are singing faster, they are rushing, losing breath, and eventually ending up winded and not able to get the notes out anyway.

So Perry's clipped and huffy performance here I would say is actually a direct result of the tempo of the song, which could have been because of drugs or could have been an intentional choice based on set times or concert pacing. I do know that by hearing the clarity and acrobatics of some of those later notes, the song would have been SUNG much better at a much slower tempo.

Anyway, that's my .02, take it for what it's worth....

Thanks for the insight. Have you heard AWYWI on the Frontiers tour video from Tokyo? It sounds a little bit different then the normal sped up versions during the chorus. Do you think this was done just to give a sound closer to the Frontiers type of music or could there have been a different reason to do with vocals?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb9BlG0A3wI

[Michigan Girl]

I didn't say that I preferred this tempo, but pitch-wise it shows the range was absolutely still there. Many bands speed up hit songs for effect live.

Again, Jeremy, if you're here please tell these few negative Nellie's what a performace this is.

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

Okay it SUCKED! That better?

Not better, but consistant with your normal attitude. I liked you better when I thought you were a guy. You're not, right?

You came on to this board with an attitude and if anyone disagrees with you, you either call them names, tell them they have an attitude, tell them they're not creative, tell them they're negative nellies, and evidently you prefer guys. And all of that is just in this thread.

LMAO!!

Now this is funny, Mad....you must agree!!!

[Since 78]

I didn't say that I preferred this tempo, but pitch-wise it shows the range was absolutely still there. Many bands speed up hit songs for effect live.

Again, Jeremy, if you're here please tell these few negative Nellie's what a performace this is.

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

How about if you put up a decent song to judge by? This one is crap!

K, how about this one?! http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=jubogiBaUhQ

Good gawd, is there such a thing as ear porn?! That "chasing thuuuuuuuuuuunder" is pure vocal excellence.

LOL, sorry my inner loon escaped again.....

Now that was loon worthy!

[stevew2]

Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

Augeri did that shit and 10 to15 years older,and played many back to back gigs and went out with Frigas foot up his ass,and didnt take a 2 year plus break in between.i respect him as much as Perry,till the lipping,then the whole band is to blame

[Don]

Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

Augeri did that shit and 10 to15 years older,and played many back to back gigs and went out with Frigas foot up his ass,and didnt take a 2 year plus break in between.i respect him as much as Perry,till the lipping,then the whole band is to blame

I've got nothing but respect for Augeri, but you're telling me he did 600 shows with Journey?

[stevew2]

Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

Augeri did that shit and 10 to15 years older,and played many back to back gigs and went out with Frigas foot up his ass,and didnt take a 2 year plus break in between.i respect him as much as Perry,till the lipping,then the whole band is to blame

I've got nothing but respect for Augeri, but you're telling me he did 600 shows with Journey?

i dont fuckin know that,all i do know is he started with journey in 1998, and ended in 2006 ,and they played every spring summer and fall, and did gigs in Dec, every fuckin year with out a break and Augeri was at least 15 years older when he started {more like twenty}i respect him just as much GB

[JRNYFan]

Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

Augeri did that shit and 10 to15 years older,and played many back to back gigs and went out with Frigas foot up his ass,and didnt take a 2 year plus break in between.i respect him as much as Perry,till the lipping,then the whole band is to blame

I've got nothing but respect for Augeri, but you're telling me he did 600 shows with Journey?

He did around 350-400, I believe. The guy didn't get a break except for 2000 when they were working on Arrival for most of the year.

[Don]

Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

Augeri did that shit and 10 to15 years older,and played many back to back gigs and went out with Frigas foot up his ass,and didnt take a 2 year plus break in between.i respect him as much as Perry,till the lipping,then the whole band is to blame

I've got nothing but respect for Augeri, but you're telling me he did 600 shows with Journey?

i dont fuckin know that,all i do know is he started with journey in 1998, and ended in 2006 ,and they played every spring summer and fall, and did gigs in Dec, every fuckin year with out a break and Augeri was at least 15 years older when he started {more like twenty}i respect him just as much GB

I think that we both can believe that this new idea by Journey to slow down on the touring shows that they finally understand that the human voice can't handle doing this catalog nonstop.

[stevew2]

Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

Augeri did that shit and 10 to15 years older,and played many back to back gigs and went out with Frigas foot up his ass,and didnt take a 2 year plus break in between.i respect him as much as Perry,till the lipping,then the whole band is to blame

I've got nothing but respect for Augeri, but you're telling me he did 600 shows with Journey?

He did around 350-400, I believe. The guy didn't get a break except for 2000 when they were working on Arrival for most of the year.

If it wasnt for Steve Augeri, I would not be a journey fan now. I tried to go online in 1997 and they were dead,they hired him ,he sang his ass off, I saw Journey in 2002, I became a fan again.I saw them 19 times since,and had a blast and saw some really awesome shows ,and they did stuff from Santana through, early Journey,Arrivel, and the greatests hits.He did the fuckin job good.i wont let the last 3 years ruin all the good that he did for Journey.The band made a bad decision to do a tour with Def lep, with a singer without a voice,I wont forgive them for that.That was my end for being a diehard Journey fan [like i used to be].I like Arnel,he is a great singer for a [musically] great band and will go see the band cause I love the music only. Augeri has my highest regard, if treated like a human being, he would still be Journeys lead singer,but that didnt happen. I hope they treat Arnel differently If not ,I wont accept another third lead singer

[annie89509]

How many shows were canceled during this tour?
Also, out of curiousity, how many shows were there supposed to be during the last leg of the Revelation tour (NOV/DEC). Was it just the one show in New Hampshire?

A lot of people think SP "walked out" on the ROR tour. My understanding of that period is he fulfilled his committment on that tour .... even took it into Feb ('87 with 2 dates in Alaska, when they were supposed to end it in Hawaii) .... read this in some account from an insider (possibly Lora).

There may or may not have been a "2nd leg" (summer tour) planned, but no show dates were scheduled (that I know of). Of course, if it were up to HH (or Neal/Jon), they would have gone right back out there.

[bluejeangirl76]

I hate when they play songs at hyperspeed though.

...and I think that's a big part of why this one sounds "bad", as some are saying.
Before Steve even opens his mouth you can hear how differently the music is being played... Did Neal and Jon have a pressing engagement or something? Jesus, slow that shit down, guys. It almost sounds like Perry is racing to keep up with them.

Its not the best, but I wouldn't call it "horrible".

[annie89509]

I've not commented on this before, mainly because I'm usually "late for the party" , but why the constant jumping on Madsplash? He doesn't post anything harsh, doesn't attack anybody. If you don't like his posts or personality, just ignore it and him. Geesh, the way some of you act, reminds me of a school clique picking on the kid who doesn't quite fit in.

[SherriBerry]

I didn't say that I preferred this tempo, but pitch-wise it shows the range was absolutely still there. Many bands speed up hit songs for effect live.

Again, Jeremy, if you're here please tell these few negative Nellie's what a performace this is.

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

Okay it SUCKED! That better?

It definitely sucked. Tempo too fast, notes not being held very long. It sounded like a coked-out performance. Now I know why his eyes looked so funny in a few ROR videos. :

This version is much too fast - the feeling of the song is lost and it sounds like they are in a hurry to get it
over with! But it does demonstrate that in 86 his voice was clear and he was still hitting the higher notes,
no question. I believe some of the rougher performances during ROR may have been after several nights
when he needed more recovery time.

People often joke about coke use, but if that had ever been the case with Steve Perry, Herbie Herbert would
have outed him on that - he spoke about Neal and Ross using coke in the eighties and you can bet if he
had that to use against Steve's reputation he would. Drug use might have been a major point of contention
between SP and those using (especially while Journey was touring), but I don't believe for a moment he was
using. No way he would do anything that would negatively impact his voice like that.

Actually, Herbie once said that when he was around the band towed the line and behaved - it was when he
wasn't there that things could get out of hand. I wonder if that's why SP insisted he go on the
ROR tour, despite how difficult it made his job - to keep those kinds of problems under control. It's not
like SP wanted to spend more time with Herbie because they liked each other so much and got along well.

[Esc]

I didn't say that I preferred this tempo, but pitch-wise it shows the range was absolutely still there. Many bands speed up hit songs for effect live.

Again, Jeremy, if you're here please tell these few negative Nellie's what a performace this is.

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

Okay it SUCKED! That better?

Not better, but consistant with your normal attitude. I liked you better when I thought you were a guy. You're not, right?

You came on to this board with an attitude and if anyone disagrees with you, you either call them names, tell them they have an attitude, tell them they're not creative, tell them they're negative nellies, and evidently you prefer guys. And all of that is just in this thread.

hence his screen name.

[Esc]

why the constant jumping on Madsplash? He doesn't post anything harsh, doesn't attack anybody. If you don't like his posts or personality, just ignore it and him. Geesh, the way some of you act, reminds me of a school clique picking on the kid who doesn't quite fit in.

annie, im sure you're a sweet lady.
but i cant quite figure how you couldnt see that he/she does have an attitude.
as far as i can see it, nobody's picking on him/her.
he/she is picking on anyone who disagrees on his/her posts.

[Suzanne]

I've just about given up on this board- why does it seem lately when certain people are commenting, (and it's always the same ones) the threads turn into a schoolyard fight? I don't ever comment because I surf through great thread starts and then read a few comments and someone somewhere ends up saying you're a big doodyhead and then the whole thread gets full of ignorant comments and off the subject. Can you email your insults to each other instead? You're ruining the board for others. Stop lashing out at each other and TRY to be nice.

I think the song is too fast but Perry sounded great considering he was rushing through it. That's only based on what I think because I really don't like when bands speed up their songs though.

[Babyblue]

Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

Thank You!

[Babyblue]

I've just about given up on this board- why does it seem lately when certain people are commenting, (and it's always the same ones) the threads turn into a schoolyard fight? I don't ever comment because I surf through great thread starts and then read a few comments and someone somewhere ends up saying you're a big doodyhead and then the whole thread gets full of ignorant comments and off the subject. Can you email your insults to each other instead? You're ruining the board for others. Stop lashing out at each other and TRY to be nice.

I think the song is too fast but Perry sounded great considering he was rushing through it. That's only based on what I think because I really don't like when bands speed up their songs though.

I have to agree with you.I just wish it would stop.

[Eric]

WAY too fast. One of the worst versions I've heard. The whole tour sounded like this......

[Babyblue]

Here's my opinion on it.

Separate Ways is a very difficult song to sing, especially during the chorus. I've definitely run out of steam before during the chorus, because of the timing and the melody make it tough to catch your breath.

Is this a great performance? Not necessarily what I would call a great performance.

But we need to look at something that I think is a misconception here that may address why Perry is giving a choppy and clipped delivery here. From what I can tell, his pitch is great, and he hits some amazing notes here.

I read a lot that speeding up a song is easier for a singer. Some people may think this, but for me it makes the song a hell of a lot more difficult to sing.

For example: Try running 2 blocks at an easy jog. Now run that same two blocks at an all out sprint. Which was easier? I think most people would agree that the easy jog is less strenuous and a lot less stressful than the sprint. Sure, you get there quicker while sprinting, but you just wore your ass out.

Same thing with singing. Singing a song at it's optimum pacing and tempo is the ideal way to perform a song live. Breath support is the biggest thing to worry about during the pacing of a performance. If you are at an all out sprint, you're going to run out of breath and rush words, and eventually lose the breath support you need to project a song properly. If you sing at a normal tempo, you may have to hold notes a little longer, but how many times are those notes going to be as long as the ending scream of Sep Ways or the bridge of After The Fall? Rarely is that few seconds the singer is saving going to make any difference in their voice. And if they are singing faster, they are rushing, losing breath, and eventually ending up winded and not able to get the notes out anyway.

So Perry's clipped and huffy performance here I would say is actually a direct result of the tempo of the song, which could have been because of drugs or could have been an intentional choice based on set times or concert pacing. I do know that by hearing the clarity and acrobatics of some of those later notes, the song would have been SUNG much better at a much slower tempo.

Anyway, that's my .02, take it for what it's worth....

Enjoyed reading your input on this.

[TRAGChick]

I read a lot that speeding up a song is easier for a singer. Some people may think this, but for me it makes the song a hell of a lot more difficult to sing.

For example: Try running 2 blocks at an easy jog. Now run that same two blocks at an all out sprint. Which was easier? I think most people would agree that the easy jog is less strenuous and a lot less stressful than the sprint. Sure, you get there quicker while sprinting, but you just wore your ass out.

Same thing with singing. Singing a song at it's optimum pacing and tempo is the ideal way to perform a song live. Breath support is the biggest thing to worry about during the pacing of a performance. If you are at an all out sprint, you're going to run out of breath and rush words, and eventually lose the breath support you need to project a song properly. If you sing at a normal tempo, you may have to hold notes a little longer, but how many times are those notes going to be as long as the ending scream of Sep Ways or the bridge of After The Fall? Rarely is that few seconds the singer is saving going to make any difference in their voice. And if they are singing faster, they are rushing, losing breath, and eventually ending up winded and not able to get the notes out anyway.

BINGO!

Excellent analogy, Jeremey.....well done - and yup, I agree.

BTW: Talk about "synchronicity":

I read this thread, & I forgot that I left my alarm-clock on the pre-set to go off....I got up way before, and forgot to turn it off.
So, it was going off; I pushed the lever too far over and turned the radio on by accident.

and WHAT DID I HEAR.....?

".....If we can't go on,
To survive the tide -
Love diviiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiides...."

[annpea]

[

quote="Gunbot"]Well like I said, 600 shows in 9 years. Perry gave it his best shot. I don't think Augeri did that many shows with Journey and I think it's safe to say Arnel won't be doing that many either. Perry toured his ass off, sacrificed his voice and now he's enjoying the money that he earned and is still earning from the Journey brand name. All is as it should be.

[/quote] I, have to agree totally with you GB; he earned his freedom and he should be able to enjoy it.

[annpea]

[

quote="annie89509"]I've not commented on this before, mainly because I'm usually "late for the party" , but why the constant jumping on Madsplash? He doesn't post anything harsh, doesn't attack anybody. If you don't like his posts or personality, just ignore it and him. Geesh, the way some of you act, reminds me of a school clique picking on the kid who doesn't quite fit in.

[/quote] God, bless you Annie for addressing that.

[Liquid_Drummer]

This source material from this is too fast. The song is in E but in this clip it is a bit above E. Like playing an lp a bit too fast.. Im sorry but Perry's voice was not in best form here. He is taking tons of shortcuts using different vowel sounds on certain words and on Miss you love where he wavers between two notes. He didnt do that for effect. He did it beacause he couldnt hold the original note. I have heard him do this many times when he has long note holds and it was almost every show on the ROR tour.. He toured too much, played with the wrong chemicals and became over stressed and as result his voice suffered...


Nothing last forever.. I mean could you imagine M Jackson singing ABC during the Thriller years... Voices change and for males it happens a few times and it is common to take a slight dive in your mid 30's.. Nothing you can do about that..

[TRAGChick]

...Nothing last forever.. I mean could you imagine M Jackson singing ABC during the Thriller years... Voices change and for males it happens a few times and it is common to take a slight dive in your mid 30's.. Nothing you can do about that..

Well, I wouldn't call it "taking a dive" - to me, it conveys a slightly negative tone.

But, in a way, you are correct - according to my College Vocal Coach, Raymond Buckingham, the Male / Female Singing Voice does NOT reach its full potential until after age 30.
Now, at age 41, I can hear the strength and confidence & have the Voice that I always wanted. Finally!

So, yeah...."American Idol" is a joke: what are you gonna do with these performers, once their voices fully mature & they don't have "the Sound" that got them the gig in the first place....?

[bluejeangirl76]

I've not commented on this before, mainly because I'm usually "late for the party" , but why the constant jumping on Madsplash? He doesn't post anything harsh, doesn't attack anybody. If you don't like his posts or personality, just ignore it and him. Geesh, the way some of you act, reminds me of a school clique picking on the kid who doesn't quite fit in.

God, bless you Annie for addressing that.

Here is why he gets jumped on:

His voice was either 'toast', or he was too busy running around out of breath. I think it sounded horrible. Not to be negative.

Of course you did. Why would it be different? At least your consistant. Boring and stale but consistant.

Any trained singer will tell you the difficulty level of that performance. Not that you care or that facts should get in the way. The fact that I posted it would make you have of negative response, of course.

Ask Jeremy how great and difficult that performance was. He's the most qualified person here to decide. Hopefully he'll post on this.

Horrible? Horrible? C'mon man. Are you friggin' kidding me? My God, man. You either hate me enough to rag on this or you're just plain musically and vocally illiterate.

Show me where anything in StM's post warranted that. ALL he said was he didn't like it, and he did it without saying anything negative TO or ABOUT Splash. And Splash came back with "Oh of course you say that just because it was me who posted it..."

And then further down the page he insulted LLL for no good reason...

And LLL, oops, I spelled it wrong. Is that the most creative thing that you can bring to this discussion? I was afraid so.

Its been a pattern with him and that's why people "jump" on him. I think most are just sick of it.
Honestly, the best thing to do would be for everyone to stop responding to him, period.

[Deb]

This source material from this is too fast. The song is in E but in this clip it is a bit above E. Like playing an lp a bit too fast.. Im sorry but Perry's voice was not in best form here. He is taking tons of shortcuts using different vowel sounds on certain words and on Miss you love where he wavers between two notes. He didnt do that for effect. He did it beacause he couldnt hold the original note. I have heard him do this many times when he has long note holds and it was almost every show on the ROR tour.. He toured too much, played with the wrong chemicals and became over stressed and as result his voice suffered...


Nothing last forever.. I mean could you imagine M Jackson singing ABC during the Thriller years... Voices change and for males it happens a few times and it is common to take a slight dive in your mid 30's.. Nothing you can do about that..

True. Means very little to me.....range is quite low on my vocal preference meter. Delivery, emoting, tone/timbre......rank much higher.