Journey Looking Forward: Best Case Scenario

[Gideon]

They're in better shape than they've been since at LEAST the ROR era, arguably Frontiers.
Where's the beef?

Huh? Arrival blows away Revelation. And Augeri's first tour blew everyone away.

Don't agree here. I saw that tour and Augeri was using falsetto in parts, and not very well I'm afraid. You don't want to use it in the money notes of DSB "Hiding.... somewhere.... in the [switch to airy falsetto here] niiiiiight".


Augeri has a good voice, but Arnel is a step up power and range wise.

Augeri had many casual fans thinking he was Perry. Fact. If they would have had that WalMart deal for that tour it would have dwarfed Revelation sales.

I never really heard the startling similarities between Arnel and Perry or Augeri and Perry. But that's probably because I a.) not a moron and b.) have listened to them all out the wazoo.

As far as Augeri and Perry comparisons go, you're comparing them to two different sets of standards. Augeri was the first singer to replace Perry and they do care similar tonality, so it's not surprising that there are a few individuals who would mistake them. Second, Arnel (unlike Augeri) has become a media phenomenon with his story of rags to riches. Not to mention they look a lot different.

So I'm not sure how Augeri being mistaken for Perry is proof that he's better than Arnel. Augeri has an advantage in phrasing, but power, range, control, stamina are all Arnel's by a landslide.

[Don]

What they should do is join with Apple, or Creative, or Sandisc....and partner in an effort to preload every CD on an MP3 player.

and maybe start selling those little flash drives preloaded with the catalog, or the show that just ended that night. $100 gets you the catalog plus live show from that night. They'd be rolling in it.

Look for Samsung or Toshiba to buy Sandisk sometime this year. As for the other points, if Revelation had been available on Amazon Music or Itunes, especially after the SuperBowl Show, we're talking a whole different ballgame.

[brywool]

They're in better shape than they've been since at LEAST the ROR era, arguably Frontiers.
Where's the beef?

Huh? Arrival blows away Revelation. And Augeri's first tour blew everyone away.

Don't agree here. I saw that tour and Augeri was using falsetto in parts, and not very well I'm afraid. You don't want to use it in the money notes of DSB "Hiding.... somewhere.... in the [switch to airy falsetto here] niiiiiight".


Augeri has a good voice, but Arnel is a step up power and range wise.

Augeri had many casual fans thinking he was Perry. Fact. If they would have had that WalMart deal for that tour it would have dwarfed Revelation sales.

remember what Herbie said about Deen ghosting him a LOT. I love Augeri, don't get me wrong. But his range is not what Arnel's is. Never was. As for the accent, it bothered me on the SB thing, but on the album and in the latest show clips, it doesn't bother me at all. I could care less where he's from. Many singers have accents, some of them American , doesn't mean they're not worth the price of admission.

There's a difference between hearing Klause Meine singing original Scorpion songs with his slight german accent, which you would expect....and listening to classic Journey songs with that annoying AH after every last syllable of a line.....savvy?

tons of soul singers do that.
Also, Klaus Meine on The Who's "Can't Explain"- you could say the same thing, but rather than whine about his accent, I'll say "hell, it rocks".

[Don]

Fuck the accent, I don't give a shit about that. Write new songs that fit Arnel's voice, no more pulling shit out of the crap bin or off the hard drive that was written 5 years ago. Tell Cain to save the ballads for his daughter's album and write some good rockers this time out.

[NealIsGod]

So I'm not sure how Augeri being mistaken for Perry is proof that he's better than Arnel.

But it's proof that they made a helluva choice.

[brywool]

So I'm not sure how Augeri being mistaken for Perry is proof that he's better than Arnel.

But it's proof that they made a helluva choice.

both of those choices were good for Journey. No argument here.

[Gideon]

So I'm not sure how Augeri being mistaken for Perry is proof that he's better than Arnel.

But it's proof that they made a helluva choice.

Absolutely. I love Augeri. The only reason I may give Revelation the nod is because of "Change For the Better." Everything else, the best of Arrival either equals or surpasses.

[steveo777]

So I'm not sure how Augeri being mistaken for Perry is proof that he's better than Arnel.

But it's proof that they made a helluva choice.

Absolutely. I love Augeri. The only reason I may give Revelation the nod is because of "Change For the Better." Everything else, the best of Arrival either equals or surpasses.

I have to say I'm totally digging this new arrangement of What I Needed......probably my fav from Revelation now.

[Gideon]

So I'm not sure how Augeri being mistaken for Perry is proof that he's better than Arnel.

But it's proof that they made a helluva choice.

Absolutely. I love Augeri. The only reason I may give Revelation the nod is because of "Change For the Better." Everything else, the best of Arrival either equals or surpasses.

I have to say I'm totally digging this new arrangement of What I Needed......probably my fav from Revelation now.

I like "What I Needed", but at the end of the day... it's a power ballad. And thus cannot compete, overall, to the greatness that is "Change For the Better."

[wednesday's child]

Best case scenario forward? For Journey?

They write an album's worth of new material and burn that badboy to disc, for release in '09.
None of this "Jon and/or Neal have a surplus of 2 year old, already-written pop" shit.
The way they'll confirm that they're a real band today is if they write new material today.
Rock tailored to Arnel's and Deen's dynamics and style, and I'm not just talking vox.

If they can find a way to do Augeri and JSS a solid nice (offer Arnel or Deen guest vocal?), so that
Jeff and Steve at least consider putting their bands on the next Journey tour, or maybe even guest voxing
on the next album, it'll resolve a lot of fucking bad history. Bonus points for getting Gregg to guest.

JM2Pesos worth of fantasy.

-wech

You have got to be joking.

The 'best case' is to finish touring this year and then plan 2010. Unless they set time aside to record a proper album, they rush through and record mediocre crap....and, yes, IMO, that includes Revelation, and Generations....Mediocre crap that should have been saved for a Bad English reunion.

Yes, I was joking, hence the included smiley ------>

Seriously, I don't think it'll matter if they set aside two years for a new album,
if they're just going to tweak stuff that was already written when Arnel came aboard.
They know his strengths and weaknesses, and should write with them in mind.

Revelation sounds rushed all right, and the redo CD is too much garbage for me,
but little of what frustrates me seems due to rushed songwriting. The album seemed
to me a fishing expedition, at once guessing at and sounding out what the market wanted,
rather than something more cohesive and from-the-gut.

My fear is that more "honesty", burned into methacrylate discs, will only mean more sappy pop
from Jon, rather than more-muscular rock from Neal, Deen, Ross and Arnel.

They'll record two more albums, I guess; and tour in-support-of each time,
Then they'll consider a profitable farewell tour if they can't get any traction moving more CD's.

wech

Ain't gonna happen. Journey is into generic cookie cutter music with mediocre or bad production quality released as quickly as possible so they can get back on the road where the real money is. They are in it for the money, not the music, or the fans. Taking a year off to write and create high quality music does not make them any money...I'm sure it is viewed as losing money from not touring. That has not been in the equation since Arrival.

But, but... they've changed (for the better)!
Arnel's made them better persons now!
They've got the magic back!



Oh, and I forgot:
We'll see.

[Jana]

Best case scenario forward? For Journey?

They write an album's worth of new material and burn that badboy to disc, for release in '09.
None of this "Jon and/or Neal have a surplus of 2 year old, already-written pop" shit.
The way they'll confirm that they're a real band today is if they write new material today.
Rock tailored to Arnel's and Deen's dynamics and style, and I'm not just talking vox.

If they can find a way to do Augeri and JSS a solid nice (offer Arnel or Deen guest vocal?), so that
Jeff and Steve at least consider putting their bands on the next Journey tour, or maybe even guest voxing
on the next album, it'll resolve a lot of fucking bad history. Bonus points for getting Gregg to guest.

JM2Pesos worth of fantasy.

-wech

You have got to be joking.

The 'best case' is to finish touring this year and then plan 2010. Unless they set time aside to record a proper album, they rush through and record mediocre crap....and, yes, IMO, that includes Revelation, and Generations....Mediocre crap that should have been saved for a Bad English reunion.

Yes, I was joking, hence the included smiley ------>

Seriously, I don't think it'll matter if they set aside two years for a new album,
if they're just going to tweak stuff that was already written when Arnel came aboard.
They know his strengths and weaknesses, and should write with them in mind.

Revelation sounds rushed all right, and the redo CD is too much garbage for me,
but little of what frustrates me seems due to rushed songwriting. The album seemed
to me a fishing expedition, at once guessing at and sounding out what the market wanted,
rather than something more cohesive and from-the-gut.

My fear is that more "honesty", burned into methacrylate discs, will only mean more sappy pop
from Jon, rather than more-muscular rock from Neal, Deen, Ross and Arnel.

They'll record two more albums, I guess; and tour in-support-of each time,
Then they'll consider a profitable farewell tour if they can't get any traction moving more CD's.

wech

Ain't gonna happen. Journey is into generic cookie cutter music with mediocre or bad production quality released as quickly as possible so they can get back on the road where the real money is. They are in it for the money, not the music, or the fans. Taking a year off to write and create high quality music does not make them any money...I'm sure it is viewed as losing money from not touring. That has not been in the equation since Arrival.

But, but... they've changed (for the better)!
Arnel's made them better persons now!
They've got the magic back!



Oh, and I forgot:
We'll see.

There, I fixed it for you, Wech. I knew you INADVERTENTLY used the wrong emoticons.

[steveo777]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

[Gideon]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

I'll just refer them to Saint John's most recent post on the subject.

[Don]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

I'll just refer them to Saint John's most recent post on the subject.

Unless he includes picture, we just ignore his posts anyway, He is the anti-Deano (even though they are buds in the real Non-Journey world).

[Gideon]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

I'll just refer them to Saint John's most recent post on the subject.

Unless he includes picture, we just ignore his posts anyway, He is the anti-Deano (even though they are buds in the real Non-Journey world).

It will be required reading before the week is out, my friend. SJ is your musical salvation; he is here to share the light with you nonbelievers.

[Don]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

I'll just refer them to Saint John's most recent post on the subject.

Unless he includes picture, we just ignore his posts anyway, He is the anti-Deano (even though they are buds in the real Non-Journey world).

It will be required reading before the week is out, my friend. SJ is your musical salvation; he is here to share the light with you nonbelievers.

Couch the text in a border of naked Asian chicks and I might sneak a peek.

[Gideon]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

I'll just refer them to Saint John's most recent post on the subject.

Unless he includes picture, we just ignore his posts anyway, He is the anti-Deano (even though they are buds in the real Non-Journey world).

It will be required reading before the week is out, my friend. SJ is your musical salvation; he is here to share the light with you nonbelievers.

Couch the text in a border of naked Asian chicks and I might sneak a peek.

Would you settle for a border of naked Ross Valories?

[Don]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

I'll just refer them to Saint John's most recent post on the subject.

Unless he includes picture, we just ignore his posts anyway, He is the anti-Deano (even though they are buds in the real Non-Journey world).

It will be required reading before the week is out, my friend. SJ is your musical salvation; he is here to share the light with you nonbelievers.

Couch the text in a border of naked Asian chicks and I might sneak a peek.

Would you settle for a border of naked Ross Valories?

I'm not looking for mature older women.

[bluejeangirl76]

Would you settle for a border of naked Ross Valories?

People are eating lunch here, Gideon!!

[Gideon]

Would you settle for a border of naked Ross Valories?

People are eating lunch here, Gideon!!

Mmhmm. And I bet you're ravenous now.

[Monker]

Best case scenario forward? For Journey?

They write an album's worth of new material and burn that badboy to disc, for release in '09.
None of this "Jon and/or Neal have a surplus of 2 year old, already-written pop" shit.
The way they'll confirm that they're a real band today is if they write new material today.
Rock tailored to Arnel's and Deen's dynamics and style, and I'm not just talking vox.

If they can find a way to do Augeri and JSS a solid nice (offer Arnel or Deen guest vocal?), so that
Jeff and Steve at least consider putting their bands on the next Journey tour, or maybe even guest voxing
on the next album, it'll resolve a lot of fucking bad history. Bonus points for getting Gregg to guest.

JM2Pesos worth of fantasy.

-wech

You have got to be joking.

The 'best case' is to finish touring this year and then plan 2010. Unless they set time aside to record a proper album, they rush through and record mediocre crap....and, yes, IMO, that includes Revelation, and Generations....Mediocre crap that should have been saved for a Bad English reunion.

Yes, I was joking, hence the included smiley ------>

Seriously, I don't think it'll matter if they set aside two years for a new album,
if they're just going to tweak stuff that was already written when Arnel came aboard.
They know his strengths and weaknesses, and should write with them in mind.

Revelation sounds rushed all right, and the redo CD is too much garbage for me,
but little of what frustrates me seems due to rushed songwriting. The album seemed
to me a fishing expedition, at once guessing at and sounding out what the market wanted,
rather than something more cohesive and from-the-gut.

My fear is that more "honesty", burned into methacrylate discs, will only mean more sappy pop
from Jon, rather than more-muscular rock from Neal, Deen, Ross and Arnel.

They'll record two more albums, I guess; and tour in-support-of each time,
Then they'll consider a profitable farewell tour if they can't get any traction moving more CD's.

wech

Ain't gonna happen. Journey is into generic cookie cutter music with mediocre or bad production quality released as quickly as possible so they can get back on the road where the real money is. They are in it for the money, not the music, or the fans. Taking a year off to write and create high quality music does not make them any money...I'm sure it is viewed as losing money from not touring. That has not been in the equation since Arrival.

But, but... they've changed (for the better)!
Arnel's made them better persons now!
They've got the magic back!



Oh, and I forgot:
We'll see.

I see...so it's about some 'magic' or about them being better people.

None of that matters if all they can do is write and record music that mimics 30yr old pop.

[Monker]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

The coolest thing about Journey WAS that they never looked BACK and moved forward with their music. Now they are an 80's nostalgia band - by their own admission.

[Don]

If you need a little Filipino dude to make you a better person, you've got some serious issues to begin with.

[Gideon]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

The coolest thing about Journey WAS that they never looked BACK and moved forward with their music. Now they are an 80's nostalgia band - by their own admission.

Depends. One could argue that they've always had a certain formula since "Escape." And if by moving forward you mean pulling the shit that Jon Bon Jovi has (i.e. turning from a rock band into country music rejects), I'll take Journey's "nostalgia" any day.

[Don]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

The coolest thing about Journey WAS that they never looked BACK and moved forward with their music. Now they are an 80's nostalgia band - by their own admission.

Depends. One could argue that they've always had a certain formula since "Escape." And if by moving forward you mean pulling the shit that Jon Bon Jovi has (i.e. turning from a rock band into country music rejects), I'll take Journey's "nostalgia" any day.

Bon Jovi did what it had to do to stay relevant.
100 shows last year, 100 sellouts. 150 million dollars.

[Gideon]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

The coolest thing about Journey WAS that they never looked BACK and moved forward with their music. Now they are an 80's nostalgia band - by their own admission.

Depends. One could argue that they've always had a certain formula since "Escape." And if by moving forward you mean pulling the shit that Jon Bon Jovi has (i.e. turning from a rock band into country music rejects), I'll take Journey's "nostalgia" any day.

Bon Jovi did what it had to do to stay relevant.
100 shows last year, 100 sellouts. 150 million dollars.

You all kill me.

Are you after quality music or commercial success? The two don't always coincide. Journey puts out great shit, in my book, and they've had great success thus far.

Britney Spears is, once again, a megahit. "Relevant." Still wouldn't regard her work as great.

[Don]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

The coolest thing about Journey WAS that they never looked BACK and moved forward with their music. Now they are an 80's nostalgia band - by their own admission.

Depends. One could argue that they've always had a certain formula since "Escape." And if by moving forward you mean pulling the shit that Jon Bon Jovi has (i.e. turning from a rock band into country music rejects), I'll take Journey's "nostalgia" any day.

Bon Jovi did what it had to do to stay relevant.
100 shows last year, 100 sellouts. 150 million dollars.

You all kill me.

Are you after quality music or commercial success? The two don't always coincide. Journey puts out great shit, in my book, and they've had great success thus far.

Britney Spears is, once again, a megahit. "Relevant." Still wouldn't regard her work as great.

I didn't mention album sales, I don't even know Bon Jovi's sales figures. They play two hour sets and go through the whole catalog, just like Journey does. What's the big difference? They get booked to play stadiums. If selling a country music album gets them the bookings, then so be it. Bon Jovi was one the groups that usurped Journey's thrown in the late eighties, they're talented whether you believe it or not.

[Jana]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

The coolest thing about Journey WAS that they never looked BACK and moved forward with their music. Now they are an 80's nostalgia band - by their own admission.

Depends. One could argue that they've always had a certain formula since "Escape." And if by moving forward you mean pulling the shit that Jon Bon Jovi has (i.e. turning from a rock band into country music rejects), I'll take Journey's "nostalgia" any day.

Bon Jovi did what it had to do to stay relevant.
100 shows last year, 100 sellouts. 150 million dollars.

You all kill me.

Are you after quality music or commercial success? The two don't always coincide. Journey puts out great shit, in my book, and they've had great success thus far.

Britney Spears is, once again, a megahit. "Relevant." Still wouldn't regard her work as great.

I really don't get the comparisons to Bon Jovi. They have the original lead singer and they are a mega band that has done it right. But Journey was at a disadvantage starting over, but they did it with Steve Augeri, starting small. They've put in a lot of hard work and are having success in spite of change-ups with lead singers. These guys are in their fifties, heading towards sixty and still amazing musicians. And Deen and Arnel are in their forties. They shot the new DVD. But they are stuck with playing the hits to a degree. I like the changes and with two hours in shows, hopefully, we'll see variation on some song choice. If they can get another record deal at this stage of the game, I consider that great without the original lead singer. Forget it. I'm probably off topic. I always start responding to something that wasn't even mentioned.

[Don]

Hey, the coolest thing about Journey is when they are getting bashed, you know they are doing something.

The coolest thing about Journey WAS that they never looked BACK and moved forward with their music. Now they are an 80's nostalgia band - by their own admission.

Depends. One could argue that they've always had a certain formula since "Escape." And if by moving forward you mean pulling the shit that Jon Bon Jovi has (i.e. turning from a rock band into country music rejects), I'll take Journey's "nostalgia" any day.

Bon Jovi did what it had to do to stay relevant.
100 shows last year, 100 sellouts. 150 million dollars.

You all kill me.

Are you after quality music or commercial success? The two don't always coincide. Journey puts out great shit, in my book, and they've had great success thus far.

Britney Spears is, once again, a megahit. "Relevant." Still wouldn't regard her work as great.

I really don't get the comparisons to Bon Jovi. They have the original lead singer and they are a mega band that has done it right. But Journey was at a disadvantage starting over, but they did it with Steve Augeri, starting small. They've put in a lot of hard work and are having success in spite of change-ups with lead singers. These guys are in their fifties, heading towards sixty and still amazing musicians. And Deen and Arnel are in their forties. They shot the new DVD. But they are stuck with playing the hits to a degree. I like the changes and with two hours in shows, hopefully, we'll see variation on some song choice. If they can get another record deal at this stage of the game, I consider that great without the original lead singer. Forget it. I'm probably off topic. I always start responding to something that wasn't even mentioned.

I just jumped into the conversation when I saw Bon Jovi mentioned. They started from scratch, built up their fanbase in Japan first and went upward from there. They've done what they have to do, like U2 has. It doesn't make them any less talented because they seem more commercialized now. Journey was accused of the same thing also during their heyday.

[wednesday's child]

I knew you INADVERTENTLY used the wrong emoticons.

Just like Jon Cain "inadvertently" belittled Arnel, practically to his face, during auditions...
Just like Steve Perry "inadvertently" voted Ross, Smitty and Herb off the island...
Just like Gunbot, the heartless bastard, "inadvertently" quit using those Aki Kawamura avi's...
Suuuure...


wech