President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[Rockindeano]

You making and taking a sign? You'll find out what I mean about 11 songs in...They take sign requests, and that has morphed into a stump the band thing too. They played I Want to be Sedated by the Ramones, I'm Nationwide by ZZ Top, and when I was in LA, they played Proud Mary. Just proves they are the best band in the land. You'll dig it Stu, but my guess is you hit the pisser at the 6 song mark. He plays 3 B sides, Seeds, Johnny 99 and Ghost of Tom Joad. You might see Billy Joel come out tonight. That's what is being thrown around on Backstreets.

Also, this being Philly, it will be a special show. Philly is a special stop for Bruce, and they are razing the Spectrum later this year, so I would expect all the classics, like Jungleland, Thunder Road, Rosalita, and of course 10th Ave Freeze Out.

[S2M]

You making and taking a sign? You'll find out what I mean about 11 songs in...They take sign requests, and that has morphed into a stump the band thing too. They played I Want to be Sedated by the Ramones, I'm Nationwide by ZZ Top, and when I was in LA, they played Proud Mary. Just proves they are the best band in the land. You'll dig it Stu, but my guess is you hit the pisser at the 6 song mark. He plays 3 B sides, Seeds, Johnny 99 and Ghost of Tom Joad. You might see Billy Joel come out tonight. That's what is being thrown around on Backstreets.

Good, cause Joel smokes Bruce anyway.....Billy is a much more talented singer-songwriter. Carry on.

[Rockindeano]

You making and taking a sign? You'll find out what I mean about 11 songs in...They take sign requests, and that has morphed into a stump the band thing too. They played I Want to be Sedated by the Ramones, I'm Nationwide by ZZ Top, and when I was in LA, they played Proud Mary. Just proves they are the best band in the land. You'll dig it Stu, but my guess is you hit the pisser at the 6 song mark. He plays 3 B sides, Seeds, Johnny 99 and Ghost of Tom Joad. You might see Billy Joel come out tonight. That's what is being thrown around on Backstreets.

Good, cause Joel smokes Bruce anyway.....Billy is a much more talented singer-songwriter. Carry on.

LOL, ok, if you say so. I would love some evidence to back up your ridiculous statement. Sales, hits, tours, etc.

Spoken like a true jealous fan. God it's good being a fan of the best band and frankly best lead man ever. It's real good right now.

[lights1961]

Spector the opportunist SENATOR from PA... never was a republican but became one because he new in 1980 with Reagan that was the party he could win in... now...
well 30 years later... he has to switch because its the only way he might win next election... geee what balls that takes... its a no brainer for him, since he knows nothing else except how to spend our money..

R

[Eric]

Fair:

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/art ... ckcomments

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

Spector the opportunist SENATOR from PA... never was a republican but became one because he new in 1980 with Reagan that was the party he could win in... now...
well 30 years later... he has to switch because its the only way he might win next election... geee what balls that takes... its a no brainer for him, since he knows nothing else except how to spend our money..

R

so Spector jumped from a party of big oppressive government (GOP) to a party of even bigger oppressive government. God what a profile in courage.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Fair:

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/art ... ckcomments

You would think it's fair, considering the article repeats the same debunked lie you tried to pass off here.
Show me quotes of Obama "apologis[ing] for the United States."
I'll be waiting...

[Eric]

Fair:

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/art ... ckcomments

You would think it's fair, considering the article repeats the same debunked lie you tried to pass off here.
Show me quotes of Obama "apologis[ing] for the United States."
I'll be waiting...

It talks about good things and bad things so far. I know you'd prefer an all-glowing report, but thats not fair. And what debunked lie do you speak of? If you say something isn't true that doesn't make it debunked...just so you know.

Here are some quotes/comments though:
Apologizing for absolutely nothing. Bush was clear even just 2 days after 9-11 that Muslims were a people of peace.
"I know there have been difficulties these last few years," he said. "I know that the trust that binds us has been strained, and I know that strain is shared in many places where the Muslim faith is practiced. Let me say this as clearly as I can: the United States is not at war with Islam."

So, I was only 3 so don't blame me was his message...and not we were trying to rid you of a brutal commie dictator who repressed people in his country for 5 decades now
After Nicaraguan President Daniel Ortega berated the United States at a recent summit, President Obama joked, in reference to the failed Bay of Pigs operation, “I’m grateful that President Ortega did not blame me for things that happened when I was 3 months old.”

SO sorry we called you out France on your Oil scandal with Saddam. So sorry to Germany and other Euros we asked for help in a global struggle against terrorism..I mean...we've never helped you out in the past or anything"
“Instead of celebrating your dynamic union and seeking to partner with you to meet common challenges, there have been times where America has shown arrogance and been dismissive, even derisive.”

Yeah...its our fault, not the individual Mexicans who are killing and brutalizing people.
He also blamed America's appetite for illegal drugs and its lax control of the flow of guns and cash to Mexico were to blame for illegals violence here.

SO sorry we lead the world and so that affects you. So sorry we didn't tell everyone how to be.....never mind that it comes down to irresponsible individuals who bought houses they couldn't afford.
And he told Euros that America did not regulate Wall street and that led to the worldwide financial crisis.

[The_Noble_Cause]

It talks about good things and bad things so far. I know you'd prefer an all-glowing report,...

No, I'm just against lies.

And what debunked lie do you speak of? If you say something isn't true that doesn't make it debunked...just so you know.

Repeatedly now, you quote Obama to make it seem he is apologizing for America, when prejudices on both sides of the Atlantic are taken to task, and renounced.
You try it again in this very post - I deal with it below.

Here are some quotes/comments though:
Apologizing for absolutely nothing. Bush was clear even just 2 days after 9-11 that Muslims were a people of peace.
"I know there have been difficulties these last few years," he said. "I know that the trust that binds us has been strained, and I know that strain is shared in many places where the Muslim faith is practiced. Let me say this as clearly as I can: the United States is not at war with Islam."

Like it or not, Bush's voluntary invasion of a Muslim country and indefinite detention/torture policies left behind a bad funk.
Is the new President not allowed to re-define the battle on his own terms?
Even under Rumsfeld, the administration changed the name of the War on Terror.

So, I was only 3 so don't blame me was his message...and not we were trying to rid you of a brutal commie dictator who repressed people in his country for 5 decades now
After Nicaraguan President Daniel Ortega berated the United States at a recent summit, President Obama joked, in reference to the failed Bay of Pigs operation, “I’m grateful that President Ortega did not blame me for things that happened when I was 3 months old.”

This isn't even an apology, it's just Obama pointing out that Ortega's laundry list of American imperialist acts have no relation to him.
Did you expect Obama to defend the Bay of Pigs?
Who doesn't agree that was a disaster?

SO sorry we called you out France on your Oil scandal with Saddam. So sorry to Germany and other Euros we asked for help in a global struggle against terrorism..I mean...we've never helped you out in the past or anything"
“Instead of celebrating your dynamic union and seeking to partner with you to meet common challenges, there have been times where America has shown arrogance and been dismissive, even derisive.”

Nice edited quote, O'Reilly.
Too bad you conveniently left out the part where Obama rejected prejudice on both sides:

"...have been times where America has shown arrogance and been dismissive, even derisive. But in Europe, there is an anti-Americanism that is at once casual, but can also be insidious. Instead of recognizing the good that America so often does in the world, there have been times where Europeans choose to blame America for much of what is bad. On both sides of the Atlantic, these attitudes have become all too common. They are not wise. They do not represent the truth. They threaten to widen the divide across the Atlantic and leave us both more isolated.

Yeah...its our fault, not the individual Mexicans who are killing and brutalizing people.
He also blamed America's appetite for illegal drugs and its lax control of the flow of guns and cash to Mexico were to blame for illegals violence here.

Ok.
You've now gone from providing quotes that weren't even apologies, to just quoting your own opinion.
Do you have examples of the President apologizing or not?

SO sorry we lead the world and so that affects you. So sorry we didn't tell everyone how to be.....never mind that it comes down to irresponsible individuals who bought houses they couldn't afford.[/b]

"Irresponsible homeowners" have little to do with investment banks bundling up mortgages and getting false triple A ratings etc etc.
Huge oversimplification.

And he told Euros that America did not regulate Wall street and that led to the worldwide financial crisis.

This is 100% right.
Just look at who Bush appointed to run the SEC - in addittion to gutting regulations, the guy ignored warnings about Madoff.

Owning up to mistakes is not the same thing as slavishly apologising.
How did you feel about Reagan apologizing and compensating the Japanese-American internees?

[Eric]

It talks about good things and bad things so far. I know you'd prefer an all-glowing report,...

No, I'm just against lies.

No...what you are is ridiculous. You unable to recognize any faults in Obama, and this flaw makes you unreliable and invalid.

[The_Noble_Cause]

It talks about good things and bad things so far. I know you'd prefer an all-glowing report,...

No, I'm just against lies.

No...what you are is ridiculous. You unable to recognize any faults in Obama, and this flaw makes you unreliable and invalid.

Given your penchant for lying about Obama, it's little wonder you do the same when when the topic is me.
Fact of the matter is, I've criticized Obama's financial team on several occassions.
Otherwise, I have very little to complain about.
And why would I? - Obaman's budget hasn't even taken effect yet.
The idea that me, Lula, or Deano should be screaming for "impeachment" after 100 days, while you sad Bushbot deadenders are still blindly supporting your guy is laughable.

[Eric]

It talks about good things and bad things so far. I know you'd prefer an all-glowing report,...

No, I'm just against lies.

No...what you are is ridiculous. You unable to recognize any faults in Obama, and this flaw makes you unreliable and invalid.

Given your penchant for lying about Obama, it's little wonder you do the same when when the topic is me.
Fact of the matter is, I've criticized Obama's financial team on several occassions.
Otherwise, I have very little to complain about.
And why would I? - Obaman's budget hasn't even taken effect yet.
The idea that me, Lula, or Deano should be screaming for "impeachment" after 100 days, while you sad Bushbot deadenders are still blindly supporting your guy is laughable.

Who said anything about impeachment???????

Name one lie?

I gave you quotes and you spun them as not being the whole speech or him being right. I gave you quotes.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Who said anything about impeachment???????

That was hyperbole, obviously.
But the point remains the same.
Be it cries for impeachment or just standard self-righteous teabag indignation, I don't share any of it.
At this early stage, I think Obama has done a good job.

Name one lie?

You and Treetop really are two of a kind.
You just accused me of being "unable to recognize any faults.."
To refute that, I mentioned how I have criticized Obama's financial team repeatedly on here.
Therefore, your accusation is a lie.
Got it?

I gave you quotes and you spun them as not being the whole speech or him being right.

You can't "spin" something as not being in context.
It either is or it isn't.
Your quote of Obama calling America "arrogant" is a total hatchet job.
Adding the immediately proceeding sentences back in is not "spinning" - just the opposite.

I gave you quotes.

None of which were an apology.
Hell, half of them weren't even direct quotes, just your own two-bit demagoguery.

[Eric]

You can't "spin" something as being not in context.
It either is or isn't.
Your quote of Obama calling America "arrogant" is a total hatchet job.
Also, not a single one of your provided quotes is an apology.
Hell, half of them weren't even direct quotes, just your own two-bit demagoguery.

How was it NOT in context!!??? He said it....he meant it. He may have also criticized Europe later in the speech, but he still apologized for our so called dismissive and arrogant behavior. You don't have to say...I apologize at that start of a statement to make it an apology. Gimme a break! To even argue this point is beyond absurd. You even are trying to psin because you agree with the Muslim one then its not an apology.

Here you lie, which you often do. 3/5 were DIRECT quotes I could easily go grab. 2/5 were summaries of things he has said that I remembered, but didn't know where to pull them from. So, 60% of them were direct quotes, not "half" like you said. Soooo.....YOU are a liar.

[Eric]

Who said anything about impeachment???????

That was hyperbole, obviously.
But the point remains the same.
Be it cries for impeachment or just standard self-righteous teabag indignation, I don't share any of it.
At this early stage, I think Obama has done a good job.

Not at all hyperbole, but nice BS.

And, you more than think he has done a good job. Victor Davis Hanson's piece that I linked to previously summarized what he felt was the good and bad so far about Obama's foreign policy. You slammed it as having lies in it. What lies exactly?

[The_Noble_Cause]

How was it NOT in context!!??? He said it....he meant it.

HUGE difference between:

"Instead of celebrating your dynamic union and seeking to partner with you to meet common challenges, there have been times where America has shown arrogance and been dismissive, even derisive.”

AND

"Instead of celebrating your dynamic union and seeking to partner with you to meet common challenges, there have been times where America has shown arrogance and been dismissive, even derisive. But in Europe, there is an anti-Americanism that is at once casual, but can also be insidious. Instead of recognizing the good that America so often does in the world, there have been times where Europeans choose to blame America for much of what is bad. On both sides of the Atlantic, these attitudes have become all too common. They are not wise. They do not represent the truth. They threaten to widen the divide across the Atlantic and leave us both more isolated."

One is a deceptive attempt to paint Obama's comments as one sided and endorsing anti-American views.
Which wasn't the case at all.

He may have also criticized Europe later in the speech,

Yeh, a whole sentence later.

...but he still apologized for our so called dismissive and arrogant behavior. You don't have to say...I apologize at that start of a statement to make it an apology Gimme a break! To even argue this point is beyond absurd.

Acknowledging something is not apologizing.
In no uncertain terms, he rejected prejudices on both sides and spoke up for America as a force for good.
Those who say he was profusely "apologzsing" are seeing only what they want to.

...You even are trying to psin because you agree with the Muslim one then its not an apology.

I don't know what you're saying here.

...Here you lie, which you often do. 3/5 were DIRECT quotes I could easily go grab. 2/5 were summaries of things he has said that I remembered, but didn't know where to pull them from. So, 60% of them were direct quotes, not "half" like you said. Soooo.....YOU are a liar.

So to condemn my truthiness you're highlighting your own record of slipshod bullshit.
Nice work!
1/2 or 3/5, who cares?
I didn't bother counting.
The bottom line is the direct quotes weren't apologies, and many of them weren't direct quotes at all.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Not at all hyperbole, but nice BS.

Huh?
Of course my use of "impeachment" was hyperbole.
Just what the fuck are you talking about?

And, you more than think he has done a good job. Victor Davis Hanson's piece that I linked to previously summarized what he felt was the good and bad so far about Obama's foreign policy. You slammed it as having lies in it. What lies exactly?

The ones I just painstakingly went over.
I even quoted Hanson in my post.
Stop wasting my time.

[Eric]

Not at all hyperbole, but nice BS.

Huh?
Of course my use of "impeachment" was hyperbole.
Just what the fuck are you talking about?

And, you more than think he has done a good job. Victor Davis Hanson's piece that I linked to previously summarized what he felt was the good and bad so far about Obama's foreign policy. You slammed it as having lies in it. What lies exactly?

The ones I just painstakingly went over.
I even quoted Hanson in my post.
Stop wasting my time.

Sorry - I thought you were accusing me of hyperbole by saying I am not asking for impeachment. Mis-understood.

Name one lie from the Hanson piece? Where did you...show me again?

[Eric]

...You even are trying to spin because you agree with the Muslim one then its not an apology.

I don't know what you're saying here.

If you agree with what Obama said then you claim its not an apology. He was apologizing in Turkey when it was unnecessary. It has never been a war against Muslims. AGAIN - you don't have to say the words I apologize or I'm sorry to be apologizing. Unbelievable

[The_Noble_Cause]

Name one lie from the Hanson piece? Where did you...show me again?

I took issue with him saying Obama is "apologis[ing] for the United States."
That is what started this back-and forth to begin with.

[Eric]

After Nicaraguan President Daniel Ortega berated the United States at a recent summit, President Obama joked, in reference to the failed Bay of Pigs operation, “I’m grateful that President Ortega did not blame me for things that happened when I was 3 months old.”

This isn't even an apology, it's just Obama pointing out that Ortega's laundry list of American imperialist acts have no relation to him.

The proper thing would have been to walk out when that piece of lint Ortega was berating Obama's country. Then to not even counter it leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Why would you allow someone to bad mouth the United States of America when you are its President?

And imperialistic? Go fuck yourself. This is just a terrible and untrue thing to say.

[Eric]

Name one lie from the Hanson piece? Where did you...show me again?

I took issue with him saying Obama is "apologis[ing] for the United States."
That is what started this back-and forth to begin with.

You're right...this is just a waste of time. You don't think he's apologized or evidently even taken an apologetic tone when not necessary. I do. I'm sorry I called you a liar.

[The_Noble_Cause]

If you agree with what Obama said then you claim its not an apology.

No, I don't think admitting America has been arrogant, or that the Monroe Doctrine is obsolete, are apologies.

He was apologizing in Turkey when it was unnecessary. It has never been a war against Muslims. AGAIN - you don't have to say the words I apologize or I'm sorry to be apologizing. Unbelievable

And just who are you to speak on how the Muslim world has viewed the past eight years.
Undergoing an unecessary war in a Muslim country is not the best way to win friends.
You are conflating acknowledging any mistake with apologising.
By that standard, any President in recent history would be found guilty.

[The_Noble_Cause]

The proper thing would have been to walk out when that piece of lint Ortega was berating Obama's country. Then to not even counter it leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Why would you allow someone to bad mouth the United States of America when you are its President?

There's a case to be made for walking out.
As far as denouncing Ortega, I don't think Obama is fast enough on his feet to come up with anything to say.

And imperialistic? Go fuck yourself. This is just a terrible and untrue thing to say.

Wanna bet?
Ever hear of Mainfest Destinty?
Monroe Doctrine?
Trail of tears?
"Remember the Maine, To hell with Spain",ring any bells?
How about the 1953 Iran coup?
Or overthrowing the elected gov't in Guatemala on the behalf of Chiquita?
I thought Conservatives were the ones with a healthy distrust of gov't.
You need a wake up call, man.

[Eric]

The proper thing would have been to walk out when that piece of lint Ortega was berating Obama's country. Then to not even counter it leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Why would you allow someone to bad mouth the United States of America when you are its President?

There's a case to be made for walking out.
As far as denouncing Ortega, I don't think Obama is fast enough on his feet to come up with anything to say.

And imperialistic? Go fuck yourself. This is just a terrible and untrue thing to say.

Wanna bet?
Ever hear of Mainfest Destinty?
Monroe Doctrine?
Trail of tears?
"Remember the Maine, To hell with Spain",ring any bells?
How about the 1953 Iran coup?
Or overthrowing the elected gov't in Guatemala on the behalf of Chiquita?
I thought Conservatives were the ones with a healthy distrust of gov't.
You need a wake up call, man.

I thought you were specifically saying the bay of pigs fiasco was about imperialism. I don't feel America has been Imperialistic in recent history. If we had been, gas would .50/gallon.

[Eric]

The proper thing would have been to walk out when that piece of lint Ortega was berating Obama's country. Then to not even counter it leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Why would you allow someone to bad mouth the United States of America when you are its President?

There's a case to be made for walking out.
As far as denouncing Ortega, I don't think Obama is fast enough on his feet to come up with anything to say.

We'll say this is common ground.

I just worry that he's either too eager to please people that don't need to be pleased, or that maybe he believes we aren't a great country.

[Gideon]

Off topic, I have an older, conservative teacher who has strong opposition towards Obama. She says he makes overtures of communism all the time.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I thought you were specifically saying the bay of pigs fiasco was about imperialism. I don't feel America has been Imperialistic in recent history. If we had been, gas would .50/gallon.

I was actually just trying to neutrally describe what it was Ortega did at the meeting.
From what I read, he recited a list of actions by America he took issue with.
Imperialist was his word, not mine, and was bandied about on the news.
I did not set out to defend his views.

[Eric]

http://www.billoreilly.com/newsletterco ... ?pid=26086

I'll admit that I'm suffering from ODS.....I have tried to be fair, but I can try harder

[Eric]

I thought Conservatives were the ones with a healthy distrust of gov't.
You need a wake up call, man.

I'm not a fan of liberal views and am a registered Republican, but I wouldn't say I'm conservative because I'm not at all religious.