Another Jab at Perry

[Laydee]

Nickleback and David Cook releases mark the death of grunge

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainmen ... mark_.html

DAVID COOK, "David Cook" (19/RCA Records)

NICKELBACK, "Dark Horse" (Roadrunner Records)

(One star for each)

Let any genre stick around long enough and it starts to rot. Over the course of 40 years, soul slid from the searing pain of Etta James to the suburban privilege of Robin Thicke. After a quarter century, punk plunged from the soaring glory of the Clash to the frat-house pranks of Blink-182. And, in just over a decade, grunge has gone from the rallying cries of Nirvana to the mall crawls of Nickelback and David Cook.

That's the fate of all revolutionary forms: Once the mainstream devours and digests them, they're excreted like so much cultural waste.

The unappetizing result hits a pungent new low in the work of David Cook. Even by the most generous math, he's a sixth-generation copy of an original sound, descended, steeply, from Nirvana's meaningful peak through second stringers (Pearl Jam, Soundgarden), third (Candlebox, Bush), fourth (Nickelback) and fifth (Daughtry). Cook, let us pray, will slam the final nail into this coffin.

How fitting that grunge's nadir should take place on "American Idol," whose crown Cook swiped this year. It's even more appropriate that this year's champ regurgitated the work of an earlier contestant from that very show (Chris Daughtry). Given the success of Daughtry's CD (over 4 million sold), it should have surprised no one that Cook triumphed over rival and fellow David, Archuleta.

Now comes Cook's debut CD, which features the same faux growl and planed down, pseudo-Seattle power chords he showcased on TV. There's just one fiddle: "David Cook" presents an even more diluted take on that style.

Cook's recordings - some of which he co-wrote - reconcile the bottom feeders of '90s grunge (think: Seven Mary Three, only lower), with the detritus of '80s hair-pop (the later solo albums of Journey squawker Steve Perry).

Proceed at your own peril.

Compared to this, Nickelback, the former epicenter of post-grunge evil, sounds like Led Zeppelin. In fact, playing the Cook and Nickelback albums back to back almost makes the more seasoned band sound good. (I said almost.) "Dark Horse" does offer one small improvement for this, the band that has made more hay than anyone by picking over the bones of grunge (with 6 million copies sold of their peak CD, "Silver Side Up").

The new disk marks the first time they worked with a major outside producer, and they picked a doozy - Robert (Mutt) Lange. He's the brains behind both Def Leppard and (ex-wife) Shania Twain. Predictably, Lange made Nickel's sound fatter, and a bit catchier, though there's only so much he can do with their lank songwriting and slack singer.

The band itself changed one key aspect: their lyrics. Perhaps spooked by Daughtry and Cook having seized the more mainstream part of their demographic, they've aimed younger. Out of nowhere they now present themselves as leering stoner dudes. They drool out lyrics about sexed-up babes and, even less convincingly, about getting high.

Suffice it to say, if Kurt Cobain came back to life and heard these CDs, he'd do himself in all over again.

[portland]

Well as far as I am concerned if Kurt Cobain did himself in all over again it would be no bigger loss than the first time.....

[weatherman90]

Same Jim Farber as the other one. Some just don't get it apparently.

[Babyblue]

Nickleback and David Cook releases mark the death of grunge

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainmen ... mark_.html

DAVID COOK, "David Cook" (19/RCA Records)

NICKELBACK, "Dark Horse" (Roadrunner Records)

(One star for each)

Let any genre stick around long enough and it starts to rot. Over the course of 40 years, soul slid from the searing pain of Etta James to the suburban privilege of Robin Thicke. After a quarter century, punk plunged from the soaring glory of the Clash to the frat-house pranks of Blink-182. And, in just over a decade, grunge has gone from the rallying cries of Nirvana to the mall crawls of Nickelback and David Cook.

That's the fate of all revolutionary forms: Once the mainstream devours and digests them, they're excreted like so much cultural waste.

The unappetizing result hits a pungent new low in the work of David Cook. Even by the most generous math, he's a sixth-generation copy of an original sound, descended, steeply, from Nirvana's meaningful peak through second stringers (Pearl Jam, Soundgarden), third (Candlebox, Bush), fourth (Nickelback) and fifth (Daughtry). Cook, let us pray, will slam the final nail into this coffin.

How fitting that grunge's nadir should take place on "American Idol," whose crown Cook swiped this year. It's even more appropriate that this year's champ regurgitated the work of an earlier contestant from that very show (Chris Daughtry). Given the success of Daughtry's CD (over 4 million sold), it should have surprised no one that Cook triumphed over rival and fellow David, Archuleta.

Now comes Cook's debut CD, which features the same faux growl and planed down, pseudo-Seattle power chords he showcased on TV. There's just one fiddle: "David Cook" presents an even more diluted take on that style.

Cook's recordings - some of which he co-wrote - reconcile the bottom feeders of '90s grunge (think: Seven Mary Three, only lower), with the detritus of '80s hair-pop (the later solo albums of Journey squawker Steve Perry).

Proceed at your own peril.

Compared to this, Nickelback, the former epicenter of post-grunge evil, sounds like Led Zeppelin. In fact, playing the Cook and Nickelback albums back to back almost makes the more seasoned band sound good. (I said almost.) "Dark Horse" does offer one small improvement for this, the band that has made more hay than anyone by picking over the bones of grunge (with 6 million copies sold of their peak CD, "Silver Side Up").

The new disk marks the first time they worked with a major outside producer, and they picked a doozy - Robert (Mutt) Lange. He's the brains behind both Def Leppard and (ex-wife) Shania Twain. Predictably, Lange made Nickel's sound fatter, and a bit catchier, though there's only so much he can do with their lank songwriting and slack singer.

The band itself changed one key aspect: their lyrics. Perhaps spooked by Daughtry and Cook having seized the more mainstream part of their demographic, they've aimed younger. Out of nowhere they now present themselves as leering stoner dudes. They drool out lyrics about sexed-up babes and, even less convincingly, about getting high.

Suffice it to say, if Kurt Cobain came back to life and heard these CDs, he'd do himself in all over again.

What a jerk the writer is.Perry was never that nor will he ever be.

[artist4perry]

I will take that "Squawker" over this idle "Talker" any day.

[texafana]

You guys do realize that everytime you post anything about Perry good or bad it's going to get indexed via Google and other search engines? Do you really want to add negative posts about Perry in this forum and have it come up when someone searches? If someone searches on "melodic rock Steve Perry" these negative posts could eventually come up high in the search indexes. So you may not be doing ol Stevey any favors plus it may come across as this site being over negative towards SP. Just sumpin to think about.

[youkeepmewaiting]

Boo hissssss how dare someone have an opinion..

[Jubilee]

You guys do realize that everytime you post anything about Perry good or bad it's going to get indexed via Google and other search engines? Do you really want to add negative posts about Perry in this forum and have it come up when someone searches? If someone searches on "melodic rock Steve Perry" these negative posts could eventually come up high in the search indexes. So you may not be doing ol Stevey any favors plus it may come across as this site being over negative towards SP. Just sumpin to think about.

Come across as being over negative? To whom? And why should we care? This is a forum not a Perry-love site. Nothing regarding Perry's professional career should be off limits - the good, the bad, or the ugly. IMHO this article doesn't even qualify as "negative" and for the life of me I cannot understand the need for the "Steve Perry Anti-Defamation League" to come charging to Perry's defense every time some writer fails to genuflect.

And here's something else to think about: Believe it, or not, there really are people out here who are looking for informative and insightful grown-up discussions on Perry and his professional career. Isn't that the true nature of MR?

[Arianddu]

You guys do realize that everytime you post anything about Perry good or bad it's going to get indexed via Google and other search engines? Do you really want to add negative posts about Perry in this forum and have it come up when someone searches? If someone searches on "melodic rock Steve Perry" these negative posts could eventually come up high in the search indexes. So you may not be doing ol Stevey any favors plus it may come across as this site being over negative towards SP. Just sumpin to think about.

Come across as being over negative? To whom? And why should we care? This is a forum not a Perry-love site. Nothing regarding Perry's professional career should be off limits - the good, the bad, or the ugly. IMHO this article doesn't even qualify as "negative" and for the life of me I cannot understand the need for the "Steve Perry Anti-Defamation League" to come charging to Perry's defense every time some writer fails to genuflect.

And here's something else to think about: Believe it, or not, there really are people out here who are looking for informative and insightful grown-up discussions on Perry and his professional career. Isn't that the true nature of MR?

+100.

[Sarah]

Nickelback, Daughtry, and David Cook are grunge? I'd go look up their listed genres on various sites but I bet none of them will say grunge.

I call shenanigans.

[jrnyman28]

You guys do realize that everytime you post anything about Perry good or bad it's going to get indexed via Google and other search engines? Do you really want to add negative posts about Perry in this forum and have it come up when someone searches? If someone searches on "melodic rock Steve Perry" these negative posts could eventually come up high in the search indexes. So you may not be doing ol Stevey any favors plus it may come across as this site being over negative towards SP. Just sumpin to think about.

Come across as being over negative? To whom? And why should we care? This is a forum not a Perry-love site. Nothing regarding Perry's professional career should be off limits - the good, the bad, or the ugly. IMHO this article doesn't even qualify as "negative" and for the life of me I cannot understand the need for the "Steve Perry Anti-Defamation League" to come charging to Perry's defense every time some writer fails to genuflect.

And here's something else to think about: Believe it, or not, there really are people out here who are looking for informative and insightful grown-up discussions on Perry and his professional career. Isn't that the true nature of MR?

To add to your points, there are some people out there who simply do not like Perry's voice or his style of singing. The fact is, when they think of someone who epitomizes a style they do not care for they think of Perry. That still illustrates Perry's success....

[*Laura]

I cannot understand the need for the "Steve Perry Anti-Defamation League" to come charging to Perry's defense every time some writer fails to genuflect.

This is not about a writer who failed to genuflect. The guy's opinion about Perry is immature to say the least. It's cheap sarcasm toward a singer who is labeled by the vast majority as one of the best singers in history. If someone wants to criticize Perry they'd better do it with valid arguments not kindergarten adjectives.
I believe this is the reason why the "Anti-Defamation League", as you (sarcastically ) name it, reacts to this particular situation.

[jrnyman28]

I cannot understand the need for the "Steve Perry Anti-Defamation League" to come charging to Perry's defense every time some writer fails to genuflect.

This is not about a writer who failed to genuflect. The guy's opinion about Perry is immature to say the least. It's cheap sarcasm toward a singer who is labeled by the vast majority as one of the best singers in history. If someone wants to criticize Perry they'd better do it with valid arguments not kindergarten adjectives.I believe this is the reason why the "Anti-Defamation League", as you (sarcastically ) name it, reacts to this particular situation.

He is not criticizing Perry. He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance. These two articles have NOTHING to do with Perry...

[*Laura]

He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance.

Of course he does. He made his opinion about Perry quite clear with just one word (or three). I'm guessing that if he'd write an entire article about Perry it wouldn't be a positive one. But sure, it's his (personal) opinion...Not that it reflects the majority's or the objective truth, but he has the pen and the paper, no?

[stevew2]

He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance.

Of course he does. He made his opinion about Perry quite clear with just one word (or three). I'm guessing that if he'd write an entire article about Perry it wouldn't be a positive one. But sure, it's his (personal) opinion...Not that it reflects the majority's or the objective truth, but he has the pen and the paper, no?

Nice pose, and awesome rack

[steveo777]

He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance.

Of course he does. He made his opinion about Perry quite clear with just one word (or three). I'm guessing that if he'd write an entire article about Perry it wouldn't be a positive one. But sure, it's his (personal) opinion...Not that it reflects the majority's or the objective truth, but he has the pen and the paper, no?

Nice pose, and awesome rack

Exactly
More pics!

[JasonD]

He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance.

Of course he does. He made his opinion about Perry quite clear with just one word (or three). I'm guessing that if he'd write an entire article about Perry it wouldn't be a positive one. But sure, it's his (personal) opinion...Not that it reflects the majority's or the objective truth, but he has the pen and the paper, no?

Nice pose, and awesome rack

Exactly
More pics!

Steve & Steve-------- !!!!! What are you guys thinking?

No lady wants to hear you say, "Awesome rack." That's tacky!!!!!

[steveo777]

He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance.

Of course he does. He made his opinion about Perry quite clear with just one word (or three). I'm guessing that if he'd write an entire article about Perry it wouldn't be a positive one. But sure, it's his (personal) opinion...Not that it reflects the majority's or the objective truth, but he has the pen and the paper, no?

Nice pose, and awesome rack

Exactly
More pics!

Steve & Steve-------- !!!!! What are you guys thinking?

No lady wants to hear you say, "Awesome rack." That's tacky!!!!!

Jason, sometimes the truth IS tacky, son.

[Jubilee]

I cannot understand the need for the "Steve Perry Anti-Defamation League" to come charging to Perry's defense every time some writer fails to genuflect.

This is not about a writer who failed to genuflect. The guy's opinion about Perry is immature to say the least. It's cheap sarcasm toward a singer who is labeled by the vast majority as one of the best singers in history. If someone wants to criticize Perry they'd better do it with valid arguments not kindergarten adjectives.I believe this is the reason why the "Anti-Defamation League", as you (sarcastically ) name it, reacts to this particular situation.

He is not criticizing Perry. He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance. These two articles have NOTHING to do with Perry...

Agreed. But alas, there's just no getting through to the Sisters of the Perpetual Outrage. He never said he thought Perry was a poor singer, an overrated singer, or even a less than adequate singer. He makes no comment on Perry's voice/talent at all. All this fiddle-dee-dee over the writers use of the word "squawker" instead of "frontman"? Seriously? Perry is not made of glass. Neither the man, nor his reputation are in jeopardy here.

[*Laura]

I cannot understand the need for the "Steve Perry Anti-Defamation League" to come charging to Perry's defense every time some writer fails to genuflect.

This is not about a writer who failed to genuflect. The guy's opinion about Perry is immature to say the least. It's cheap sarcasm toward a singer who is labeled by the vast majority as one of the best singers in history. If someone wants to criticize Perry they'd better do it with valid arguments not kindergarten adjectives.I believe this is the reason why the "Anti-Defamation League", as you (sarcastically ) name it, reacts to this particular situation.

He is not criticizing Perry. He is using his opinion to exemplify another performance. These two articles have NOTHING to do with Perry...

Agreed. But alas, there's just no getting through to the Sisters of the Perpetual Outrage. He never said he thought Perry was a poor singer, an overrated singer, or even a less than adequate singer. He makes no comment on Perry's voice/talent at all. All this fiddle-dee-dee over the writers use of the word "squawker" instead of "frontman"? Seriously? Perry is not made of glass. Neither the man, nor his reputation are in jeopardy here.

Sister Mary here from Operation Mindcrime. So to you the term "squawker" is not a comment/opinion about Perry's voice, eh? Like I said in the other thread about the same article writer, "squawker" is used in the same vein as "battered seal" - a cheap shot at SP's voice.

Okay, so let's say David Cook is a guitar player instead of a singer and this article writer throws in Neal Schon's name like this: "( the later solo albums of Journey's cheesy ukulele player Neal Schon)". I'm sure that Schon's fans would be thrilled to read that and would not comment against the writer's obvious point. Right.

I don't know, Jubilee... I'm guessing that your problem is not with the Perry jab in itself but with the people who think that Perry doesn't deserve to be labeled like that. Hence the many "Leagues" and "Sororities" that you have come up with when we were simply talking about the usage of certain terms.
Yes, Perry is not made of glass but you are pretty much transparent.

[Jubilee]

Sister Mary here from Operation Mindcrime. So to you the term "squawker" is not a comment/opinion about Perry's voice, eh? Like I said in the other thread about the same article writer, "squawker" is used in the same vein as "battered seal" - a cheap shot at SP's voice.

Okay, so let's say David Cook is a guitar player instead of a singer and this article writer throws in Neal Schon's name like this: "( the later solo albums of Journey's cheesy ukulele player Neal Schon)". I'm sure that Schon's fans would be thrilled to read that and would not comment against the writer's obvious point. Right.

I don't know, Jubilee... I'm guessing that your problem is not with the Perry jab in itself but with the people who think that Perry doesn't deserve to be labeled like that. Hence the many "Leagues" and "Sororities" that you have come up with when we were simply talking about the usage of certain terms.
Yes, Perry is not made of glass but you are pretty much transparent.

Transparent? It should be crystal clear by now. Yes, IMHO it is more than a little bizarre that anyone would or even could interpret either of these articles as any sort of knock on Perry.

Using your example with Neal Schon, I believe your analogy is a bit off. Calling Neal Schon a "cheesy ukulele player" is an obvious insult. A more fitting analogy would be if the writer referred to Schon as a "strummer" as opposed to "Rock God". Just because one term is less effusive of praise doesn't make it an insult.

[jrnyman28]

the writers use of the word "squawker" instead of "frontman".

"( the later solo albums of Journey's cheesy ukulele player Neal Schon)".

These two do not equate. "Squawker" would be more equal to "String bender" and I see nothing wrong with that either. The fact is you are applying your assumptions on everyone else. You are the one who deems "squawker" to be negative. While it is equally possible that it is simply a term for "singer". Certain birds "squawk" and to many of "us" is might sound unattractive...but among that birds species it could be considered a beautiful mating call. It's a matter of perspective.

Now, I will cede that this writer has shown a negative opinion of Perry because there are TWO references. If this were the only one I would shoot that down completely. But, the point still remains that this article is not about Perry. "Squawker" is being used to describe someone and actually so is "Steve Perry". They are reference points to help the writer describe what he hears to people reading his article and unable to hear for himself.

[Don]