Kevin Shirley - Again

[steveo777]

... if they were smart, they would ask Perry to produce it. He knows the true Journey sound better than anyone.

Something I've preached for years. There's no reason why Perry can't still be in the band, just not on stage.


later~

He could probably teach AP the finer points of being Steve Perry. Maybe they could do that halogram act like Elvis, where it would show Perry's mug and have AP's voice. And before a bunch of people get their panties in a bunch or sand in their clams, yes, I'm fucking kidding.

[Saint John]

This might sound fucking crazy (because it is!), but a four disc package, 2 albums and 2 Blu-Ray DVDs, would sell like motherfucking hotcakes. You put the new Journey album in there, the new Perry material (which would require him actually making a decision and recording the material!) and a Blu-Ray DVD of the ROR tour and a Blu-Ray DVD of the Manila show. All of the fans win.

This would showcase the band and Steve Perry, and get the back catalog churning like a hot dick in Elton John's ass. Wal Mart would win big with the back catalog and the exclusive 4 disc package. The media would eat this alive. I can't think of a band ever co-releasing something with an ex-singer. This package would sell like 25 cent cucumbers in a convent.

[RumTumJM]

Journey has used recorded backing vocals for some time. I don't think anyone has a beef with that. ( I was addressing RumTum)

Thanks for the clarification about that, but I was aware of the backing vocals with Journey. I was asking more so about Def Leppard. I constantly hear "They use pipped vocals" & "They do not". For every fans that insists they do, there seems to be a video of Sav or someone denying it. To me they sound live (sans a handful of vocals effects like echo, sustain etc.)

I just wasn't sure if Deano or someone else has definitive knowledge. I sure hope they would not use blatant live vocals like Journey did. If they did, I hope it will be less next time around. Elliott is finally getting a year off in 2010.

[Journey/Survivor]

I'd rather see Elson again but have no problem w/ Shirley.

Agreed. I'd rather see Elson back in the producers chair for the next Journey album.

[Jana]

This might sound fucking crazy (because it is!), but a four disc package, 2 albums and 2 Blu-Ray DVDs, would sell like motherfucking hotcakes. You put the new Journey album in there, the new Perry material (which would require him actually making a decision and recording the material!) and a Blu-Ray DVD of the ROR tour and a Blu-Ray DVD of the Manila show. All of the fans win.

This would showcase the band and Steve Perry, and get the back catalog churning like a hot dick in Elton John's ass. Wal Mart would win big with the back catalog and the exclusive 4 disc package. The media would eat this alive. I can't think of a band ever co-releasing something with an ex-singer. This package would sell like 25 cent cucumbers in a convent.

Sounds crazy.

I say a live album with songs from tour from 2008 and 2009, making it a two-disk deal.

[Eric]

Journey has used recorded backing vocals for some time. I don't think anyone has a beef with that.

No one is talking bg vox Steve. That is no big deal either. I wish they only used bg vox and I could still be a fan. It's sad for me really, because they're music was so great...but now it's just tarnished and frankly that's unfair to Steve Perry, who had nothing to do with the bad in the band, only the good.

Their music is still good. I can understand how you're hurt, but they're doing it right now at least.

[Eric]

Loved Shirley's production on TBF.....Revelation CD and DVD especially were fine.

Wasn't happy with GH-Live (fireworks track.....UGH), Arrival (can you say muddy) or DVD 2001 (weird 5.1 mix - no center).

[lights1961]

This might sound fucking crazy (because it is!), but a four disc package, 2 albums and 2 Blu-Ray DVDs, would sell like motherfucking hotcakes. You put the new Journey album in there, the new Perry material (which would require him actually making a decision and recording the material!) and a Blu-Ray DVD of the ROR tour and a Blu-Ray DVD of the Manila show. All of the fans win.

This would showcase the band and Steve Perry, and get the back catalog churning like a hot dick in Elton John's ass. Wal Mart would win big with the back catalog and the exclusive 4 disc package. The media would eat this alive. I can't think of a band ever co-releasing something with an ex-singer. This package would sell like 25 cent cucumbers in a convent.

why not this journey package...as long as your going crazy...

DVD's from each Journey singer that has been in the band... you have the Dallas DVD that has never been released...30 year annivsersary tour...featuring Augeri, you have maybe captured or
Frontiers tour that could be out there somewhere... then you have Arnel and last year tour... plus throw in a DVD from 2006 and JSS...

[kgdjpubs]

plus throw in a DVD from 2006 and JSS...

Don't think anything was professionally filmed on that tour--or in the short 2007 JSS tenure.

[Don]

The professionally filmed pieces I have bootlegs of that haven't been released are from Sound Stage in 78, Osaka in 1980, Tokyo in 81, and Budokan in 83. I know the Dallas show can be downloaded somewhere as I saw it on jamtothis.com awhile back. It was two DVDs worth of footage but I just never felt the urge to get it and the seeding on it was pisspoor anyway.
While a decent boot, the JSS fronted show in Omaha is the only video I have of his tenure in the band and is obviously not pro-shot. The Chile boot with Arnel isn't bad but not as good as the Sony shoots from the 80s which ended up being used for MTV videos when that network first aired in 81.

[Jeremey]

I really don't think you're going to see any more releases of re-recorded material, and certainly won't see anything Sony-owned by the current Journey (any DVD or footage up until 2001)...That release would only come from Sony and from the "Perry" side of the legal fence.

I'm skeptical that you'll see a concept album by Journey either. Neal has lots of ideas, but there's a pretty fine filter that those go through before Journey releases a finished product.

I think the only way to replicate the success of the 1,000,000+ copies of Revelation sold will be to have another CD of original material, and then a CD of Journey covering material well suited for Arnel's voice, such as Journey covering Aerosmith, Led Zep, Stryper, etc. I think the Pinoy fanbase could push the sales of that product through the roof.

[Don]

I really don't think you're going to see any more releases of re-recorded material, and certainly won't see anything Sony-owned by the current Journey (any DVD or footage up until 2001)...That release would only come from Sony and from the "Perry" side of the legal fence.

I'm skeptical that you'll see a concept album by Journey either. Neal has lots of ideas, but there's a pretty fine filter that those go through before Journey releases a finished product.

I think the only way to replicate the success of the 1,000,000+ copies of Revelation sold will be to have another CD of original material, and then a CD of Journey covering material well suited for Arnel's voice, such as Journey covering Aerosmith, Led Zep, Stryper, etc. I think the Pinoy fanbase could push the sales of that product through the roof.

I was thinking the same thing about the DVDs. Sony and Journey don't seem to be on the same page there. I was thinking about a cover disc also, since everyone else has tried that it seems. Bon Jovi definitely likes to mix them in with their lives shows but has stayed away from recording them outright. Perhaps the royalty issue? I noticed Heart stays away from a lot of their hits that were penned by others when they tour. For them though, maybe that's a personal thing.
The problem with covers is they have to pretty much straight up interpretations so as not to be considered derivative works in which case you need permission from the songwriters. Does Neal really want to do straight up covers of another guitarist's music?

[steveo777]

I really don't think you're going to see any more releases of re-recorded material, and certainly won't see anything Sony-owned by the current Journey (any DVD or footage up until 2001)...That release would only come from Sony and from the "Perry" side of the legal fence.

I'm skeptical that you'll see a concept album by Journey either. Neal has lots of ideas, but there's a pretty fine filter that those go through before Journey releases a finished product.

I think the only way to replicate the success of the 1,000,000+ copies of Revelation sold will be to have another CD of original material, and then a CD of Journey covering material well suited for Arnel's voice, such as Journey covering Aerosmith, Led Zep, Stryper, etc. I think the Pinoy fanbase could push the sales of that product through the roof.

I was thinking the same thing about the DVDs. Sony and Journey don't seem to be on the same page there. I was thinking about a cover disc also, since everyone else has tried that it seems. Bon Jovi definitely likes to mix them in with their lives shows but has stayed away from recording them outright. Perhaps the royalty issue? I noticed Heart stays away from a lot of their hits that were penned by others when they tour. For them though, maybe that's a personal thing.
The problem with covers is they have to pretty much straight up interpretations so as not to be considered derivative works in which case you need permission from the songwriters. Does Neal really want to do straight up covers of another guitarist's music?

Probably not, but you have to admit there are a lot of previous hits out there that could certainly benefit from Neal's guitar work.

[Don]

I really don't think you're going to see any more releases of re-recorded material, and certainly won't see anything Sony-owned by the current Journey (any DVD or footage up until 2001)...That release would only come from Sony and from the "Perry" side of the legal fence.

I'm skeptical that you'll see a concept album by Journey either. Neal has lots of ideas, but there's a pretty fine filter that those go through before Journey releases a finished product.

I think the only way to replicate the success of the 1,000,000+ copies of Revelation sold will be to have another CD of original material, and then a CD of Journey covering material well suited for Arnel's voice, such as Journey covering Aerosmith, Led Zep, Stryper, etc. I think the Pinoy fanbase could push the sales of that product through the roof.

I was thinking the same thing about the DVDs. Sony and Journey don't seem to be on the same page there. I was thinking about a cover disc also, since everyone else has tried that it seems. Bon Jovi definitely likes to mix them in with their lives shows but has stayed away from recording them outright. Perhaps the royalty issue? I noticed Heart stays away from a lot of their hits that were penned by others when they tour. For them though, maybe that's a personal thing.
The problem with covers is they have to pretty much straight up interpretations so as not to be considered derivative works in which case you need permission from the songwriters. Does Neal really want to do straight up covers of another guitarist's music?

Probably not, but you have to admit there are a lot of previous hits out there that could certainly benefit from Neal's guitar work.

That could make the song a derivative work if Neal puts his own spin on it. Look at DSB and the issue with Simon, The only reason Journey had the ability to block the release was because McElderry's version was going to change the melody and other parts of the music. If Simon wanted to (and it may still happen) he could just have Joe release a straight cover version without worrying about permission. That's the difference between a compulsory license where all you need to do is pay royalties. If Neal rearranged a guitar solo to show his own signature, he would have to have permission from the original writers/ publishers. where as if he leaves it as it was originally done, he doesn't need to do anything except pay royalties for x-amount of discs sold.

Now, I've just managed to talk myself out of the plausibility of the whole thing.

We know there is one Aerosmith song they will not be covering regardless.
I don't want to miss a thing (Diane Warren)

[RockitRide]

My vote for producer is Dennis Ward. The latest Sunstorm CD has that absolutely perfect big rock production. The drums and all vocals have tremendous power, something that Revelation completely lacked. Revelation does not have that big sound. House of Dreams sounds awesome cranked on a good system. I don't care for "live sounding" studio CD's. They always suck. If I want live I will get a live CD.

[slucero]

I'd rather see them work with someone like Mutt Lange... Mike Shipley.... Chris Lord Alge

They need a more modern rock sound and those guys have modern label cred that would get them some media play...

[Saint John]

My vote for producer is Dennis Ward. The latest Sunstorm CD has that absolutely perfect big rock production. The drums and all vocals have tremendous power, something that Revelation completely lacked. Revelation does not have that big sound. House of Dreams sounds awesome cranked on a good system. I don't care for "live sounding" studio CD's. They always suck. If I want live I will get a live CD.

Agreed. The sound on Revelation is mediocre at best. It sounded very compressed. It had no fullness or power to it whatsoever.

[steveo777]

I'd rather see them work with someone like Mutt Lange... Mike Shipley.... Chris Lord Alge

They need a more modern rock sound and those guys have modern label cred that would get them some media play...

Yeah and Journey could hire a woman to front the band and sound somewhat like a cross between themselves and Shania Twain.

Does Mutt even do anything anymore?

[FishinMagician]

My vote for producer is Dennis Ward. The latest Sunstorm CD has that absolutely perfect big rock production. The drums and all vocals have tremendous power, something that Revelation completely lacked. Revelation does not have that big sound. House of Dreams sounds awesome cranked on a good system. I don't care for "live sounding" studio CD's. They always suck. If I want live I will get a live CD.

Agreed. The sound on Revelation is mediocre at best. It sounded very compressed. It had no fullness or power to it whatsoever.

ya, It sounds compressed to me too

[slucero]

I'd rather see them work with someone like Mutt Lange... Mike Shipley.... Chris Lord Alge

They need a more modern rock sound and those guys have modern label cred that would get them some media play...

Yeah and Journey could hire a woman to front the band and sound somewhat like a cross between themselves and Shania Twain.

Does Mutt even do anything anymore?

Mutt produced part of Nickelback's Dark Horse album...

* USA: 2x Platinum[18]
* Canada: 5x Platinum[23]
* Australia: 2x Platinum
* New Zealand: Platinum[24]
* UK: Platinum[25]
* Germany: Gold[26]
* Sweden: Gold[27]

He is currently working on Maroon 5's 3rd studio album.

You can diss Mutt all ya want.. but his record of success is unparalleled... and he's a friggin hit songwriting machine, which is what everyone on this board has been bitching about since SmfP left...

And it really doesn't have to be Mutt... it could be Shipley or Chris Lord Alge... or anybody... just use someone NEW... not "new on the scene", just new. They need some new blood.

[sniper16]

i really havnt like much shirley has produced of journey, mutt lange is out of the question because of cost, as for modern sound, dont waste your time, bands like journey are never going to get mass airplay on current rock stations nation wide, maybe a few stations here or there, would love to see them work with michael wagener, esp. if the want a rock sound.he s in nashville

[brywool]

god, PLEASE no covers of Journey or anyone else...
If I want to hear someone else's tunes, I'll buy them.

[Don]

Sometimes, bringing in new blood for recording is good. Case in point, Dark Side Of The Moon. Mix Abby Road Studios with an Engineer named Alan Parsons and you get an album that is still on the charts today, one of the top selling records of all time.

[Tomulator]

This might sound fucking crazy (because it is!), but a four disc package, 2 albums and 2 Blu-Ray DVDs, would sell like motherfucking hotcakes. You put the new Journey album in there, the new Perry material (which would require him actually making a decision and recording the material!) and a Blu-Ray DVD of the ROR tour and a Blu-Ray DVD of the Manila show. All of the fans win.

This would showcase the band and Steve Perry, and get the back catalog churning like a hot dick in Elton John's ass. Wal Mart would win big with the back catalog and the exclusive 4 disc package. The media would eat this alive. I can't think of a band ever co-releasing something with an ex-singer. This package would sell like 25 cent cucumbers in a convent.

That's just crazy.

[slucero]

i really havnt like much shirley has produced of journey, mutt lange is out of the question because of cost, as for modern sound, dont waste your time, bands like journey are never going to get mass airplay on current rock stations nation wide, maybe a few stations here or there, would love to see them work with michael wagener, esp. if the want a rock sound.he s in nashville

I never said they'd get airplay... but Michael Wagner???? Jesus that dudes a friggin' dinosaur too..

I like Shirley.. but its just time for some new blood... hell they have a new singer... why not a new producer too...

[journeyrock]

This might sound fucking crazy (because it is!), but a four disc package, 2 albums and 2 Blu-Ray DVDs, would sell like motherfucking hotcakes. You put the new Journey album in there, the new Perry material (which would require him actually making a decision and recording the material!) and a Blu-Ray DVD of the ROR tour and a Blu-Ray DVD of the Manila show. All of the fans win.

This would showcase the band and Steve Perry, and get the back catalog churning like a hot dick in Elton John's ass. Wal Mart would win big with the back catalog and the exclusive 4 disc package. The media would eat this alive. I can't think of a band ever co-releasing something with an ex-singer. This package would sell like 25 cent cucumbers in a convent.

You put a DVD of the ROR tour in it and it wouldn't matter WHAT else was there, it would sell like (what you said above. )

[jrnyjetster]

god, PLEASE no covers of Journey or anyone else...
If I want to hear someone else's tunes, I'll buy them.

Agreed!

[RockitRide]

My vote for producer is Dennis Ward. The latest Sunstorm CD has that absolutely perfect big rock production. The drums and all vocals have tremendous power, something that Revelation completely lacked. Revelation does not have that big sound. House of Dreams sounds awesome cranked on a good system. I don't care for "live sounding" studio CD's. They always suck. If I want live I will get a live CD.

Agreed. The sound on Revelation is mediocre at best. It sounded very compressed. It had no fullness or power to it whatsoever.

ya, It sounds compressed to me too

Yep, compression is the "best" effect, but consequently it is also the most abused effect. Again, House of Dreams just jumps out my speakers. It would be nice if the next Journey CD had that same impact.

[Don]

Many albums are released with lower volume, allowing a "Remastered Disc" to be released later which fools listeners into believing the new album "sounds brighter" when all that has really been done is just an added increase in the volume level.

[bradwjensen]

Let's hope they have the new album mastered better than Revelation was. Revelation was not mastered that great, ESPECIALLY the 2nd disc, as the sound quality on it was complete shit (not even listenable). Hopefully they will get someone like Bob Ludwig or Tom Coyne to master it..