President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

General Intelligent Discussion & One Thread About That Buttknuckle

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Postby slucero » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:30 am

double damn post...
Last edited by slucero on Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby conversationpc » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:30 am

Saint John wrote:
donnaplease wrote:I guess doctors and nurses should be the next in line for loan forgiveness then,given what we're looking at in the future.


No way. This is just another veiled attempt to subconsciously push government bailout and/or government dependence. You borrow ... you pay. No fucking exceptions; not ever. The American way is education, hard work, savings and responsibility. This sock monkey look-alike president we have is virtually wiping out the final 3 aforementioned qualities that made this country great. I paid off my student loans and it took me 10 years. No complaints and no help. Had there been, I wouldn't have taken it anyway. Pretty simple ... if you have pride.


Sock monkey look-alike?
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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:35 am

conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:
donnaplease wrote:I guess doctors and nurses should be the next in line for loan forgiveness then,given what we're looking at in the future.


No way. This is just another veiled attempt to subconsciously push government bailout and/or government dependence. You borrow ... you pay. No fucking exceptions; not ever. The American way is education, hard work, savings and responsibility. This sock monkey look-alike president we have is virtually wiping out the final 3 aforementioned qualities that made this country great. I paid off my student loans and it took me 10 years. No complaints and no help. Had there been, I wouldn't have taken it anyway. Pretty simple ... if you have pride.


Sock monkey look-alike?


Google image "sock monkey" and it's a dead ringer for Obama. Try "Curious George," too, while you're at it. :lol:
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Postby Michigan Girl » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:36 am

Ehwmatt wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:
donnaplease wrote:

I guess doctors and nurses should be the next in line for loan forgiveness then,given what we're looking at in the future. :?


Absolutely, and it's going to happen in order to fill more positions now that there are going to be 32 million more customers. It's a worthwhile idea, which most countries use that have nationalized health care.


What would really be nice to happen is for the educational model/pathway to becoming a doctor to shift to a quasi-European style model to allow doctors to get to medical school and start learning their craft earlier. It's pretty stupid to make people go through 4 years of science in college just to get to med school. I don't know if it'd be smart to let them come right outta HS, because then you wind up with a bunch of parfait-types running around medical schools thinking they're awesome, but it'd be nice to see if they could switch to a one or two-year intensive science curriculum and MCAT to help people (a) become doctors quicker and (b) not incur the ridiculous 8-year+ debt load of living and tuition loans. I mean really, by the time you finish residency, you're looking at about 10 years of bills. It's terrible.

There's a million permutations on that theme too that I can think of... like requiring a year or two of an internship under practicing medical professionals AND a year of intensive science training+MCAT, etc. The system they have now is just asinine from a financial standpoint. Whatever benefits we get from well-rounded, liberal arts educated doctors is most definitely cancelled out by the absurd process one has to go through.

I'm VERY partial to the internship-first model myself, as I think a LOT of people get into professions like the medical, legal, and accounting fields without knowing what it's really about and for the wrong reasons (eg parents over-encouraging it, greed, misconceptions of the job description, any combination of those factors and more).
Oh...no, no, no, Matty! This may work for a very small fraction of these brilliant minds, but not all!!!
I'm much more comfortable knowing that my physicians are well rounded and well educated.
Why not reduce the cost of med school~ somehow, someway!!! :wink:
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Postby Rockindeano » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:40 am

Oh Cons, WTF is this? 162,000 jobs added in March. Unemployment at 9.7%. Big companies hiring.

Slowly but surely, the economy is recovering.
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Postby Ehwmatt » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:43 am

Michigan Girl wrote:
Ehwmatt wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:
donnaplease wrote:

I guess doctors and nurses should be the next in line for loan forgiveness then,given what we're looking at in the future. :?


Absolutely, and it's going to happen in order to fill more positions now that there are going to be 32 million more customers. It's a worthwhile idea, which most countries use that have nationalized health care.


What would really be nice to happen is for the educational model/pathway to becoming a doctor to shift to a quasi-European style model to allow doctors to get to medical school and start learning their craft earlier. It's pretty stupid to make people go through 4 years of science in college just to get to med school. I don't know if it'd be smart to let them come right outta HS, because then you wind up with a bunch of parfait-types running around medical schools thinking they're awesome, but it'd be nice to see if they could switch to a one or two-year intensive science curriculum and MCAT to help people (a) become doctors quicker and (b) not incur the ridiculous 8-year+ debt load of living and tuition loans. I mean really, by the time you finish residency, you're looking at about 10 years of bills. It's terrible.

There's a million permutations on that theme too that I can think of... like requiring a year or two of an internship under practicing medical professionals AND a year of intensive science training+MCAT, etc. The system they have now is just asinine from a financial standpoint. Whatever benefits we get from well-rounded, liberal arts educated doctors is most definitely cancelled out by the absurd process one has to go through.

I'm VERY partial to the internship-first model myself, as I think a LOT of people get into professions like the medical, legal, and accounting fields without knowing what it's really about and for the wrong reasons (eg parents over-encouraging it, greed, misconceptions of the job description, any combination of those factors and more).
Oh...no, no, no, Matty! This may work for a very small fraction of these brilliant minds, but not all!!!
I'm much more comfortable knowing that my physicians are well rounded and well educated.
Why not reduce the cost of med school~ somehow, someway!!! :wink:


Reducing cost is not going to happen, not on the undergrad or medical school level. You can only learn so much from books, anyway. They'll "learn" a lot by being down in the trenches in the internship.

Anyway, I have 2 close friends in medical school and 3 close friends in dental school right now. They had to sit there and take all kinds of (difficult) pointless science classes that they'll never use in their profession.

The well-rounded argument is a good one and one I'm certainly sympathetic too, but at the end of day, taking some bullshit English class and an Economics class isn't going to make any one a better physician. In other words, they didn't really take that many other classes. It was mostly just class after class of tough science/science labs. It might make them better people, but at the end of the day, the cost and process of medical school has gotten so ridiculous that practical concerns must trump. Something has to give at some point with the absurd system they have in place. All it is is a way of weeding people out throughout undergrad through hard science classes and a lot of time investment because they're too lazy to come up with more hands-on models.

A much better way to weed people out would be to condense all the toughest and most on-point science into a year or two of education, and most importantly, show them what it really is like to be a doctor before they commit to doing something they don't wanna do for 4 years and six figures of tuition in undergrad... or even worse, they realize it after a year or two of med school.
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Postby hoagiepete » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:43 am

President Clinton did a lot of things right, but he was one lucky SOB. How many presidents had an internet explosion from which to reap economic benefits? This was a once in a lifetime thing. He also rode the real estate bubble that everyone new was going to burst...just happened to happen during GW's term.

Like a QB...way too much emphasis is put on the president anyway when it comes to the economy. There are too many other factors... Congress, economic cycles, etc.

I love California and many Californians. San Diego is one of my favorite cities anywhere. Love San Francisco and the wine country. Pebble Beach and the Monterrey Pennisula :shock: , holy crap!!! With all that it has going for it...how could it go broke? They were going broke long before the most recent downturn in the economy. And why are people now leaving?
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Postby Lula » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:44 am

Loan forgiveness was in place before Obama took office. There have been some changes like income based repayment which is based on a cap at 15% I believe. These things aren't exactly advertised you have to seek programs out.

Work study is also an opportunity to gain experience in a chosen field. I worked for one of my professors in the English dept.
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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:51 am

Rockindeano wrote:Oh Cons, WTF is this? 162,000 jobs added in March. Unemployment at 9.7%. Big companies hiring.

Slowly but surely, the economy is recovering.


:lol: :lol: :lol: ... 1/4 of these are census worker positions. Besides, most analysts predicted the number would surpass 200,000. And you forgot this:

"More than 6.5 million Americans have been unemployed for six months or longer--a record high, the data showed."

Here you go. Here's absolute proof that because of this scumbag we have in office, people are becoming lazier, have no ambition to work and are sitting on there asses just waiting for their next check to go along with me paying for their free health care:

"The Commerce Department expects to hire at least 600,000 temporary workers this year to staff the 2010 Census survey. Forecasters expected a bump of 100,000 census hires in March. But only 48,000 were hired."

So, people are out of work, and the goverment is offering $17 an hour jobs to do nothing more than fucking count, and these lazy fuckers won't do it? Why should they? Drop unemployment benefits like Bunning suggested and let these motherfuckers sink or swim. I think you'd be surprised how resilient you can be ... when you have to.
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Postby conversationpc » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:53 am

Saint John wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:
donnaplease wrote:I guess doctors and nurses should be the next in line for loan forgiveness then,given what we're looking at in the future.


No way. This is just another veiled attempt to subconsciously push government bailout and/or government dependence. You borrow ... you pay. No fucking exceptions; not ever. The American way is education, hard work, savings and responsibility. This sock monkey look-alike president we have is virtually wiping out the final 3 aforementioned qualities that made this country great. I paid off my student loans and it took me 10 years. No complaints and no help. Had there been, I wouldn't have taken it anyway. Pretty simple ... if you have pride.


Sock monkey look-alike?


Google image "sock monkey" and it's a dead ringer for Obama. Try "Curious George," too, while you're at it. :lol:


How about this one...

Image

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Postby Rockindeano » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:53 am

LOL, you are home and not working today I see. :lol:

I am going to the track....getting ready to become rich overnight so I can start voting conservative republican after I hit the Pick 6. :D

I noticed Suzie didn't offer me up that meaty fastball out over the plate last night. I swear to God I was waiting for it for hours, loaded for bear dude.. :)
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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:55 am

Rockindeano wrote:LOL, you are home and not working today I see.


I'm off today for Good Friday ... company paid. And, for the record, I write the work days down on my full desk calendar. I have worked 64 straight days this year (that's every one, btw). I still have all 15 vacation days remaining. 8) Additionally, I have never taken off a work day for being sick. Not one day ever. :)
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Postby conversationpc » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:01 am

Saint John wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:LOL, you are home and not working today I see.


I'm off today for Good Friday ... company paid. And, for the record, I write the work days down on my full desk calendar. I have worked 64 straight days this year (that's every one, btw). I still have all 15 vacation days remaining. 8) Additionally, I have never taken off a work day for being sick. Not one day ever. :)


Never? Have you gone to work sick? I was off sick yesterday. Pisses me off when people come to work sick instead of staying home. Ends up making productivity lower if people are either working sick or get sick because of someone else coming in and spreading it around.
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Postby lights1961 » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:06 am

conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:LOL, you are home and not working today I see.


I'm off today for Good Friday ... company paid. And, for the record, I write the work days down on my full desk calendar. I have worked 64 straight days this year (that's every one, btw). I still have all 15 vacation days remaining. 8) Additionally, I have never taken off a work day for being sick. Not one day ever. :)


Never? Have you gone to work sick? I was off sick yesterday. Pisses me off when people come to work sick instead of staying home. Ends up making productivity lower if people are either working sick or get sick because of someone else coming in and spreading it around.[/quote

if our employees are sick, we want them to stay home...we only have 15 employees in the office... it sucks when they work while sick, because the illness gets passed around to all of us...which is even worse.


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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:14 am

conversationpc wrote:Never?


Never.


conversationpc wrote:Have you gone to work sick?


A few times. I had an upper respiratory infection for 3 weeks last winter that was awful. It took 4 medications being taken simultaneously to get rid of it. I'm very courteous about staying away from people and not polluting the air when I'm sick, but I will never take off unless I'm hospitalized. Never. I use my "vacation days" for just that ... vacationing!


conversationpc wrote:I was off sick yesterday. Pisses me off when people come to work sick instead of staying home.


Pisses me off when people are whiny pussies about someone being sick at work ... so I guess we're even. :lol:


conversationpc wrote:Ends up making productivity lower if people are either working sick or get sick because of someone else coming in and spreading it around.


Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:
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Postby conversationpc » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:20 am

Saint John wrote:Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:


Build pissed off coworkers more than it does character. I only ever take sick days when I'm actually sick. This was actually the first sick day I've used in nearly two years for myself. Other than that, I only use sick time for dental/doctor appointments and when I have to take my daughter to appointments.
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Postby slucero » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:29 am

Rockindeano wrote:Oh Cons, WTF is this? 162,000 jobs added in March. Unemployment at 9.7%. Big companies hiring.

Slowly but surely, the economy is recovering.



The expectation was 200,000 jobs Deano...


Subtract the 48,000 Census workers form the 162,000 and the real number is....... 114,000


The numbers are being managed not to make them look the best they can but for what the market will tolerate. Thus the reason they down played the census hiring, to make the private sector hiring "look" better. Not so much to justify raising interest rates (at least not much) but enough to continue the illusion that things are getting better and the end is in sight. Of course, that $333 Billion of net Government borrowing in March 2010 has no consequences because things are getting better. :roll:

The real measure of unemployment... the U-6 number (which includes everyone) went up again... for the 3rd consecutive month...

The trend is rising unemployment... according to the government's own numbers...
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Postby Gin and Tonic Sky » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:41 am

conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:


Build pissed off coworkers more than it does character. I only ever take sick days when I'm actually sick. This was actually the first sick day I've used in nearly two years for myself. Other than that, I only use sick time for dental/doctor appointments and when I have to take my daughter to appointments.


thing is , when the sickness hits you you actuallly have passed the contageous stage. What you actually need to do is take the sick day before the sickness hits you.- so its kind of guess work . Just call into the office and say Im have no hard and fast evidence, but I think Im "incubating" and take the day off! an ounce of preventin is worth a pound of cure!
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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:48 am

conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:


Build pissed off coworkers more than it does character. I only ever take sick days when I'm actually sick. This was actually the first sick day I've used in nearly two years for myself. Other than that, I only use sick time for dental/doctor appointments and when I have to take my daughter to appointments.


I was just busting your balls, Dave. That's the only time I've been sick in 4 years, excluding ear infections, which pose no threat to others.
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Postby conversationpc » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:53 am

Saint John wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:


Build pissed off coworkers more than it does character. I only ever take sick days when I'm actually sick. This was actually the first sick day I've used in nearly two years for myself. Other than that, I only use sick time for dental/doctor appointments and when I have to take my daughter to appointments.


I was just busting your balls, Dave. That's the only time I've been sick in 4 years, excluding ear infections, which pose no threat to others.


Fortunately, my balls are not sore. :lol:
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Postby Rockindeano » Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:13 am

Saint John wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:


Build pissed off coworkers more than it does character. I only ever take sick days when I'm actually sick. This was actually the first sick day I've used in nearly two years for myself. Other than that, I only use sick time for dental/doctor appointments and when I have to take my daughter to appointments.


I was just busting your balls, Dave. That's the only time I've been sick in 4 years, excluding ear infections, which pose no threat to others.


Hey Dan, you didn't give me any props about going to work heavily intoxicated, the last time we hung out in Santa Monica, remember that doozy? I couldn't see straight, let alone talk at all. I fucked up everything that night. :oops:
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Postby Rockindeano » Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:15 am

Fact Finder wrote:Wife and I are self-employed and neither of us has had a sick day off in 22 years. We've been sick, strep throat, an occasional cold or stomach bug, but damnit, shit needs done and we somehow do it. We also only take major holidays off and usually 1 week of va-ca a year, excluding last years trip to England for our Daughters Wedding and that was 12 days. I insisted on being back on a Wednesday flight so we wouldn't loose Thursday and Fridays income. I just couldn't stand the thought of losing two full weeks of pay. :wink:


Props to you FF. I like the great work ethic. I am off now going on 2 months, but hey if I can't walk, I can't physically do my job.
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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:27 am

Rockindeano wrote:
Saint John wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:


Build pissed off coworkers more than it does character. I only ever take sick days when I'm actually sick. This was actually the first sick day I've used in nearly two years for myself. Other than that, I only use sick time for dental/doctor appointments and when I have to take my daughter to appointments.


I was just busting your balls, Dave. That's the only time I've been sick in 4 years, excluding ear infections, which pose no threat to others.


Hey Dan, you didn't give me any props about going to work heavily intoxicated, the last time we hung out in Santa Monica, remember that doozy? I couldn't see straight, let alone talk at all. I fucked up everything that night. :oops:


Dude, that was admirable. We drank heavily that night. Man, that was fun. Between you and your Liquid Ass and me calling Kobe Bryant a rapist in a room full of about 200 Lakers fans, what a great night of drinking! :lol:
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Postby Rockindeano » Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:34 am

Saint John wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:
Saint John wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Saint John wrote:Working through adversity and toughing out being sick builds character! :lol:


Build pissed off coworkers more than it does character. I only ever take sick days when I'm actually sick. This was actually the first sick day I've used in nearly two years for myself. Other than that, I only use sick time for dental/doctor appointments and when I have to take my daughter to appointments.


I was just busting your balls, Dave. That's the only time I've been sick in 4 years, excluding ear infections, which pose no threat to others.


Hey Dan, you didn't give me any props about going to work heavily intoxicated, the last time we hung out in Santa Monica, remember that doozy? I couldn't see straight, let alone talk at all. I fucked up everything that night. :oops:


Dude, that was admirable. We drank heavily that night. Man, that was fun. Between you and your Liquid Ass and me calling Kobe Bryant a rapist in a room full of about 200 Lakers fans, what a great night of drinking! :lol:


I am getting a couple more bottles of Liquid Ass. I will send you one..Spray down your office early in the a.m., and I bet the boss calls off work for the day. It festers and lingers for countless hours. What you should do is spray it in Tito's car, roll up the windows and let it bake in the sun all day. He will heave chunks for hours upon hours. He won't be able to drive that heap of shit for days. :) :)
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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:47 am

Rockindeano wrote:I am getting a couple more bottles of Liquid Ass. I will send you one..Spray down your office early in the a.m., and I bet the boss calls off work for the day. It festers and lingers for countless hours. What you should do is spray it in Tito's car, roll up the windows and let it bake in the sun all day. He will heave chunks for hours upon hours. He won't be able to drive that heap of shit for days. :) :)


We were flying through those $2 sixteen ounce beers faster than Pete Rose betting exactas at Santa Anita. :lol: I just remember being on the 3rd Street Promenade and realizing I was wasted. I can't imagine having to go to work like that! :lol: :shock:
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Postby donnaplease » Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:57 am

Saint John wrote:
donnaplease wrote:I guess doctors and nurses should be the next in line for loan forgiveness then,given what we're looking at in the future.


No way. This is just another veiled attempt to subconsciously push government bailout and/or government dependence. You borrow ... you pay. No fucking exceptions; not ever. The American way is education, hard work, savings and responsibility. This sock monkey look-alike president we have is virtually wiping out the final 3 aforementioned qualities that made this country great. I paid off my student loans and it took me 10 years. No complaints and no help. Had there been, I wouldn't have taken it anyway. Pretty simple ... if you have pride.


I have no problem with loan forgiveness in certain circumstances. And some people do take advantage of those simply to get that forgiveness. I know we have a TEACH grant in Virginia, which is a grant for education majors, and if they will work in one of the underserved areas (either geographical or in positions such as spEd) that it will continue to be a grant. However, if they do not, then it converts to a loan. Just doing it to get out of a student loan is a piss-poor reason to do it, though. The teacher and the students suffer, IMO.

I think there already are some of those things in place for doctors and nurses as well. I'm just concerned that with the changes that we're looking at (as healthcare providers) the demand is going to FAR outweigh the supply in certain areas. There has been research in years past that we will be seeing a MAJOR nursing shortage in the future as it is. There aren't enough nursing instructors as it currently stands. I have many colleagues who have waited for a few years to even get admitted into a college clinicals program. Of course, if the desire to enter the field shrinks, perhaps there will be less of a wait. Who knows....
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Postby 7 Wishes » Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:21 am

There's nothing like getting "data" from the Heritage Foundation when it comes to unencumbered, unbiased information. Sort of like getting your "news" from Glenn Beck.

Anyway, if you want to arm-wrestle about defecits, let's start talking about Ronnie Reagan (don't forget that while the defecit tripled under his watch, the economy, which had been growing at 4%, grew at a meager 2.5% as trickle-down failed miserably).
But around town, it was well known...when they got home at night
Their fat and psychopathic wives
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Postby donnaplease » Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:51 am

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Postby Saint John » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:03 pm

7 Wishes wrote:There's nothing like getting "data" from the Heritage Foundation when it comes to unencumbered, unbiased information. Sort of like getting your "news" from Glenn Beck.

Anyway, if you want to arm-wrestle about defecits, let's start talking about Ronnie Reagan (don't forget that while the defecit tripled under his watch, the economy, which had been growing at 4%, grew at a meager 2.5% as trickle-down failed miserably).


Reagan's "deficit" allowed 200 million people to sleep better at night as the USSR crumbled and we became the lone super power. There hasn't been a better or more important president than Reagan, probably since Kennedy.
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Postby Rockindeano » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:25 pm

Dan, went to the track today. Saw a horse in the 7th named Rummysecretwar. I loved his works and form. he was at 14-1 and I put 8 across on him. I later walked up and CANCELED my ticket on the SOB in favour of a horse at 4-1 named General Dan. Race runs...Rummy gets the money. You do the math. I lost a bucket full of money on General Dan. Oh and I had Rummy keyed in the exacta, which paid 112.60 for a 1 dollar exacta. I originally had a 4 dollar exacta ticket, and....CANCELED it too. 450 bucks lost on the exacta bet and about 240 on the across the board bet lost for a total of 730 bucks..Oh man I was sick. Did I mention that General Dan shit the bed? Fucker ran dead last..cocksucker. I heckled the shit out of him when he trotted past the rail seats on his way to the barn.

Moral of the story, Rummy has fucked me more ways than a two bit whore.
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Rockindeano
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