FEDERAL JUDGE knocks down PRO 8 in CA...

[BobbyinTN]

Moral disapproval is an improper basis for denying rights to gay men and lesbians and that the evidence shows conclusively Prop 8 enacts without reason a private moral view that same sex couples are inferior.--- Vaughn Walker--Chief Judge, U.S. District Court, Northern District of CA



That's why this Supreme Court will have an incredible time over ruling Judge Walker's decision. The man is a genius.

[BobbyinTN]

Bullcrap...I'm not a fan of Limbaugh and never listen to his show but I do listen to Beck.

I do too, not by choice... my boss runs talk radio all day in the office... In fact, it's on now. LOL

Some other show on the same channel was hot on this issue yesterday... and my boss and I do NOT see eye to eye on it (she's conservative, I'm not), so one of us will make a comment, then we start debating... this has been going on for two days.

So do you work for a private company Bluejeangirl? What do the other employees think about her pushing Glenn Beck on them?

[Angel]

I find myself very conflicted in this subject. Based on my own religious beliefs I think marriage should be between a man and a woman. Those beliefs lead me to feel that if I were to support same sex marriage I would be supporting something that I don't believe is right. On the other hand, my religion also teaches me that I should not judge another person-that is not my job. This leads me to believe that NOT supporting same sex marriage is in some way judging another person. I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

[conversationpc]

Bullcrap...I'm not a fan of Limbaugh and never listen to his show but I do listen to Beck.

I do too, not by choice... my boss runs talk radio all day in the office... In fact, it's on now. LOL

Some other show on the same channel was hot on this issue yesterday... and my boss and I do NOT see eye to eye on it (she's conservative, I'm not), so one of us will make a comment, then we start debating... this has been going on for two days.

So do you work for a private company Bluejeangirl? What do the other employees think about her pushing Glenn Beck on them?

She didn't say her boss was PUSHING Glenn Beck on them. If it's like my office, whether I'm playing music or listening to talk radio, I'm not pushing it on anyone but they may be able to hear it if they are near my office walking by or just popping in to speak with me.

[bluejeangirl76]

Bullcrap...I'm not a fan of Limbaugh and never listen to his show but I do listen to Beck.

I do too, not by choice... my boss runs talk radio all day in the office... In fact, it's on now. LOL

Some other show on the same channel was hot on this issue yesterday... and my boss and I do NOT see eye to eye on it (she's conservative, I'm not), so one of us will make a comment, then we start debating... this has been going on for two days.

So do you work for a private company Bluejeangirl? What do the other employees think about her pushing Glenn Beck on them?

Ok, calm down there, killer. She isn't pushing Beck on anyone. We share an office, and she likes to have the radio on, it's seriously no big deal. I don't really care one way or another what kind of programming she has running. She has her views, I have mine, and no amount of radio talk show is going to change how I feel.

[RedWingFan]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

[Angel]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

[BobbyinTN]

Bullcrap...I'm not a fan of Limbaugh and never listen to his show but I do listen to Beck.

I do too, not by choice... my boss runs talk radio all day in the office... In fact, it's on now. LOL

Some other show on the same channel was hot on this issue yesterday... and my boss and I do NOT see eye to eye on it (she's conservative, I'm not), so one of us will make a comment, then we start debating... this has been going on for two days.

So do you work for a private company Bluejeangirl? What do the other employees think about her pushing Glenn Beck on them?

She didn't say her boss was PUSHING Glenn Beck on them. If it's like my office, whether I'm playing music or listening to talk radio, I'm not pushing it on anyone but they may be able to hear it if they are near my office walking by or just popping in to speak with me.

Well, I was just thinking if it was being pumped throughout the office building, that would be wrong. But what she plays in her office is her business. Obviously it doesn't bother BJG, so that's cooler than cool.

[BobbyinTN]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

That's complete and utter bullshit hyperbole. If minors and adults were gonna marry, they didn't need homosexuals to lead the way. As a matter of fact, years ago it was perfectly fine for a minor to marry an adult, just watch Coal Miner's Daugther and even today, a parent can consent and let their child marry anyone they wish to marry, older, younger or the same age.

[BobbyinTN]

I find myself very conflicted in this subject. Based on my own religious beliefs I think marriage should be between a man and a woman. Those beliefs lead me to feel that if I were to support same sex marriage I would be supporting something that I don't believe is right. On the other hand, my religion also teaches me that I should not judge another person-that is not my job. This leads me to believe that NOT supporting same sex marriage is in some way judging another person. I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Good for you Angel, that's the way it should be. My religious views or your religious views should not hamper our right to be treated equally and fairly under the law.

[BobbyinTN]

Bullcrap...I'm not a fan of Limbaugh and never listen to his show but I do listen to Beck.

I do too, not by choice... my boss runs talk radio all day in the office... In fact, it's on now. LOL

Some other show on the same channel was hot on this issue yesterday... and my boss and I do NOT see eye to eye on it (she's conservative, I'm not), so one of us will make a comment, then we start debating... this has been going on for two days.

So do you work for a private company Bluejeangirl? What do the other employees think about her pushing Glenn Beck on them?

Ok, calm down there, killer. She isn't pushing Beck on anyone. We share an office, and she likes to have the radio on, it's seriously no big deal. I don't really care one way or another what kind of programming she has running. She has her views, I have mine, and no amount of radio talk show is going to change how I feel.

Good, I was about to go all Norma Rae on them. LOL

[bluejeangirl76]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Why are there people thinking that if gays are allowed to legally marry, it's going to open the door for adults marrying minors, people marrying their dogs, and all kind of other doomsday scenarios?

We're talking about consenting adults being allowed to marry each other regardless of each others gender. I mean come on.... did straight marriage start up a movement for people wanting to marry their neighbors kid or their pet goat? No.

The difference is, there are still age restrictions imposed on marriage, and I'm sure it would apply to gay marriage also, so where is this idea coming from that immediately people are going to want to start marrying minors? p.s. - that already goes on anyway.

[BobbyinTN]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Why are there people thinking that if gays are allowed to legally marry, it's going to open the door for adults marrying minors, people marrying their dogs, and all kind of other doomsday scenarios?

We're talking about consenting adults being allowed to marry each other regardless of each others gender. I mean come on.... did straight marriage start up a movement for people wanting to marry their neighbors kid or their pet goat? No.

The difference is, there are still age restrictions imposed on marriage, and I'm sure it would apply to gay marriage also, so where is this idea coming from that immediately people are going to want to start marrying minors? p.s. - that already goes on anyway.

A-Men!

[RedWingFan]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

I didn't miss it.
You just said, "it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right". You saying your against civil rights of minors? Look into NAMBLA Natalie, the effort's already well underway. If you wave goodbye to right and wrong, they're gone in all cases.

[Angel]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

I didn't miss it.
You just said, "it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right". You saying your against civil rights of minors? Look into NAMBLA Natalie, the effort's already well underway. If you wave goodbye to right and wrong, they're gone in all cases.

Yes, I guess I am saying I'm against civil rights for minors if it means allowing an older person to coerce them into marriage. You're comparing apples to oranges, Scott.

[RedWingFan]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

I didn't miss it.
You just said, "it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right". You saying your against civil rights of minors? Look into NAMBLA Natalie, the effort's already well underway. If you wave goodbye to right and wrong, they're gone in all cases.

Yes, I guess I am saying I'm against civil rights for minors if it means allowing an older person to coerce them into marriage. You're comparing apples to oranges, Scott.

Why argue? We're just Americans whose votes don't count anyway. It's up to Liberal Federal activist judges anyway. Take comfort in agreeing on them with this one Nat. When the next barrier falls and you don't agree with it, you have no right to complain!
http://www.nambla.org/

[StevePerryHair]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

I didn't miss it.
You just said, "it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right". You saying your against civil rights of minors? Look into NAMBLA Natalie, the effort's already well underway. If you wave goodbye to right and wrong, they're gone in all cases.

I don't find that necessarily true that saying goodbye to one thing being right or wrong means they're all gone. When dealing with religion, many things are considered sins. Some minor some more major. I still have a free thinking brain and I can see certain things as being definitely wrong, but maybe some other things more understandable. It really depends on how judgemental a person is. I really have a feeling people judge each other way more harshly than God may. All religion and sin are open for interpretation based on how you interpret the bible. I can certainly judge that what 2 consenting adults do is not the same as some sex act being forced on a minor. Just as I can see the difference between a rape and premarital sex in heterosexuals. There are some sins that can be judged less severely. You can't lump them all. And I don't know if I even consider homosexuality a sin. I believe they are born that way and why would God make them that way? And if it is, then I choose to just love them anyway. It's between them and their maker.

[Angel]

Why argue? We're just Americans whose votes don't count anyway. It's up to Liberal Federal activist judges anyway. Take comfort in agreeing on them with this one Nat. When the next barrier falls and you don't agree with it, you have no right to complain!
http://www.nambla.org/

Scott, you're not even making sense. Adults marrying minors is a totally different subject. In the case of same sex marriages you are talking about two adults who have both reached a level of maturity that they are able to make choices about their future-including marriage. In most cases they are living together-not married-yet perfectly happy-they just want to have the benefit of marriage for a variety of reasons.

On the other hand an adult marrying a minor you have one person (the minor) who is still in the developmental stages of reaching maturity. They are not capable of understanding the consequences of their decisions-therefore they are not ready to make these decisions. Making the jump from legalizing same sex marriages to allowing adults to marry children is not even close to the same thing.

[bluejeangirl76]

Making the jump from legalizing same sex marriages to allowing adults to marry children is not even close to the same thing.

No, it's definitely not.

Ummmm.... what about polygamist compunds and people who go to states with lower age restrictions to get around it, or kids who lie about their age because a parent won't give permission.... and so on? Adults marrying minors is something that already goes on... how is allowing gays the right to legal marriage going to pave the way for it if it's already been happening for a very long time?

The arguments against it keep getting more entertaining. Some people seem to feel the Earth is going to open up and eat itself if we allow gays to say "I do". And there's always some awful scenario presented... "Well if we allow GAYS to MARRY *gasp!*, then what's next? Where do we draw the line! Next thing you know the Hot Air Balloon Flyers Club of Southern New Mexico will want the right to fellate sheep in their balloon baskets!" Christ almighty.

You know what would change? Nothing.

[RedWingFan]

Why argue? We're just Americans whose votes don't count anyway. It's up to Liberal Federal activist judges anyway. Take comfort in agreeing on them with this one Nat. When the next barrier falls and you don't agree with it, you have no right to complain!
http://www.nambla.org/

On the other hand an adult marrying a minor you have one person (the minor) who is still in the developmental stages of reaching maturity.

Tell that to the unelected Federal judge that will impose it on this country.

Screw the votes, screw the amendment process, screw the Constitution. Like I said, you'll have no right to complain. "Who are you to decide if it's wrong or right" or some such thing. We're living in a soft tyranny and you don't even see that as the real issue.

[S2M]

Ok...I guess this is the hot topic du jour...not Fair Tax. So I'll weigh in....

I don't care what anybody does...I don't care if you're gay, retarded, a midget, dumb, deaf, or blind....as long as what YOU are, or CHOOSE to be doesn't infringe on MY life....have at it folks.

[BobbyinTN]

I would like to see a compromise, whereby homosexuals are given 'separate but equal' rights (don't like that term for historical reasons, but it serves the purpose here), just call it something other than 'marriage'. It would accomplish what most gays would like legally, but it would preserve the sanctity of marriage for those that have strong personal and/or religious beliefs in that regard.

would that be acceptable to you? Would you be satisfied with a 'civil union' if it would grant you the things you asked for above?

Yes. Seems like a perfect compromise to me.

I agree with Saint John Bobby, i do not feel any hate from anyone here hon.But i do feel it from you.I am sorry and i am sure its not easy for you either.And for hate i don't think anyone hates you here.I know i don't i am sure you are a good & kind man. But you need to get rid of the hate hon.And i know you will come back with something.Stand your ground but without all the hate hon.

The only people I "hate" are bigots. Nobody has to like me, but nobody should be allowed to vote on my rights.

Let me correct that for you.

" nobody should vote for my rights unless they're voting to my likings and for my best "


Even if you were straight , you'd still be a hateful selfish bastard , finding something else to bitch about. That's the truth.

Fuck you and your judgmental opinions.

You bring your opinions to the table with that much hatred , you're just making yourself look like an ass. You're the Mel Gibson of MR. Mel Gaybson , Sorry

Once again, it's not your homosexuality that I'm judgmental about. It's your anger , hatred and hypocrisy

I'm grateful that you're gay cause this way , a wife is saved from a wifebeater.

You have no idea what you're talking about. Anger is called for in some cases and your opinion of me doesn't matter. All that matters is equality. And if I were anything like Mel Gibson, you'd already be missing teeth.


I'm finished with you.

Quit bragging about your dick size....it can't be THAT big....

LMAO! It is and that hard too. LOL

[BobbyinTN]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

I didn't miss it.
You just said, "it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right". You saying your against civil rights of minors? Look into NAMBLA Natalie, the effort's already well underway. If you wave goodbye to right and wrong, they're gone in all cases.

People like you have been warning about "NAMBLA " for years now and nothing, NOT A THING has happened for the good of that organization. It's a group of pedophiles and if they are caught engaging in those acts, they are arrested. They have nothing to do with the homosexual community. AND, if you want to talk perverts, since the gay, lesbian, transgendered and bi community is at best 12% of the population, that means there's millions more heterosexual perverts than there are homosexual ones.


By the way, what do you NOT understand about consenting adults and the law of equal marriage?

[BobbyinTN]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

I didn't miss it.
You just said, "it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right". You saying your against civil rights of minors? Look into NAMBLA Natalie, the effort's already well underway. If you wave goodbye to right and wrong, they're gone in all cases.

Yes, I guess I am saying I'm against civil rights for minors if it means allowing an older person to coerce them into marriage. You're comparing apples to oranges, Scott.

Why argue? We're just Americans whose votes don't count anyway. It's up to Liberal Federal activist judges anyway. Take comfort in agreeing on them with this one Nat. When the next barrier falls and you don't agree with it, you have no right to complain!
http://www.nambla.org/

So, did you also have a problem with those judges appointed George W. Bush President? Is it only republican judges you want on the bench?

[BobbyinTN]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Did you miss the part where I said between "consenting adults?" Marriage between adults and minors is a whole different ball game because minors are not mature enough to make a decision about marriage.

I didn't miss it.
You just said, "it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right". You saying your against civil rights of minors? Look into NAMBLA Natalie, the effort's already well underway. If you wave goodbye to right and wrong, they're gone in all cases.

I don't find that necessarily true that saying goodbye to one thing being right or wrong means they're all gone. When dealing with religion, many things are considered sins. Some minor some more major. I still have a free thinking brain and I can see certain things as being definitely wrong, but maybe some other things more understandable. It really depends on how judgemental a person is. I really have a feeling people judge each other way more harshly than God may. All religion and sin are open for interpretation based on how you interpret the bible. I can certainly judge that what 2 consenting adults do is not the same as some sex act being forced on a minor. Just as I can see the difference between a rape and premarital sex in heterosexuals. There are some sins that can be judged less severely. You can't lump them all. And I don't know if I even consider homosexuality a sin. I believe they are born that way and why would God make them that way? And if it is, then I choose to just love them anyway. It's between them and their maker.

Beautiful!

[bluejeangirl76]

Bobby, why do you press enter 40 times before typing your reply? I've been wondering that for 2 days.

[Angel]

Bobby, why do you press enter 40 times before typing your reply? I've been wondering that for 2 days.

haha, me too, but I already commented on his quoting so I didn't say anything about it-I wouldn't want Bobby to think I was pickin' on him!!

[BobbyinTN]

Making the jump from legalizing same sex marriages to allowing adults to marry children is not even close to the same thing.

No, it's definitely not.

Ummmm.... what about polygamist compunds and people who go to states with lower age restrictions to get around it, or kids who lie about their age because a parent won't give permission.... and so on? Adults marrying minors is something that already goes on... how is allowing gays the right to legal marriage going to pave the way for it if it's already been happening for a very long time?

The arguments against it keep getting more entertaining. Some people seem to feel the Earth is going to open up and eat itself if we allow gays to say "I do". And there's always some awful scenario presented... "Well if we allow GAYS to MARRY *gasp!*, then what's next? Where do we draw the line! Next thing you know the Hot Air Balloon Flyers Club of Southern New Mexico will want the right to fellate sheep in their balloon baskets!" Christ almighty.

You know what would change? Nothing.

They're the same arguments they had when the miscegenation laws where being debated and everyone was going to hell when women wanted to vote and the whole world was gonna be destroyed when women started preaching in the churches. It's the Frankenstein's Monster Mob Mentality, kill it now, ask questions later. They never learn and never want to learn.

[BobbyinTN]

Bobby, why do you press enter 40 times before typing your reply? I've been wondering that for 2 days.

My computer jumps when there's a lot of quotes at the top and that's the only way I can type and read it. Usually I'm tryping blind because the box is jumping each time I type a letter.

[Behshad]

I think in the end, not judging others wins so I support marriage between two consenting adults-I don't have to think it's right but in the end it's not my position to decide if it's wrong or right.

Be prepared to make the same statement about relationships and marriages between adults and minors. After this barrier is broken, that's next....watch!

Why are there people thinking that if gays are allowed to legally marry, it's going to open the door for adults marrying minors, people marrying their dogs, and all kind of other doomsday scenarios?

We're talking about consenting adults being allowed to marry each other regardless of each others gender. I mean come on.... did straight marriage start up a movement for people wanting to marry their neighbors kid or their pet goat? No.

The difference is, there are still age restrictions imposed on marriage, and I'm sure it would apply to gay marriage also, so where is this idea coming from that immediately people are going to want to start marrying minors? p.s. - that already goes on anyway.

Next you see people want to vote for who is considered CONSENTING ADULTS and want to change it to 14+ or some this like that ,,, No one said that it will happen immidiately,,,, but if there are changes being made and there are laws being bent to fit some people, then other groups will push for what they personally categorize as their pursuit of happiness.