Revelation Re-records

[Jana]

Personally I don't care in general for re-recordings of any kind. To me it's just the current incarnation of the bands trying to push a few more cds out to unsuspecting consumers who might see something like Revelation and see new music plus a GH cd. The only thing is instead of getting the GH songs they know they get songs that aren't up to par with the originals.

I don't think the general customer cares one way or the other. Otherwise, the Glee cds, which are poor recordings of the songs done by people who had no association with them whatsoever in the first place, wouldn't sell at all. If the average listener can't tell the difference between Perry, Augeri, Arnel and whoever, I don't think they would care one way or the other if an Arnel version came on the radio instead of the tried-and-true Perry original.

I find it funny how we've had this whole topic of discussion on the re-recording of the classic Perry songs, yet the new matierial for Revelation relies on 2/13 tracks being written and released from another Journey album and there isn't any discussions as to what versions are better.

The honest answer as I see it is that people don't care about the non-Perry songs. If it wasn't recorded by Perry, it doesn't matter. One could make the honest debate that the Perry versions of some of the Infinity material (Anytime, Winds of March, Wheel in the Sky?) are cover versions as Journey was playing them live with Robert Fleischman on vocals before Perry was even part of the picture.

The re-recording of Place in Your Heart might be a bit better, but I agree with other than the raw energy of the Augeri Faith in the Heartland wasn't matched.


I've seen a few covers that are better than the original, some that are average, and some that do a pretty good job of ruining what was a good song. For a lot of people here though, it's simply a travesty to touch the original songs. The way I see it is that the original recordings didn't go anywhere. It's no more a travesty to redo a recording substituting Arnel for Perry than it is to remix and remaster the songs--they were recorded in a certain way on purpose. If you change that, you are changing the original vision of the songs. I refuse to get worked up about it, but it seems most do exactly that if Perry was involved.

I've had a couple of friends I've given Revelation to that like the rerecords. But they're not Journey fans, so looked at the second disk as nice. Like you said, the general public doesn't care. It's the Journey fans who aren't interested, because they have the originals.

Here's one remake that is better to me. And I love Bowie but I thought this cover was excellent. It was done on an album paying tribute to Bowie's music by many other musicians and on TFF's B side album. So the song is sung in the same vein.

Ashes to Ashes = David Bowie - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyMm4rJemtI

Ashes to Ashes - Roland Orzabal - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6qlM49b5Uc

[Michigan Girl]

It's not about another singer/band covering a band/song, it's about a band
covering their own legacy songs/sound w/another singer ...regardless of
the reason or the band, imo. Fans who don't have a preference/care, really can't be
considered "fans" of the band/songs and probably won't listen to either, anyway!!

[kgdjpubs]

It's not about another singer/band covering a band/song, it's about a band
covering their own legacy songs/sound w/another singer ...regardless of
the reason or the band, imo. Fans who don't have a preference/care, really can't be
considered "fans" of the band/songs and probably won't listen to either, anyway!!

the way I look at it is this....I think I listened to the actual cd of re-records once or twice. Nothing wrong with them, and some might be technically better played, but I have no real reason to dig it out. If it came out on it's own, I probably wouldn't buy it. The live dvd is more useful--and makes a great cd to listen to in the car. I bought the album for the new material, and anything else was just a bonus.

The original Perry recordings are out there. The remastered Perry recordings are out there. The live Perry recordings are out there. What's the fuss all about?

[Onestepper]

I heard the Separate Ways remake at a bar. It was good. Not better than the original. But good for a remake.

That is all.

[Michigan Girl]

It's not about another singer/band covering a band/song, it's about a band
covering their own legacy songs/sound w/another singer ...regardless of
the reason or the band, imo. Fans who don't have a preference/care, really can't be
considered "fans" of the band/songs and probably won't listen to either, anyway!!

the way I look at it is this....I think I listened to the actual cd of re-records once or twice. Nothing wrong with them, and some might be technically better played, but I have no real reason to dig it out. If it came out on it's own, I probably wouldn't buy it. The live dvd is more useful--and makes a great cd to listen to in the car. I bought the album for the new material, and anything else was just a bonus.

The original Perry recordings are out there. The remastered Perry recordings are out there. The live Perry recordings are out there. What's the fuss all about?

Oh, I don't like the idea or the songs. I'm sure they had
their reasons, they are their songs, it is their band ...
but I care as much about that as they care about
me and my feelings ...that's all!!
I'm glad my mom got a new birth certificate for ea. new little
sister that she brought home, you know, instead of
replacing the name ea. time ...that would've hurt!!
Just an opinion, Kevin ...but your points are, almost always, excellent!!

[kgdjpubs]

It's not about another singer/band covering a band/song, it's about a band
covering their own legacy songs/sound w/another singer ...regardless of
the reason or the band, imo. Fans who don't have a preference/care, really can't be
considered "fans" of the band/songs and probably won't listen to either, anyway!!

the way I look at it is this....I think I listened to the actual cd of re-records once or twice. Nothing wrong with them, and some might be technically better played, but I have no real reason to dig it out. If it came out on it's own, I probably wouldn't buy it. The live dvd is more useful--and makes a great cd to listen to in the car. I bought the album for the new material, and anything else was just a bonus.

The original Perry recordings are out there. The remastered Perry recordings are out there. The live Perry recordings are out there. What's the fuss all about?

Oh, I don't like the idea or the songs. I'm sure they had
their reasons, they are their songs, it is their band ...
but I care as much about that as they care about
me and my feelings ...that's all!!
I'm glad my mom got a new birth certificate for ea. new little
sister that she brought home, you know, instead of
replacing the name ea. time ...that would've hurt!!
Just an opinion, Kevin ...but your points are, almost always, excellent!!

Don't get me wrong. I'd be up in arms if the original versions went away (like the Ozzy songs that replaced the bass/drums on the original songs with new recordings), but the originals are still out there. You didn't lose anything--you just gained something that, admittedly, few people wanted. That's why I'm confused. Clear as mud?

[parfait]

I heard the Separate Ways remake at a bar. It was good. Not better than the original. But good for a remake.

That is all.

Thank you for those insightfull words. Thank you.

[Saint John]

People get way too fucking caught up with the concept of "originals." People here get nuts, as if they own the songs. You can't really own something that isn't physical. I think there's some sort of flawed misconception that re-recording a few songs is going to somehow erase history and what these songs mean to you. "Ownership" is in your heart and the associated memories. Nothing can change that. Besides, I don't hear anyone lobbying for the original versions of Any Way You Want It or The Winds Of March by Robert Fleischman. Probably because both versions of both songs suck. Blech.

[Michigan Girl]

hmmmm ...I don't think I'm going nuts, but it's certainly possible!!
You have also expressed some very valid, and touching, points ...hats off!!
I feel the way I feel ...although, I will say, it's not as bad as I initially thought ...
I never hear the re's like I was afraid I would!!!

[Don]

I heard the Separate Ways remake at a bar. It was good. Not better than the original. But good for a remake.

That is all.

The weird thing with that is it's the songwriters that are getting money from the licensing royalties for these public area type of uses. I don't think using the re-records lower the licensing fees these guys pay to ASCAP/BMI, and in a club setting only a few diehard fans might notice it's Pineda, not Perry so what's the point?

It's obviously not like your getting a totally different take on the songs like the Glee version of DSB, or having a female singer on Open Arms instead of a male; it's just poorly produced copycat versions done so Wal-Mart could sell a multi-disc package with out dealing with Sony, purely a business product more than an attempt to create a new musical experience with the classic versions.

[kgdjpubs]

hmmmm ...I don't think I'm going nuts, but it's certainly possible!!

around here, I'd change "certainly possible" to "highly likely verging towards indisputable fact".

[annie89509]

People get way too fucking caught up with the concept of "originals." People here get nuts, as if they own the songs. You can't really own something that isn't physical. I think there's some sort of flawed misconception that re-recording a few songs is going to somehow erase history and what these songs mean to you. "Ownership" is in your heart and the associated memories. Nothing can change that. Besides, I don't hear anyone lobbying for the original versions of Any Way You Want It or The Winds Of March by Robert Fleischman. Probably because both versions of both songs suck. Blech.

eh, Dan....RF never sang AWYWI...it's a Steve-Neal written song and recorded in the Departure album (1980).
Now... Robert did sing WOM...and WITS...and Anytime.... but SP was better...that's why he got the gig to record with Journey. As far as the public is concerned, Steve did sing the "originals" of those songs.

[Rick]

People get way too fucking caught up with the concept of "originals." People here get nuts, as if they own the songs. You can't really own something that isn't physical. I think there's some sort of flawed misconception that re-recording a few songs is going to somehow erase history and what these songs mean to you. "Ownership" is in your heart and the associated memories. Nothing can change that. Besides, I don't hear anyone lobbying for the original versions of Any Way You Want It or The Winds Of March by Robert Fleischman. Probably because both versions of both songs suck. Blech.

eh, Dan....RF never sang AWYWI...it's a Steve-Neal written song and recorded in the Departure album (1980).
Now... Robert did sing WOM...and WITS...and Anytime.... but SP was better...that's why he got the gig to record with Journey. As far as the public is concerned, Steve did sing the "originals" of those songs.

I'm sure he meant Wheel In The Sky.

[portland]

People get way too fucking caught up with the concept of "originals." People here get nuts, as if they own the songs. You can't really own something that isn't physical. I think there's some sort of flawed misconception that re-recording a few songs is going to somehow erase history and what these songs mean to you. "Ownership" is in your heart and the associated memories. Nothing can change that. Besides, I don't hear anyone lobbying for the original versions of Any Way You Want It or The Winds Of March by Robert Fleischman. Probably because both versions of both songs suck. Blech.

eh, Dan....RF never sang AWYWI...it's a Steve-Neal written song and recorded in the Departure album (1980).
Now... Robert did sing WOM...and WITS...and Anytime.... but SP was better...that's why he got the gig to record with Journey. As far as the public is concerned, Steve did sing the "originals" of those songs.

Nice Annie.......

[Saint John]

eh, Dan....RF never sang AWYWI

Like Rick said, I meant Wheel In The Sky.

Robert did sing WOM...and WITS...and Anytime.... but SP was better..

That's an opinion, but what's not an opinion is that the songs are not Perry originals.

As far as the public is concerned, Steve did sing the "originals" of those songs.

Pretty stupid logic. I think Pineda sings circles around Perry on Open Arms and Only The Young, but I'll never think, argue or imply that he's the "original" singer.

[FamilyMan]

No problem. Hmm, I don't really want to ask about your whole experience with Journey, mostly for fear of the unknown, as I REALLY don't want to look at my heroes differently than I already do... (long story about my love for them, won't bore you with it). But I AM a little curious about the the backstory of the Wal-Mart re-records... I doubt that whatever you may say about them will change my liking of them, for me it's Arnel ONLY that keeps me listening to those.

Wal Mart approached Journey to do rerecords while Augeri was still in the band. Some in the Journey camp were worried that with JSS in the band things may not work out. However, I was told by people IN THE BAND that JSS and Journey did perform a concert with greatest hits for people in the Wal Mart camp and they were still going to move forward with the idea. Neal definitely wanted to make the CD a package of rerecords with a few new songs on it. At the time I was with (around) Journey, there was still uncertainty about the idea because the band knew WM would want video promotion of the package, and everyone from management down to the band itself was worried that Steve Perry would not sign off on allowing video promotion of the disc. During the time I was still involved with the band, Neal was pushing to do a CD of original material along with the rerecords. I was pushing Jonathan to do a disc of rearrangements, acoustic style arrangements, different ways of presenting the songs. After I was pretty much on the outs with Journey, Jonathan and Neal continued to write new songs, and the concept became a new CD with a double edition of straight up rerecords to make the suits at WM happy.

And that's the fucking truth.

I love when Jeremey is drunk.

[timstar78]

For the most part, I thought the re-recordings were well-done as far as these type of things go. (KISS', on the other hand, were terrible.)

Generally I am not a fan of re-recordings of classic songs, but understand the business behind them.

I enjoy "Stone In Love" the most probably, but can't say that I find myself listening to the disc that much as a whole. I do like the studio album disc of "Revelation," however.

[Don]

For the most part, I thought the re-recordings were well-done as far as these type of things go. (KISS', on the other hand, were terrible.)

Generally I am not a fan of re-recordings of classic songs, but understand the business behind them.

I enjoy "Stone In Love" the most probably, but can't say that I find myself listening to the disc that much as a whole. I do like the studio album disc of "Revelation," however.

You don't find that the production is extremely weak? Listen to both discs back to back (Well, skip NWA, the production on that is garbage also, a shame as that may be one of the best new songs they have done). There seems to be a big difference on what Shirley did with Disc one and what Cain attempted on Disc Two.

[timstar78]

For the most part, I thought the re-recordings were well-done as far as these type of things go. (KISS', on the other hand, were terrible.)

Generally I am not a fan of re-recordings of classic songs, but understand the business behind them.

I enjoy "Stone In Love" the most probably, but can't say that I find myself listening to the disc that much as a whole. I do like the studio album disc of "Revelation," however.

You don't find that the production is extremely weak? Listen to both discs back to back (Well, skip NWA, the production on that is garbage also, a shame as that may be one of the best new songs they have done). There seems to be a big difference on what Shirley did with Disc one and what Cain attempted on Disc Two.

Sure...let me clarify. Sonically, I think the re-records leave much to be desired. (I believe I even hear a click track in the intro to "Open Arms.")

Performance-wise, I thought the band played the songs well. In comparison, KISS' re-records are a sloppy mess in terms of not only sonics, but lethargic performances (and Paul Stanley's awful pitch-corrected vocals on a few tracks.)