MR ECLIPSE SHOWCASE

[Don]

I think some of the folks here need to stick to Raised On Radio.

There's a good chance they will and this album ends up selling less than Arrival. Doesn't mean it's a bad record, it's just the majority of Journey fans need their ballad fix and this record isn't going to provide that.

[Michigan Girl]

I wish someone could go back and find the Revelation
review/opinion thread/threads ...it'd be interesting
to see what everyone thought then and
compare it to the most recent Revelation
thread, pun intended!!

I like reading the different viewpoints pertaining to Eclipse, as well ...

[Don]

I wish someone could go back and find the Revelation
review/opinion thread/threads ...it'd be interesting
to see what everyone thought then and
compare it to the most recent Revelation
thread, pun intended!!

Revelation was three discs for 12 bucks and the added selling point of listening to someone else's vocal take on the classics. This album is 12 songs for ten bucks and so far, no samples on Wal-Mart's site to give any of the casual fans who don't frequent fan-sites an idea of what they are buying.

It's really a different ballgame this time around.

[Saint John]

I wish someone could go back and find the Revelation
review/opinion thread/threads ...it'd be interesting
to see what everyone thought then and
compare it to the most recent Revelation
thread, pun intended!!

I like reading the different viewpoints pertaining to Eclipse, as well ...

I think most people conceded that Revelation was a safe introduction to the new singer. Especially having the Walmart mandated re-records, Journey had to craft the music to a much more familiar formula. Now that the fans have accepted Arnel, the band has decided to parlay that popularity and take some chances. And that's something virtually everyone swore they would never do. I think if they were artistically bankrupt, money-hungry vultures like so many here claim, you would have seen a re-tread of Revelation, chock full of soft AC ballads and safe Never Walk Away type tunes. But you just don't see them doing that, do you?

[steveo777]

I wish someone could go back and find the Revelation
review/opinion thread/threads ...it'd be interesting
to see what everyone thought then and
compare it to the most recent Revelation
thread, pun intended!!

I like reading the different viewpoints pertaining to Eclipse, as well ...

I think most people conceded that Revelation was a safe introduction to the new singer. Especially having the Walmart mandated re-records, Journey had to craft the music to a much more familiar formula. Now that the fans have accepted Arnel, the band has decided to parlay that popularity and take some chances. And that's something virtually everyone swore they would never do. I think if they were artistically bankrupt, money-hungry vultures like so many here claim, you would have seen a re-tread of Revelation, chock full of soft AC ballads and safe Never Walk Away type tunes. But you just don't see them doing that, do you?

Not so happy, so fast, there sparky. I can't get in witih both feet til I hear the whole product.
My hunch is that it's gonna be great, but I don't wanna be wrong.

[Michigan Girl]

What is the same is that all of the same people were blasting all of the other
same people for not liking that CD like THEY did. All the name calling
and carrying on only to admit later that it was meh, okaaaayy!

Revelation was off of the radar and we were back to discussing/
arguing the classics once again ...The true test for this release will be how long
people talk/argue about this new music, not what everyone
thinks at this moment.

SJ, I don't see them doing anything because I haven't listened to the new
stuff, but when I do, you can bet your sweet bippy you'll be hearing my
point of view!!

[Red13JoePa]

Isn't Lady Gaga coming out the same week?
That can;t bode well.

[VirgilTheart]

What is the same is that all of the same people were blasting all of the other
same people for not liking that CD like THEY did. All the name calling
and carrying on only to admit later that it was meh, okaaaayy!

Revelation was off of the radar and we were back to discussing/
arguing the classics once again ...The true test for this release will be how long
people talk/argue about this new music, not what everyone
thinks at this moment.

SJ, I don't see them doing anything because I haven't listened to the new
stuff, but when I do, you can bet your sweet bippy you'll be hearing my
point of view!!

To be fair though, you have to realize the differences between the music now and the music from the 80s:

1. Radio won't support a band this old, especially when the new material is considerably more progressive than usual. And even the singles from Revelation weren't huge hits because of that.

2. The Perry songs didn't start out as "classics". They were hits certainly, but nostalgia over the years was what elevated those songs to classics. Considering Revelation has only been out for almost three years now, that's a bit of an unfair comparison between songs just because nothing on the album has yet to be considered a "classic".

Just my two cents.

[Michigan Girl]

What is the same is that all of the same people were blasting all of the other
same people for not liking that CD like THEY did. All the name calling
and carrying on only to admit later that it was meh, okaaaayy!

Revelation was off of the radar and we were back to discussing/
arguing the classics once again ...The true test for this release will be how long
people talk/argue about this new music, not what everyone
thinks at this moment.

SJ, I don't see them doing anything because I haven't listened to the new
stuff, but when I do, you can bet your sweet bippy you'll be hearing my
point of view!!

To be fair though, you have to realize the differences between the music now and the music from the 80s:

1. Radio won't support a band this old, especially when the new material is considerably more progressive than usual. And even the singles from Revelation weren't huge hits because of that.

2. The Perry songs didn't start out as "classics". They were hits certainly, but nostalgia over the years was what elevated those songs to classics. Considering Revelation has only been out for almost three years now, that's a bit of an unfair comparison between songs just because nothing on the album has yet to be considered a "classic".

Just my two cents.

It's not going to happen ...here's your change!!

[Deb]

You haven't read much of TNC.
He is a lot of things, among which is probably the most critical of the band among the die-hards who post. If he's enthused he says so, if he hates something, we read about it (in spades) but I think he could give 2 shits less about gathering or derailing the bandwagon.

I may not always agree w/him but I usually like his posts. His, dryer than a popcorn fart, sense of humour cracks me up.

[Majestic]

It's also worth mentioning that Don't Stop Believin', Journey's most recognizable song, not to mention one of the most popular songs in the world, doesn't even really have a (refrain) chorus. So while Journey's known for catchy hooks and choruses, their most famous song, one that almost didn't even make it into Escape, deviates from their usual formula. They took a chance on that song ... just like they're doing with Eclipse. I find it remarkable that people are now complaining that they're not following their normal cookie cutter song structure. These are the same people that were complaining that they followed it too closely on Revelation and didn't take any chances.

Personally, I think this album is for all generations of Journey fans. There are some rockers, some progressive tunes for the early fans, some cool new ballads and some familiar hooks and choruses. Seems to me like they went out of their way to take some chances, yet make sure fans also had some comfortable reminders that it's still Journey.

DSB is a great example of a song that lives off of its hooks. If you really break down the song, where the fuck does the midnight train eventually end up? No one knows .

I know where, you didn't listen to the song carefully enough, Don. The train goes to anywhere.

[Majestic]

Isn't Lady Gaga coming out the same week?
That can;t bode well.

Why not? I can't imagine too many fans of Journey are conflicted between getting new Journey or new Gaga, can you? Pretty different genres, I don't think there should be much competition there. How many Gaga albums do you have? I'm not even sure if I know what she sounds like.

[Red13JoePa]

You haven't read much of TNC.
He is a lot of things, among which is probably the most critical of the band among the die-hards who post. If he's enthused he says so, if he hates something, we read about it (in spades) but I think he could give 2 shits less about gathering or derailing the bandwagon.

I may not always agree w/him but I usually like his posts. His, dryer than a popcorn fart, sense of humour cracks me up.

Suffice it to say being in his cross hairs isn't a fun place to be!
One thing he doesn't do is propogandize his music opinions though.

[Red13JoePa]

Isn't Lady Gaga coming out the same week?
That can;t bode well.

Why not? I can't imagine too many fans of Journey are conflicted between getting new Journey or new Gaga, can you? Pretty different genres, I don't think there should be much competition there. How many Gaga albums do you have? I'm not even sure if I know what she sounds like.

One.
She's awful but the 3 females who operate my house love it.

I like Katy Perry's voice and songs way better.

[Glenn]

Best samples so far, but i am still very unconvinced by this release.
Does seem to have its plus moments though and 'Resonate' certainly seems to be a good one. Liked it the first time i heard it. 'Chain of love' is another one that appeals to me. However, stuff like 'Edge of the moment' goes completely nowhere, and i read someone somewhere class it as the new Separate ways. Absolutely laughable. 'Human feel'? the less i say about that the better.
I shall buy it as its Journey and i need to hear the new release before i see them next month, but whether it will take pride alongside all the other Journey releases in my home, or go the same route as Generations did, (straight in the garbage bin) remains to be seen.

Your loss. Generations represented the band at its lowest- and even it had some very valid stuff on it. Eclipse is Neal literally taking the reigns and actually caring about the end product, and it shows. Every one of these clips sounds like Journey bringing their A-game. No comparison to Generations. Loving the details in the clips. Chain of Love sounds enormous.

Well said....The fact that Genersucknations and Eclipse is even compared/used in thle same sentence made me uncomfortable and nervous.

[Glenn]

I found value in the songs on Red 13 and Generations, but this, to me, only exceeds those releases in production value.

That's insane. You're putting "Butterfly" and "Gone Crazy" in the same league as this new stuff?
Gens was a phoned-in, underproduced piece of crap with Neal hitting the sauce, and his creative attention focused on SoulSirkus.
Eclipse sounds like TBF...superb musicianship and painstakingly-crafted songs.

Augerihead...Nuff said..

[Glenn]

I think some of the folks here need to stick to Raised On Radio.

Maybe so, but I sure know where I'd like to stick Raised On Radio.

[Glenn]

I liked Journey the way they were with big hooks, powerful harmonies and huge choruses and these 3 major factors that made Journey as great as they were seem to be sadly lacking here.

Aside from the Greatest Hits album, the Journey you're speaking of never existed. Where are the non-stop arena anthems to be found on Departure or Infinity? Only Escape and Frontiers featured back-to-back classics. Most J albums have a handful of fist-pumpers and then some lesser material. As it is, I hear plenty of HUGE classic choruses and big hooks on Eclipse. "Anything is Possible", "Someone", "Ritual" - none of these strike you as Journey? If that's the case, it's your loss. Sounds like 100% Journey to me.

Anyway You Want It screams arena anthem to me. So does Wheel In The Sky. Both songs from Departure and Infinity.

Thanks for proving my exact point. That's ONE arena rocker per album. So as I said, the expectation that Eclipse should be chockful of absolutely nothing but big, huge "hooks and choruses" is just dumb. Like previous albums, it's got some of that. Anyone bitching about this new album is a tasteless troll. This, to me, sounds like the best Journey album since Frontiers.

And Anyway You Want It is an 80s anthem. Nice to hear in concert sometimes (not my favorite by any stretch of the imagination), but not exactly what I want to hear recorded in 2011 by a mature band.

Thank you...Though I love 70's and 80's Journey, I live in 2011...And I want to here Journey 2011 style. I don't need to live the past again. No 80's hair, clothes, etc... here.

[Glenn]

What is the same is that all of the same people were blasting all of the other
same people for not liking that CD like THEY did. All the name calling
and carrying on only to admit later that it was meh, okaaaayy!

Revelation was off of the radar and we were back to discussing/
arguing the classics once again ...The true test for this release will be how long
people talk/argue about this new music, not what everyone
thinks at this moment.

SJ, I don't see them doing anything because I haven't listened to the new
stuff, but when I do, you can bet your sweet bippy you'll be hearing my
point of view!!

MG, will this review be 100% objective?

[Glenn]

Edge is my favorite clip wise, that may change when I hear songs in their entirety.

[Deb]

What is the same is that all of the same people were blasting all of the other
same people for not liking that CD like THEY did. All the name calling
and carrying on only to admit later that it was meh, okaaaayy!

Revelation was off of the radar and we were back to discussing/
arguing the classics once again ...The true test for this release will be how long
people talk/argue about this new music, not what everyone
thinks at this moment.

SJ, I don't see them doing anything because I haven't listened to the new
stuff, but when I do, you can bet your sweet bippy you'll be hearing my
point of view!!

Neither have I yet, haven't had time. MB's on tour, waaaay to much LIVE MB to listen to. I'll get around to it eventually too.

[The_Noble_Cause]

And those delusional fans you speak of actually have been comparing this record to those records. I have read quite a few of that on here. "Song 1" is the new DSB or the new "Separate Ways".

So? There's a big difference between comparing a new song to an old classic, and complaining that there are no hooks, or that the music sounds like a different band altogether. You're changing the subject.

Um....the public internet wasn't exactly in its infancy at that point.

Sure it was. YouTube didn't even exist yet. Neither did Itunes. If you wanted to hear a Journey bootleg, you had to download it off Napster or Livewire. The whole reason Deano had to create a blog and post soundbytes of the band lipping, is because there were no sites with audio of the band. Like I said, with the internet expanding, the floodgates have been opened, and every little thing this band does is scrutinized under a microscope. The SA lineup would never have survived.

[steveo777]

What is the same is that all of the same people were blasting all of the other
same people for not liking that CD like THEY did. All the name calling
and carrying on only to admit later that it was meh, okaaaayy!

Revelation was off of the radar and we were back to discussing/
arguing the classics once again ...The true test for this release will be how long
people talk/argue about this new music, not what everyone
thinks at this moment.

SJ, I don't see them doing anything because I haven't listened to the new
stuff, but when I do, you can bet your sweet bippy you'll be hearing my
point of view!!

MG, will this review be 100% objective?

I wouldn't worry about her. She should be pretty fair. Portland, on the other hand would diss anything
non Perry, even if it were solid gold, perfect, studded with a bigger diamond than Texas. LOL

[portland]

What is the same is that all of the same people were blasting all of the other
same people for not liking that CD like THEY did. All the name calling
and carrying on only to admit later that it was meh, okaaaayy!

Revelation was off of the radar and we were back to discussing/
arguing the classics once again ...The true test for this release will be how long
people talk/argue about this new music, not what everyone
thinks at this moment.

SJ, I don't see them doing anything because I haven't listened to the new
stuff, but when I do, you can bet your sweet bippy you'll be hearing my
point of view!!

MG, will this review be 100% objective?

I wouldn't worry about her. She should be pretty fair. Portland, on the other hand would diss anything
non Perry, even if it were solid gold, perfect, studded with a bigger diamond than Texas. LOL

WRONG.........

[koberry]

Do Not Stop Believing?

Affectianately named such after reading it that way in many translated South American concert reviews.

Sounds like an order/demand ...I like it!!

Nah, You will not stop believing is an order. Are we there, yet? I think people will believe in this release only after they own it and give a few spins. I don't know what some people expect! Perry is not in this band, and this is not the 80s with 30 something musicians. Besides, do we really want another Stone in Love or Faithfully? Don't we have them already?

I'd love another Stone in Love. Very, very melodic, major key shredding. Tasty. Ok, maybe the next one shouldn't be about a blue jean girl, tho.

[koberry]

most sounds rock, but the lyrics, especially the verses are terrible.

highlights are

anything is possible
resonate
someone
to whom it may concern
Ritual is good, but once again the chorus goes nowhere.
and the instrumental,

the firsit 4 songs should have been instrumentals too.

You have just echoed exactly how I feel about it as well.

To be fair, Journey hasn't exactly been a thinking man's band when it comes to lyrics throughout the years. "Any way you want it, that's the way you need it, any way you want it"? Rhyming "you" with "you" three times in the Separate Ways chorus?

Journey's had their share of nondescript, ambiguous lyrics over the years. I think what is happening here, is they are trying to actually be taken seriously and it just doesn't work for a lot of folks. Journey can't be who they're not, it's too later in the game to change that.
I think this album is a great musical treat for those of us who wanted the band to just put something out that was predominantly rock as compared to being ballad heavy. Overall, they've achieved that, even if other areas of the record have suffered because of it.

I'm quite okay with a different lyrical approach and attempting to be serious - I heard that in Arrival, too. After all, I was in my teens when I initially became a fan. And the themes that resonated then don't quite the same way anymore.

[NoMoreTails]

I found value in the songs on Red 13 and Generations, but this, to me, only exceeds those releases in production value.

That's insane. You're putting "Butterfly" and "Gone Crazy" in the same league as this new stuff?
Gens was a phoned-in, underproduced piece of crap with Neal hitting the sauce, and his creative attention focused on SoulSirkus.
Eclipse sounds like TBF...superb musicianship and painstakingly-crafted songs.

Augerihead...Nuff said..

I was as big a fan of the Augeri era as anyone here but just based on the clips alone Eclipse is going to blow away Arrival and Gens. I fully expect it to be better than a compliation of the best of them.

[Michigan Girl]

MG, will this review be 100% objective?

I wouldn't worry about her. She should be pretty fair.

Steveo, this is,
perhaps, the most accurately observant statement you’ve ever made …where
I’m concerned, anyway!! I’m certain that in about 2 minutes/seconds you’ll
say something idiotic to ruin the pride I feel for you right now …but credit
where credit is due!! Portland, you can deal with him.

JSSR~ I stated earlier that I would be interested to see the initial
Revelation reviews from this group, myself included. I’m pretty
sure I was either pretty ok with them, or, if I was uncertain, standoffish.
I listened to that CD quite a bit, more than twice for sure. My thoughts today are this,

1) The voice was good/sometimes great …dialect issues aside.
2) The songs/lyrics were mmmm, ok to good, but that’s typical for Journey.
3) Some really good moments with the overall musicianship
4) I won't even touch on the mixing crap because I don't understand
all of that, but people here make sense of it for me.

But, I was bored, I had no desire/urge to listen to these songs.
There was just no connection, the singer was not pulling me in,
he did not make me believe that we had been together for 20/30
years, long enough to have faded photographs…I was shocked to
find out that we had children together, much less a sexual relationship.
I’m hoping with this CD, and AP’s input, I will feel as though he has an
emotional connection to the songs, which will, in turn, pull me in.

I will wait to hear them in full, in order, in my stereo and then I'll
have input ...

[Don]

MG, will this review be 100% objective?

I wouldn't worry about her. She should be pretty fair.

Steveo, this is,
perhaps, the most accurately observant statement you’ve ever made …where
I’m concerned, anyway!! I’m certain that in about 2 minutes/seconds you’ll
say something idiotic to ruin the pride I feel for you right now …but credit
where credit is due!! Portland, you can deal with him.

JSSR~ I stated earlier that I would be interested to see the initial
Revelation reviews from this group, myself included. I’m pretty
sure I was either pretty ok with them, or, if I was uncertain, standoffish.
I listened to that CD quite a bit, more than twice for sure. My thoughts today are this,

1) The voice was good/sometimes great …dialect issues aside.
2) The songs/lyrics were mmmm, ok to good, but that’s typical for Journey.
3) Some really good moments with the overall musicianship
4) I won't even touch on the mixing crap because I don't understand
all of that, but people here make sense of it for me.

But, I was bored, I had no desire/urge to listen to these songs.
There was just no connection, the singer was not pulling me in,
he did not make me believe that we had been together for 20/30
years, long enough to have faded photographs…I was shocked to
find out that we had children together, much less a sexual relationship.
I’m hoping with this CD, and AP’s input, I will feel as though he has an
emotional connection to the songs, which will, in turn, pull me in.

I will wait to hear them in full, in order, in my stereo and then I'll
have input ...

My initial review of Revelation was a 7, based solely on the first disc. A great album usually has 4 or 5 songs that take it over the top; Revelation had two that I liked and a third that I could live with. After three years only one of them, NWA has survived the test of time. What sucks is it suffers in production compared to the other songs and I rarely mix it into any of my playlists because of that.

[Greg]

So? There's a big difference between comparing a new song to an old classic, and complaining that there are no hooks, or that the music sounds like a different band altogether. You're changing the subject.

Look, my whole point is that I'm not as hot for this album as you are. Which is fine. If you think it's the greatest album since Frontiers, good for you. I disagree. I hope there are fans who like this album and support it as they are helping to support the Melodic Rock community. Outside of that, I don't appreciate someone saying that "You are delusional" if one does not like this album. I will shut down that type of douchebagger pretty quickly.

Sure it was. YouTube didn't even exist yet. Neither did Itunes. If you wanted to hear a Journey bootleg, you had to download it off Napster or Livewire. The whole reason Deano had to create a blog and post soundbytes of the band lipping, is because there were no sites with audio of the band. Like I said, with the internet expanding, the floodgates have been opened, and every little thing this band does is scrutinized under a microscope. The SA lineup would never have survived.

Um, the internet did exist long before You Tube and iTunes. The "public internet" had already been out for years by the time of the SA lineup. Hardly an "infancy" stage in terms of computer technology. In fact, the internet itself has been going on since the early 60's. So, no, it was not the "infancy" stage of the internet. True, you didn't have You Tube or iTunes back in the early 2000's, but you did have music services like Yahoo's music service in which you could listen to your favorite band's tunes legally. And as far as Journey goes, there was a Journey Digest in which I was subscribed to back in the late 90's. In fact, that is how I heard about Steve Perry's departure from Journey. And there, of course, was this forum which was in existence before You Tube and during the Steve Augeri years. AND the "lipping" stuff didn't really come out until after You Tube was started anyways. So, you have your facts messed up on this. Apparently you have forgotten those years of the Loons VS the Wigglers.