Eclipse Billboard - Flop

[steveo777]

This album outselling everything in the Walmart stable should cause folks to question why Walmart is even in the music business.

Walmart doesn't have a clue about marketing music and maybe they think they can ride on the coat tails of the names they are selling,
but overall, it looks like they got it wrong this time. It's not just Journey's music. Look around.

They marketed NKOTBSB well enough. The Wal-Mart special edition disc combined with the digital download distribution from Apple, Amazon and Wal-Mart itself, resulted in the New Kids basically cleaning Journey's clock despite only being the inhouse #1 best seller for two days.

Every time I read a post from you, I feel like you are flipping me off (avatar). I've begun to do the same to customers this week. No wonder sales are down.

[Don]

This album outselling everything in the Walmart stable should cause folks to question why Walmart is even in the music business.

Walmart doesn't have a clue about marketing music and maybe they think they can ride on the coat tails of the names they are selling,
but overall, it looks like they got it wrong this time. It's not just Journey's music. Look around.

They marketed NKOTBSB well enough. The Wal-Mart special edition disc combined with the digital download distribution from Apple, Amazon and Wal-Mart itself, resulted in the New Kids basically cleaning Journey's clock despite only being the inhouse #1 best seller for two days.

Every time I read a post from you, I feel like you are flipping me off (avatar). I've begun to do the same to customers this week. No wonder sales are down.

I'm just being passive aggressive. Ask Red13joepa, he'll tell you. It's my nature.

[Jana]

Anybody ever seen the Samuel L. Jackson movie, The Negotiator? How come I feel like if this album doesn't catch fire, somehow, and sell. Cain is going to be the David Morse character, Beck, and say "I'm back in charge" (the part where Samuel Jackson's character leaves the federal building). I see this happening behind the scenes in Journey's camp in a couple of weeks.

Go puff another fatty you stupid sonofabitch.

Yep...Jonathan does not have the balls to lead this or any other band. I can see Journey splitting up and Neal and Jonathan working on solo albums together, and writing for other musicians....but I just don't see how Journey can dig themselves out of this hole.

If that's true, then good for you, I guess.

Not what I wanted, but I've expected ever since the Auger/JSS/Arnel firing, hiring, firing, hiring.

Neal wants the $'s that comes with the Legacy albums along with the musical freedom of Eclipse. He's stated that ever since Arrival. That will never happen...and that is why this band is in serious trouble right now...at least for ever having a major release ever again.

Oh, well, if they never do one again, they put out four releases in 11 years. Three were/are very enjoyable, Arrival, Revelation and Eclipse. Red 13 was just an EP but interesting. And Generations was just a hot mess. But many older bands never put out four albums and an EP in 10 years when they're in their third decade of music. Eclipse is an excellent album, so I can't fault the album, only the promoting.

[Argus]

This band/management should just concentrate on getting some old shows released on DVD.

ROR
Frontiers
Captured
Departure
Evolution
Infinity

then have a reunion tour. I do not think the fans would really care that SP can't sing like he used to. I think the detractors underestimate the fanbase on this one. Journey is best when all parties are collaborating.

I don't underestimate the fanbase. But you always miss the point. It's not that he can't sing like he used to. It's that he doesn't sing live, period, not one song, nothing live for 18 years, not an album for 16 years. The reason they won't ever do a final tour or one-off together is because he will never sing live again imo.

Granted maybe not a concert however -----> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_P-DpMFd8_A

[Jana]

This album outselling everything in the Walmart stable should cause folks to question why Walmart is even in the music business.

Walmart doesn't have a clue about marketing music and maybe they think they can ride on the coat tails of the names they are selling,
but overall, it looks like they got it wrong this time. It's not just Journey's music. Look around.

They marketed NKOTBSB well enough. The Wal-Mart special edition disc combined with the digital download distribution from Apple, Amazon and Wal-Mart itself, resulted in the New Kids basically cleaning Journey's clock despite only being the inhouse #1 best seller for two days.

I always thought that would do good. Two boy bands that were really popular and still have a fanbase combining and putting out all their hits and a few new tunes, from what I read, seemed like a win-win, combing their fan bases to buy this release.

[Don]

I wonder if Journey ever tried to finance that Arnel Doc? A pack-in dvd can make a big difference in sales, just look at what NKOTBSB did. They basically had nothing more than a greatest hits CD.They threw in a DVD and poster and BAM!, they get a top ten release.

[RedWingFan]

Wow. Just wow.

I knew it would be ugly, but not this ugly. I almost feel bad enough for Niel to go out to Walmart and pick up a copy....almost.

I think after Rip gets wind of this he's going to put on a blue smock and start smuggling copies into the carts of unsuspecting customers.

I predicted less than Gold for Revelation, so they did exceed even my expectations. This album ... minimum 500k sold and well over a million worldwide. Probably closer to 1.5 or 2. I'm quite sure Revealtion was over a million worldwide.

[steveo777]

I wonder if Journey ever tried to finance that Arnel Doc? A pack-in dvd can make a big difference in sales, just look at what NKOTBSB did. They basically had nothing more than a greatest hits CD.They threw in a DVD and poster and BAM!, they get a top ten release.

I think if Journey could have crossed all the legal hurdles this would have probably done this long ago.
Perry has probably fought this with enough gusto to make the potential legal ramifications insurmountable.
That's why this has been left to live or die by whatever funds an outsider can muster, which apparently
has not been enough. Ramona Diaz might have enough money to do this herself, if she mortgaged her
life, but even she is not that unrealistic. This film is not viable or practical this late in the story.

[The_Noble_Cause]

The band shot themselves in the foot.

#1. There isn't one song on the album that is radio friendly. Not one song. That kills album sales because no one knows the album is out. They needed 2 Journeyish anthems and a true ballad with this release and it would've been better off.

"Anything is Possible" and "Someone" sound very radio friendly to me. Not sure that it matters. "Higher Place" and "All the Way" were also radio friendly and got limited play (if any).

[The_Noble_Cause]

Not too bad considering that the only promotion for Eclipse came from a few of us here on the site I've talked to a number of pretty passionate Journey fans at work, etc. and none of them had any idea that this was coming out.

Agreed. This album had about as much promotion as Generations. I'm impressed it debuted in the Top 30.

[Maui Tom]

Not too bad considering that the only promotion for Eclipse came from a few of us here on the site I've talked to a number of pretty passionate Journey fans at work, etc. and none of them had any idea that this was coming out.

Agreed. This album had about as much promotion as Generations. I'm impressed it debuted in the Top 30.

Generations...they couldn't GIVE it away.....

[slucero]

wow.. this thing is more DOA than I thought it would be..

[jestor92]

The band shot themselves in the foot.

#1. There isn't one song on the album that is radio friendly. Not one song. That kills album sales because no one knows the album is out. They needed 2 Journeyish anthems and a true ballad with this release and it would've been better off.

"Anything is Possible" and "Someone" sound very radio friendly to me. Not sure that it matters. "Higher Place" and "All the Way" were also radio friendly and got limited play (if any).

They'd be radio friendly if they weren't filler tracks. IMO the only songs on the album that are worthy of a release are City of Hope, Chain Of Love, and Tantra. Edge of the Moment, Resonate, and To Whom It May Concern are alright songs, but nothing special. The rest of the album is filler.

If they put the best of Arnel on a cd you'd almost have one killer album.

Never Walk Away
Change For the Better
After All These Years
City of Hope
Chain of Love
Tantra
Resonate
To Whom It May Concern
Edge Of The Moment
Turn Down The World Tonight

[Eric]

Aw fuck it, last post-

What these nimirods should have done, was go out on the road, on an exclusive American/Canada tour with Shania Twain, and opened up. Screw the new crap. They could play 1 or 2 of the new ones sure, but just being on the bill with her, would ensure tons of sales of Eclipse. I just read her book, and she even mentions Journey on a page...she was a fan...not sure of now though.

I thought I read she was in a Journey cover band in her teens, actually? She had an album WAY back I bought my wife when it was reissued - maybe her first one - and it was pure 80's music. I could actually see that tour.

I am tired of reading about the demise of Journey on here though. I've been reading this for 15 years now and they keep coming back.

So you agree my idea has merit?

It would honestly work....it could be huge. Not sure if Shania has kept all her mass fans with the layoff to be the headliner? but it the music together could work. It's out of the box but its not at the same time.

[koberry]

This band/management should just concentrate on getting some old shows released on DVD.

ROR
Frontiers
Captured
Departure
Evolution
Infinity

then have a reunion tour. I do not think the fans would really care that SP can't sing like he used to. I think the detractors underestimate the fanbase on this one. Journey is best when all parties are collaborating.

I don't underestimate the fanbase. But you always miss the point. It's not that he can't sing like he used to. It's that he doesn't sing live, period, not one song, nothing live for 18 years, not an album for 16 years. The reason they won't ever do a final tour or one-off together is because he will never sing live again imo.

Granted maybe not a concert however -----> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_P-DpMFd8_A

Wow, and this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqLS7SkwDnw

Seriously brought a tear of joy to my eye to Steve leading the crowd, shots of the City and the bay on the Jumbotron. My favorite music group and a huge Giants fan. It was a tough time being all the way across the country, made me homesick for awhile...

It's great to see him looking good, enjoying himself and getting the props/adulation he deserves for what was a fabulous run.

I wish Steve could/would come back. But knowing he won't, I'm enjoying the heck of the new music his former bandmates are creating.

[The_Noble_Cause]

They'd be radio friendly if they weren't filler tracks. IMO the only songs on the album that are worthy of a release are City of Hope, Chain Of Love, and Tantra. Edge of the Moment, Resonate, and To Whom It May Concern are alright songs, but nothing special. The rest of the album is filler.

Like Escape, there is no filler on this album. It's a lean and mean 12 tracks - only Neal's instrumental is a waste of time. City of Hope is pretty lame, but otherwise I've got no complaints.

[Jana]

This band/management should just concentrate on getting some old shows released on DVD.

ROR
Frontiers
Captured
Departure
Evolution
Infinity

then have a reunion tour. I do not think the fans would really care that SP can't sing like he used to. I think the detractors underestimate the fanbase on this one. Journey is best when all parties are collaborating.

I don't underestimate the fanbase. But you always miss the point. It's not that he can't sing like he used to. It's that he doesn't sing live, period, not one song, nothing live for 18 years, not an album for 16 years. The reason they won't ever do a final tour or one-off together is because he will never sing live again imo.

Granted maybe not a concert however -----> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_P-DpMFd8_A

Wow, and this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqLS7SkwDnw

Seriously brought a tear of joy to my eye to Steve leading the crowd, shots of the City and the bay on the Jumbotron. My favorite music group and a huge Giants fan. It was a tough time being all the way across the country, made me homesick for awhile...

It's great to see him looking good, enjoying himself and getting the props/adulation he deserves for what was a fabulous run.

I wish Steve could/would come back. But knowing he won't, I'm enjoying the heck of the new music his former bandmates are creating.

I agree with this. He looked joyous.

I also agree I'm glad to have a great new album in Eclipse and just don't compare. I still have an Infinity fixation right now, which I hadn't listened to in whole for forever and have been playing it here and there for over a month.

[Red13JoePa]

Didn't "Arrival" debut at #50 and "Generations" at, like, #113? If these figures are accurate, I'm more than impressed.

I absolutely agree. If you'd told the band after Arrival that there were back to back top 20 albums in their future including a top 5, they'dve taken it in 2 seconds flat.. Revelation skewed the expectations for this but I think it's a very solid bow.

[RedWingFan]

If you take the total sold and divide it by the 3,619 Walmart stores in the US it comes out to less than 5 copies sold per store over the entire week.

[Red13JoePa]

If you take the total sold and divide it by the 3,619 Walmart stores in the US it comes out to less than 5 copies sold per store over the entire week.

But it's all relative man.

[S2M]

Ok Majestic.....would you feel the same if say....a female became the singer of Journey? How about Ann Wilson? What if she were hired as the next replacement....you still singing the same lame tune?

Better yet, how about Adele? Or Crystal Bowersox, Season 9 runner-up on American Idol.....Same ole Song and Dance?

[Deb]

Ok Majestic.....would you feel the same if say....a female became the singer of Journey? How about Ann Wilson? What if she were hired as the next replacement....you still singing the same lame tune?

Better yet, how about Adele? Or Crystal Bowersox, Season 9 runner-up on American Idol.....Same ole Song and Dance?

Ahhh, great old Aerosmith track....... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJdWPSwSOLw

[Toph]

Horrible debut. Quite disappointing. Neal should have listened to Cain and put a traditional Journey ballad on there.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Horrible debut. Quite disappointing. Neal should have listened to Cain and put a traditional Journey ballad on there.

I fail to see how this is horrible. If the band was still in their prime, hot off the heels of ROR, maybe you'd have a point. Just a few years ago, this band wasn't even charting. For a dinosaur act lacking their most recognizable player, with no radio play, and no promotion, this is a tremendous feat.

[Jana]

Didn't "Arrival" debut at #50 and "Generations" at, like, #113? If these figures are accurate, I'm more than impressed.

I absolutely agree. If you'd told the band after Arrival that there were back to back top 20 albums in their future including a top 5, they'dve taken it in 2 seconds flat.. Revelation skewed the expectations for this but I think it's a very solid bow.

So true. And everyone that says they're over, blah, blah, go back and read their predictions during Arnel and Revelation, wrong, and I'm sure many on Arrival, wrong. They kept going. Even after Generations, I'm sure the predictions were dire. They're going nowhere and will have a great tour this year and an album they're all proud of and that many will love.

[jestor92]

They'd be radio friendly if they weren't filler tracks. IMO the only songs on the album that are worthy of a release are City of Hope, Chain Of Love, and Tantra. Edge of the Moment, Resonate, and To Whom It May Concern are alright songs, but nothing special. The rest of the album is filler.

Like Escape, there is no filler on this album. It's a lean and mean 12 tracks - only Neal's instrumental is a waste of time. City of Hope is pretty lame, but otherwise I've got no complaints.

Whatever Kool-Aid you're drinking I need some. Yes this is the best album they've released since Arrival, but that's not saying much. The only album this is better from Perry's era is ROR. The album is filler with 3 solid tracks.

Also forgot to mention that one of those tracks (City Of Hope) sounds like a U2 riff rip off mixed with "Praise" from Soul SirkUS. When they jam toward the end of the song and Neal is ripping it up listen to the other riff going on then go back and listen to "Praise"

[jrny84]

Horrible debut. Quite disappointing. Neal should have listened to Cain and put a traditional Journey ballad on there.

I fail to see how this is horrible. If the band was still in their prime, hot off the heels of ROR, maybe you'd have a point. Just a few years ago, this band wasn't even charting. For a dinosaur act lacking their most recognizable player, with no radio play, and no promotion, this is a tremendous feat.

You have a very good point. At first I thought the chart position was terrible, but what you think about, to chart that high in todays messed up music world without one of the most recognizable and talented rock singers out there...thats pretty darn good. No promotion, no radio singles, and going on without their most famous singer. To go from having albums not even crack the top 40 (Generations and Arrival) a few years ago, to having back to back top 20 albums in this day in age, pretty darn good.

[brywool]

Didn't "Arrival" debut at #50 and "Generations" at, like, #113? If these figures are accurate, I'm more than impressed.

I absolutely agree. If you'd told the band after Arrival that there were back to back top 20 albums in their future including a top 5, they'dve taken it in 2 seconds flat.. Revelation skewed the expectations for this but I think it's a very solid bow.

So true. And everyone that says they're over, blah, blah, go back and read their predictions during Arnel and Revelation, wrong, and I'm sure many on Arrival, wrong. They kept going. Even after Generations, I'm sure the predictions were dire. They're going nowhere and will have a great tour this year and an album they're all proud of and that many will love.

yeah, wasn't Arnel supposed to be done after three weeks with the band because he wouldn't be able to handle it?????

[brywool]

Horrible debut. Quite disappointing. Neal should have listened to Cain and put a traditional Journey ballad on there.

Did a heckuva lot better than 100 Years From Now...
Sales don't equate to a bad album. Both great albums... that suffered from no promotion.

[Michigan Girl]

So you have 4 played regularly...Ooooooh, so aggressive of them!

It's more than what you said they did, dude. It's okay to be wrong every once and a while.

"Only the Young"
"Stone in Love"
"Any Way You Want It"
"Girl Can't Help It"
"Send Her My Love"
"Open Arms"
"Still They Ride"
"Strung Out"
"Suzanne"
"Lights"
"Wheel in the Sky"
"Raised on Radio"
"Ask the Lonely"
"Who's Crying Now"
"Oh Sherrie"
"Lovin', Touchin', Squeezin'"
"Jailhouse Rock"
"Separate Ways (Worlds Apart)"
Encores:
"Be Good to Yourself"
"Don't Stop Believin'"
"Faithfully"

^ This is Wiki's ROR tour setlist. I count 4 tracks from ROR.

edit: Missed the title track.

When I saw them, they also did Positive Touch, Raised On Radio, and I'll be Alright Without You. This list is not correct. I saw them 5 times on that tour.

I know, but isn't funny ?...Giddy must be desperado debating w/incorrect inf. Revelation tour was the DD+3, a few shows got 1 more. ROR got five, six?!? Definitely more than
Giddy~wik's Power Point Presentation reflects!!! lol