Should the pledge be changed?

[artist4perry]

But religion has been the main motivator throughout history. There's no doubt about that.

Sorry, wrong again...If you look at people's real motivations, the main motivator is personal power, fame, fortune, etc. There's no doubt about it. Look at Jim Jones...Yeah, he used religion as the excuse to kill all those people but, in the end, it was for his own power-mad purposes.

Exactly. Don't drink the Koolaid.

The crusades. The witch burnings. The inquisition. The Anti-Judaic and Anti-semitic persecution. Jihad. Oppression of women. Or what about the genocides the Man himself orders? When God commanded his chosen people to conquer the Promised Land, he placed city after city 'under the ban" -which meant that every man, woman and child was to be slaughtered at the point of the sword. The slaughtering of the first born in Egypt? The serial rape and murder of a priest's concubine by the Benjamites? But wait - suddenly Jesus is born in some godforsaken village in Palestine through parthenogenesis, got strung up on the cross and rose from the dead? (Note that it wasn't just Jesus who rose from the dead, but every dead person around) Yeah...

The number of logical, scientific and historical fallacies in the Bible are mind-numbing. Believe what you want. The only koolaid I've been drinking is the one of rationality however. Following the current trends, then organized religion will be gone in a few centuries in Europe. Fortunately.

I'll say a prayer for you sweetie. LOL Seriously, you don't understand the bible at all. Say what you will but it is not ours to take a life. I could care less what you think about it. The debate is over the pledge of allegiance. You are not an American and personally never have to say it ever. So what is your beef? Just Christian bashing every chance you can? Seriously get a hobby or something. Most Christians today hold no threat at all. Not all religions are violent, if anything they are the opposite.

[S2M]

But religion has been the main motivator throughout history. There's no doubt about that.

Sorry, wrong again...If you look at people's real motivations, the main motivator is personal power, fame, fortune, etc. There's no doubt about it. Look at Jim Jones...Yeah, he used religion as the excuse to kill all those people but, in the end, it was for his own power-mad purposes.

But what you are forgetting, is for those 909 people - they died for their 'religion'. So Jim may have been a snake oil salesman, but those people believed what he was selling....therefore religion was the main motivator.

[artist4perry]

But religion has been the main motivator throughout history. There's no doubt about that.

Sorry, wrong again...If you look at people's real motivations, the main motivator is personal power, fame, fortune, etc. There's no doubt about it. Look at Jim Jones...Yeah, he used religion as the excuse to kill all those people but, in the end, it was for his own power-mad purposes.

But what you are forgetting, is for those 909 people - they died for their 'religion'. So Jim may have been a snake oil salesman, but those people believed what he was selling....therefore religion was the main motivator.

So 909 lemmings do something stupid and all religion is bad is that what your driving at? Considering he made these people believe he was God and Jesus Christ, he was their deity. So it isn't even the Christian God they worshiped.

[S2M]

But religion has been the main motivator throughout history. There's no doubt about that.

Sorry, wrong again...If you look at people's real motivations, the main motivator is personal power, fame, fortune, etc. There's no doubt about it. Look at Jim Jones...Yeah, he used religion as the excuse to kill all those people but, in the end, it was for his own power-mad purposes.

But what you are forgetting, is for those 909 people - they died for their 'religion'. So Jim may have been a snake oil salesman, but those people believed what he was selling....therefore religion was the main motivator.

So 909 lemmings do something stupid and all religion is bad is that what your driving at? Considering he made these people believe he was God and Jesus Christ, he was their deity. So it isn't even the Christian God they worshiped.

That's not what I'm saying....he didn't make those people do anything. They did it because they were weak-minded individuals. Irrational people....easily swayed. Religious people have an external locus of control. That's my issue. People accomplish things because 'god' helped them. People die because, 'It was there time to go, or god wanted them'. A religious person has never had an internal locus of control. Nothing ever happened because of the individual. Nothing. JimBob won the lottery - it was god. Marylou fell down a 60 ft. well and survived - EGADS! a miracle. a 5-alarm fire rips through a condo unit and kills 34. 12 survive. Another miracle. But what about the 34? I guess 'god' was tired that day. And my old standby - I've never met an amputee that has ever grown a limb back. I guess 'god' hates those people, huh? A zillion recorded miracles, and not one ever involved a regenerated lost limb.....

[artist4perry]

But religion has been the main motivator throughout history. There's no doubt about that.

Sorry, wrong again...If you look at people's real motivations, the main motivator is personal power, fame, fortune, etc. There's no doubt about it. Look at Jim Jones...Yeah, he used religion as the excuse to kill all those people but, in the end, it was for his own power-mad purposes.

But what you are forgetting, is for those 909 people - they died for their 'religion'. So Jim may have been a snake oil salesman, but those people believed what he was selling....therefore religion was the main motivator.

So 909 lemmings do something stupid and all religion is bad is that what your driving at? Considering he made these people believe he was God and Jesus Christ, he was their deity. So it isn't even the Christian God they worshiped.

That's not what I'm saying....he didn't make those people do anything. They did it because they were weak-minded individuals. Irrational people....easily swayed. Religious people have an external locus of control. That's my issue. People accomplish things because 'god' helped them. People die because, 'It was there time to go, or god wanted them'. A religious person has never had an internal locus of control. Nothing ever happened because of the individual. Nothing. JimBob won the lottery - it was god. Marylou fell down a 60 ft. well and survived - EGADS! a miracle. a 5-alarm fire rips through a condo unit and kills 34. 12 survive. Another miracle. But what about the 34? I guess 'god' was tired that day. And my old standby - I've never met an amputee that has ever grown a limb back. I guess 'god' hates those people, huh? A zillion recorded miracles, and not one ever involved a regenerated lost limb.....

I don't believe in modern day miracles. I guess I would be an oddball to you! LOL

I don't think I am a weak minded individual. Regardless of why you chose to believe or not, that is a piss poor way of looking at things.

What if Christians look at atheists as weak minded? So anyone who doesn't see things YOUR way is weak minded. Sorry I disagree. God does work through providence I believe. As far as nothing happens because of the individual that is stupid too. I did not get the job I got yesterday because I did nothing to assist my own life. I had to apply, go to an interview, and wow the principals.

God never promised we would never suffer. The whole planet was set up that we would not live forever. We grow old, we get sick and we die. It says the rain must fall on the good and the bad. So no, people with one arm are not growing a new one. That is a miracle. That is not what I believe happens.

If I no longer can use my arm because of the nerve that is damaged I won't blame God. It is just one of those things of life. If anything I know God will get me through it. I don't care if you think I am weak minded or not. \

I see you as cynical sometimes. And I also think you miss out on some really terrific friends if they are faithful Christians. As a matter of fact I am a great person to know. Sad if you cannot see this. My religion does not make me a bad person, or a weak minded person, I think it helps me to be a better more whole person. It may not be your cup of tea, and I can accept that. But I would not insult you because you choose another path.

[Rip Rokken]

Foreigners and Atheists have fucked all this up. America is moving away from a country of faith with great values and moral fiber.
Liberal butt fuckers!

Atheists maybe, but what does Foreigner have to do with this?

[artist4perry]

Foreigners and Atheists have fucked all this up. America is moving away from a country of faith with great values and moral fiber.
Liberal butt fuckers!

Atheists maybe, but what does Foreigner have to do with this?

They wanna know what love is........................LOL