Religion & Morality

[majik]

The clip below is an interview with Richard Dawkins about his new book The Magic of Reality, which is aimed at kids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-TFIxW1d10

I'm perfectly fine with atheists doing this if they so wish with their own children. I just find it pretty hypocritical that they have such a fit with people of faith doing the same thing with their children.

It's not hypocritical. It's about teaching the truth and giving kids a fair chance in life. What is hypocritical is beliving is denying evolution, but being perfectly happy to use antibiotics.

Having watched the clip its easy to see that Dawkins is substituting one story for another story, this time using scientific terminology, which as he said in the clip is a spellbinding story, all good stories are.

The Adam and Eve story points to the apparent loss of Paradise by eating from the tree of knowledge, so lets teach the children more stories to believe in just as we were taught and its the blind leading the blind again.

Is reality a story or is it THAT in which all stories appear. What you are IS Reality and not the story about reality.

Matthew 18:1-4

At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?” And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them and said, “Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

This scripture a very good pointer.

[parfait]

So you don't think the evolution/big bang is true?

be·lief/biˈlēf/
Noun:

1. An acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
2. Something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.

Haha. Handpicking quotes, huh? Put in the whole description next time:

- an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists:
his belief in the value of hard work | a belief that solitude nourishes creativity

- something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction:
contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language we’re prepared to fight for our beliefs

- a religious conviction: Christian beliefs | I’m afraid to say belief has gone | local beliefs and customs

Link: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/belief?region=us

Since atheism, just like belief in God, cannot be proven or disproven by any physical evidence then, yes, it is every bit as much of a belief as faith is. Looking at that objectively and not through the lens of either belief in faith or belief in atheism, the only ones that really have it right are agnostics.

You're mixing up terms yet again. Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

There's simply no logical or empirical proof to believe in a creator or whatever you want to call it. Disproving a non-belief makes absolutely no sense. It seems to me that you have made no effort reading up what atheism really is, as your arguments really just are based on ignorance and misunderstandings.

[steveo777]

Just go look into someone's eye's and see a sparkle, a caring, loving person and you will believe that something good created that person and they are made of good. They care for themselves, their children and their husband. They are inherently good people. That didn't just happen by accident, some explosion along the way. Evolution, may have brought us to a higher estate, but we are fallible.

Others, I believe, are straight from the bowels of hell. You look at those types and you are immediately uncomfortable in their presence, almost like they crossed from hell into our world. Their eyes are like those of a shark, glazen, shielded and moving all the time. They are dishonest in words, but more so in posture.

I believe there is, at least, good and evil, created to behave like it's maker (s) whoever they are.

[majik]

So you don't think the evolution/big bang is true?

be·lief/biˈlēf/
Noun:

1. An acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
2. Something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.

Haha. Handpicking quotes, huh? Put in the whole description next time:

- an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists:
his belief in the value of hard work | a belief that solitude nourishes creativity

- something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction:
contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language we’re prepared to fight for our beliefs

- a religious conviction: Christian beliefs | I’m afraid to say belief has gone | local beliefs and customs

Link: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/belief?region=us

Since atheism, just like belief in God, cannot be proven or disproven by any physical evidence then, yes, it is every bit as much of a belief as faith is. Looking at that objectively and not through the lens of either belief in faith or belief in atheism, the only ones that really have it right are agnostics.

You're mixing up terms yet again. Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

There's simply no logical or empirical proof to believe in a creator or whatever you want to call it. Disproving a non-belief makes absolutely no sense. It seems to me that you have made no effort reading up what atheism really is, as your arguments really just are based on ignorance and misunderstandings.

And where does this story Atheist vs.Christian take place? as you've pointed out...... In Reality!

[majik]

So you don't think the evolution/big bang is true?

be·lief/biˈlēf/
Noun:

1. An acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
2. Something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.

Haha. Handpicking quotes, huh? Put in the whole description next time:

- an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists:
his belief in the value of hard work | a belief that solitude nourishes creativity

- something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction:
contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language we’re prepared to fight for our beliefs

- a religious conviction: Christian beliefs | I’m afraid to say belief has gone | local beliefs and customs

Link: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/belief?region=us

Since atheism, just like belief in God, cannot be proven or disproven by any physical evidence then, yes, it is every bit as much of a belief as faith is. Looking at that objectively and not through the lens of either belief in faith or belief in atheism, the only ones that really have it right are agnostics.

Is anyone born agnostic ? no it is what some may become, like Buddhism and enlightenment or the Christians finding salvation all are a becoming for the believed in person.

What you ARE is Reality and that is Not A Becoming it is already so.

[Duncan]

Just go look into someone's eye's and see a sparkle, a caring, loving person and you will believe that something good created that person and they are made of good. They care for themselves, their children and their husband. They are inherently good people. That didn't just happen by accident, some explosion along the way. Evolution, may have brought us to a higher estate, but we are fallible.

Others, I believe, are straight from the bowels of hell. You look at those types and you are immediately uncomfortable in their presence, almost like they crossed from hell into our world. Their eyes are like those of a shark, glazen, shielded and moving all the time. They are dishonest in words, but more so in posture.

I believe there is, at least, good and evil, created to behave like it's maker (s) whoever they are.

[Duncan]

Just go look into someone's eye's and see a sparkle, a caring, loving person and you will believe that something good created that person and they are made of good. They care for themselves, their children and their husband. They are inherently good people. That didn't just happen by accident, some explosion along the way. Evolution, may have brought us to a higher estate, but we are fallible.

Others, I believe, are straight from the bowels of hell. You look at those types and you are immediately uncomfortable in their presence, almost like they crossed from hell into our world. Their eyes are like those of a shark, glazen, shielded and moving all the time. They are dishonest in words, but more so in posture.

I believe there is, at least, good and evil, created to behave like it's maker (s) whoever they are.

Do you people go through life just making shit up and believing in it because you like the idea of it.

[Duncan]

[majik]

[conversationpc]

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively disproven, then therefore none can be conclusively proven. Claiming that believers “cannot prove that God exists” often relies upon the misunderstanding that believers claim “God does exist” and should prove this. In reality, believers merely fail to accept the atheists' claim “God doesn't exist” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the atheist.

Fixed.

[parfait]

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively disproven, then therefore none can be conclusively proven. Claiming that believers “cannot prove that God exists” often relies upon the misunderstanding that believers claim “God does exist” and should prove this. In reality, believers merely fail to accept the atheists' claim “God doesn't exist” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the atheist.

Fixed.

Wow. Just wow.

[Duncan]

So you don't think the evolution/big bang is true?

be·lief/biˈlēf/
Noun:

1. An acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
2. Something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.

Haha. Handpicking quotes, huh? Put in the whole description next time:

- an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists:
his belief in the value of hard work | a belief that solitude nourishes creativity

- something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction:
contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language we’re prepared to fight for our beliefs

- a religious conviction: Christian beliefs | I’m afraid to say belief has gone | local beliefs and customs

Link: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/belief?region=us

Since atheism, just like belief in God, cannot be proven or disproven by any physical evidence then, yes, it is every bit as much of a belief as faith is. Looking at that objectively and not through the lens of either belief in faith or belief in atheism, the only ones that really have it right are agnostics.

Is anyone born agnostic ? no it is what some may become, like Buddhism and enlightenment or the Christians finding salvation all are a becoming for the believed in person.

What you ARE is Reality and that is Not A Becoming it is already so.

Hmm, I would argue that all babies are born athiest and remain so until the concept of god and religion is introduced to them.

[conversationpc]

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively disproven, then therefore none can be conclusively proven. Claiming that believers “cannot prove that God exists” often relies upon the misunderstanding that believers claim “God does exist” and should prove this. In reality, believers merely fail to accept the atheists' claim “God doesn't exist” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the atheist.

Fixed.

Wow. Just wow.

Oh, for crying out loud. Have a sense of humor for once, will ya?

[artist4perry]

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively disproven, then therefore none can be conclusively proven. Claiming that believers “cannot prove that God exists” often relies upon the misunderstanding that believers claim “God does exist” and should prove this. In reality, believers merely fail to accept the atheists' claim “God doesn't exist” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the atheist.

Fixed.

Wow. Just wow.

Oh, for crying out loud. Have a sense of humor for once, will ya?

You got your terms mixed up here. One can't believe in atheism, because it itself is the rejection of all belief. The Magic of Reality is simply a science book for kids, about the magic of reality - meaning how actually stuff works, void of any supernatural being. One doesn't need a God to explain what the sun is or where Man came from anymore.

Parfait like it or not, you believe in the theory of evolution. It is part of your belief system. You believe in it don't you? If I asked you what you believed to be the origin of mankind you would tell me what you think, or believe to be true. If you do not believe in it, then you would have some other belief on the origins of life. If you believe in nothing you would say I don't believe anything about how the world began. I have no clue. Now that would be believing in nothing. But if you want to say atheists don't have a clue as to how life begins because they believe in nothing............don't let me stop you.

[parfait]

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively disproven, then therefore none can be conclusively proven. Claiming that believers “cannot prove that God exists” often relies upon the misunderstanding that believers claim “God does exist” and should prove this. In reality, believers merely fail to accept the atheists' claim “God doesn't exist” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the atheist.

Fixed.

Wow. Just wow.

Oh, for crying out loud. Have a sense of humor for once, will ya?

You got your terms mixed up here. One can't believe in atheism, because it itself is the rejection of all belief. The Magic of Reality is simply a science book for kids, about the magic of reality - meaning how actually stuff works, void of any supernatural being. One doesn't need a God to explain what the sun is or where Man came from anymore.

Parfait like it or not, you believe in the theory of evolution. It is part of your belief system. You believe in it don't you? If I asked you what you believed to be the origin of mankind you would tell me what you think, or believe to be true. If you do not believe in it, then you would have some other belief on the origins of life. If you believe in nothing you would say I don't believe anything about how the world began. I have no clue. Now that would be believing in nothing. But if you want to say atheists don't have a clue as to how life begins because they believe in nothing............don't let me stop you.

Go back and read the post I wrote earlier on the description of the word belief (which you amusingly enough didn't include). Believing in evolution is just the same as believing in gravity. I'd even say that we know far more about evolution than gravity. There's a big difference here. Your belief (again; see my last post) is not based on millions of data, observations and trial, but faith - where's a belief in evolution, gravity or a combustion engine is.

Get it?

[majik]

So you don't think the evolution/big bang is true?

be·lief/biˈlēf/
Noun:

1. An acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
2. Something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.

Haha. Handpicking quotes, huh? Put in the whole description next time:

- an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists:
his belief in the value of hard work | a belief that solitude nourishes creativity

- something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction:
contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language we’re prepared to fight for our beliefs

- a religious conviction: Christian beliefs | I’m afraid to say belief has gone | local beliefs and customs

Link: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/belief?region=us

Since atheism, just like belief in God, cannot be proven or disproven by any physical evidence then, yes, it is every bit as much of a belief as faith is. Looking at that objectively and not through the lens of either belief in faith or belief in atheism, the only ones that really have it right are agnostics.

Is anyone born agnostic ? no it is what some may become, like Buddhism and enlightenment or the Christians finding salvation all are a becoming for the believed in person.

What you ARE is Reality and that is Not A Becoming it is already so.

Hmm, I would argue that all babies are born athiest and remain so until the concept of god and religion is introduced to them.

Well that takes the biscuit, WTF.
That is a label YOU are placing on all babies, atheism is learned in a response to belief in God

Edit:
It can be seen not only in this thread that the atheist is very knowledgable about belief in god and BECOME atheist as a result of the teaching they received. Babies believe nor disbelieve.

[artist4perry]

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively disproven, then therefore none can be conclusively proven. Claiming that believers “cannot prove that God exists” often relies upon the misunderstanding that believers claim “God does exist” and should prove this. In reality, believers merely fail to accept the atheists' claim “God doesn't exist” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the atheist.

Fixed.

Wow. Just wow.

Oh, for crying out loud. Have a sense of humor for once, will ya?

You got your terms mixed up here. One can't believe in atheism, because it itself is the rejection of all belief. The Magic of Reality is simply a science book for kids, about the magic of reality - meaning how actually stuff works, void of any supernatural being. One doesn't need a God to explain what the sun is or where Man came from anymore.

Parfait like it or not, you believe in the theory of evolution. It is part of your belief system. You believe in it don't you? If I asked you what you believed to be the origin of mankind you would tell me what you think, or believe to be true. If you do not believe in it, then you would have some other belief on the origins of life. If you believe in nothing you would say I don't believe anything about how the world began. I have no clue. Now that would be believing in nothing. But if you want to say atheists don't have a clue as to how life begins because they believe in nothing............don't let me stop you.

Go back and read the post I wrote earlier on the description of the word belief (which you amusingly enough didn't include). Believing in evolution is just the same as believing in gravity. I'd even say that we know far more about evolution than gravity. There's a big difference here. Your belief (again; see my last post) is not based on millions of data, observations and trial, but faith - where's a belief in evolution, gravity or a combustion engine is.

Get it?

I get it, but I also get that you are arguing something that is a bit of a contradiction. You said that atheists reject all belief. You did not say religious belief........you said belief. There are different kinds of belief. But I propose you argue your belief in evolution and atheistic ideas like it was a religion. You don't just agree with the thoughts or science behind it, you defend it with great passion. Almost as though you find it offensive if anyone would dare to disagree with its stance. You don't just believe as in I think something is true.........you staunchly defend it with venom if anyone questions it at all.

Some atheists are militant about that nothing they don't believe in. They sue people for having a differing belief. They legislate and threaten and name call those of differing ideals. Sounds like a strong belief system to me. Otherwise they would not care if someone disagrees at all. Why defend it with so much venom if it is just something you learned in school and thought to be true?

I can believe I will hurt my head if I hit it with a hammer........but that does not make it a religious thing. So yes, atheists believe in evolution.

[majik]

Everything can be negated either by thought or during deep sleep when all is negated. The only thing that cannot be negated is your Being-ness as to do so requires your presence. What must you be....... the presence itself, Self illuminating.

[majik]

If God exists and is asked if he believes in God he would have to reply, No. To believe in God he would have to be separate from himself in the way believers believe they are separate from him. This by definition makes God an Atheist.
Knowing himself is not the same as believing in God as we all claim to Know ourselves as ourself. Meaning believers have faith in an atheist God.

On the other hand if God does not exist then atheism is a false platform regarding that which does not exist, which puts the believer and the atheist in bed together, they need each other for the mutual survival of their identity.

Both stances are a diversionary tactic of the ego mind to keep it from seeing it is the personal you that does not exist. This wholeness/oneness is the expression of presence and it may or may not include the IDEA of the personal you.

[G.I.Jim]

If God exists and is asked if he believes in God he would have to reply, No. To believe in God he would have to be separate from himself in the way believers believe they are separate from him. This by definition makes God an Atheist.
Knowing himself is not the same as believing in God as we all claim to Know ourselves as ourself. Meaning believers have faith in an atheist God.

On the other hand if God does not exist then atheism is a false platform regarding that which does not exist, which puts the believer and the atheist in bed together, they need each other for the mutual survival of their identity.

Both stances are a diversionary tactic of the ego mind to keep it from seeing it is the personal you that does not exist. This wholeness/oneness is the expression of presence and it may or may not include the IDEA of the personal you.

I'm sorry, but this is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard. That's like saying if someone asks you if you believe in Majik, you would have to say no? You can't believe that you yourself exists? Uhh... okay.

[majik]

If God exists and is asked if he believes in God he would have to reply, No. To believe in God he would have to be separate from himself in the way believers believe they are separate from him. This by definition makes God an Atheist.
Knowing himself is not the same as believing in God as we all claim to Know ourselves as ourself. Meaning believers have faith in an atheist God.

On the other hand if God does not exist then atheism is a false platform regarding that which does not exist, which puts the believer and the atheist in bed together, they need each other for the mutual survival of their identity.

Both stances are a diversionary tactic of the ego mind to keep it from seeing it is the personal you that does not exist. This wholeness/oneness is the expression of presence and it may or may not include the IDEA of the personal you.

I'm sorry, but this is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard. That's like saying if someone asks you if you believe in Majik, you would have to say no? You can't believe that you yourself exists? Uhh... okay.

Majik does not exist its a made up name and if you were to question what you believe you are, the personal self will be found to be a construct in language only, therefore it can be deconstructed as it is false. The false cannot stand up to investigation. Being-ness IS and that is the totality the REAL and is what I Am. You are the totality and not the separate limited time bound entity you believe yourself to be, born only to die.

Believes and non-believers are joined at the hip, evenly yoked, a perfect balance of the Ying and the Yang. G.I. Jim is real is that what you are saying??

[majik]

Ok, here is the challenge......... prove you exist.


Edit:

I've been listening to Journey' Chain of Love, check out the lyrics. It would seem they are also saying the same thing Buddha had to say about the self,
There Is No Self and Jesus also said Deny The Self. There is none so blind as those who will not see. Who has all the problems ?? "I" has and its a fiction. No wonder the album bombed.

One precious moment in a state of grace
Send the mantra to an endless night.
Feel the glow, feel the peace of mind
True perfection in one true light

Pathways in my mind that lead to nowhere
Promises of happiness that leave me wanting more
When my desire becomes a nightmare
Feel paranoia about what I'm wishing for.
If I could just let go of who I think I am
Surrender to the silence, help me understand

[Chorus]
There's no beginning, there's no end
There is no self, no fortress to defend
An endless circle beyond space and time.
It's the chain of love that binds me
The chain of love defines me.
Chain, chain, chain, chain of love.

Voices in my head that try to rule me.
I've found a place where I can't hear them anymore.
My own illusions come to fool me
Lost in emotions that I've never touched before.
If I could get beyond what's in my mind
Free my spirit, leave the world behind


More lyrics: http://www.lyricsmode.com/lyrics/j/journey/#share

[parfait]

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively proven, then therefore none can be conclusively disproven. Claiming that atheists “cannot prove that God does not exist” often relies upon the misunderstanding that atheists claim “God does not exist” and should prove this. In reality, atheists merely fail to accept the theists' claim “God exists” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the believer.

Your claim relies upon the erroneous assumption that all propositions are created equal and, because some cannot be conclusively disproven, then therefore none can be conclusively proven. Claiming that believers “cannot prove that God exists” often relies upon the misunderstanding that believers claim “God does exist” and should prove this. In reality, believers merely fail to accept the atheists' claim “God doesn't exist” and, hence, the initial burden of proof lies with the atheist.

Fixed.

Wow. Just wow.

Oh, for crying out loud. Have a sense of humor for once, will ya?

You got your terms mixed up here. One can't believe in atheism, because it itself is the rejection of all belief. The Magic of Reality is simply a science book for kids, about the magic of reality - meaning how actually stuff works, void of any supernatural being. One doesn't need a God to explain what the sun is or where Man came from anymore.

Parfait like it or not, you believe in the theory of evolution. It is part of your belief system. You believe in it don't you? If I asked you what you believed to be the origin of mankind you would tell me what you think, or believe to be true. If you do not believe in it, then you would have some other belief on the origins of life. If you believe in nothing you would say I don't believe anything about how the world began. I have no clue. Now that would be believing in nothing. But if you want to say atheists don't have a clue as to how life begins because they believe in nothing............don't let me stop you.

Go back and read the post I wrote earlier on the description of the word belief (which you amusingly enough didn't include). Believing in evolution is just the same as believing in gravity. I'd even say that we know far more about evolution than gravity. There's a big difference here. Your belief (again; see my last post) is not based on millions of data, observations and trial, but faith - where's a belief in evolution, gravity or a combustion engine is.

Get it?

I get it, but I also get that you are arguing something that is a bit of a contradiction. You said that atheists reject all belief. You did not say religious belief........you said belief. There are different kinds of belief. But I propose you argue your belief in evolution and atheistic ideas like it was a religion. You don't just agree with the thoughts or science behind it, you defend it with great passion. Almost as though you find it offensive if anyone would dare to disagree with its stance. You don't just believe as in I think something is true.........you staunchly defend it with venom if anyone questions it at all.

Some atheists are militant about that nothing they don't believe in. They sue people for having a differing belief. They legislate and threaten and name call those of differing ideals. Sounds like a strong belief system to me. Otherwise they would not care if someone disagrees at all. Why defend it with so much venom if it is just something you learned in school and thought to be true?

I can believe I will hurt my head if I hit it with a hammer........but that does not make it a religious thing. So yes, atheists believe in evolution.

There's no contradiction. Atheist consists of two words. A and theist. A is latin for non, and theist is a belief in a deity. Together they mean non-believer. There's no fucking contradiction here! This is just silly semantics.

Evolution is not something I just learned in school and think to be true. It is true. There's no doubt about it. As I've stated earlier; believe what you want. However, when a religious believer puts their ass where they don't belong, trying to push their faith into schools or science, well, that's unacceptable. You and the rest of the believers in this thread have contentiously written what is seemingly "facts", but are nothing more than half-truths or straight out false - I just correct it. I don't see that as spouting venom like I was some fucking cobra. Suing someone for believing in a specific religion would never work in the states. Freedom of religion remember.

[donnaplease]

However, when a religious believer puts their ass where they don't belong, trying to push their faith into schools or science, well, that's unacceptable. You and the rest of the believers in this thread have contentiously written what is seemingly "facts", but are nothing more than half-truths or straight out false - I just correct it. I don't see that as spouting venom like I was some fucking cobra. Suing someone for believing in a specific religion would never work in the states. Freedom of religion remember.

Actually, in the US, it's quite the opposite. The "believers" as you call them have historically been in our schools. It's you, the non-believers who are trying to change our society into something it has never been. Like it or not, our country has ALWAYS been faith-based, in our schools, our government, and our everyday life. People have twisted and turned the "separation of church and state" into something that it isn't and never was, but our society is too weak to stand up to those who are trying to erase our religious heritage. I'm now wondering how long it will be before Christmas, Easter, and Thanksgiving will be under attack as federal holidays because of the whole "separation of church and state" bullshit. They are, after all, based on religious history.

[artist4perry]

However, when a religious believer puts their ass where they don't belong, trying to push their faith into schools or science, well, that's unacceptable. You and the rest of the believers in this thread have contentiously written what is seemingly "facts", but are nothing more than half-truths or straight out false - I just correct it. I don't see that as spouting venom like I was some fucking cobra. Suing someone for believing in a specific religion would never work in the states. Freedom of religion remember.

Actually, in the US, it's quite the opposite. The "believers" as you call them have historically been in our schools. It's you, the non-believers who are trying to change our society into something it has never been. Like it or not, our country has ALWAYS been faith-based, in our schools, our government, and our everyday life. People have twisted and turned the "separation of church and state" into something that it isn't and never was, but our society is too weak to stand up to those who are trying to erase our religious heritage. I'm now wondering how long it will be before Christmas, Easter, and Thanksgiving will be under attack as federal holidays because of the whole "separation of church and state" bullshit. They are, after all, based on religious history.

She is right. Prayer was in school before the theory of evolution. Atheists went to court and insisted on having evolution taught in the classrooms. Many legislative lawsuits later and prayer was removed. The very mention of religion can cause you to lose your job in schools today. So who pushed out what?

As for lawsuits give me a break. There are tons of lawsuits. If you go to the atheist website alone they site victories over lawsuits all day long. Crosses removed from memorials, public seals, nativity scenes denied to be put up at Christmas time, Christmas trees to be called "Holiday Trees", the lists go on at a nauseating pace.

Many people are having to fight for the right for the freedom of expression of religion (Which by the way is a constitutional right), against those who tout "Separation of Church and State" which I have explained time and again is not part of our laws at all.

And where the word atheism means not believing in supernatural beings, you do believe in evolution. You believe it so much your on here frequently fighting as though it meant life or death over something you deem to be true. So much so you get pissed off at anyone who does not believe in it.

You defend it like it was a religion, something sacred to be believed. If it were a fact that people disbelieve, like some old people believe we never went to the moon, it would not matter to you. You would kind of chuckle and wink your eye at their "ignorance", but you would not get so mad.

Your so called "truth" is a theory, and like many others like yourself, you fail to see that it has not been proven. It has gaps, holes in the theory. I have heard your arguments, but scientist themselves state that they do not know the true origin of life. So your claims that it is truth beyond a shadow of a doubt is a falsehood by itself.

We don't have Christian Jihad. Most modern Christian religions are peaceful and harmless. As a matter of fact that is why we make good targets. We are not allowed to fight back. So if a cartoonist does a cartoon about Mohamed, Muslim extremist threaten the cartoonist life. But in movies, cartoons, and artwork people insult the image of God and Jesus all the time, and we don't threaten to kill someone. We just have to tolerate it.

[jaxmanjoe]

We don't have Christian Jihad. Most modern Christian religions are peaceful and harmless. As a matter of fact that is why we make good targets. We are not allowed to fight back. So if a cartoonist does a cartoon about Mohamed, Muslim extremist threaten the cartoonist life. But in movies, cartoons, and artwork people insult the image of God and Jesus all the time, and we don't threaten to kill someone. We just have to tolerate it.

There are as many Christian extremists in the world as extremists of any other group. Don't act like there aren't and don't feign ignorance. Just as there are extremist atheists and non-extremist atheists. There are extremists in ANY group.

And to say you don't fight back - ha! How many abortion clinics have been blown up? How many white supremacy groups are there (and don't tell me these are not hard core Christians)? How many atheists do you see accosting people in their homes pushing the word of God on them? How many atheists send soldiers, I mean missionaries, out into the world to recruit more believers?

Extreme is extreme and each of our groups has them. And don't act like you tolerate it. Your last post was just proof that you don't tolerate it. You despise it. Much like your counterparts on the opposite side of the argument. Your extremists are JUST as bad as Muslim extremists. The only difference is we have better laws here and controls here to keep our extremists in line. That's it. Otherwise, bombs would be going off everywhere and atheists would be hunted and killed here because that's what Christians have done historically...

[artist4perry]

Atheist public attacks on religion:






These are only a few. These are based to attack religion, and the thoughts of religion.

[artist4perry]

We don't have Christian Jihad. Most modern Christian religions are peaceful and harmless. As a matter of fact that is why we make good targets. We are not allowed to fight back. So if a cartoonist does a cartoon about Mohamed, Muslim extremist threaten the cartoonist life. But in movies, cartoons, and artwork people insult the image of God and Jesus all the time, and we don't threaten to kill someone. We just have to tolerate it.

There are as many Christian extremists in the world as extremists of any other group. Don't act like there aren't and don't feign ignorance. Just as there are extremist atheists and non-extremist atheists. There are extremists in ANY group.

And to say you don't fight back - ha! How many abortion clinics have been blown up? How many white supremacy groups are there (and don't tell me these are not hard core Christians)? How many atheists do you see accosting people in their homes pushing the word of God on them? How many atheists send soldiers, I mean missionaries, out into the world to recruit more believers?

Extreme is extreme and each of our groups has them. And don't act like you tolerate it. Your last post was just proof that you don't tolerate it. You despise it. Much like your counterparts on the opposite side of the argument. Your extremists are JUST as bad as Muslim extremists. The only difference is we have better laws here and controls here to keep our extremists in line. That's it. Otherwise, bombs would be going off everywhere and atheists would be hunted and killed here because that's what Christians have done historically...

If those people lived by the tenets of Jesus they would not attack anyone. Nuts can attack in the name of anything. There was a guy who killed in the name of his dog, because his dog told him to. Do you get rid of all dogs?

As for my not tolerating it, there is a difference between voicing an opinion, which is my right to have, and my calling people childish names and insulting their intelligence, like many have here. That is far from making me an extremist. Most people of Christian faith are peaceable. Name the droves of people in the U.S. that have marched in Crusades today to make you a Christian against your will.

Seriously, an extremist is an extremist, and only a minority of so called Christians, but I would have to say they were not Christian at all when Jesus teaches to turn the other cheek........to live by the sword is to die by the sword. And note I said Most Modern day Christians, not all people who claim to have Christian faith.

I believe it is wrong to kill abortionist, I don't force religion on anyone, I just want to have my rights left in tact.

I did not say there were no nut jobs. I just was pointing out that the majority of Christians are peaceable, and don't want to hurt anyone.

By the way, I don't have a problem with anyone being an atheist, I am mainly having a problem with people calling people of religion stupid because they don't believe in what they do. I also have a problem with anyone wanting to remove my religious rights to freedom of expression of religion.

[Rip Rokken]

Atheist public attacks on religion:






These are only a few. These are based to attack religion, and the thoughts of religion.

At a minimum, the first photo is fake. The text doesn't line up with the billboard. Maybe the photo was created and posted by an atheist, but it's not a real board. Plus, it would violate decency standards.

The 2nd looks legit, and that is a real organization - I just met their president David Silverman a few weeks ago.

Not sure about the 3rd.

[artist4perry]

Atheist public attacks on religion:






These are only a few. These are based to attack religion, and the thoughts of religion.

At a minimum, the first photo is fake. The text doesn't line up with the billboard. Maybe the photo was created and posted by an atheist, but it's not a real board. Plus, it would violate decency standards.

The 2nd looks legit, and that is a real organization - I just met their president David Silverman a few weeks ago.

Not sure about the 3rd.

I can agree on the first, and I will remove it. But there are many more and you and I know it. Please tell me the purpose of such billboards. I am just curious as to why they feel the need to erect them at all.

If atheist just believe there is no supernatural beings, then why do they go on attack like this?

Personally I have no problem with you or anyone here not believing in God. I just don't get the need to remove others rights to believe in God, or the need to make fun of or belittle others who do believe in God.

I am all for removing dangerous extremists of all kinds. Anyone killing in the name of God, dogs, frogs, or anything else are evil and should be stopped. But most Christian religions are peaceable. And some here take a few wacko extremist views and say all religion is dangerous? Seriously?

You have met me Rip, do you find me dangerous? Boring I can concede, but dangerous? There are some here who would tout that because I believe in God and a few nut jobs killed in the name of God, I am of the same mindset.