Queensrÿche vs. Queensrÿche

[Rip Rokken]

A month ago I bought the new QR disc featuring the band sans Tate. It is a 'grower', which is always the best type of album. Doesn't necessarily grab you immediately, but slowly works its magic and has a hell of a lot of staying power. GREAT disc.

I bowed into temptation and picked up a copy of GT's "Frequency Unknown". Popped it in and from the first song, it grabbed me immediately. KICKED ASS! Then it grew old really quick. Quite the opposite of a 'grower'. BUT... there is one song on there that really is Queensrÿche... "In The Hands of God"... sounds like a modern version of a Rage For Order-era song. Interestingly, the two best songs on the album (coincidentally also having the highest production values) were both co-written with Lukas Rossi of ROCK STAR: Supernova fame. He's either a true QR fan or he's a quick study. Many of the rest of the songs sounds like unpolished and uninspired demos.

[verslibre]

A month ago I bought the new QR disc featuring the band sans Tate. It is a 'grower', which is always the best type of album. Doesn't necessarily grab you immediately, but slowly works its magic and has a hell of a lot of staying power. GREAT disc.

I bowed into temptation and picked up a copy of GT's "Frequency Unknown". Popped it in and from the first song, it grabbed me immediately. KICKED ASS! Then it grew old really quick. Quite the opposite of a 'grower'. BUT... there is one song on there that really is Queensrÿche... "In The Hands of God"... sounds like a modern version of a Rage For Order-era song. Interestingly, the two best songs on the album (coincidentally also having the highest production values) were both co-written with Lukas Rossi of ROCK STAR: Supernova fame. He's either a true QR fan or he's a quick study. Many of the rest of the songs sounds like unpolished and uninspired demos.

Hey, man, a thread exists. Re: your comment about the rest of the songs sound like unpolished/uninspired demos, it's because that's what they are. GT doesn't write shit, he just sings and sometimes writes a lyric. Many of the rhythm guitars were tracked by one guy for FU and a bazillion guests play all over it. The only reason it rocks harder than anything Geoff has sung on in 17 or 20 years is because he knew he had to compete with the album QR was releasing. Otherwise, it would be colored by the usual electronica/dance influences.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Some of the Frequency Unknown/Tate solo songs have potential ( I actually like "Hands of Gold" and "Cold" and a few others), but he needs to collaborate with someone besides Kelly Gray...maybe Wilton or Rockenfeld? The Todd Ryche disc is waaay better. Bands can evolve. But Tate's evolution of the band has not been nearly as forward-thinking as he likes to pretend. Sax solos and hip-hop influences on Dedicated to Chaos are an example of that. He's like Sperry ruining the band with ROR. Tate says he is now working on a new concept album (not a Mindcrime 3, thankfully). Does anyone believe he can pull this off?

[verslibre]

Some of the Frequency Unknown/Tate solo songs have potential ( I actually like "Hands of Gold" and "Cold" and a few others), but he needs to collaborate with someone besides Kelly Gray...maybe Wilton or Rockenfeld?

Uhh...what? The other guys split because Geoff kept not using their ideas. Kelly Gray didn't write anything on the album, Geoff picked over odds 'n sods from Slater's songbook. Craig Locicero tracked most of the guitars. The album was assembled like a Subway sandwich, all the way down to too much bread, nowhere near enough meat.

Tate says he is now working on a new concept album (not a Mindcrime 3, thankfully). Does anyone believe he can pull this off?

He'll get something out again before the court hearing because that's the kind of guy he is.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Some of the Frequency Unknown/Tate solo songs have potential ( I actually like "Hands of Gold" and "Cold" and a few others), but he needs to collaborate with someone besides Kelly Gray...maybe Wilton or Rockenfeld?

Uhh...what? The other guys split because Geoff kept not using their ideas.

The point I am trying to make is, the band needed to collaborate in order to function. The last albums have obviously not been cohesive. I know they talk through lawyers and hate each other.

[verslibre]

Some of the Frequency Unknown/Tate solo songs have potential ( I actually like "Hands of Gold" and "Cold" and a few others), but he needs to collaborate with someone besides Kelly Gray...maybe Wilton or Rockenfeld?

Uhh...what? The other guys split because Geoff kept not using their ideas.

The point I am trying to make is, the band needed to collaborate in order to function. The last albums have obviously not been cohesive. I know they talk through lawyers and hate each other.

The bottom line to the state of things as they are is that GT did not want to collaborate with his bandmates. He kept bringing in outsiders and using their material to mold Queensryche more into "his" band than "a band." For years, he said the other guys had no material. I've no doubt some of the songs on the TLT-Queensryche were ones that GT passed over.

[The_Noble_Cause]

That's fine. GT's collaborators just happened to suck. His new musical direction took the band backwards.

[verslibre]

That's fine. GT's collaborators just happened to suck. His new musical direction took the band backwards.

That's how Whip, Rock and Ed have felt for years.

[TageRyche]

After listening to the self-titled CD, sorry to disagree with you all, but I think the Tate CD is a shade better.

Both got three star reviews from me.

[conversationpc]

After listening to the self-titled CD, sorry to disagree with you all, but I think the Tate CD is a shade better.

Both got three star reviews from me.

No apologies necessary...We won't hold poor taste and tinnitus against you!

[Pelata]

I think there are good songs and poor songs on both CDs. The ToddRyche CD sounds like a band trying to sound like, or very influenced by, the old Queensryche without sounding like THE Queensryche. They don't quite nail it but do an admirable job trying to recapture the classic (legacy...hehe) sound of the band while still remaining somewhat modern. The songs themselves just don't stick w/ me or make me want to listen again once it's over.

That said, TateRyche's album isn't better, but it's not really worse either. Some of the songs are just no good...but the ones that I think ARE good, I like better than what I like on ToddRyche...if that makes any sense. Songs like "Cold", "In The Hands Of God", "Life Without You", "Weight Of The World" are all really strong songs that also sound like a good, modern Queensryche (helped along by the fact that Tate is actually singing them).

I will say though, that I did notice that Tate "talks" more on FU than he actually sings...there are very little held notes, vibrato and melody and a lot of talking, short, cut off words and attempts at attitude. So, as for "singing", ToddRyche takes that. Even on the FU songs I like, he does very little actual singing on them.

[verslibre]

I will say though, that I did notice that Tate "talks" more on FU than he actually sings...there are very little held notes, vibrato and melody and a lot of talking, short, cut off words and attempts at attitude. So, as for "singing", ToddRyche takes that. Even on the FU songs I like, he does very little actual singing on them.

Tate hasn't been a "singer" for years. And everything on that album was composed by somebody else, so if you like the best songs better than anything on the ToddRyche album, keep in mind Tate is not the composer. About all he produces that's original these days is whatever he leaves in the tidy bowl.

[Pelata]

I will say though, that I did notice that Tate "talks" more on FU than he actually sings...there are very little held notes, vibrato and melody and a lot of talking, short, cut off words and attempts at attitude. So, as for "singing", ToddRyche takes that. Even on the FU songs I like, he does very little actual singing on them.

Tate hasn't been a "singer" for years. And everything on that album was composed by somebody else, so if you like the best songs better than anything on the ToddRyche album, keep in mind Tate is not the composer. About all he produces that's original these days is whatever he leaves in the tidy bowl.

I'm sure he's writing at least some of the lyrics and melodies, so in that sense he's contributing to the composition....that's still part of songwriting.

[verslibre]

I read that he picked Slater's songbook clean, like a vulture.

[Starrider]

I read that he picked Slater's songbook clean, like a vulture.

I believe he also purchased songs from Lukas Rossi. "Cold" is one of those songs. I think it is the best song on the album, but Kelly Gray took a steaming dump all over it with that horrid guitar solo that doesn't really fit well with the rest of the song.

[verslibre]

Kelly Gray took a steaming dump all over it with that horrid guitar solo that doesn't really fit well with the rest of the song.

He sucks. It was probably the best he could do.

[Rip Rokken]

I read that he picked Slater's songbook clean, like a vulture.

I believe he also purchased songs from Lukas Rossi. "Cold" is one of those songs. I think it is the best song on the album, but Kelly Gray took a steaming dump all over it with that horrid guitar solo that doesn't really fit well with the rest of the song.

You are right about the guitar solo - it just seems bolted on, especially with the change of pace in the drums during the solo only.

Lukas Rossi's two songs are the best on the album. "Cold" is an instantly catchy tune, but it wore out quick to me. "In The Hands of God" is excellent, and like someone else said, it reminds me too of "Gonna Get Close To You". Both those songs have excellent production. Much of the rest of the album is not very well produced, and sounds very demo-ish. Many of the guest players on the album are wasted on these songs. A good example is "Running Backwards" - why hire K.K. Downing for this? Crap production, the guitar work is completely non-impressive, and Tate's vocals seem very weak on it. A waste of K.K.'s talent.

[Rip Rokken]

After listening to the self-titled CD, sorry to disagree with you all, but I think the Tate CD is a shade better.

Both got three star reviews from me.

No apologies necessary...We won't hold poor taste and tinnitus against you!

Wow... wondering how much of a Queensryche fan TageRyche is if he prefers the Tate CD to the excellent S/T with Todd La Torre.

[Starrider]

I read that he picked Slater's songbook clean, like a vulture.

I believe he also purchased songs from Lukas Rossi. "Cold" is one of those songs. I think it is the best song on the album, but Kelly Gray took a steaming dump all over it with that horrid guitar solo that doesn't really fit well with the rest of the song.

You are right about the guitar solo - it just seems bolted on, especially with the change of pace in the drums during the solo only.

Agreed. I always thought it was a bad cut & paste job, like they had Kelly Gray put his oven mitts on and start noodling and wanking all over his Flying V, and then someone either pasted it into that song as an accident or a joke.

If Billy Sherwood had stayed with that re-mixing project for more than two days, I'm sure he would have fixed it. He probably realized what he was getting himself into though and bailed.

[conversationpc]

Agreed. I always thought it was a bad cut & paste job, like they had Kelly Gray put his oven mitts on and start noodling and wanking all over his Flying V, and then someone either pasted it into that song as an accident or a joke.

If Billy Sherwood had stayed with that re-mixing project for more than two days, I'm sure he would have fixed it. He probably realized what he was getting himself into though and bailed.

Kelly Gray should not even be allowed near another guitarist playing a solo much less playing one himself.

[Starrider]

Agreed. I always thought it was a bad cut & paste job, like they had Kelly Gray put his oven mitts on and start noodling and wanking all over his Flying V, and then someone either pasted it into that song as an accident or a joke.

If Billy Sherwood had stayed with that re-mixing project for more than two days, I'm sure he would have fixed it. He probably realized what he was getting himself into though and bailed.

Kelly Gray should not even be allowed near another guitarist playing a solo much less playing one himself.

What makes it even more laughable is that he actually was in the real Queensryche (before getting fired). Can't believe they couldn't find someone better. To go from Chris DeGarmo to Kelly Gray...words can't describe the drop in talent there. I guess Geoff Tate was trying to fill the band with his cronies from Myth.

[verslibre]

I guess Geoff Tate was trying to fill the band with his cronies from Myth.

It's no guess.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Gotta say, that's some mighty fine keyboard playing at the start of the clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WTHhIqWewE

[verslibre]

Yup, Randy always mimes it. He didn't think the cameras were going to catch that in the perfect light of day.

And Geoff sounds like some guy at karaoke.

[Starrider]

Gotta say, that's some mighty fine keyboard playing at the start of the clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WTHhIqWewE

The irony of sounding so horrible on a song entitled "Best I Can." If that's the best you can do, then it's time to hang it up. There wasn't anything good about that performance from Monsters of Rock from any of those six guys.

[conversationpc]

Gotta say, that's some mighty fine keyboard playing at the start of the clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WTHhIqWewE

That's not even a difficult keyboard bit to play and then to just be finger-syncing (rather than lip-syncing) is rather ridiculous.