Batman V Superman: Dawn of Justice THREAD

[verslibre]

Here's something else you haven't touched: Black Widow is not an original Avenger in the comics, but is an original Avenger in the MCU. She was introduced in Iron Man 2 and she's been in three Marvel films — four, if you count Age of Ultron — and she's had no solo film. Why are you not complaining about that? Because you prefer what Marvel is doing, that's why.

That's a dumb comparison. If Marvel had went ahead and followed up Iron Man 1 with "Black Widow vs. Iron Man" then you would have a point. That's essentially what DC/Warner is doing with BvS. Also, when Marvel introduced her in Iron Man 2, they weren't cynically copying someone else's playbook like DC/WB is. And Black Widow is not even in the same league as Batman. Choosing to insert a somewhat obscure character like her into the Marvel universe has very little net effect on Marvel's profits. Shoehorning a popular figure like Batman into a Man of Steel sequel, on the other hand...well, that strikes many as a desperate hail Mary creative pass (and no, a blink-and-miss-it Wayne Enterprises satellite Easter egg in MOS did NOT constitute exposition or character development).

I don't see it that way. This is a pairing people have waited a long time for, with previous attempts that date back as far as fifteen years ago never getting off the ground. And how is DC copying Marvel's playbook? Isn't it NOT what they are doing, which has you guys sharpening your blades? You guys want multiple solo films for everybody before even two flagship characters interact with each other. And while you're correct where Black Widow and Batman are concerned (as if that needs to be said), my point is valid because she has figured largely in these movies, especially the second Cap flick, to the degree people think she should have her own film (and it looks like she will). Widow isn't a backgrounder or third stringer the way Hawkeye has been kept for now (he had more of a role as a puppet in Avengers). Widow has had a greater presence in the MCU than the Hulk, which makes her the #4, below Iron Man, Cap and Thor, whether by default or design.

Consider that these characters were unknown to the moviegoing public before 2008: Iron Man, Black Widow, Hawkeye, Marvel's Thor (who is not redhaired and does not sport a forked beard), the new Nick Fury (and everyone had forgotten about Hasselhoff's, anyway), and Phil Coulson — plus numerous others. An older well-known character (Captain America) and two out of that list have gotten solo movies, the rest have not, and the SHIELD show's timeline exists from these movies onward.

OTOH, everybody, even your Yahoo Chat buddies in Lithuania, know who Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman are.

Personally, I think this movie is screwed, and I cannot wait to come back here and see YoungJrynyFan spinning like a dervish boasting of all the unaccounted-for bootleg DVD sales and the film's strong box office numbers in former Yugoslav republics.

Hahaha, whatever you say.

[YoungJRNYfan]

Personally, I think this movie is screwed, and I cannot wait to come back here and see YoungJrynyFan spinning like a dervish boasting of all the unaccounted-for bootleg DVD sales and the film's strong box office numbers in former Yugoslav republics

After the huge success that will be BvS, I can't wait to see you back in the Justice League thread and hike up that post-count to feed that ego of yours. It's okay to love to hate this (closet DC fan; hater.) It's more interesting to talk about givin' the loud chirping of crickets in the Marvel Movie thread right about now.

[YoungJRNYfan]

Shoehorning a popular figure like Batman into a Man of Steel sequel

Wait, so this IS a Man of Steel sequel now? $50 bucks to me and v. Thanks.

...well, that strikes many as a desperate hail Mary creative pass

No it doesn't. It was widely known that the success's of Man of Steel formed the path to the destiny that was Justice League. Snyder intended for the DCCinmaticUniverse to start with Man of Steel. Justice League waited in those wings.

Now, it's all greenlighted. If DC was to throw a hail marry, they would have went straight into Justice League like everybody and their mother thought would happen. They didn't. Instead, they decided to develop Superman's story further by introducing Batman in an already established world.

WB would never mess or even put one of their billion dollar franchise's in danger and partner him up with a franchise in desperate need if they thought Man of Steel didn't turn out what they wanted; mind you a shift in character so soon from TDKTrilogy, where a LEGION of a fanbase was created and didn't want to see a different take on Batman so soon.

Inserting Batman was a logical move and was always going to happen in their plans and not having to worry about fleshing out yet another Batman origin reboot that would take years to make years down the road that wouldn't allow him to be apart of it all right away.

It's a ballsy move by DC in the midst of haters and their criticism's of Man of Steel by then announcing Batman V Superman (only a month where Man of Steel was still in theaters) and stuck to their guns of the universe they wanted to create in the darker tone they were building in Man of Steel. Right there, DC threw the middle finger right into the face of the TNC's and the Monker's of the world and debunked their petty and cynic theories of hate they have towards them.

(and no, a blink-and-miss-it Wayne Enterprises satellite Easter egg in MOS did NOT constitute exposition or character development).

Take a listen at 5:00-6:34:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExT5rqFqef0

I also disagree that it "doesn't constitute as character development." We see in the BvS footage that the development in BvS is there and is an ongoing story in Man of Steel, which was the theme brought up in Man of Steel over and over again in how the planet would react if an alien walks amongst us. It brings fear and what better hero to introduce to this story to the mass's that emulates fear better than Batman. It makes perfect sense even if you don't want it to.

[YoungJRNYfan]

Been waiting for this:

BvS teaser: HISHE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QFPuyDrIIk

[verslibre]

Been waiting for this:

BvS teaser: HISHE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QFPuyDrIIk

[Monker]

The difference here is DC is catering to a small segment of the movie buying public in order to keep comic book fans happy...that's not a very smart plan.

You wrote yesterday that for generally everybody Superman remains Christopher Reeve and Batman remains Adam West. That means you either forgot or chose to exclude all the fans of Michael Keaton's Batman and Christian Bale's Batman — you know, that last trilogy everybody talked about, out of which two films crossed the one billion mark?

The point I was making is the Batman/Superman that people think of is NOT the characters in BvS. You can take whatever actors you want to and substitude them. The point is the image people have of Batman isn't an old fat and grumpy middle aged dude. The image people have of Superman isn't a chronically depressed alien who needs therapy. So, to throw those two new characters into a movie together is going to confuse people.

I'm glad Snyder is doing something different. If he played it safe and made a pastiche, people would criticize DC/WB for treading (overly) familiar ground.

He wouldn't have to. They could have had a new Batman movie to show how he became this cynical character. The image I was left after TDK was a hero type who preferred being under the radar and could handle public ridicule. Also, Gordan consistantly defended him. Then towards the end, throw in a cameo of Superman doing something Batman found completely antagonizing...and you would have had BvS setup perfectly.

Do you know that movie Bryan Singer made, called Superman Returns? It's nearly ten years old now. That's exactly what you're saying they should do, only they already did it, and things didn't pan out.

No I'm not...I said MAYBE a Superman movie. The movie they NEEDED was a Batman movie. And, I am not asking to emulate Reeve. I am saying THAT is the image everybody thinks of...So, you need to do more to bridge the gap. Even at the end of MoS, Superman shows up with a "whatever" (a forget, a helicopter, 'whatever'?) and says he wanted to return it. Then they have a bit of conversation of spying on him...and Superman sounded VERY MUCH like Reeve's version.

Your saying something is amiss or not clearly outlined because the very first teaser doesn't spell everything out with wooden letter blocks is simply the result of bias.

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying the iconic characters that people "know" from the past films are NOT what is being delivered...and it's not what people want. To get to what people want, you have to take some time and get them used to the characters. This is VERY BASIC storytelling. Fall away from that and it's leaning towards failure.

So, for guys like you who need your Batman and Superman to have a conflict, you need to take the film and put it into the deep fat fryer rather than develop these new versions of the characters over a couple films. You don't care about introducing the character and showing their new and unfamiliar character traits...what you want is BvS rolled out at a fast food paced clip and instant gratification.

No, you're merely engaging in wordplay.

No, I'm not, and you know it. Character building was skipped and they went right into conflict. They rushed this.

You can't take what I said about the 'Ragnarok' story and attribute it to BvS, which picks up directly after the events of MoS.

I believe I did just that.

You're doing what everyone else is doing, grilling DC and giving Marvel a Speedpass. Here's the gist of BvS: Batman and Superman have a problem with each other because the former sees the latter as a threat. There will be more to it than that. There are all sorts of rumors of additional villains and heroes (perhaps even Robin).

You don't understand basic story telling....that is the problem here. How many villans and other heroes there are does not matter if nobody cares about the main characters.

Here's something else you haven't touched: Black Widow is not an original Avenger in the comics, but is an original Avenger in the MCU. She was introduced in Iron Man 2 and she's been in three Marvel films — four, if you count Age of Ultron — and she's had no solo film. Why are you not complaining about that? Because you prefer what Marvel is doing, that's why.

[/quote]

TNC already knocked this down.

However, what DC did was to go from Iron Man right into Civil War without any other films in between. That would have been ridiculous and I would have been just as critical. There is a pace and timing to be maintained in drama and story telling. Marvel knows what they are doing, DC is all fucked up and hasn't a clue.

[YoungJRNYfan]

You can worldbuild successfully without following the Marvel model. WB has an amazing track record in debunking that idiotic theory with films who did it similar than they are doing with Bvs; ala Harry Potter and Hobbit franchise. The Marvel koolaid has to be Stan Lee's urine pouring down the throats of Marvelites.

You don't need to flesh out yet again a Batman reboot to understand the core of his character. It's Batman. It's Superman. Everyone knows of these characters regardless of why they may butt heads. Getting their ass in the movie theater to find out is the answer, not 4 years in between another Batman solo and Justice League. Can't believe we can't insert the spoons in our own mouth nowadays.

[YoungJRNYfan]

I want to know where Hulk, Black Widow, Falcon, and Hawkeye's solo films are, let alone the other 1 million shoehorned into the MCU.

The Hulk is one of Marvel's and comic book's most popular superhero's. There was ALREADY two versions of the Hulk released to the public beforehand that ISN'T MCU's Hulk. I'm sure people didn't walk in the theater and was like "Who the fuck is this green guy? Where's this one's solo movie! I'm out!" probably because everybody already knows who the fucking Hulk is regardless. Or maybe they did.

The next Marvel movies subtitle should be DBSTDRD...Double standard.

[verslibre]

"Around and around it goes. Where it stops...nobody knows!"

The point is the image people have of Batman isn't an old fat and grumpy middle aged dude.

I don't see Adam West in BvS. You implied all people think of Adam West when they think of Batman. You can't possibly be referring to Ben Affleck because he's not old and fat. If you want to find out why he has a beef: watch the movie.

The image people have of Superman isn't a chronically depressed alien who needs therapy.

The Superman of the Silver Age was retooled by John Byrne in the '80s. The mythos was updated and given a clean overhaul. Mark Waid put his spin on it, too. So have others. By the way, the Superman of the Silver Age or the Modern Age would not take a six year mission to visit the remnants of an exploded Krypton, which is exactly what happened in Returns. (This is fully supported by Peter David; look him, and it, up.) Snyder is not doing this. Cavill's Superman is an ally of Earth, as he should be. If you'd like to know more: watch the movie.

They could have had a new Batman movie to show how he became this cynical character.

The movie they NEEDED was a Batman movie.

Don't worry, buddy. They'll get to it. And when they do, you can watch the movie.

They rushed this.

If you're going by that logic, Marvel is rushing Civil War, Ragnarok and Infinity War. Those are storylines that involve many characters, some of which are not currently available for Disney-Marvel to use, unfortunately. They're barely going to introduce Black Panther, who should already be established in the MCU for CW.

BvS is a conflict between two characters who are destined to be allies. I don't see the problem with this approach.

You can't take what I said about the 'Ragnarok' story and attribute it to BvS, which picks up directly after the events of MoS.

I believe I did just that.

That's because you're a funny guy.

You don't understand basic story telling....that is the problem here. How many villans and other heroes there are does not matter if nobody cares about the main characters.

Sounds like you'd better stop typing and get on Warner-DC's hotline and demand to speak to Zack Snyder. You'd better set him straight, or you'll take his job and do it better. Make sure he gets that.

{ }

TNC already knocked this down.

No, he didn't. My point remains a valid one. You don't have to like it, but you can't counter it.

However, what DC did was to go from Iron Man right into Civil War without any other films in between. That would have been ridiculous and I would have been just as critical. There is a pace and timing to be maintained in drama and story telling. Marvel knows what they are doing, DC is all fucked up and hasn't a clue.

Nope. That doesn't even qualify as an exaggeration. It's just bologna. I'd better get my bog boots.

[verslibre]

The Hulk is one of Marvel's and comic book's most popular superhero's. There was ALREADY two versions of the Hulk released to the public beforehand that ISN'T MCU's Hulk. I'm sure people didn't walk in the theater and was like "Who the fuck is this green guy? Where's this one's solo movie! I'm out!" probably because everybody already knows who the fucking Hulk is regardless. Or maybe they did.

Yeah, we have to know WHY RuffaHulk is the way he is. WHY does RuffaHulk get mad and big and green and grunt and smash?

It's NOT the way BanaHulk and NorHulk got mad and big and green and grunted and smashed. This is DIFFERENT. It needs its own proper, separate origin so people UNDERSTAND.


Zackisafraud!

[YoungJRNYfan]

All I want to know, is why is the Hulk look like Godzilla nowadays? He's now a cartoon? A CGI model? Why doesn't he have a fro? This isn't Hulk. People only view the Hulk as Lou Ferrigno. This new Hulk full of veins, muscle and grows to be a 10ft monster isn't the real Hulk the audience knows of him and recognizes him for. #BringFerrignoback.

[YoungJRNYfan]

I don't see Adam West in BvS. You implied all people think of Adam West when they think of Batman. You can't possibly be referring to Ben Affleck because he's not old and fat. If you want to find out why he has a beef: watch the movie.

#BEASTFLECK:

[verslibre]

People only view the Hulk as Lou Ferrigno.

This guy's the real Dr. Strange! Cumber-who?

[YoungJRNYfan]

The overall impression seems to be that Avengers: Age of Ultron is more of a cog in the works of the Marvel Cinematic Universe machine than a powerful standalone piece, and as such it assumes that the audience has a religious familiarity with all of the movies so far as well as a good idea of what stories are coming up. This might sound good to fans who want a comic book movie that caters to them, but it could leave more casual viewers confused and alienated.

That sounds awfully familiar!

And, that's fine. The difference here is DC is catering to a small segment of the movie buying public in order to keep comic book fans happy...that's not a very smart plan.

[Monker]

You can worldbuild successfully without following the Marvel model. WB has an amazing track record in debunking that idiotic theory with films who did it similar than they are doing with Bvs; ala Harry Potter and Hobbit franchise. The Marvel koolaid has to be Stan Lee's urine pouring down the throats of Marvelites.

Neither Harry Potter nor The Hobbit movies skipped over character building and went straight into conflict between the heroes. If they did the same as BvS, all of the characters would be bitching at each other in the first film. Those major character conflicts were saved until AFTER we got to know the main characters and gave a damn about them. Thorin may have been skeptical of Frodo, but by the end of the first film he was praising him In the third film, Thorin was ready to throw Frodo from the gates to "his" mountain. THAT is good story telling...get the audience to CARE about the characters before you begin to create such conflict. Harry Potter was the SAME WAY. The first film, they were all buddies...by the last two, they were at each others throats. BvS has the main heroes at each other throats IN THE FIRST FILM - horrible story telling.

You don't need to flesh out yet again a Batman reboot to understand the core of his character. It's Batman.

According YOU TWO, this is a Batman who is so cynical that he confronts someone who just saved the world from destruction. That is simply NOT the Batman people know. So, yes, explaining that character change in a separate move makes a lot more sense than giving the audience a fast food version of the story. I wasn't saying a new origin story had to happen...but an explanation of why he is so cynical would do a LOT to ease us into BvS.

Getting their ass in the movie theater to find out is the answer, not 4 years in between another Batman solo and Justice League. Can't believe we can't insert the spoons in our own mouth nowadays.

You are saying that people are going to go see BvS because they want to know why Batman is an asshole and Superman is depressed. People are more fickle than that and simply would rather stay home.

[Monker]

I want to know where Hulk, Black Widow, Falcon, and Hawkeye's solo films are, let alone the other 1 million shoehorned into the MCU.

By the looks of it, many will get their solo movies.

The Hulk is one of Marvel's and comic book's most popular superhero's. There was ALREADY two versions of the Hulk released to the public beforehand that ISN'T MCU's Hulk. I'm sure people didn't walk in the theater and was like "Who the fuck is this green guy? Where's this one's solo movie! I'm out!" probably because everybody already knows who the fucking Hulk is regardless. Or maybe they did.

That is absolutely correct. And, since the Hulk is essentially a one dimensional character that there were no plans to really change, everybody knows, get him angry and the "other guy" shows up. Nothing about that changed, there were already a couple solo movie - even if they were not MCU's - , so everybody knows what to expect from him.

[Monker]

I actually love that film and it's why I was excited to see a proper Dr. Strange movie was going to be made. I have no idea about the comics, but that old 70's movie showed there is a lot of potential for a great character and story there.

The sad truth is, Sherlock, Smaug, Khan, Cumber--who? has a name who will probably sell more tickets than the name "Dc Strange". And, you have to admit, he is perfectly cast. It's going to be an awesome movie.

People only view the Hulk as Lou Ferrigno.

This guy's the real Dr. Strange! Cumber-who?

[Monker]

All I want to know, is why is the Hulk look like Godzilla nowadays? He's now a cartoon? A CGI model? Why doesn't he have a fro? This isn't Hulk. People only view the Hulk as Lou Ferrigno. This new Hulk full of veins, muscle and grows to be a 10ft monster isn't the real Hulk the audience knows of him and recognizes him for. #BringFerrignoback.

Speaking of Godzilla...

There are plans for a King Kong vs. Godzilla movie. Wonder if Godzilla will be depressed that the world didn't like how he saved the world in the last film a few years ago...and I'm sure King Kong is now recovered from his heart transplant but is all pissy that some other giant monster was trampling all over his turf.

[Monker]

The overall impression seems to be that Avengers: Age of Ultron is more of a cog in the works of the Marvel Cinematic Universe machine than a powerful standalone piece, and as such it assumes that the audience has a religious familiarity with all of the movies so far as well as a good idea of what stories are coming up. This might sound good to fans who want a comic book movie that caters to them, but it could leave more casual viewers confused and alienated.

That sounds awfully familiar!

And, that's fine. The difference here is DC is catering to a small segment of the movie buying public in order to keep comic book fans happy...that's not a very smart plan.

Yep...except Marvel is catering to comic book MOVIE fans and DC is catering to comic book fans. It may seem the same but that is completely different. Marvel has a following for their movies now...and they can afford to do that. DC is catering to a smaller portion of the potential ticket buyers....and they are fans of a completely different medium.

[verslibre]

I actually love that film and it's why I was excited to see a proper Dr. Strange movie was going to be made. I have no idea about the comics, but that old 70's movie showed there is a lot of potential for a great character and story there.

The sad truth is, Sherlock, Smaug, Khan, Cumber--who? has a name who will probably sell more tickets than the name "Dc Strange". And, you have to admit, he is perfectly cast. It's going to be an awesome movie.

It was a joke.

I think Benny is in danger of overexposure. I was rooting for Joaquin Phoenix, actually. I think they made another safe play by going with Cumberkhansmauglock.

[verslibre]

There are plans for a King Kong vs. Godzilla movie.

Source?

There's a new Godzilla movie coming from Toho next year. Legendary's Godzilla 2 is scheduled for a 2018 release. The Kong movie I know of, Skull Island, is also coming from Legendary, scheduled for 2017 or thereabouts.

I don't know anything about another King Kong vs. Godzilla movie. Wouldn't work, anyway. Kong isn't that big. Godzilla would step on him or charbroil him and go for a swim.

Oh, wait...you're joking! Haha! You funny guy.

[verslibre]

According YOU TWO, this is a Batman who is so cynical that he confronts someone who just saved the world from destruction. That is simply NOT the Batman people know.

That's an oversimplification.

In this new DCCU, Kal-el isn't necessarily viewed as a savior by everybody. There's more than one angle. That's made crystal clear via the voiceovers. When superpowered humanoids show up and toss train cars like ping pong balls, not every ordinary human is going to be wowed. An element of fear will also be present. This was also seen in Man of Steel when Zod's ship arrived and Zod demanded Kal-el be turned over to him.

[YoungJRNYfan]

By the looks of it, many will get their solo movies.

So is Superman, Batman, Aquaman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Flash and Cyborg. The hypocrisy continues!

Yep...except Marvel is catering to comic book MOVIE fans and DC is catering to comic book fans.

When peddling backwards, shoulders square, short choppy feet, bend at the waist and nose over your toes to prevent falling backwards

That is absolutely correct. And, since the Hulk is essentially a one dimensional character that there were no plans to really change, everybody knows, get him angry and the "other guy" shows up. Nothing about that changed, there were already a couple solo movie - even if they were not MCU's - , so everybody knows what to expect from him.

There's more to the Hulk than just getting him angry and and he destroy's. They've tinkered with other aspects of Hulk's character before when it comes to the inner, philosophical struggle between Banner and the beast, let alone the things Banner can do with science with his mind and Hulk having feelings that can really add dimension to his character other than "ME MAD." He's not one dimensional. Marvel just doesn't know what to do with him in fear of his solo's crashing and burning like they did the first 2 outings.

BvS has the main heroes at each other throats IN THE FIRST FILM - horrible story telling.

No. You're not understanding the blueprint here. BvS is working in the same jest as the Potter and Hobbit films as far as world building is concerned. It doesn't matter if you follow the same tiring way to get there, WB knows what they are doing when it comes to world building and their track record speaks for it.

In this case, it's role reversal. Instead of having development of goodie goodie best friends at first and then have it develop towards angst, it's reversed. We will see the angst towards each other setup from the events of Man of Steel but the development phase will occur in the movie itself when other parties are involved that solve Superman and Batman's understanding of each other, hence: Dawn of Justice. There's MORE to this than just "BATMAN IS FIGHTING SUPERMAN THE WHOLE MOVIE! DERRDuhDUERR!" There's a reason for it. Watch to find out what's really happening.

It's not always what it seems at face value. It's clear that givin' the hardcore events that has happened in Man of Steel, there is already a great assumption as to why Batman, givin' his character, would be upset and not trust an alien without having all the facts or getting to know Kal-EL at a personal level. Right now, Kal-EL's a threat to many and people are scared of his power.

Remember, Superman was the first hero to be show his face world-wide. The others are in hiding. They don't know of each other yet. There will be first encounters at every turn and all of this will develop Superman and Batman further and lead into Justice League. You have to watch the movie. A teaser trailer is NOT going to show much of the plot. Trailer #2 and #3 and all the marketing will give a much more clearer picture to the audience. For now, the title sells : Batman V Superman and it got people wondering why. Job well done.

but an explanation of why he is so cynical would do a LOT to ease us into BvS.

That can be takin' care of very, very easily within' the movie itself and have Batman's backstory fleshed out during BvS. You don't need a whole solo movie to set that up and having to wait another 3 full years to see Batman's next adventure. The heart and origin of Batman will always be the same. It's an iconic tale that everybody knows. He is the way he is because of witnessing the death of his parents on that fateful night. Everybody knows this and the character and personality beats in BvS doesn't need a whole lot. At all. If you have a brain, you can connect to Batman's story quite quickly. Nothing of that aspect has changed with the character. EVER.

You are saying that people are going to go see BvS because they want to know why Batman is an asshole and Superman is depressed. People are more fickle than that and simply would rather stay home.

Wait until the official trailer revealing of the plot happens and maybe see our first shot of Wonder Woman and hell, maybe even Aquaman. You know the marketing doesn't stop at the first footage; teaser trailer, right? There's more the public will see. Wait until we see more lines from Alfred, Lois Lane, Clark Kent and Lex Luthor. Suddenly, there's more to the story than just Batman V Superman. There's questions that need answered and Justice League is right around the corner. The more people will see, the more hype it draws as release date nears.

[verslibre]

[verslibre]

No. You're not understanding the blueprint here. BvS is working in the same jest as the Potter and Hobbit films as far as world building is concerned. It doesn't matter if you follow the same tiring way to get there, WB knows what they are doing when it comes to world building and their track record speaks for it.

In this case, it's role reversal. Instead of having development of goodie goodie best friends at first and then have it develop towards angst, it's reversed. We will see the angst towards each other setup from the events of Man of Steel but the development phase will occur in the movie itself when other parties are involved that solve Superman and Batman's understanding of each other, hence: Dawn of Justice. There's MORE to this than just "BATMAN IS FIGHTING SUPERMAN THE WHOLE MOVIE! DERRDuhDUERR!" There's a reason for it. Watch to find out what's really happening.

Some people prefer (require) an extremely traditional approach to storytelling. Prelude (catalyst), first act (introduce the characters), second act (introduce the conflict), third act (climax without protection), and all that jizz. I mean jazz.

It's pretty obvious that something will turn the tide at a certain point, and Bats ad Supes (and rumor has it, Wondy) will join forces against another foe/force that poses a greater threat to innocents. It's supposed to end on a cliffhanger (so I hear, but it's all up in the air). I don't know why some people don't get that, but what can you do?

I have this friend who I used to eat lunch with 1-2 times a week when we worked near each other. We'd go to our favorite Chinese place, a great hole-in-the-wall. This wasn't like Panda, this was good stuff. However, every time we went, my friend would place the same order. Exactly the same, every single time, without fail. "Orange chicken." I would always go, "Dude, get the Mongolian beef, it's really fuckin' good!" "Try to 'Tso' combo, chicken with onions, veggies, she uses a lot of spice." "Hey, get the #12. Looks awesome." NOPE. Always, always, always the same 'orange chicken' order. He wanted to eat the same thing, every single time. I understand the comfort in sticking to the same old, same old, but some people are like this with their movies, their books, their music.

[YoungJRNYfan]

[YoungJRNYfan]

Good CHRIST Leto

[verslibre]

Henry Cavill Tells Us Why ‘Dawn Of Justice’ Is Not ‘A Superman Sequel’

“I wouldn’t call this a Superman sequel,” Cavill said, while promoting his spy drama “The Man from U.N.C.L.E.” with co-star Armie Hammer. “This is Batman versus Superman. It’s a separate entity altogether. It’s introducing the Batman character and expanding upon the universe, which was kicked off by ’Man of Steel.'”

http://www.mtv.com/news/2140143/henry-cavill-dawn-of-justice-not-superman-film/

[YoungJRNYfan]

Joss Whedon:

"I found [the trailer for ‘Batman v Superman’] interesting," Joss Whedon told Yahoo! Movies in a recent interview when asked for his thoughts on the recently released teaser for Zack Snyder's Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice. "Because they’re bringing up a lot of issues that we bring up in ‘Age of Ultron’ and I think it’s inevitable. People with power, who are good, do not always agree and it makes perfect sense for me that [Batman and Superman] would fight. And besides… Batman and Superman are gonna fight! I’m so excited! I’m so excited!" That's not the answer some DC hating fanboys probably wanted to hear, and both Chris Evans and Jeremy Renner - neither of whom have seen the teaser - were equally diplomatic. "How does anyone fight Superman?" asks Evans. "I feel like [Superman] would bulldoze our whole squad, they really wrote him unfairly. It’s not fair, he’s got too much."

[YoungJRNYfan]

Henry Cavill Tells Us Why ‘Dawn Of Justice’ Is Not ‘A Superman Sequel’

“I wouldn’t call this a Superman sequel,” Cavill said, while promoting his spy drama “The Man from U.N.C.L.E.” with co-star Armie Hammer. “This is Batman versus Superman. It’s a separate entity altogether. It’s introducing the Batman character and expanding upon the universe, which was kicked off by ’Man of Steel.'”

http://www.mtv.com/news/2140143/henry-cavill-dawn-of-justice-not-superman-film/

^Yep. This is a Man of Steel sequel. The Justice League universe hinged on Man of Steel and the world building that goes into that. Introducing Batman kills two birds with one stone. Not only does it continue Superman's story and focus's on Superman, others come out to play into the Man of Steel world to set it all up. It's logical. Superman will have a Super-solo probably after Justice League 1 or 2 , as announced. So will Bats.