Classic Journey

[perryfaithful]

You (YAK) & NC sure have a lot in common
Lori

GEE...let's think about this????

[The_Noble_Cause]

You (YAK) & NC sure have a lot in common
Lori

GEE...let's think about this????

I don't like what you're implying.

Me and Yak are two completely separate individuals who just so happen to share similarities on the most tenuous of levels, that being a mutual enjoyment from a band called Journey.

Yup, that's right, PF.
There are actually multiple people on this board who listen to Journey and post here. They are not all (as you like to seem to believe) just one person using varying sns.
What a mind fuck this theory must be for you!
A succesful rock band around for over 30 years having more than one fan. Wow! Go figure! Imagine that!
Go wrap your head around that for a while (that is, if your pea sized brain hasn't exploded from sheer bewilderment already).

As I stated, me and Yak don't know each other and are two diff. people.
Any claim to the opposite is a lie and I won't tolerate it.

[jrnyman28]

And jrnyman, you say that without Augeri & Deen there would have been no award."

What you fail to understand that IF Steve Perry had NOT been in the band, Journey would NOT have been successful!

Not true. I have never taken anything away from what Perry contributed to the band. That is where we differ...I see Perry as a huge PART of the band. And he was certainly a huge PART of why Journey was successful.

But to be honest, you have NO IDEA if Journey would have been successful or not. Most of Infinity was already written, Robert's version of For You sounded good. Maybe not HUGE, but it still could have been a success. There has always been a lot of talent in Journey and I think there would still have been success. I agree that it may not have been as huge, but still there.

Remember it was "Perry who brought the success to the band". That is what Neal stated that in BHTM,

Another way to say that would be 'With Perry came success.' That does not mean he is the reason, it means he and success came at the same time. But still, I don't take anything away from Perry's contributions.

so with that said, it is BECAUSE OF PERRY & the success he brought to the band that Augeri & Deen were recieving an award in the first place!!!

Lori

True to some extent...it is because of Journey's HISTORY that Steve and Deen recieved the award. But still true that it is because of Steve and Deen that Journey recieved the award. (And this is a fact as one of the key members of JPP has addressed this issue and stated that had the Journey not continued, JPP never would have existed and felt compelled to honor Journey as they have.)

[yak]

What do I care that somebody else thought that Augeri looked like Tiny Tim. I didn't make the remark that YOU feel is so offensive, so take it up with that person.

No, but one of your buddies, all of whom you consistently agree with, DID make it. You never have a point of your own to make, you just jump into somebody elses post every so often and say something like "I totally agree!" You waste more bandwith than any other poster here.

I don't like what you're implying.

Me and Yak are two completely separate individuals who just so happen to share similarities on the most tenuous of levels, that being a mutual enjoyment from a band called Journey.

Yup, that's right, PF.
There are actually multiple people on this board who listen to Journey and post here. They are not all (as you like to seem to believe) just one person using varying sns.


As I stated, me and Yak don't know each other and are two diff. people.
Any claim to the opposite is a lie and I won't tolerate it.

DITTO

You must be desperate for attention to imply that we are the same poster. Look into your own house for that one.

Furthermore, I do NOT know Noble Cause, only from this board. Like him, I came here for Journey information and talk. Some like to put their foot in the mud and kick it up in the Journey fans faces. Don't blame Journey fans for your idol's disappearance from the scene. He obviously has issues of some kind that prevent him from commitment. He has had said issues for decades now.

[jrnyman28]

I also don't understand discounting "Lights" and "Lovin', Touchin', Squeezin" that come from the pre-Cain days. Even though Escape was their most successful album that doesn't necessarily mean none of the songs on the previous three albums were hit worthy.

Funny you should use the term "hit worthy". That would mean worthy of being a hit but was not. I certainly feel that Remember Me, Higher Place, Loved By You, Kiss Me Softly, Walking Away From The Edge and I Can Breathe are ALL hit worthy! And while that is just MY opinion you are certainly welcome to not share it. But the fact is that radio is different these days and hits by 'classic rock' bands are slim. Most bands from 20+ years ago only garner radio attention by using the reunion gimmick. And Journey would have (and did to some extent) do this with TBF. One of the reasons WYLAW was successful was the fact that Journey had REUNITED.

[jrnyman28]

[( I don't know where Augeri worked before joining Journey).

If you read this thread you would know where he worked.

I guess it is just too tough of a discussion for you to handle, so you rather divert the conversation to Augeri's previous job, than discuss the the REAL truth that Augeri has NOT made his OWN MARK in Journey OR the music business!

Yet again, a difference of OPINION. To those of us who support and appreciate Steve Augeri it is OBVIOUS the mark he has left in Journey. The music business is a whole different beast. it has changed since the time when Journey ruled the airwaves and you are being ignorant if you chose to ignore that. (That may have been a redundant statement. )

And for EVERYONE ELSE HERE, I HAVE SEEN Augeri/Journey in concert before, so yes, I gave AUGERI an opportunity to show me his own talents. He was ok!

While seeing Steve and giving him a chance are two different things, it is nice to know that you are not basing your opinions SOLELY on the words of others.

I've seen Steve Perry in concert 3 times with Journey! Steve Perry was Fantastic!!!

When was the last time?

As for "your poor misguided thought" NC, that "I'm angry" at Perry because he isn't singing, I have always supported him & will continue to support Perry for whatever choice he makes in his life. Perry is & always will be my favorite singer, no matter what he does!!!!!

Fair enough.

However, what has made "me angry" is that YOU & SOME others here don't allow for others to speak their opinions & views that are DIFFERENT from your own.


Lori

I don't believe that is true. You seem to mistake differing opinions and attempts to have you see the other side as 'not allowing you to speak your opinions'. Not true at all.

[PROPERRY]

You (YAK) & NC sure have a lot in common
Lori

GEE...let's think about this????

Perryfaithful,

I was already thinking the same thing you were about NC & Yak being the same person.

I believe the reason NC viciously attacks us is because HE fear's others MIGHT start questioning that as a possibility too!

Lori

[jrnyman28]

2) Cain did have hit magic with both the Babys and Bad English - more so than Perry had with Street Talk

Interesting info from the "H" man....Herbie Herbert re Street Talk

It went double platinum in America.  At the time (it was) the second most successful solo album by an artist leaving a major group - second only to Bella Donna by Stevie Nicks.  Whether it's Daryl Hall and John Oates, or the members of Pink Floyd, or the members of the Cars, or the members of Foreigner, or the members of Boston - every guy that ever tried a solo album - it was just a prescription for failure.  No way.  Stevie Nicks and Steve Perry were the only ones that were successful.

They were not the ONLY ones that were successful, they were just the two MOST successful ones. There is a difference.

And you will notice that singers have more success solo than other members of the band. That is simply because they are already the focal point of a group. Even a singer who doesn't write a single song or melody can have success based on the fact that they have been the focal point of a group.

The point you are missing is the comparison between the success of Journey AND the success of Perry. Without Jon and Neal's contributions, Perry's solo outings were less successful than Journey's.

[jrnyman28]

You (YAK) & NC sure have a lot in common
Lori

GEE...let's think about this????

Perryfaithful,

I was already thinking the same thing you were about NC & Yak being the same person.

I believe the reason NC viciously attacks us is because HE fear's others MIGHT start questioning that as a possibility too!

Lori

Oh PUH-LEEZE! They are not the same person! And who cares if they are? It is ridiculous to resort to that kind of a defense. Stand up for your beliefs but quit with the personal asides.

And before anybody wigs out, I will say this:
Noble_Cause, while I agree with most of your posts, I do think you portray yourself as angry. That is a useless emotion on a Journey Board. It will do you no good. Do not let Perry fans make you angry, it is a waste of energy. Stick to your facts, your opinions, your discussions. Drop the anger, attitude and personal attacks. How can you expect anyone to even give your views a chance if they don't like how you present them. People who feel attacked get defensive...and therefore could never be open to another view. Attacking a poster is a futile action.

[PROPERRY]

[( I don't know where Augeri worked before joining Journey).

If you read this thread you would know where he worked.

I guess it is just too tough of a discussion for you to handle, so you rather divert the conversation to Augeri's previous job, than discuss the the REAL truth that Augeri has NOT made his OWN MARK in Journey OR the music business!

Yet again, a difference of OPINION. To those of us who support and appreciate Steve Augeri it is OBVIOUS the mark he has left in Journey. The music business is a whole different beast. it has changed since the time when Journey ruled the airwaves and you are being ignorant if you chose to ignore that. (That may have been a redundant statement. )

And for EVERYONE ELSE HERE, I HAVE SEEN Augeri/Journey in concert before, so yes, I gave AUGERI an opportunity to show me his own talents. He was ok!

While seeing Steve and giving him a chance are two different things, it is nice to know that you are not basing your opinions SOLELY on the words of others.

I've seen Steve Perry in concert 3 times with Journey! Steve Perry was Fantastic!!!

When was the last time?

As for "your poor misguided thought" NC, that "I'm angry" at Perry because he isn't singing, I have always supported him & will continue to support Perry for whatever choice he makes in his life. Perry is & always will be my favorite singer, no matter what he does!!!!!

Fair enough.

However, what has made "me angry" is that YOU & SOME others here don't allow for others to speak their opinions & views that are DIFFERENT from your own.


Lori

I don't believe that is true. You seem to mistake differing opinions and attempts to have you see the other side as 'not allowing you to speak your opinions'. Not true at all.

Jrnyman,

This thread is 7 or more pages long now, so forgive me for not knowing what Augeri did for a living before he joined Journey. It really doesn't matter what kind of job he had before being in Journey.

As for all the fans that enjoy Augeri & feel that he has made "his mark" with them that is fine, but not everyone of us feel that way & have a different opinions about it.

As I said Augeri has been in Journey for 7 years & the majority of the years he has been singing the songs that Perry, Cain, & Schon wrote, so really I don't view that as making his OWN mark in Journey. That is my opinion!


And Yes, I did go see Augeri/Journey in concert. I think it was called "The vacation's Over Tour". It was Augeri's first tour. As I said before, Augeri was ok!


Jrnyman, I don't have a problem seeing the other side.The problem is that someone is attacking us for our opinions & doing alot of name calling towards Perry fans.

I can tell you that I will NEVER see that particular person's side of things for the way he behaves & talks to Perry fans.

Lori

[The_Noble_Cause]

I can tell you that I will NEVER see that particular person's side of things for the way he behaves & talks to Perry fans.

Of course you wont. You are a dyed in the wool zealot ideaologue. You are not here for debate, you are here for purposes of disruption. All talk about the current lineup of Journey is to be hijacked and overturned into a discussion about Steve Perry. You are not fooling anyone.

In the world of online Journey fandom, you are the cyber equivalency of the Al-Queda terrorist group. You are here only to destroy. All you want to do is obliterate any discussion of the new lineup. The U.S. doesn't negotiate with terrorists and similarly, I would hope everyone here would be wise enough not to negotiate (or even try to talk rationally) with you.
-Your agenda is perfectly clear.



Monker said it best.....

[this forum] is used for the attempted destruction of anything Journey, and people defending the band, or attacking Perry in response.

I can play that game...But, the others who come here to go down that road should not PRETEND that they are here for a civil discusion - because they are not..and they will not get one from me.

[Kuroneko1]

Steve Augeri did not join Journey straight from a bath tube singing career. Tall stories album still remains as a melodic rock gem. Tyketto at the other hand is a well known melodic rock band who made quite a fuss in its heyday.
Working at GAP is not a crime. There is nothing wrong with making a honest living. Diving for pearls singer used to work as a singer waiter in a italian restaurant. There are many others who have to work at day time jobs even they are still active in music industry. Not everyone is that lucky to make tons of money and disappear in mansions.
I listen various types of rock and metal and let me tell you, talented people are hard to come these days. Apart from melodic rock and hard rock scene, bands do not need real singers or musicians any more, just look at the bloody linkin park or puddle of mudd etc! Also melodic rock bands are not topping charts anymore and AOR became more like an alternative scene. Basicly guys like Augeri are too good for the modern music scene these days. It is difficult for such people to find serious people doing serious music. Thank God, for the last 5 years, melodic rock started to rise and many old talents are back like Mickey Thomas, Joseph Williams etc...
Steve Augeri took a big risk by replacing a legend. He did just fine with remember me single, arrival album and Red 13. Accusing him as singing other peoples songs is unfair because he is singing JOURNEY's songs not Steve Perry's solo stuff. If Perry contributed in some songs in last Journey album that does not mean they are "his" songs.
His concert performances are quite good and he never went ballistic because he is in Journey. He is the guy in front but sure knows when to step back. His contribution to song writing will improve in time. He had very big shoes to fill and he did not have any problems with it like Gary Creone in Van Halen.
Thank God Augeri is here and fronting this mighty band. Instead of sending him back to GAP why not giving this humble and talented guy a chance. After all he does look like a guy to be relied on. I mean at least you dont hae to wait for him for ages to have another Journey album.
Ladies and Gentlemen, like it or not, hate him or love him, Augeri is the lead singer of this band now. Living in past and thinking about Journey as the Perry's own property OR moving on is your choice. Imagining Perry as the lead singer of the band may sound good to you but after all it is the reality that counts. And this reality is called Steve Augeri.

[Eric]

perryfaithful,

Granted - Street Talk was a big hit, but as a solo artist Perry is just a one hit wonder with no staying power. He needs Journey for rock credibility.....

[perryfaithful]

2) Cain did have hit magic with both the Babys and Bad English - more so than Perry had with Street Talk

Interesting info from the "H" man....Herbie Herbert re Street Talk

It went double platinum in America.  At the time (it was) the second most successful solo album by an artist leaving a major group - second only to Bella Donna by Stevie Nicks.  Whether it's Daryl Hall and John Oates, or the members of Pink Floyd, or the members of the Cars, or the members of Foreigner, or the members of Boston - every guy that ever tried a solo album - it was just a prescription for failure.  No way.  Stevie Nicks and Steve Perry were the only ones that were successful.

They were not the ONLY ones that were successful, they were just the two MOST successful ones. There is a difference.

And you will notice that singers have more success solo than other members of the band. That is simply because they are already the focal point of a group. Even a singer who doesn't write a single song or melody can have success based on the fact that they have been the focal point of a group.

The point you are missing is the comparison between the success of Journey AND the success of Perry. Without Jon and Neal's contributions, Perry's solo outings were less successful than Journey's.

Actually Dave....and Eric also......I would have clearly stated my point if I was trying to make one! I called it "interesting info" I guess the mention of Street Talk made me think of that interview and Herbies words regarding the success of lead singers of that era breaking away from their VERY successful groups and doing a solo album! Sorry........no need to beat me up!

[perryfaithful]

And before anybody wigs out, I will say this:
Noble_Cause, while I agree with most of your posts, I do think you portray yourself as angry. That is a useless emotion on a Journey Board. It will do you no good. Do not let Perry fans make you angry, it is a waste of energy. Stick to your facts, your opinions, your discussions. Drop the anger, attitude and personal attacks. How can you expect anyone to even give your views a chance if they don't like how you present them. People who feel attacked get defensive...and therefore could never be open to another view. Attacking a poster is a futile action.

Well put Dave! I have just received a private message from Mr. Noble Cause calling me a Stupid Fat Wench Dumb ass buck toothed pig. Just Tornado Jackson with a new nic. It no longer matters what his message is. I would hope this is NOT the kind of company anyone here keeps off the boards

[The_Noble_Cause]

And before anybody wigs out, I will say this:
Noble_Cause, while I agree with most of your posts, I do think you portray yourself as angry. That is a useless emotion on a Journey Board. It will do you no good. Do not let Perry fans make you angry, it is a waste of energy. Stick to your facts, your opinions, your discussions. Drop the anger, attitude and personal attacks. How can you expect anyone to even give your views a chance if they don't like how you present them. People who feel attacked get defensive...and therefore could never be open to another view. Attacking a poster is a futile action.

Well put Dave! I have just received a private message from Mr. Noble Cause calling me a Stupid Fat Wench Dumb ass buck toothed pig. Just Tornado Jackson with a new nic. It no longer matters what his message is. I would hope this is NOT the kind of company anyone here keeps off the boards

Oh, and while you're at it, don't forget to include this little doozy of a private message you sent the other night stating (ahem, and I quote).

"Might as well stop now, sweetie! You UNJourney fans are nearly done for. Give it a rest! Only the Steve Perry years matter! That is why they are the only ones people talk about. Steve Perry is still missed after all these years. What does that say about Tiny Tim's less than reputable talent? Clearly, he is not leaving a very lasting impression on people!!!! Of course he's not, you can't replace the only true voice of Journey, Steve Perry!
People don't want to hear a cover band, they want the REAL thing. "The Steve Perry years", of course!! After the new album sells less than Arrival and Red 13 combined Neal is sure to hang it up for good. No wonder he is looking to start other bands these days. Better start kissing you and your precious band goodbye "

Like I said, you are soooooooooooooo evily transparent.
You will not quit until you see that all fans of the current group are disuaded from talking openly about their favorite band here.

Some may wish to play along with your game, but I am not one of them.

As I said before, in the world of online Journey fandom, you are the cyber equivalency of the Al-Queda terrorist group. You are here only to destroy. All you want to do is obliterate any discussion of the new lineup. The U.S. doesn't negotiate with terrorists and similarly, I would hope everyone here would be wise enough not to negotiate (or even try to talk rationally) with you.
-Your agenda is perfectly clear.

[perryfaithful]

[quote="The_Noble_Cause"]

Oh, and while you're at it, don't forget to include this little doozy of a private message you sent the other night stating (ahem, and I quote).


I have not sent a message to Noble Cause. This is sick

[jrnyman28]

Jrnyman,

This thread is 7 or more pages long now, so forgive me for not knowing what Augeri did for a living before he joined Journey. It really doesn't matter what kind of job he had before being in Journey.

Except you specifically responed to NC's post in which he stated that Steve Augeri worked at the GAP. Are you not even reading the posts you disagree with?

As for all the fans that enjoy Augeri & feel that he has made "his mark" with them that is fine, but not everyone of us feel that way & have a different opinions about it.

And no one said you had to. But you act as if you are right and that everyone should agree with you. All I am saying is that others feel that Steve HAS made his mark with Journey. And whether you like it or not, that is true. And if others feel that Steve HAS made his mark on Journey than Steve HAS made his mark on Journey.

As I said Augeri has been in Journey for 7 years & the majority of the years he has been singing the songs that Perry, Cain, & Schon wrote, so really I don't view that as making his OWN mark in Journey. That is my opinion!

And I understand where you are coming from. But it there are more ways to 'make your mark'. Steve has been involved with creating Arrival and Red13. He is heavily involved with the creation of the new CD. He has brought old songs back to life. He has spread the love of Journey around the country (and world if you include South America and Japan tour dates). He has been a key part of the recognition Journey has been recieving these past couple of years. So, while the business world makes it difficult for Steve to make an impact on a large public scale, Journey and Steve have continued to create music and share Journey's music with the masses.

And Yes, I did go see Augeri/Journey in concert. I think it was called "The vacation's Over Tour". It was Augeri's first tour. As I said before, Augeri was ok!

I agree, Steve was OK on Vacation's over. That was the 2nd leg of his first tour with Journey. He was timid for the first part of the show and he struggled occasionally with some of the material. But since then Steve has grown to be a commanding figure on stage. He really relates to the audience, he feeds off of their love and adoration. He truly fronts this band on stage. And he is singing these Journey songs in HIS voice now, instead of trying to sing so much like Perry. That was a fault early on, but understandable. I think when you have heard a song done a certain way all your life, and you know the audience has too, you want to portray the song that way. But after singing these songs for 7 years he can feel them as his own. That makes it easier to express them as your own. And that is what he is doing now. I think the turning point was the Under The Radar Tour last year. That was definately, by far, the best Journey show I have ever seen!

Jrnyman, I don't have a problem seeing the other side.The problem is that someone is attacking us for our opinions & doing alot of name calling towards Perry fans.

I agree that NC's tactics are in poor taste and I have said so twice before in this thread. However, you have yet to concede someone else's opinion. You have yet to say anything like 'I see where you are coming from but' or 'I agree but' or 'That could be true but'. Of course it is not just you, or 'your side', very few people seem to take the time to atleast understand a little of the other side.

I can tell you that I will NEVER see that particular person's side of things for the way he behaves & talks to Perry fans.

Lori

I understand that completely and said the exact same thing in another post. However, NC does not always post like that. It is obvious that he starts posting like that when he gets frustrated. If you (or your side) could have appeared the least bit open to what he (or his side) was saying, even without agreeing, he may not have gotten so 'angry'. Either way, nothing will change. No one's opinions will change and I suspect no one's internet ettiquette will either. So Journey fans will continue to go 'round and 'round and never reach a civil understanding.

[jrnyman28]

Please, let's quit with the PM's, sharing the PM's or fabricating the PM's. They have NO PLACE on the board!

Let's get back to the topic or move on. Quit getting personal!

[NealIsGod]

Boy, a lot of unstable people on here with no sense of reality or priorities. You know who you are.

[jrnyman28]

Actually Dave....and Eric also......I would have clearly stated my point if I was trying to make one! I called it "interesting info" I guess the mention of Street Talk made me think of that interview and Herbies words regarding the success of lead singers of that era breaking away from their VERY successful groups and doing a solo album! Sorry........no need to beat me up! [/color]

No one is beating you up. But you were using this "information" as an illustration of your point. It is true that Perry had a successful solo cd (one cd, FTLOSM was not a hit.) and at that time he may have been the 2nd most successful solo by a lead singer from a group, but when you compare his success IN Journey to his success OUT of Journey than you see that all of them were a PART of the magic that made Journey successful. And that point is directly related to the conversation.

Sadly, I would imagine the likes of Justin Timberlake has moved Perry down the list. But, if you want to talk about lead singer solo career than we should talk about Stevie Nicks, Phil Collins and Don Henley. You could probably add Tom Petty since he has a successful career with the Heartbreakers and without. These are artists who may not have had huge solo DEBUT success but have had a very successful solo career. Unfortunately, for whatever reasons, Perry has not had a successful solo career. Street Talk will be remembered mostly for Oh Sherrie, a song that sounds very much like a Journey song. Yes there were other minor hits "Foolish Heart" and "Strung Out" but ultimately, as a solo artist, Perry is a one-hit wonder. (Sadly, the best of his solo work, and the stuff that actually sounded solo, was never released as singles). He shelved (had shelved) his 2nd solo CD, Against The Wall. FTLOSM had ONE single that got attention and it sounded WAY TOO much like a Journey song (IMO). And GH+5 did next to nothing. Journey fans bought his CDs but he did not 'leave his mark' on the world as a solo artist. Perry had three opportunities: 2 full cds and a GH CD with 7 previously 'unheard' songs. Journey has put out 1 full cd and an EP with 4 songs on it. Maybe we should wait until Journey has released the same amount of material as Perry before we compare them. Of course it won't make much of a difference, I don't see Journey ever having another big hit. Too much has changed. But in my eyes, if Journey NOW can be almost equally successful as Perry solo THEN (in that musical climate) than I would say that Journey has triumphed. But that's just me...Perry fans probably won't get it.

[PROPERRY]

And before anybody wigs out, I will say this:
Noble_Cause, while I agree with most of your posts, I do think you portray yourself as angry. That is a useless emotion on a Journey Board. It will do you no good. Do not let Perry fans make you angry, it is a waste of energy. Stick to your facts, your opinions, your discussions. Drop the anger, attitude and personal attacks. How can you expect anyone to even give your views a chance if they don't like how you present them. People who feel attacked get defensive...and therefore could never be open to another view. Attacking a poster is a futile action.

Well put Dave! I have just received a private message from Mr. Noble Cause calling me a Stupid Fat Wench Dumb ass buck toothed pig. Just Tornado Jackson with a new nic. It no longer matters what his message is. I would hope this is NOT the kind of company anyone here keeps off the boards

Oh, and while you're at it, don't forget to include this little doozy of a private message you sent the other night stating (ahem, and I quote).

"Might as well stop now, sweetie! You UNJourney fans are nearly done for. Give it a rest! Only the Steve Perry years matter! That is why they are the only ones people talk about. Steve Perry is still missed after all these years. What does that say about Tiny Tim's less than reputable talent? Clearly, he is not leaving a very lasting impression on people!!!! Of course he's not, you can't replace the only true voice of Journey, Steve Perry!
People don't want to hear a cover band, they want the REAL thing. "The Steve Perry years", of course!! After the new album sells less than Arrival and Red 13 combined Neal is sure to hang it up for good. No wonder he is looking to start other bands these days. Better start kissing you and your precious band goodbye "

Like I said, you are soooooooooooooo evily transparent.
You will not quit until you see that all fans of the current group are disuaded from talking openly about their favorite band here.

Some may wish to play along with your game, but I am not one of them.

As I said before, in the world of online Journey fandom, you are the cyber equivalency of the Al-Queda terrorist group. You are here only to destroy. All you want to do is obliterate any discussion of the new lineup. The U.S. doesn't negotiate with terrorists and similarly, I would hope everyone here would be wise enough not to negotiate (or even try to talk rationally) with you.
-Your agenda is perfectly clear.

NC,

YOU remind me of a "school yard bully". You know the kind that continually harass and beats up on others because they may be different in some way.

In this case though, it is the Perry fans who are viewed as "different" and even as an "evil threat" to you( NC), simply because we express our OWN opinions.

It really bothers you (NC) that we don't share your same opinions & beliefs about the current line up, so you go into a rage & overly exaggerate & compare Perry fans to "Al-Queda-terrorist group."

NC, I really wonder about YOUR state of mind????????

Gosh Perryfaithful, are we the only ones that see this about NC???

And Perryfaithful, I believe you did not send that message to NC because you have more "control of yourself" & don't flip out over a person's post because the opinion is different than yours.

And given NC's behavior on this board toward Perry fans & that HE shows that he has NO CONTROL over himself, and is contantly name calling towards those that don't agree with him. I believe NC is very capable of sending that kind of a message that Perryfaithful recieved in her private email.

NC, I just want you to know that I will continue to express my points of views here, regardless of how much you call me names & attack me, so again, learn to take your OWN advice & DEAL WITH IT!!!

Lori

[perryfaithful]

...Perry fans probably won't get it.

More than half the problem here is that "Perry fans" are are all lumped together, a mass with a single mind, a single agenda, a single......whatever! Not right! It is as if there is no more consideration given to ones posts than, "oh well, it's a Perry fan and all Perry fans think alike so even if one said it, Hell they would all say it anyway!"

I consider you to be a pretty classy guy Dave so I have to say I am disappointed that you would gloss over some of the behavior here by your fellow fans of Journey. Being called disgusting names, whether on the board OR in a private message, should not be tolerated by anyone. I do not care WHO you are a fan of or not a fan of. Believe me, if you were the person being harassed I would not think twice about defending you, no matter what differences we had regarding our experiences with Journey over the years.

[PROPERRY]

Jrnyman,

This thread is 7 or more pages long now, so forgive me for not knowing what Augeri did for a living before he joined Journey. It really doesn't matter what kind of job he had before being in Journey.

Except you specifically responed to NC's post in which he stated that Steve Augeri worked at the GAP. Are you not even reading the posts you disagree with?

As for all the fans that enjoy Augeri & feel that he has made "his mark" with them that is fine, but not everyone of us feel that way & have a different opinions about it.

And no one said you had to. But you act as if you are right and that everyone should agree with you. All I am saying is that others feel that Steve HAS made his mark with Journey. And whether you like it or not, that is true. And if others feel that Steve HAS made his mark on Journey than Steve HAS made his mark on Journey.

As I said Augeri has been in Journey for 7 years & the majority of the years he has been singing the songs that Perry, Cain, & Schon wrote, so really I don't view that as making his OWN mark in Journey. That is my opinion!

And I understand where you are coming from. But it there are more ways to 'make your mark'. Steve has been involved with creating Arrival and Red13. He is heavily involved with the creation of the new CD. He has brought old songs back to life. He has spread the love of Journey around the country (and world if you include South America and Japan tour dates). He has been a key part of the recognition Journey has been recieving these past couple of years. So, while the business world makes it difficult for Steve to make an impact on a large public scale, Journey and Steve have continued to create music and share Journey's music with the masses.

And Yes, I did go see Augeri/Journey in concert. I think it was called "The vacation's Over Tour". It was Augeri's first tour. As I said before, Augeri was ok!

I agree, Steve was OK on Vacation's over. That was the 2nd leg of his first tour with Journey. He was timid for the first part of the show and he struggled occasionally with some of the material. But since then Steve has grown to be a commanding figure on stage. He really relates to the audience, he feeds off of their love and adoration. He truly fronts this band on stage. And he is singing these Journey songs in HIS voice now, instead of trying to sing so much like Perry. That was a fault early on, but understandable. I think when you have heard a song done a certain way all your life, and you know the audience has too, you want to portray the song that way. But after singing these songs for 7 years he can feel them as his own. That makes it easier to express them as your own. And that is what he is doing now. I think the turning point was the Under The Radar Tour last year. That was definately, by far, the best Journey show I have ever seen!

Jrnyman, I don't have a problem seeing the other side.The problem is that someone is attacking us for our opinions & doing alot of name calling towards Perry fans.

I agree that NC's tactics are in poor taste and I have said so twice before in this thread. However, you have yet to concede someone else's opinion. You have yet to say anything like 'I see where you are coming from but' or 'I agree but' or 'That could be true but'. Of course it is not just you, or 'your side', very few people seem to take the time to atleast understand a little of the other side.

I can tell you that I will NEVER see that particular person's side of things for the way he behaves & talks to Perry fans.

Lori

I understand that completely and said the exact same thing in another post. However, NC does not always post like that. It is obvious that he starts posting like that when he gets frustrated. If you (or your side) could have appeared the least bit open to what he (or his side) was saying, even without agreeing, he may not have gotten so 'angry'. Either way, nothing will change. No one's opinions will change and I suspect no one's internet ettiquette will either. So Journey fans will continue to go 'round and 'round and never reach a civil understanding.

Jrnyman,


I CLEARLY stated that it was "my opinion", and I also RESPECTFULLY said that, "All the fans who enjoy Augeri & feel that he made his mark with them, that is fine, but not everyone feels that way.

Jrnyman, I do have a right to express my OWN opinion! You may not have liked what I said, & don' t agree with me on what I said, & that is certainly fine by me!

But your statement of, "You act as though you are right & everyone has to agree with you" is way off base! Again by saying it is "my opinion" certainly makes it clear that is "how I feel", and that I don't expect EVERYONE to agree with me.


And hey, for all those fans who enjoy Augeri's singing talents that is GREAT!

I just thought the concert I attended Of Augeri/Journey was ok, so for ME, & ONLY speaking for ME, it just wasn't all that great that I would want to go spend money on tickets to see them again. Again, this is MY OPINION, and no one has to agree with me on it either. Are we clear now?


And Jrnyman, there is NOTHING CIVIL about NC's posts on this board toward Perry fans, and as long as he attacks fans here for expressing their own point of view & resorting to vicious name calling, that WILL certainly cause a great deal of trouble!


Lori

[Rockindeano]

Is this 7 page long piece of crap thread the reason ANDREW shuts down the Journey board? I personally would not shut it down because we are adults and we definitely are passionate....But Jesus Christ, if you are an observer like I am, this whole bantering back and forth is..pathetic...

I have an endorsement, however(not that anyone cares), but it seems to me, that the "Pro Perry" fans involved in this bewildering argument are Hell bent on destroying the current Journey, and to me that is not acceptable. If you do not like the current Journey, then that's fine, don't go to their shows, don't buy their new release, and go back and spin Escape for the millionth time.....

Notice I didn't put Mr. Perry down? And why would I? The guy is fucking awesome...when he sings. However he doesn't anymore, and my ultimate finale feeling regarding him is this...He was a member of a "Band" and the Band had 5 different members...Hell he fired 2 of them..Anyway, when he pulled his shit, he IMO, held the remaing members HOSTAGE.....You cannot spin this...I'm not saying Neal and Jon aren't at some fault here, but Perry needs to grow up(well, he should have done that 10 years ago), but he is at home where he wants to be.

PF- I said ealier that "Perry was home playing with his cats." You got pissed at me for that. I wasn't demeaning the man, simply saying, and correctly so, that Perry was at home, playing with his cats! No biggie. And while he is doing that, Neal and the rest are entertaining the ones that WANT TO BE ENTERTAINED.......Got it??

[perryfaithful]

PF- I wasn't demeaning the man, simply saying, and correctly so, that Perry was at home, playing with his cats! ......Got it??

from the email questions at Fan Asylum

Do you have any pets?
SP: I've had many pets through my life. When I was a young boy I had a Cocker named "Lady" then through the years I've had 3 Beagles. "Peggy," "Donna," and "Lenda," and later 3 cat's named “Tashka” and “Tonja” and then later again "Kitty." I do love all pets but right now, I have none.

[PROPERRY]

Is this 7 page long piece of crap thread the reason ANDREW shuts down the Journey board? I personally would not shut it down because we are adults and we definitely are passionate....But Jesus Christ, if you are an observer like I am, this whole bantering back and forth is..pathetic...

I have an endorsement, however(not that anyone cares), but it seems to me, that the "Pro Perry" fans involved in this bewildering argument are Hell bent on destroying the current Journey, and to me that is not acceptable. If you do not like the current Journey, then that's fine, don't go to their shows, don't buy their new release, and go back and spin Escape for the millionth time.....

Notice I didn't put Mr. Perry down? And why would I? The guy is fucking awesome...when he sings. However he doesn't anymore, and my ultimate finale feeling regarding him is this...He was a member of a "Band" and the Band had 5 different members...Hell he fired 2 of them..Anyway, when he pulled his shit, he IMO, held the remaing members HOSTAGE.....You cannot spin this...I'm not saying Neal and Jon aren't at some fault here, but Perry needs to grow up(well, he should have done that 10 years ago), but he is at home where he wants to be.

PF- I said ealier that "Perry was home playing with his cats." You got pissed at me for that. I wasn't demeaning the man, simply saying, and correctly so, that Perry was at home, playing with his cats! No biggie. And while he is doing that, Neal and the rest are entertaining the ones that WANT TO BE ENTERTAINED.......Got it??

Rock'deano you stated,"Pro Perry" fans involved in this bewildering argument are hell bent on destroying the current Journey, and to me that is not acceptable."



YOU sure do GIVE us "couple Perry fans" posting here a lot of Power with your statement above! After all there is FAR MORE fans of the current line up here, than Perry fans here.

I can't believe that YOU really think that we Perry fans have the ability & the power, (by posting our OWN opinions) to destroy the current Journey. Like the current line up of Journey will just stop performing & never be heard from again, because we Perry fans voiced our own opinions on this board.

Lori

[SF-Dano]

This is an endless debate which could go on for ever. Actually it is not really a debate. It is just opinion after opinion, leading to insult after insult.

Andrew, please at least close this thread down. 9 pages and counting is really enough.

[jrnyman28]

...Perry fans probably won't get it.

More than half the problem here is that "Perry fans" are are all lumped together, a mass with a single mind, a single agenda, a single......whatever! Not right!

Fair enough. I should have better described the type of person I was referring to. Does "Perry-only Fan" sound better? I remember "Perrytrooper" being bounced around for a while. I am serious when I say that I am looking for a way to describe/differentiate a specific type of fan without insult.

It is as if there is no more consideration given to ones posts than, "oh well, it's a Perry fan and all Perry fans think alike so even if one said it, Hell they would all say it anyway!"

That is certainly not how I intended the statement to be read. But it is still valid that on this board there really are just two types of fans posting: the fans who continue to support Journey (Journey fans) and the fans who do not support Journey (I called them Perry fans). So, in my post I was referring fans that do not support Journey.

I consider you to be a pretty classy guy Dave so I have to say I am disappointed that you would gloss over some of the behavior here by your fellow fans of Journey. Being called disgusting names, whether on the board OR in a private message, should not be tolerated by anyone.

HOW have I glossed over this. I have now made FOUR posts or references to this. And I pointed the finger first to a 'fellow' Journey fan. I think I have been equal in my criticisms in how people are posting to each other. But at the end of the day, I am not a moderator. Guess what, my opinion on the posting style of forum members holds no more weight than my opinions on Journey. And neither does yours. I would like to keep the peace as much as possible because I do not want to lose this forum again. And I enjoy debate and conversation. It is all this bickering that drives me nuts! And I think Andrew would agree...

I do not care WHO you are a fan of or not a fan of. Believe me, if you were the person being harassed I would not think twice about defending you, no matter what differences we had regarding our experiences with Journey over the years.

And I say again, I think I have been equal about this. I have called out NC 3 times about this. I have focussed on him because he posts here more than yak or some others. I also focussed on him because we share the same views but he is not helping Journey fans present their views when he gets frustrated.

And it's funny, but I do not feel like I need defending. I have lost my head in the past. I am sure OhSherrie remembers a few times. I have learned from my mistakes. But I have also learned that I will deal with my words and actions. I don't need anyone else to defend them. It is a nice offer and it is a gesture I can return. But this is a website forum. Nothing else.

[jrnyman28]

Jrnyman,


I CLEARLY stated that it was "my opinion", and I also RESPECTFULLY said that, "All the fans who enjoy Augeri & feel that he made his mark with them, that is fine, but not everyone feels that way.

Originally you said:

I guess it is just too tough of a discussion for you to handle, so you rather divert the conversation to Augeri's previous job, than discuss the the REAL truth that Augeri has NOT made his OWN MARK in Journey OR the music business!

So first you said the "REAL truth that Augeri has NOT made his OWN MARK" and then you say it is fine if you feel he did but I don't agree. If you had just said that from the beginning than this would be a moot point. You originally came across as "You act as though you are right & everyone has to agree with you". That is what I reacted to.

Jrnyman, I do have a right to express my OWN opinion! You may not have liked what I said, & don' t agree with me on what I said, & that is certainly fine by me!

See, we are in agreeance here.

I just thought the concert I attended Of Augeri/Journey was ok, so for ME, & ONLY speaking for ME, it just wasn't all that great that I would want to go spend money on tickets to see them again. Again, this is MY OPINION, and no one has to agree with me on it either. Are we clear now?

Again, did you NOT read my post. I agreed with you about the Vacation's Over Tour!! SHEESH! I then went on to say how I have seen Steve grow on stage. But I didn't say you should go and see another show. I didn't say I thought you shouldn't talk about Steve until you do. I didn't say you were wrong. You could have simply said 'thank you' to this part of my post!

And Jrnyman, there is NOTHING CIVIL about NC's posts on this board toward Perry fans, and as long as he attacks fans here for expressing their own point of view & resorting to vicious name calling, that WILL certainly cause a great deal of trouble!


Lori

One more time we agreed on this. I have already addressed this (now) FIVE times. It appears yet again that you do not even read my posts!