Boomchild wrote:Specific data please.
Do your own research. Forbes and all sorts of periodicals have covered the varying healthcare systems out there. But you're the guy claiming that they all suck ass equally.
Moderator: Andrew
Boomchild wrote:Specific data please.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:steveo777 wrote:Ok, give TNC a break. This is the kind of distortion you'll see anywhere, when talking to a liberal. They have a deficiency in math, history and truth. Given facts, the best you'll ever get back from them will be that you'll called some vile name.
It's pretty obvious that you delusional clowns don't talk to liberals, or associate with anyone that challenges your beliefs. Let us count the ways you guys are living in a Teabagger vacuum.
European countries always had socialized medicine - FALSE.
Government healthcare is a sign of dictatorship - (laughably) FALSE.
Obamacare, the sweetheart giveaway to the HMOs, is actually a Trojan horse for single payer - IDIOTIC
Singlepayer will destroy the US healthcare system, despite singlepayer Medicare being in existence for decades - RETARDED
Your best friend is your AM talk radio and it shows. Why don't you curl up with your dog eared bedside copy of "No Spin Zone For Kids: The Coloring Book Edition" and try to unstick the pages?
Boomchild wrote:The_Noble_Cause wrote:Boomchild wrote:Their systems have never gone form great to worse. That's why they haven't taken to the streets. Here in the U.S. Obamacare will take a good system, not perfect and make the issues worse then they are.
Actually, Switzerland went from a system like ours to the HMOs being run as non-profits w/ a universal mandate. Guess what? Their system went from mediocre to excellent and nobody is talking about reverting back. Of course, you already knew this and just chose not to mention it, right?
Specific data please.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:Boomchild wrote:Specific data please.
Do your own research. Forbes and all sorts of periodicals have covered the varying healthcare systems out there. But you're the guy claiming that they all suck ass equally.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:But the systems won't be kept as they are. Nobody expects that. Reagan and Greenspan already reformed SS. Anyone ever tell you you sound alot like Chicken Little?
slucero wrote:see what I mean...
no facts... just "I'm right".. and all of you are wrong..
Boomchild wrote:And still the government reports it's not sustainable. The basic premise is doomed to fail. You can make all the changes you want but, all it does is just delay the eventual outcome which will be disaster. It's like putting a band aid on a tumor and claiming your cured.
Boomchild wrote: My points are that Obamacare here in America is not the answer. No matter how you shape it people will fall through the cracks, go without coverage and die because of it. That's reality.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:see what I mean...
no facts... just "I'm right".. and all of you are wrong..
Not my job to educate the know-it-alls. I've done the reading and have my own opinions. If you haven't done due diligence, then refrain from spouting off. Or, act like you, and just plagiarize other websites.
slucero wrote:You pointed us at Forbes, and referenced the Swiss HC system as a model.. so I just followed your lead and sourced some info there and found some info.
slucero wrote:So, here's your chance to refute the articles findings with your own empirical data, and own opinion... (sans name-calling if you can resist)
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:see what I mean...
no facts... just "I'm right".. and all of you are wrong..
Not my job to educate the know-it-alls. I've done the reading and have my own opinions. If you haven't done due diligence, then refrain from spouting off. Or, act like you, and just plagiarize other websites.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:You pointed us at Forbes, and referenced the Swiss HC system as a model.. so I just followed your lead and sourced some info there and found some info.
Good for you, bro. Def not the article I read. But the one you posted states that healthcare should be de-coupled from employment. Do you agree with that? Did you even read the article?
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:So, here's your chance to refute the articles findings with your own empirical data, and own opinion... (sans name-calling if you can resist)
Umm, I'll post what I want, when I want, and on my terms - not yours. Got it?
The_Noble_Cause wrote:Boomchild wrote:And still the government reports it's not sustainable. The basic premise is doomed to fail. You can make all the changes you want but, all it does is just delay the eventual outcome which will be disaster. It's like putting a band aid on a tumor and claiming your cured.
Tell ya what. You can wait it out in your apocalypse bunker, as I gladly collect your SS check and spend it on beer. Deal?
The_Noble_Cause wrote:Boomchild wrote: My points are that Obamacare here in America is not the answer. No matter how you shape it people will fall through the cracks, go without coverage and die because of it. That's reality.
And apparently the nightmare scenario you aspire to. America can do better.
steveo777 wrote:
You shouldn't be talking about things you don't understand. If YOU had done the same deed you are asking us to do (due diligence), YOU would have found that the "present MO" is going to bankrupt this country. The reason I susbcribe to my ideals is because I love my family. I want them to have the opportunity to enjoy the same America I enjoyed as a child and most of my adult life. I don't want them to have to solute some piece of shit as they parade down the street. My family will never have to say the words "Heil Obama"......I'd be gone before that. You, on the other hand, will probably choose to go down with the shit.
steveo777 wrote:You shouldn't be talking about things you don't understand. If YOU had done the same deed you are asking us to do (due diligence), YOU would have found that the "present MO" is going to bankrupt this country.
slucero wrote:SO you discount the article before you read it..
slucero wrote:yet won't refute any of the points.. uh-huh...
slucero wrote:Yup read it.
slucero wrote:...and that would be the reason no once actually debates anything with you.. because you apparently aren't interested in changing minds with fact.. instead you prefer to close minds with hate.
Boomchild wrote:The point is the liberal progressive mindset is to give people anything they want regardless of cost and the burdens it will put on children of America. They want what they want now and could care less of it's impact on the future (or no future) of this country.
Boomchild wrote: Even though the facts prove otherwise. It's like some voodoo New Age mindset of believe and it will come true.
Boomchild wrote:By the time I reach the age to qualify for SS benefits (assuming it still exists), it won't be enough to purchase a bottle of beer.
steveo777 wrote: The reason I susbcribe to my ideals is because I love my family. I want them to have the opportunity to enjoy the same America I enjoyed as a child and most of my adult life
Fact Finder wrote:Mr. Nixons war? You are fucked up dude. Seek help and get rest. At least learn some history.
Fact Finder wrote:Instead, the House has kept up a frenetic pace, including a Saturday session, voting on bill after bill to reopen parts of the government, including the national parks to the National Institutes of Health.
The Senate, meanwhile, has all but shut down itself. Majority Leader Harry Reid, Nevada Democrat, hasn’t held a floor vote in nearly a week. The House has voted 26 times since the last Senate vote.
House Republicans passed legislation that would have ensured the U.S. didn’t default by insisting that its debt interest payments still be made, but Senate Democrats and President Obama rejected that idea.
Read more: http://p.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/ ... z2h3dZ9GXl
Tell me again who is shutting down the Gov to get their way?
Fact Finder wrote:State Dept. Awards $5M Contract for Crystal Stem and Barware For Embassies
We ought to buy fucking sippy cups for these dirtbags.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:SO you discount the article before you read it..
No, I read it. And she is making the case that Obamacare needs to be MORE like Switzerland. Did you even read the article? Are you now advocating for even more government intervention in the marketplace? Do you even have a point?
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:yet won't refute any of the points.. uh-huh...
Sorry. I have a life, dude. And I am not on your time.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:Yup read it.
Good for you. Private HMOs are also not allowed to make a profit in Switzerland. You agree with that sentiment as well, I take it?
The_Noble_Cause wrote:slucero wrote:...and that would be the reason no once actually debates anything with you.. because you apparently aren't interested in changing minds with fact.. instead you prefer to close minds with hate.
What debate? Your buddy, Boomchild, lied and said that all European countried have always had cradle to grave healthcare. This is a lie. As Switzerland did not switch till the 90s. That was the point. [/quote[
That's between you and Boomchild..The_Noble_Cause wrote:I have no interest in scoring debate points with paranoid morons.
steveo777 wrote:Fact Finder wrote:State Dept. Awards $5M Contract for Crystal Stem and Barware For Embassies
We ought to buy fucking sippy cups for these dirtbags.
That's some that math that libs think is ok. Spend...spend....spend, someone else will have to pay.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:What debate? Your buddy, Boomchild, lied and said that all European countried have always had cradle to grave healthcare. This is a lie. As Switzerland did not switch till the 90s. That was the point. I have no interest in scoring debate points with paranoid morons.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:Boomchild wrote:By the time I reach the age to qualify for SS benefits (assuming it still exists), it won't be enough to purchase a bottle of beer.
Ok. Keep thinking that. The system is fully capable of lasting another 50 years. Sounds like you are actually rooting for it to be destroyed. Do you get hard and moist just thinking of the day Grandma is forced to eat out of a dumpster? You are really one sick ass dude.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:Your Norman Rockwell sanitized version of America is a daydream.
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