OT--Mccain or Obama,Who Gets Your Vote And Why??

[conversationpc]

nope. Maybe he had good reason. Out of curiosity where is your sources? All I am saying, is sometimes it depends on who the story teller is, and their agenda. I am not refering to you, just the source.

The news.
I'm tired of being this forum's surrogate Googler.
This story was everywhere and then some.

http://www.military.com/news/article/ve ... -bill.html
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/e ... bama_N.htm
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar ... fends.html
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/26/mccain/

His opposition makes sense according to this bit from the USA Today link you provided...

McCain opposes the measure, as does the Pentagon, out of concern that providing such a benefit after only three years of service would encourage people to leave the military after completing only one enlistment even as the U.S. fights two wars and is trying to increase the size of the Army and Marine Corps.

Instead, McCain and Republican colleagues proposed a bill to increase benefits in conjunction with a veteran's length of service. Senate Democrats blocked the measure last week.

"Most worrying to me is that by hurting retention, we will reduce the numbers of men and women who we train to become the backbone of all the services, the noncommissioned officer," McCain said in his statement.

[Don]

A little off topic but I would really like to see Bush or Rice or whoever has the authority to step in and stop the indentured servitude known as stoploss. I understand people volunteer willingly to join the service but to extend their enlistment indefinitely isn't right. If you were drafted in Vietnam, you did 12 months and were finished. The way it is now, there are guys who should have been out 3 years ago, but instead are facing their second or third rotation to Iraq. A few of them have become casualties on that extra trip when they should have already been back in the civilian sector. I'm a proud vet but I sent my son to college to keep him from becoming cannonfodder under this new form of slavery. it's a cheap and quick way to keep the numbers of active duty soldiers at a set level with out worrying about offering a more attractive package that might entice more young people to join the service.

[The_Noble_Cause]

The new bill only makes sure troop benefits are commensurate with today’s rising school costs.
No more, no less.
Maybe you’d prefer the alternative, easing recruitment standards concerning mental health and criminal records to shore up recruitment goals – Wait. We already did that.

In addition to the two vets who sponsored it, the bill was endorsed by virtually every veterans group in the country:

Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America (IAVA)
The Veterans of Foreign Wars (VFW)
The American Legion
The Military Officers' Association of America (MOAA)
Vietnam Veterans of America (VVA)
AMVETS
The Air Force Sergeants Association (AFSA)
The Enlisted Association of the National Guard of the United States (EANGUS)
The Student Veterans of America (SVA)
The American Association of Community Colleges (AACC)
The National Association of State Universities and Land Grant Colleges (nasulgc)
The Partnership for Veterans' Education
The American Council on Education (ACE)
Association of Independent Colleges and Universities (NAICU)
Disabled American Veterans (DAV)

[The Sushi Hunter]

A little off topic but I would really like to see Bush or Rice or whoever has the authority to step in and stop the indentured servitude known as stoploss. I understand people volunteer willingly to join the service but to extend their enlistment indefinitely isn't right. If you were drafted in Vietnam, you did 12 months and were finished. The way it is now, there are guys who should have been out 3 years ago, but instead are facing their second or third rotation to Iraq. A few of them have become casualties on that extra trip when they should have already been back in the civilian sector. I'm a proud vet but I sent my son to college to keep him from becoming cannonfodder under this new form of slavery. it's a cheap and quick way to keep the numbers of active duty soldiers at a set level with out worrying about offering a more attractive package that might entice more young people to join the service.

That's part of the contract I believe. If there's a conflict going on and they're a part of it, they just can't just get out in the middle of it, even if their time is up.

As for who I'm voting for....McCain/Palin. As for why....because they share many of the same American values as I do.

One thing on my mind however is if Obama makes President, I think that six months into his term, there's going to be a lot of angry black people, cause after about six months, they will realize that Obama being president can't give them everything for nothing as they are expecting will happen. That's why P.Diddy did those anti-Palin youtubes. Cause he thinks that if Obama wins, out of all other things, gas expenses for the continued operation of his private jet will dissappear.

Sort of like after Clinton took office as the American President. All I heard on the news, out on the street, etc. about six months after he took office was how pissed off all the homosexuals were because they had voted for Bill simply because one of his campaign promises was to change the military's recruiting proceedures where homosexuals could join in the Armed Forces. About six months from the time Bill took office, the homos figured out that Bill couldn't do what he had promised and it pissed them the fuck off. Who could blame them right? You know, if I, being the guy that I am, could join an all female military outfit where I could eat, sleep, and best of all shower with all the ladies around me, I too would have been pissed the fuck off if I voted for someone simply because that was one of the promises they made to me for my vote.

[Don]

A little off topic but I would really like to see Bush or Rice or whoever has the authority to step in and stop the indentured servitude known as stoploss. I understand people volunteer willingly to join the service but to extend their enlistment indefinitely isn't right. If you were drafted in Vietnam, you did 12 months and were finished. The way it is now, there are guys who should have been out 3 years ago, but instead are facing their second or third rotation to Iraq. A few of them have become casualties on that extra trip when they should have already been back in the civilian sector. I'm a proud vet but I sent my son to college to keep him from becoming cannonfodder under this new form of slavery. it's a cheap and quick way to keep the numbers of active duty soldiers at a set level with out worrying about offering a more attractive package that might entice more young people to join the service.

That's part of the contract I believe. If there's a conflict going on and they're a part of it, they just can't just get out in the middle of it, even if their time is up.

As for who I'm voting for....McCain/Palin. As for why....because they share many of the same American values as I do.

One thing on my mind however is if Obama makes President, I think that six months into his term, there's going to be a lot of angry black people, cause after about six months, they will realize that Obama being president can't give them everything for nothing as they are expecting will happen. That's why P.Diddy did those anti-Palin youtubes. Cause he thinks that if Obama wins, out of all other things, gas expenses for the continued operation of his private jet will dissappear.

Sort of like after Clinton took office as the American President. All I heard on the news, out on the street, etc. about six months after he took office was how pissed off all the homosexuals were because they had voted for Bill simply because one of his campaign promises was to change the military's recruiting proceedures where homosexuals could join in the Armed Forces. About six months from the time Bill took office, the homos figured out that Bill couldn't do what he had promised and it pissed them the fuck off. Who could blame them right? You know, if I, being a guy, could join an all female military outfit where I could eat, sleep, and best of all shower with all the ladies around me, I too would have been pissed the fuck off if I voted for someone simply because that was one of the promises they made to me for my vote.

If this was a real war with a closing objective but it's not. it's an occupation with an open date to withdrawal. If we stay there for another 10 years, does that mean a soldier's enlistment should be tied to that time line? When people find out that I'm a vet and ask me about their son or daughter enlisting, I now make it my job to steer them away from that path. Let uncle Sam do the selling for now on.

[S2M]

A little off topic but I would really like to see Bush or Rice or whoever has the authority to step in and stop the indentured servitude known as stoploss. I understand people volunteer willingly to join the service but to extend their enlistment indefinitely isn't right. If you were drafted in Vietnam, you did 12 months and were finished. The way it is now, there are guys who should have been out 3 years ago, but instead are facing their second or third rotation to Iraq. A few of them have become casualties on that extra trip when they should have already been back in the civilian sector. I'm a proud vet but I sent my son to college to keep him from becoming cannonfodder under this new form of slavery. it's a cheap and quick way to keep the numbers of active duty soldiers at a set level with out worrying about offering a more attractive package that might entice more young people to join the service.

That's part of the contract I believe. If there's a conflict going on and they're a part of it, they just can't just get out in the middle of it, even if their time is up.

As for who I'm voting for....McCain/Palin. As for why....because they share many of the same American values as I do.

One thing on my mind however is if Obama makes President, I think that six months into his term, there's going to be a lot of angry black people, cause after about six months, they will realize that Obama being president can't give them everything for nothing as they are expecting will happen. That's why P.Diddy did those anti-Palin youtubes. Cause he thinks that if Obama wins, out of all other things, gas expenses for the continued operation of his private jet will dissappear.

Sort of like after Clinton took office as the American President. All I heard on the news, out on the street, etc. about six months after he took office was how pissed off all the homosexuals were because they had voted for Bill simply because one of his campaign promises was to change the military's recruiting proceedures where homosexuals could join in the Armed Forces. About six months from the time Bill took office, the homos figured out that Bill couldn't do what he had promised and it pissed them the fuck off. Who could blame them right? You know, if I, being a guy, could join an all female military outfit where I could eat, sleep, and best of all shower with all the ladies around me, I too would have been pissed the fuck off if I voted for someone simply because that was one of the promises they made to me for my vote.

If this was a real war with a closing objective but it's not. it's an occupation with an open date to withdrawal. If we stay there for another 10 years, does that mean a soldier's enlistment should be tied to that time line? When people find out that I'm a vet and ask me about their son or daughter enlisting, I now make it my job to steer them away from that path. Let uncle Sam do the selling for now on.

I wouldn't serve again....no way. No how....

[The Sushi Hunter]

A little off topic but I would really like to see Bush or Rice or whoever has the authority to step in and stop the indentured servitude known as stoploss. I understand people volunteer willingly to join the service but to extend their enlistment indefinitely isn't right. If you were drafted in Vietnam, you did 12 months and were finished. The way it is now, there are guys who should have been out 3 years ago, but instead are facing their second or third rotation to Iraq. A few of them have become casualties on that extra trip when they should have already been back in the civilian sector. I'm a proud vet but I sent my son to college to keep him from becoming cannonfodder under this new form of slavery. it's a cheap and quick way to keep the numbers of active duty soldiers at a set level with out worrying about offering a more attractive package that might entice more young people to join the service.

That's part of the contract I believe. If there's a conflict going on and they're a part of it, they just can't just get out in the middle of it, even if their time is up.

As for who I'm voting for....McCain/Palin. As for why....because they share many of the same American values as I do.

One thing on my mind however is if Obama makes President, I think that six months into his term, there's going to be a lot of angry black people, cause after about six months, they will realize that Obama being president can't give them everything for nothing as they are expecting will happen. That's why P.Diddy did those anti-Palin youtubes. Cause he thinks that if Obama wins, out of all other things, gas expenses for the continued operation of his private jet will dissappear.

Sort of like after Clinton took office as the American President. All I heard on the news, out on the street, etc. about six months after he took office was how pissed off all the homosexuals were because they had voted for Bill simply because one of his campaign promises was to change the military's recruiting proceedures where homosexuals could join in the Armed Forces. About six months from the time Bill took office, the homos figured out that Bill couldn't do what he had promised and it pissed them the fuck off. Who could blame them right? You know, if I, being a guy, could join an all female military outfit where I could eat, sleep, and best of all shower with all the ladies around me, I too would have been pissed the fuck off if I voted for someone simply because that was one of the promises they made to me for my vote.

If this was a real war with a closing objective but it's not. it's an occupation with an open date to withdrawal. If we stay there for another 10 years, does that mean a soldier's enlistment should be tied to that time line? When people find out that I'm a vet and ask me about their son or daughter enlisting, I now make it my job to steer them away from that path. Let uncle Sam do the selling for now on.

It does have a closing objective. The withdrawal date however keeps getting moved because the Iraqi's aren't able to hold the objective on their own as of yet. But progess is being made and they slowly are being able to.

[artist4perry]

nope. Maybe he had good reason. Out of curiosity where is your sources? All I am saying, is sometimes it depends on who the story teller is, and their agenda. I am not refering to you, just the source.

The news.
I'm tired of being this forum's surrogate Googler.
This story was everywhere and then some.

http://www.military.com/news/article/ve ... -bill.html
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/e ... bama_N.htm
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar ... fends.html
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/26/mccain/

The liberal news networks. Suprise. O.K. This is where you loose me. The media is in an Obama frensy. Hard to know who to trust. But I try to look at both sides of an issue. I'll do my own research. Thanks for your trouble.

[The_Noble_Cause]

http://www.military.com/news/article/ve ... -bill.html
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/e ... bama_N.htm
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar ... fends.html
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/26/mccain/

The liberal news networks. Suprise.

Military.com is liberal?
ABC News, which employs Cato mouthpiece John Stossel, former Nixon aid Diane Sawyer, in addition to featuring Glenn Beck, is liberal?
Were they similarly too liberal when they produced and aired the revisionist Clinton hit piece “Road to 9-11” a little under two years ago?
As far as CNN goes, the only outright partisan on their payroll is "conservative" Glenn Beck.

This is where you loose me. The media is in an Obama frensy. Hard to know who to trust.

And it was McCain himself who referred to the media as “his base”, and was renowned for casually holding court with them at the back of the Straight Talk Express. It was favorable coverage of his campaign throughout the primaries that enabled him to make a comeback long after he had run out of funds and fell out of party favor. The media had several annointed celebrity candidates from the outset of this race - not the least of which was McCain.

But I try to look at both sides of an issue. I'll do my own research. Thanks for your trouble.

I’d love to for you to share some of the non-biased news sources you come up with.
I hear the EIB news network is a real good one.

[nutz4Neal]

*taxes - McCain will not raise taxes, he'll keep them low. Obama? I've never seen a Democrate who didn't love to tax & spend MY money.

Yeah, taxes only eat up a negligible amount of my income. As far as the second part of your statement, let's get real:

"I've never seen a POLITICIAN who didn't love to tax & spend EVERYONE'S money."

Really? Then the person who does your taxes must know some, shall we say, *shortcuts*, cause they sure take a chunk out of our income.

What Democratic politician has EVER given tax rebates?

[The Sushi Hunter]

Shit! The Natural Light Chick is HOTTT!

I love that beer.

I wouldn't say "No" to any of them actually. For some reason chicks look much sexier without clothes on. Ops, got to be cool, my wife would kill me if she found out I said this shit.....

[Lula]

no contest here, obama!

his views and policies are much more in tune with my own. a mccain/palin administration is frightening to me.

[walkslikealady]

I thought about McCain; however, his chosen running mate has swung me back to the Democratic Party's nominee, Obama. The "why" is because of the poor women's rights records of McCain and Palin.

[Enigma869]

The more I listen to Palin, the more she annoys me. For starters, her accent grates on my nerves (and this coming from a guy with an awful Boston accent)! Also, she needs some new material. She's like a comedian who uses the same material for every audience. The only real difference is that Sarah seems to forget that cameras are recording her every word! I've seen her on the news the last two nights on the campaign trail and she's like a fucking puppet, saying the same shit, OVER and OVER again. This dopey fucking line of "McCain may not be looking to pick a fight but he won't back down from one" is already old and tired! She used it at the RNC and now insists upon regurgitating the same bullshit EVERY time someone puts a mic in front of her piehole! You can definitely tell she has the politician thing down


John from Boston

[Lula]

i agree with you john. i'm excited for the GOP with their step into the present tho .

palin is saying the same thing each time. i'm looking forward to her own voice, not that i agree with her, but she should have the opportunity to speak her mind..... then of course she may very well agree with the bush stance. regardless, this is an exciting election.

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

The more I listen to Palin, the more she annoys me. For starters, her accent grates on my nerves (and this coming from a guy with an awful Boston accent)! Also, she needs some new material. She's like a comedian who uses the same material for every audience. The only real difference is that Sarah seems to forget that cameras are recording her every word! I've seen her on the news the last two nights on the campaign trail and she's like a fucking puppet, saying the same shit, OVER and OVER again. This dopey fucking line of "McCain may not be looking to pick a fight but he won't back down from one" is already old and tired! She used it at the RNC and now insists upon regurgitating the same bullshit EVERY time someone puts a mic in front of her piehole! You can definitely tell she has the politician thing down


John from Boston

yes but you win elections the same way that you sell Captain Krunch, Kool-Aid or Coca - Cola. Hammer away at the same sound bites, get the jingle stuck in the buying publics mind.
If candidate A says candidate B is colour blind and cant tell green grass from blue sky and you say it a 1000 times, pretty soon Joe public thinks that candidate B thinks that grass is blue.
It might drive you nuts, but it works.

[Archetype]

McCain/Palin. Strong foreign policy, free market capitalism, pro second amendment.

[Rick]

McCain/Palin. Strong foreign policy, free market capitalism, pro second amendment.

I would vote Democrat, but I certainly have a lot of conservative characteristics. The 2nd amendment is one of them.

[RunningAlone Pgh]

McCain/Palin because:

Obama has absolutely NO experience
He can't speak without prepared remarks
He has no experience
Biden is an asswipe from way back
Obama doesn't support our military
I DON'T TRUST HIM!
Obama doesn't even know how many states we have yet he wants to govern them??? WTF?
He looks like my childhood sock monkey......
Our enemies want nothing more than to make Obama Commander-in-Chief

I trust McCain
McCain has experience
Palin doesn't put up with any shit!
And the list goes on and on and on and on

[Vocalsmanvocals]

McCain/Palin because:

Obama has absolutely NO experience
He can't speak without prepared remarks
He has no experience
Biden is an asswipe from way back
Obama doesn't support our military
I DON'T TRUST HIM!
Obama doesn't even know how many states we have yet he wants to govern them??? WTF?
He looks like my childhood sock monkey......
Our enemies want nothing more than to make Obama Commander-in-Chief

I trust McCain
McCain has experience
Palin doesn't put up with any shit!
And the list goes on and on and on and on

Great post!!

[RunningAlone Pgh]

Another thing about this "everyone hates us" bullshit....

It's not hate. The liberal douchebags just say that to try to make people feel guilty here.


It's really jealousy. Jealousy of our world power.
This is just another way to try to usurp it from us...


...and liberal douchebags all over the country all hell bent to oblige. You (that fit such a description) should be proud of yourselves for your french-loving, unamerican contribution...

Yes, yes, YESSSS! Brilliant post(s)!

[7 Wishes]

Another thing about this "everyone hates us" bullshit....
It's not hate. The liberal douchebags just say that to try to make people feel guilty here.

http://pewglobal.org/reports/images/252-16.gif

Opinion towards America has become steadily more hostile throughout the presidency of George W Bush, with the Iraq war probably being the single most important factor.

Mr Bush's unpopularity appears to have rubbed off on Republican presidential candidates in general. This might explain why Mr McCain, a strong supporter of the Iraq war, is the least popular potential president in all the countries surveyed.

Meanwhile, Mr Obama, the only consistent opponent of the Iraq war in the race for the presidency, commands a clear lead. He is especially popular in Italy, where a remarkable 70 per cent would vote for him if they could.

In France, historically the European country with the strongest anti-American sentiment, 65 per cent would back Mr Obama. In Germany, the Democratic Senator would get 67 per cent of the vote - while Mr McCain would receive a derisory six per cent.

Mr Obama appears to have made less of an impact in Britain than elsewhere in Europe. A relatively modest 49 per cent of Britons would vote for him, while 14 per cent would back Mr McCain - twice the totals favouring the Republican candidate in Germany or France.

Another 13 per cent of Britons would not vote for either man and 24 per cent "don't know".

Wrong, yet again. In your face.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Obama doesn't support our military

Based on what?
A spam email by a "soldier" that even the military admitted was a total hoax?
If this is truly the case, someone better alert the dogfaces in the trenches, as Obama currently rakes in six times the amount of troop donations.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080814/military ... .html?.v=1

[csiako]

Obama doesn't support our military

Based on what?
A spam email by a "soldier" that even the military admitted was a total hoax?
If this is truly the case, someone better alert the dogfaces in the trenches, as Obama currently rakes in six times the amount of troop donations.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080814/military ... .html?.v=1

what spam email?

[7 Wishes]

McCain/Palin because:

Obama has absolutely NO experience
He can't speak without prepared remarks
He has no experience
Biden is an asswipe from way back
Obama doesn't support our military
I DON'T TRUST HIM!
Obama doesn't even know how many states we have yet he wants to govern them??? WTF?
He looks like my childhood sock monkey......
Our enemies want nothing more than to make Obama Commander-in-Chief

I trust McCain
McCain has experience
Palin doesn't put up with any shit!
And the list goes on and on and on and on

Wow. In one fell swoop, you have proven:

* your ignorance
* your prejudice
* your belief in every lie perpetuated by the right-wing media bias
* your inability to find the truth
* your refusal to glean information from anything other than hate-filled conservative blogs that are completely without merit or truth

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

http://pewglobal.org/reports/images/252-16.gif

Opinion towards America has become steadily more hostile throughout the presidency of George W Bush, with the Iraq war probably being the single most important factor.

Mr Bush's unpopularity appears to have rubbed off on Republican presidential candidates in general. This might explain why Mr McCain, a strong supporter of the Iraq war, is the least popular potential president in all the countries surveyed.

Meanwhile, Mr Obama, the only consistent opponent of the Iraq war in the race for the presidency, commands a clear lead. He is especially popular in Italy, where a remarkable 70 per cent would vote for him if they could.

In France, historically the European country with the strongest anti-American sentiment, 65 per cent would back Mr Obama. In Germany, the Democratic Senator would get 67 per cent of the vote - while Mr McCain would receive a derisory six per cent.

Mr Obama appears to have made less of an impact in Britain than elsewhere in Europe. A relatively modest 49 per cent of Britons would vote for him, while 14 per cent would back Mr McCain - twice the totals favouring the Republican candidate in Germany or France.

Another 13 per cent of Britons would not vote for either man and 24 per cent "don't know".

Wrong, yet again. In your face.

The opinion of the rest of the world is important but it is not the be all and end all .

Europe and the US are in different places in terms of the world view. The US political spectrum has a wide left-right spread. In most European countries the right of center party holds the same ideological position as the conservative wing of the Democratic party . The left is to the left of the democratic party. This is currently true of Britain too,. Consider the fact that Sky news (the fox news sister company in the UK) is a little left of center in its news analysis!

Generally there is little dissent as ideological direction in Europe. Generally statist and a non interventionist foreign policy view . If you mix that with desire to compete with the US- driven both by the natural desire to see your country finish first (understandable) with a little bit of jealousy (not right), you will arrive at a situation where it is impossible for a European to understand what drives and shapes opinion formulation in the US. That’s not wrong, they are just in a completely different place

Europe always has and always will dissent from the US. Remember Reagan’s unpopularity when the Pershing II s were deployed in W Germany as a response to the Soviet SS-18 deployments?. US unpopularity was worse than it was now.

I would suggest that Americans do NOT base their decision who to vote for based on what the world thinks.

[RossValoryRocks]

McCain/Palin because:

Obama has absolutely NO experience
He can't speak without prepared remarks
He has no experience
Biden is an asswipe from way back
Obama doesn't support our military
I DON'T TRUST HIM!
Obama doesn't even know how many states we have yet he wants to govern them??? WTF?
He looks like my childhood sock monkey......
Our enemies want nothing more than to make Obama Commander-in-Chief

I trust McCain
McCain has experience
Palin doesn't put up with any shit!
And the list goes on and on and on and on

Wow. In one fell swoop, you have proven:

* your ignorance
* your prejudice
* your belief in every lie perpetuated by the right-wing media bias
* your inability to find the truth
* your refusal to glean information from anything other than hate-filled conservative blogs that are completely without merit or truth

I can see the prejudice thing...the sock monkey comment was out of line...the rest well...that is a matter of opinion and you know...except for the sock monkey comment, perhaps one who lives in glass houses shouldn't throw stones there 7Wishes.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Obama doesn't support our military

Based on what?
A spam email by a "soldier" that even the military admitted was a total hoax?
If this is truly the case, someone better alert the dogfaces in the trenches, as Obama currently rakes in six times the amount of troop donations.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080814/military ... .html?.v=1

what spam email?

http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/d ... istan.html

[oakley_reef]

Mccain/Palin or Obama/Biden?
ill go Mccain/Palin
i dont trust obama

[7 Wishes]

Mccain/Palin or Obama/Biden?
ill go Mccain/Palin
i dont trust obama

That's because your right-wing heroes are lying to you about him and filling your mind with untruths.