Neal Schon vs Hugo & Evolution tribute Band

[Aaron]

Dit-fucking-to

Chubby, I have never come into a thread and openly disagreed with you....until now. I've considered you a friend, but friends sometimes have to be honest with each other and call each other on their bullshit. While I admire your enthusiam for Arnel and Journey, saying your fanhood just began with Arnel is to completely disrespect the musical legacy (god I hate having to keep using that word) and the bandmembers. The foundation that got Arnel this job was layed down long ago. Were it not for each previous member of Journey making their contribution to this timeless catalog of music, Arnel would be doing something else today, I promise you. For other Pinoys who share the same attitude, again they are being disrepectful to the classic band and the current members as well. I don't know if they see it that way, but some of us non Pinoys sure take it that way. Pinoy pride is ok...so is American pride, but when misplaced so blatantly, it actually runs some fans off. Some of them are blind to a Journey before Arnel. They'd better understand that just as quickly as Arnel was hired, he could be returned back to where he was and there would still be a Journey. What would those who blame Journeys success on Arnel say then? I'd suggest that you take the time to develope yourself historically, so you're not running around posting, only understanding 10% of the big picture. Now that said, there is no debate for you to win here. You simply have too little knowlege and no case whatsoever. Why don't you try being a Journey fan for awhile.....all of it.

I'm one of Arnel's biggest fans, but I've always been one of Journey's biggest fans first.

Stevo, Shit, I hate to use the word respect...again...
But you certainly earned a boatload with me on this post. This is what it's all about. A one in a million post.

So, Neal is not only protecting his work but the work of the artists the band has employed as well.....and protecting the bands investment in the consigned artwork which they've probably paid out quite a bit for over the years.

You do realize, of course, that the band has a recent history of stiffing its artists? IIRC, the guy who did the generations cover has yet to be paid in full for his work. It took me nearly an act of blackmail to get the band to pay me for constructing the online review system on its website....a system they used from pre-arrival straight through to generations!!!

So while, I understand your post and it's intent, you need to realize that you're singing out of your ass. Again, this goes back to a case of two thieves breaking into a museum and one calls the cops on the other, because the other got to the priceless art first.

Hmmmm, if this is the case then it's already been stated, You're a threat..shame on you!!!

Way to go MG!! That's the dirty little secret here.
And...no, I wont drag Hugo into this...(who's a damn good guy, so fuck all of you who just want to fight it out about him )

But the fact remains is that the ONLY thing that seperates Journey (with Arnel singing) and Evolution (with Hugo singing) is Adam, Lance and Les. The rest of the band is no more or less a tribute band than the real thing....

Neal needs to differentiate that. It's an agressive protection of his product/brand.....And that's a problem for any band out there that hires a singer culled from You Tube, a cover band or a tribute band. Not just Journey. What seperates Boston from a tribute act? What seperates Yes from a tribute act? What seperates Styx from one?

Seriously.....you take integral roles in these bands and replace them with shift workers from Lowes and Home Depot....and you're going to get people that find the brand differentiation hard to sort out...


Neal fucked up with Evolution. He would have been far better off if he shut the fuck up and tried to handle this quietly...but by making a case about it, he comes off looking like a crybaby bitch like Lars Ulrich....

There must be something in the water in San Francisco....

[Blueskies]

So, Neal is not only protecting his work but the work of the artists the band has employed as well.....and protecting the bands investment in the consigned artwork which they've probably paid out quite a bit for over the years.

You do realize, of course, that the band has a recent history of stiffing its artists? IIRC, the guy who did the generations cover has yet to be paid in full for his work. It took me nearly an act of blackmail to get the band to pay me for constructing the online review system on its website....a system they used from pre-arrival straight through to generations!!!

So while, I understand your post and it's intent, you need to realize that you're singing out of your ass. Again, this goes back to a case of two thieves breaking into a museum and one calls the cops on the other, because the other got to the priceless art first.

I don't think it's " singing out my ass" to say that it's in both Neal and the artists best interest to protect the bands trademark artwork. What would be singing out ones ass is to insinuate that there is a " history " of non-payment of artists (plural) and yet give one example and one does not make a "history". Besides which, your claim that one artist has never been paid in full is an allegation which requires proof in way of documentation of the artists own words making the allegation or for the artist to come here and speak for himself about his own personal compensation or lack of for his work. Also, an online review system is not artwork and has nothing to do with this issue of protecting a logo but you can speak to your own compensation or lack of and appearently from what you said here you did get paid. Maybe you didn't get paid in a timely enough manner for your satisfaction, but you did get paid. Getting paid does not give evidence of a history of non-payment.

[Arianddu]

Maybe you didn't get paid in a timely enough manner for your satisfaction, but you did get paid. Getting paid does not give evidence of a history of non-payment.

And paying your bills late does wonders for your credit record!

[Blueskies]

Maybe you didn't get paid in a timely enough manner for your satisfaction, but you did get paid. Getting paid does not give evidence of a history of non-payment.

And paying your bills late does wonders for your credit record!

Maybe not, if said allegation is true but late payment isn't non-payment and like I said, payment does not constitute " a history of stiffing artists " , does it?

[strangegrey]

I don't think it's " singing out my ass" to say that it's in both Neal and the artists best interest to protect the bands trademark artwork. What would be singing out ones ass is to insinuate that there is a " history " of non-payment of artists (plural) and yet give one example and one does not make a "history". Besides which, your claim that one artist has never been paid in full is an allegation which requires proof in way of documentation of the artists own words making the allegation or for the artist to come here and speak for himself about his own personal compensation or lack of for his work. Also, an online review system is not artwork and has nothing to do with this issue of protecting a logo but you can speak to your own compensation or lack of and appearently from what you said here you did get paid. Maybe you didn't get paid in a timely enough manner for your satisfaction, but you did get paid. Getting paid does not give evidence of a history of non-payment.

You're singing out of your ass to suggest that Neal's best interest is to protect his IP and to "protect his artists." For these purposes art and the use/reuse of website materials (including the art developed within it to allow the user interface to work as intended) is most certainly treated the same way, from a legal standpoint. So that part of your argument pissed down the drain.

The IP (whether it's 'art' or an online system containing 'art') is not Journey's to use or reuse as they see fit until the contract is satisfied. Transfer of ownership happens at final payment. Not before...unless there's a contractual clause that states otherwise, which there was not.

I'll let the other artists who have been screwed by this band speak up for themselves, so you can't sit there and vag-flap and argue your way out of this on a technicality. Fair enough? (you really have a screw loose...I feel sorry for the sap that has to exist with you) so while you can sit there and try to find a way to get argumentative about the 'timeliness' of things....the fact remains that this band used MY IP for several years, while I patiently waited for them to pay me. Only at a point where they decided to use the system beyond the scope of it's original design, was I able to convince them to open the checkbook. If they "cared" about protecting their own IP or the interests of their "artists"....they wouldn't have let that happen...Because at any point during this issue, I would have been able to either shut down that portion of the website personally or do so legally....in both cases, Journey would have had zero ability to protect shit...because they didn't own it. I thought a less confrontational approach was the higher road.

But make no mistake, they would have held out indefinitely if they could. They don't care about protecting their IP or their artists. That, you can take to the bank.

They worry about protecting their interests when they feel their interests are threatened...but to protect your interests, sometimes you have to pay insurance premiums when they're NOT threatened. sometimes you have to feed the guarddog when there are NO wolves at the front gate.

Try to not approach every post like you're fighting your spouse for who's got remote rights on sunday afternoon. You might actually exist here without every man on this board thinking your a fucking psycho.

[Blueskies]

I don't think it's " singing out my ass" to say that it's in both Neal and the artists best interest to protect the bands trademark artwork. What would be singing out ones ass is to insinuate that there is a " history " of non-payment of artists (plural) and yet give one example and one does not make a "history". Besides which, your claim that one artist has never been paid in full is an allegation which requires proof in way of documentation of the artists own words making the allegation or for the artist to come here and speak for himself about his own personal compensation or lack of for his work. Also, an online review system is not artwork and has nothing to do with this issue of protecting a logo but you can speak to your own compensation or lack of and appearently from what you said here you did get paid. Maybe you didn't get paid in a timely enough manner for your satisfaction, but you did get paid. Getting paid does not give evidence of a history of non-payment.

You're singing out of your ass to suggest that Neal's best interest is to protect his IP and to "protect his artists." For these purposes art and the use/reuse of website materials (including the art developed within it to allow the user interface to work as intended) is most certainly treated the same way, from a legal standpoint. So that part of your argument pissed down the drain.

The IP (whether it's 'art' or an online system containing 'art') is not Journey's to use or reuse as they see fit until the contract is satisfied. Transfer of ownership happens at final payment. Not before...unless there's a contractual clause that states otherwise, which there was not.

I'll let the other artists who have been screwed by this band speak up for themselves, so you can't sit there and vag-flap and argue your way out of this on a technicality. Fair enough? (you really have a screw loose...I feel sorry for the sap that has to exist with you) so while you can sit there and try to find a way to get argumentative about the 'timeliness' of things....the fact remains that this band used MY IP for several years, while I patiently waited for them to pay me. Only at a point where they decided to use the system beyond the scope of it's original design, was I able to convince them to open the checkbook. If they "cared" about protecting their own IP or the interests of their "artists"....they wouldn't have let that happen...Because at any point during this issue, I would have been able to either shut down that portion of the website personally or do so legally....in both cases, Journey would have had zero ability to protect shit...because they didn't own it. I thought a less confrontational approach was the higher road.

But make no mistake, they would have held out indefinitely if they could. They don't care about protecting their IP or their artists. That, you can take to the bank.

They worry about protecting their interests when they feel their interests are threatened...but to protect your interests, sometimes you have to pay insurance premiums when they're NOT threatened. sometimes you have to feed the guarddog when there are NO wolves at the front gate.

Try to not approach every post like you're fighting your spouse for who's got remote rights on sunday afternoon. You might actually exist here without every man on this board thinking your a fucking psycho.

A lot of words there none of which proves anything different. Bottom line is: You got paid.

[strangegrey]

A lot of words there which doesn't prove anything different. Bottom line: You got paid.

Perhaps you can back off, I'll do the same. We're arguing a trangential issue here which does nothing for the thread...and it's clear you and I can go back and forth for days on this. If you don't pay your car payments for 3 years, but ultimately pay it off at the end of the three year period, EVERY creditor in the country will consider that more than ample HISTORY to make a judgment on your creditworthiness.

Regardless, you obviously didn't take your medication this morning....either that or you passed by one too many mirrors and the dog wasn't around to kick....enjoy your hate bath.

[Arianddu]

Bottom line is: You got paid.

No, bottom line is, he got paid eventually, by the sounds of it after several years and many bills submitted. Someone who fails to pay me on time is not supporting me or my business; a bad customer is a bad customer even if you don't have to write-off the bill. Why are you even arguing this?

[Blueskies]

A lot of words there which doesn't prove anything different. Bottom line: You got paid.

Perhaps you can back off, I'll do the same. We're arguing a trangential issue here which does nothing for the thread...and it's clear you and I can go back and forth for days on this. If you don't pay your car payments for 3 years, but ultimately pay it off at the end of the three year period, EVERY creditor in the country will consider that more than ample HISTORY to make a judgment on your creditworthiness.

Regardless, you obviously didn't take your medication this morning....either that or you passed by one too many mirrors and the dog wasn't around to kick....enjoy your hate bath.

The only one spewing any hate speech here is you, Frank. Have a good day.

[strangegrey]

Why are you even arguing this?

Because she's hateful and spiteful and arguing makes her feel better...no other reason whatsoever.

That and someone stupidly said her name three times...

[Blueskies]

Bottom line is: You got paid.

No, bottom line is, he got paid eventually, by the sounds of it after several years and many bills submitted. Someone who fails to pay me on time is not supporting me or my business; a bad customer is a bad customer even if you don't have to write-off the bill. Why are you even arguing this?

The claim was made of " a history of stiffing artists". Although Frank claims compensation was late to him it still doesn't constitute getting " stiffed", in other words not paid at all.....and it does not prove a history of " stiffing artists". I argued this point because, although I didn't make a post to Frank to begin with he took a small part of what I said to someone else and addressed me on it so I responded. Why are you even arguing this?

[strangegrey]

Bottom line is: You got paid.

No, bottom line is, he got paid eventually, by the sounds of it after several years and many bills submitted. Someone who fails to pay me on time is not supporting me or my business; a bad customer is a bad customer even if you don't have to write-off the bill. Why are you even arguing this?

The claim was made of " a history of siffing artists". Although Frank claims compensation was late to him it still doesn't constitute getting " stiffed", in other words not paid at all.....and it does not prove a history of " stiffing artists". I argued this point because, although I didn't make a post to Frank to begin with he took a small part of what I said to someone else and addressed me on it so I responded. Why are you even arguing this?

Stiffing someone (i.e. not paying them) and then being forced to pay several years later, does not erase the fact that the person was originally stiffed. You're arguing a technicality which has zero bearing on the real world. Try stiffing a few creditors, paying them 3-4 years late...and making that same argument with the credit agencies.

You know, it's funny. I had a bet with someone that it would be at least a week before you started your viral vag-flapping again. I guess I'm out $20 bucks.

[Blueskies]

You're the one arguing a technicality. You eventually got your money didn't you? Getting " stiffed" is not getting paid at all.
I see you can't debate so you keep with the insults instead. I proved my point. Good day, Frank.

[Ehwmatt]

You're the one arguing a technicality. You eventually got your money didn't you? Getting " stiffed" is not getting paid at all.

Again, try making that argument with any creditor or lender. Have fun with that. I'm sure EquiFax will.

[Blueskies]

You're the one arguing a technicality. You eventually got your money didn't you? Getting " stiffed" is not getting paid at all.

Again, try making that argument with any creditor or lender. Have fun with that. I'm sure EquiFax will.

This is all diversion of the allegation. Frank claimed that Journey has a " history" of NON-payment to artists (plural) and none of his further argument lends evidence towards that claim. This isn't about allegations of late payments to Frank...he was alleging NON payments to artists without evidence....not even evidence with himself since he did eventually get paid.

[Arianddu]

You're the one arguing a technicality. You eventually got your money didn't you? Getting " stiffed" is not getting paid at all.
I see you can't debate so you keep with the insults instead. I proved my point. Good day, Frank.

So if your boss pays you a couple of months late, but does eventually pay you, you're cool with that? It's no problem? Nice world you live in.

[CatEyes]

Skylorde pm'ed me the actual blog entry from neal and I read it while out to dinner with the family...I literally snorted on the beer I was drinking with dinner. Here's the post:

Heads up! ESCAPE the ( Journey tribute band ) will most likely be hitting your town selling this crap as (The Journey Show) Fraudulent and misleading .

Now, Andrew, having said that, Hugo's band is called "Evolution"...Did Neal say something else with respect to Evo that I missed? Or is someone crossing their signals?

Looks like Neal is back on scotch.

Cat

[CatEyes]

But at the end of the day, good or bad, Neal owns Journey; he can do whatever he wants to protect it.

Oh, would you listen to yourself!!! Holy shit....do you take mud baths in bullshit as well or is shovelling it just a day hobby?


Neal isn't protecting Journey...he's fucking exploiting it.

Absofuckinglutely, Frank!!

And if he were anywhere near the businessman he would like to think he is, he would realize that since he IS Neal Schon, guitar player and founding member of Journey, that he should remain above the fray.

When he decides to jump down and go all ghetto he just makes himself look like an ass.

Cat

[strangegrey]

You're the one arguing a technicality. You eventually got your money didn't you? Getting " stiffed" is not getting paid at all.
I see you can't debate so you keep with the insults instead. I proved my point. Good day, Frank.

Absolutely NOT. You are. stiffing someone means not paying them when they expected to be paid. If someone has to wait 3 years to get paid on work that was delivered (and used) in good faith...that's being stiffed. The fact that I was able to coerce payment 3 years later, has nothing to do with the trustworthyness and creditworthyness of Neal Schon and Journey's management (the original issue being discussed, in case you've conveniently forgotten)....

The issue here isn't whether or not I was made 'whole' in the legal sense of the word....especially considering the fact that I needed to force their hand. The issue here is that Journey doesn't like paying people who work for them....and your statement that Neal was 'protecting' an artist, is laughable at best.

You beat someone to within an inch of death, yelling "Im going to kill you" and then three years later...you finally get arrested for the crime, convicted and thrown in jail for the rest of your life....and from your jail cell say "I didn't mean to do it, really, it was an accident, it was manslaughter"....that doesn't change your original intent. By any stretch of the imagination...even yours.


You're not making a very good argument.

[Rocker Chic]

On a side note: does anyone else find that hugo guy to be disturbingly creepy? think about it for a second. He wakes up every morning, brushes his teeth, ponders what kind of perry wig he'll be wearing, and hey, maybe he'll even put on a frontiers mustache ... i dunno - it's just weird

He doesn't wear a wig.

[strangegrey]

He doesn't wear a wig.

I'll bet he doesn't get botox injections either...

[wednesday's child]

I professed the love for this band only after they hired Arnel. I was very honest from the start how I got to know and love this band. And you should know it by now.

I will not renounce "my fan-ship" nor you cannot make me buy Infinity or TBF. I have my preference and that is Arnel with Journey. And I really like Neal, as a matter of fact, I am a proud facebook friend of Neal.

Chubby,


1. Lubos ang tuwa at pagmamalaki ko nang mapili si Arnel ng Journey, at kung hindi man ako datihan pang
tumatangkilik sa Journey, ay gugustuhin ko pa ring makilala't marinig ang mga nakaraang likha ng banda. Para
magtakip-tenga ka sa mga dating mga album nila ay salungat sa gawa ni Arnel mismo, na siyang kumakayod
sa pagbigay-parangal sa nasabing mga pamana nina Perry, Augeri atbp; sa entablado at sa plaka.

2. Ang pangit ng dating mo.
Kung ang mga binitiwan mong salita ukol kay Augeri, at 'tapos nun, kay Frank, ay walang malisya, ang naiisip
pa rin ng mga nakakabasa ng salita mo ay meron nga. Marapat na pag-aralan mo ang iyong paraan ng
pakikipag-usap, at kung BAKIT naiisip ng marami na pangit ang mga bigkas mo.

3. Ang pasan na binuhat ni Augeri ay hindi makakayang buhatin ni Arnel.
Kaka-alis lang ni Perry nun, na siyang kilala ng napakarami na boses ng Journey. Kahit sino ang kapalit niya,
babatikusin. Lalo pa kung taga-ibang bansa, at hirap pa'ng mag-Inggles --mawalang-galang na kay Arnel, pero
medyo hirap naman talaga siyang makipag-usap sa wikang Inggles.

4. Si Arnel, ay pinili dahil sa hawig ang boses niya kay Perry. Hindi exacto, pero kasinungalingan para
sabihin na iba pa ang dahilan kung bakit siya napansin ni Neal sa YouTube. Maganda ang boses, at hawig sa
boses-Perry, kaya nakuha si 'Nel.


wech

[Tito]

I don't know what's going on and I don't have time to read 12 pages. But regardless of what is going on, I'm on Neal's side. He's right.

[strangegrey]

I don't know what's going on and I don't have time to read 12 pages. But regardless of what is going on, I'm on Neal's side. He's right.

In a nutshell, Tito...

Neal went online and started complaining that some tribute bands were getting free blow jobs from male fans. He mistakenly pointed the finger at Evolution and Hugo (who weren't doing that)...instead of laying the acusation properly to other tribute bands and their glory holes operating on the west and east coast.

He was angry and jealous that he wasn't getting his fair share of knob hobblings...and made a stink about it.


Given that you are on Neal's side...does that mean you're, um, willing to shift your attentions away from the tribute bands to neal himself?

[Behshad]

I don't know what's going on .

[marco17]

Also, like most threads at some point, got off topic a few pages in, & turned into the who's the best singer for the band competition, and then defending. What are we talking about again???

[Michigan Girl]

LMAO@ Frank and B....
Jason, again, you're being a shit!!
You ask everyone else to think hypothetically and then
you make a joke when Author2 asked you to do the
same~ Shame, Shame...

Tito~ Neal appears to be wrong at this point, but have fun making it up to him!!!

[conversationpc]

You're the one arguing a technicality. You eventually got your money didn't you? Getting " stiffed" is not getting paid at all.
I see you can't debate so you keep with the insults instead. I proved my point. Good day, Frank.

Absolutely NOT. You are. stiffing someone means not paying them when they expected to be paid. If someone has to wait 3 years to get paid on work that was delivered (and used) in good faith...that's being stiffed. The fact that I was able to coerce payment 3 years later, has nothing to do with the trustworthyness and creditworthyness of Neal Schon and Journey's management (the original issue being discussed, in case you've conveniently forgotten)....

The issue here isn't whether or not I was made 'whole' in the legal sense of the word....especially considering the fact that I needed to force their hand. The issue here is that Journey doesn't like paying people who work for them....and your statement that Neal was 'protecting' an artist, is laughable at best.

You beat someone to within an inch of death, yelling "Im going to kill you" and then three years later...you finally get arrested for the crime, convicted and thrown in jail for the rest of your life....and from your jail cell say "I didn't mean to do it, really, it was an accident, it was manslaughter"....that doesn't change your original intent. By any stretch of the imagination...even yours.


You're not making a very good argument.

I declare Frank the winner. Everyone please move on. Nothing to see here.

[larryfromnextdoor]

Everyone please move on. Nothing to see here.

[FishinMagician]

I don't think it's " singing out my ass" to say that it's in both Neal and the artists best interest to protect the bands trademark artwork. What would be singing out ones ass is to insinuate that there is a " history " of non-payment of artists (plural) and yet give one example and one does not make a "history". Besides which, your claim that one artist has never been paid in full is an allegation which requires proof in way of documentation of the artists own words making the allegation or for the artist to come here and speak for himself about his own personal compensation or lack of for his work. Also, an online review system is not artwork and has nothing to do with this issue of protecting a logo but you can speak to your own compensation or lack of and appearently from what you said here you did get paid. Maybe you didn't get paid in a timely enough manner for your satisfaction, but you did get paid. Getting paid does not give evidence of a history of non-payment.

You're singing out of your ass to suggest that Neal's best interest is to protect his IP and to "protect his artists." For these purposes art and the use/reuse of website materials (including the art developed within it to allow the user interface to work as intended) is most certainly treated the same way, from a legal standpoint. So that part of your argument pissed down the drain.

The IP (whether it's 'art' or an online system containing 'art') is not Journey's to use or reuse as they see fit until the contract is satisfied. Transfer of ownership happens at final payment. Not before...unless there's a contractual clause that states otherwise, which there was not.

I'll let the other artists who have been screwed by this band speak up for themselves, so you can't sit there and vag-flap and argue your way out of this on a technicality. Fair enough? (you really have a screw loose...I feel sorry for the sap that has to exist with you) so while you can sit there and try to find a way to get argumentative about the 'timeliness' of things....the fact remains that this band used MY IP for several years, while I patiently waited for them to pay me. Only at a point where they decided to use the system beyond the scope of it's original design, was I able to convince them to open the checkbook. If they "cared" about protecting their own IP or the interests of their "artists"....they wouldn't have let that happen...Because at any point during this issue, I would have been able to either shut down that portion of the website personally or do so legally....in both cases, Journey would have had zero ability to protect shit...because they didn't own it. I thought a less confrontational approach was the higher road.

But make no mistake, they would have held out indefinitely if they could. They don't care about protecting their IP or their artists. That, you can take to the bank.

They worry about protecting their interests when they feel their interests are threatened...but to protect your interests, sometimes you have to pay insurance premiums when they're NOT threatened. sometimes you have to feed the guarddog when there are NO wolves at the front gate.

Try to not approach every post like you're fighting your spouse for who's got remote rights on sunday afternoon. You might actually exist here without every man on this board thinking your a fucking psycho.

A lot of words there none of which proves anything different. Bottom line is: You got paid.

no shit he got paid...we get it...you're missing the point by a mile or 50...