Jonathan writing country songs

[yandtguy]

This album is not religous! It is spritual. Equal, love, peace, understanding... why do people not get this

That's naive. Arnell name-checks Allah, Buddah, Krishna, and the Messiah (Jesus) on "To Whom It May Concern." "Tantra" is a Hindu term. Trial By Fire is more of a spiritual album than Eclipse. I think Eclipse is Journey's attempt to try to embrace some form of syncretism. As a Jesus follower, syncretism is anathema to me. Jesus said, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Notice, I didn't say Jesus was the only way to the Father. He did.

Feel free to believe whatever you like. As an American, I hold fast to the idea of liberty. We should all be free to believe what we like and not be discriminated against because of those beliefs. I am also free to disagree with you, as you are with me. Why in the world do we have to agree on something to be friends? At the end of the day, I am responsible for working out my own salvation "in fear and trembling" as are you.

Greg

[Blueskies]

Even though I don't agree with Deano's methods, I do agree with his statement that Allah is not my God. The biggest problem I have with the new Journey album is the universalist approach to the lyrics. I respect people of different faiths, but I do not, for one minute, believe that Allah, Vishnu, and Yaweh are the same. In fact, I believe that syncretism is the ultimate form of disrespect. Why would a Hindu not believe that Vishnu is unique? While Muslims are to recognize Jews and Christians as people of the Book, there is no way that they would equate Allah with the Triune God of the Christians. Yes, we all have to coexist, but that doesn't mean that I have to relegate my God to some watered down, collage god that doesn't offend anybody's delicate sensibilities.

Greg

Your post illustrates why we need to come to an understanding that there is only one God for us all. You say "my God" when God is exclusive to no one man formed religion. One God for all, with no one group more right than another. Segregation and separation and putting a claim on God is what brings wars...death and destruction. Wars and separate churches are man made. Man trying to speak for God and man trying to divide and concur using the name of God for power, greed, hate and destruction and for racism thinking one tribe is superior to another. There is one spirit for all and no organized man made religion...no church...only has the spirit over them exclusively. That's what is spoken about in the lyrics ....and its what I believe as well. That why I am spiritual but I'm not religious. I belong to no organized religion but I study all and respect all people of faith in whatever manner they choose. Seeking the spirit is a personal quest, not one to be debated and labeled, imo. Although I will speak up against religious persecution. People of all faiths have a right to their beliefs and not all who follow any particular faith use it wrongly for their own agendas.
One God. One love. For all. By whatever name, it is but one in the same spirit, imo.

I use the phrase "my God" like I would say "my mother." That does not mean that "my mother" is not my sisters's mother. And, again, according to the Hebrew scriptures, God made a covenant with one people, and from that people came a Messiah for all. That's not an idea I came up. God is who God is, not who we want Him to be. You say, "Seeking the spirit is a personal quest, not one to be debated and labeled, imo." You should stick to that yourself, because all you did in your statement was critique what I said, when I was merely pointing out in my previous post what I believed.

Greg

I'm not debating your personal beliefs. I was further explaining what I meant by my post that you took issue with.

[conversationpc]

That's naive. Arnell name-checks Allah, Buddah, Krishna, and the Messiah (Jesus) on "To Whom It May Concern." "Tantra" is a Hindu term. Trial By Fire is more of a spiritual album than Eclipse.

Agreed...I can listen to TBF and agree with a lot of the spiritual stuff mentioned there. Not so with "Eclipse", though I enjoy the music still.

I think Eclipse is Journey's attempt to try to embrace some form of syncretism. As a Jesus follower, syncretism is anathema to me. Jesus said, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Notice, I didn't say Jesus was the only way to the Father. He did.

[Rockindeano]

Oh what the fuck is this? Blueskies leading an online intervention of sorts in my honour? Who died and made you judge me or others for that matter? Only God judges, cunthole! I don't sit in judgment of anyone. Sure, I give my 2 cents on assholes like Neal, Azoff and RobbieG, but I also give kudos to sweet people like Lynn, Melissa and Deb from Calgary....and at the same time, although certain people here irritate me to no fucking end, like S2M and Tito, they are good guys who I apologize to if I light em up. Your point about me doing drugs and alcohol is interesting. After all, have you installed a Deano Cam in my room, car and workplace? Maybe because I come on here and do tell the truth? Yes, I do pound the living shit out of Natty Ice, and I do take heaping amounts of pain killers(because of um, pain?). What's YOUR excuse for being an all mighty prophet/lord/queen?

This is a Goddamned message board. Do I know I am the most hated here? Absolutely I do. I am the most popular so I take that in stride. I do know there are some who do like me too. I have been very rude and mean to certain people, and when necessary, be it online or in real life, have apologized and forged on. other times IMO, I have been very gracious too. Ask the many who I recorded the Direct TV show and mailed it out to wanting fans on my dime? How about me doing the same for the generations project, where many couldn't get the disc, but I could, so I did my best to distribute it. I gave away passes and tickets to people who wanted/needed them, where I could have sold them had I wanted beer money. Not a saint by any stretch, and yes I am an asshole, but for you to sit here and predict my demise Blueskies is a bit like Nostradamus.

Some here have heard from my mouth directly about my current status of being clinically deeply depressed and suicidal. Yes, it is true. I am coping the best I know how. I attempted and obviously failed, three times to commit suicide, as recently as 2 weeks ago. Why am I telling you this (you in particular Blueskies), is perhaps you are onto something, but maybe you should be careful on how you say certain things. it is kind of like making a joke about S2M's mother for laughs, only to find out she recently passed away. Not cool and cruel to Sean.

I have told my situation privately and deeply to 2 people on here, one male and one female. By our online banter, you would never figure out the female (I have tremendous respect for her knowledge and intelligence and now for her kindness). The male was none other than Mr. McNeice (and his lovely wife). In any event, yes, I am fucked up, and yes I can deal it out harshly on the board, but I can't stand by here quietly, or lay down for that matter, as this Board succumbs to BT leftovers and Pineda fans lolz and all that shit, to overrun the once great MR. I love Pineda, think he is a great guy, but sadly, and I firmly believe this, his fanbase lowers the integrity of the Journey fan base. They have no respect for the legacy, the body of work and the Classic years, and I have a problem with that.

Andrew, this is America, the land of second chances. You IMHO, really need to consider reinstating AR, Joeydelight, Joe Reardon and Journeytroll. Put 'em all on a short leash...but give em a chance to participate. There are so many good posters who are still registered here, yet choose to not post because the boredom is so great. Perfect example- Red13JoePa. Is there a nicer guy on here than he? Yeah, he ia a touch gay for his Augeri man love and his forgiveness of tapegate, but we need to get his ilk back on here and fight off the BT maggots who have come here.

Oh and Blueskies, darling, I have written a few suicide notes/letters... one for Lula, three others for my kids, Cheyanna, Bruce and Wyatt, and a general one for everyone else. I'll make sure it gets posted here before I do what I shouldn't do. I'll make sure you get a personalized copy, Phyllis, so you can celebrate my death..

[RedWingFan]

I have told my situation privately and deeply to 2 people on here, one male and one female. By our online banter, you would never figure out the female (I have tremendous respect for her knowledge and intelligence and now for her kindness).

If I guess right will you tell me????

[SF-Dano]

consider reinstating AR, Joeydelight, Joe Reardon and Journeytroll.

The old days..................
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD3y43cyddI

[Blueskies]

Oh what the fuck is this? Blueskies leading an online intervention of sorts in my honour? Who died and made you judge me or others for that matter? Only God judges, cunthole! I don't sit in judgment of anyone. Sure, I give my 2 cents on assholes like Neal, Azoff and RobbieG, but I also give kudos to sweet people like Lynn, Melissa and Deb from Calgary....and at the same time, although certain people here irritate me to no fucking end, like S2M and Tito, they are good guys who I apologize to if I light em up. Your point about me doing drugs and alcohol is interesting. After all, have you installed a Deano Cam in my room, car and workplace? Maybe because I come on here and do tell the truth? Yes, I do pound the living shit out of Natty Ice, and I do take heaping amounts of pain killers(because of um, pain?). What's YOUR excuse for being an all mighty prophet/lord/queen?

This is a Goddamned message board. Do I know I am the most hated here? Absolutely I do. I am the most popular so I take that in stride. I do know there are some who do like me too. I have been very rude and mean to certain people, and when necessary, be it online or in real life, have apologized and forged on. other times IMO, I have been very gracious too. Ask the many who I recorded the Direct TV show and mailed it out to wanting fans on my dime? How about me doing the same for the generations project, where many couldn't get the disc, but I could, so I did my best to distribute it. I gave away passes and tickets to people who wanted/needed them, where I could have sold them had I wanted beer money. Not a saint by any stretch, and yes I am an asshole, but for you to sit here and predict my demise Blueskies is a bit like Nostradamus.

Some here have heard from my mouth directly about my current status of being clinically deeply depressed and suicidal. Yes, it is true. I am coping the best I know how. I attempted and obviously failed, three times to commit suicide, as recently as 2 weeks ago. Why am I telling you this (you in particular Blueskies), is perhaps you are onto something, but maybe you should be careful on how you say certain things. it is kind of like making a joke about S2M's mother for laughs, only to find out she recently passed away. Not cool and cruel to Sean.

I have told my situation privately and deeply to 2 people on here, one male and one female. By our online banter, you would never figure out the female (I have tremendous respect for her knowledge and intelligence and now for her kindness). The male was none other than Mr. McNeice (and his lovely wife). In any event, yes, I am fucked up, and yes I can deal it out harshly on the board, but I can't stand by here quietly, or lay down for that matter, as this Board succumbs to BT leftovers and Pineda fans lolz and all that shit, to overrun the once great MR. I love Pineda, think he is a great guy, but sadly, and I firmly believe this, his fanbase lowers the integrity of the Journey fan base. They have no respect for the legacy, the body of work and the Classic years, and I have a problem with that.

Andrew, this is America, the land of second chances. You IMHO, really need to consider reinstating AR, Joeydelight, Joe Reardon and Journeytroll. Put 'em all on a short leash...but give em a chance to participate. There are so many good posters who are still registered here, yet choose to not post because the boredom is so great. Perfect example- Red13JoePa. Is there a nicer guy on here than he? Yeah, he ia a touch gay for his Augeri man love and his forgiveness of tapegate, but we need to get his ilk back on here and fight off the BT maggots who have come here.

Oh and Blueskies, darling, I have written a few suicide notes/letters... one for Lula, three others for my kids, Cheyanna, Bruce and Wyatt, and a general one for everyone else. I'll make sure it gets posted here before I do what I shouldn't do. I'll make sure you get a personalized copy, Phyllis, so you can celebrate my death..

I don't give a crap about this forum and it's popularity or not from knocking others down like you want to get started again. My only concern right now is you! If you think I've enjoyed any of this over the years you are sadly mistaken. If you think I enjoy your pain in any way you are sadly mistaken. I could go about my business and not say a thing. Think about it. Really think about why I may respond at all and put my head on the potential chopping block in way of attack?

I see because I've seen the pain youre in up close and personal from the day I was born until the day my mother took her own life! She is a big part of how I can see through peoples bullshit for their behavior now! Celebrate your death??? I want to prevent it!!! You have no idea the pain I experienced growing up watching my mom suffer through constant episodes of manic depression and attempts to commit suicide. One of my earliest memories is of the ambulance coming to the house because she took a bottle of pills. She could never see herself honestly either and was in denial of her problems for years and took everyone through crap with the paranoia in thinking everyone was against her. I was in college when she finally did the deed, taking psychology courses so I could try to understand her better and to understand the affect she had on me and the rest of the family. I have spent most of my own life contemplating what happened and recovering from the effects of growing up with her. She affected everyone. You are also affecting everyone in your life so its not all about you. The pain is not yours alone.

Celebrate your death??? Dude, you have no idea of where I've been in life and of what I've seen and went through. I found my mother in the garage at her house in the car! I even tried to revive her! I had not heard from her the day before and had gotten worried and after my sons and I got out of school that day I loaded them in the car and went over to her house to check on her because I sensed something was wrong so I had my 3 little boys with me when I found her dead!! I see the same patterns of self destruction in others that I grew up seeing in her. I see it in you without need of a camera. I observe and have a recall ability of conversation and have seen the pattern in you. You have shown much more on this forum then you think you have. No, Dean, I find absolutely no enjoyment from others pain that I see and I most definitely would not celebrate yours or anyone else's death. The only thing I've ever really done to you is try to help you. I know other people have tried to help you and you've pushed them away too.

You aren't completely honest with anyone because youre not even completely honest with yourself. You have a mental health problem. Its a chemical imbalance in your brain, it is not your fault, its like any other physical disability and there is no shame in having an affliction. You admit much but also cover up much. My mom never got properly diagnosed and the right combination of medication and therapy to help her. She would even deny everything and not talk to the doctors when we as a family had to hospitalize her a few times to try to save her life when she would get in even worse shape then we could handle. I can't even count the number of times she would try to commit suicide or say she was going to kill herself. Your pain can not be covered up with over medicating and getting drunk. The booze is a depressant and the last thing you need. Your brand of self help isn't going to help you any more than her coping mechanisms did. The booze and abusing the wrong meds only makes things worse not better.

Why did I say something bluntly to you today? Because I care. Why would I stick my neck out here in the open to have others judge me on my mothers actions and her mental problems? People do you know...something else I've had to deal with in life is the stigma of having a mom who had mental problems and killed herself. People judge me on it. Realize what your kids will go through if you kill yourself. Thats why I'm saying as much as I have already here. It's not only genuine concern for you but also for your children because I know exactly what they are going through now and what they would go through if you commit suicide. So, I'm sticking my neck out and offering you a hand once again by way of an ear to listen if you want from someone who's been there, seen it before. If you want to talk, the offer is there. I'll pm my number and you can call anytime you like if you need to talk to someone who really does understand much more than you know. So celebrate? Think again.

[RedWingFan]

I don't give a crap about this forum and it's popularity or not from knocking others down like you want to get started again. My only concern right now is you! If you think I've enjoyed any of this over the years you are sadly mistaken. If you think I enjoy your pain in any way you are sadly mistaken. I could go about my business and not say a thing. Think about it. Really think about why I may respond at all and put my head on the potential chopping block in way of attack?

I see because I've seen the pain youre in up close and personal from the day I was born until the day my mother took her own life! She is a big part of how I can see through peoples bullshit for their behavior now! Celebrate your death??? I want to prevent it!!! You have no idea the pain I experienced growing up watching my mom suffer through constant episodes of manic depression and attempts to commit suicide. One of my earliest memories is of the ambulance coming to the house because she took a bottle of pills. She could never see herself honestly either and was in denial of her problems for years and took everyone through crap with the paranoia in thinking everyone was against her. I was in college when she finally did the deed, taking psychology courses so I could try to understand her better and to understand the affect she had on me and the rest of the family. I have spent most of my own life contemplating what happened and recovering from the effects of growing up with her. She affected everyone. You are also affecting everyone in your life so its not all about you. The pain is not yours alone.

Celebrate your death??? Dude, you have no idea of where I've been in life and of what I've seen and went through. I found my mother in the garage at her house in the car! I even tried to revive her! I had not heard from her the day before and had gotten worried and after my sons and I got out of school that day I loaded them in the car and went over to her house to check on her because I sensed something was wrong so I had my 3 little boys with me when I found her dead!! I see the same patterns of self destruction in others that I grew up seeing in her. I see it in you without need of a camera. I observe and have a recall ability of conversation and have seen the pattern in you. You have shown much more on this forum then you think you have. No, Dean, I find absolutely no enjoyment from others pain that I see and I most definitely would not celebrate yours or anyone else's death. The only thing I've ever really done to you is try to help you. I know other people have tried to help you and you've pushed them away too.

You aren't completely honest with anyone because youre not even completely honest with yourself. You have a mental health problem. Its a chemical imbalance in your brain, it is not your fault, its like any other physical disability and there is no shame in having an affliction. You admit much but also cover up much. My mom never got properly diagnosed and the right combination of medication and therapy to help her. She would even deny everything and not talk to the doctors when we as a family had to hospitalize her a few times to try to save her life when she would get in even worse shape then we could handle. I can't even count the number of times she would try to commit suicide or say she was going to kill herself. Your pain can not be covered up with over medicating and getting drunk. The booze is a depressant and the last thing you need. Your brand of self help isn't going to help you any more than her coping mechanisms did. The booze and abusing the wrong meds only makes things worse not better.

Why did I say something bluntly to you today? Because I care. Why would I stick my neck out here in the open to have others judge me on my mothers actions and her mental problems? People do you know...something else I've had to deal with in life is the stigma of having a mom who had mental problems and killed herself. People judge me on it. Realize what your kids will go through if you kill yourself. Thats why I'm saying as much as I have already here. It's not only genuine concern for you but also for your children because I know exactly what they are going through now and what they would go through if you commit suicide. So, I'm sticking my neck out and offering you a hand once again by way of an ear to listen if you want from someone who's been there, seen it before. If you want to talk, the offer is there. I'll pm my number and you can call anytime you like if you need to talk to someone who really does understand much more than you know. So celebrate? Think again.

Nice post. I was able to read it in its entirety because you somehow had it broken into paragraphs.

[Blueskies]

Well, getting judged on my bad typing, grammer, punctuation and spacing is hell of a lot better then unfairly being judged on my mom's affliction and actions.
I'm just hoping Deans kids never have to be in the same position.

[slucero]

How 'bout that new Night Ranger album?

[S2M]

How 'bout that new Night Ranger album?

4 good tracks...the rest? Meh....

[Don]

How 'bout that new Night Ranger album?

The Night Ranger album was sort of what I had expected Eclipse to sound like. Straight ahead rock and roll, like early 80s Def Leppard (before Pyromania).

[StringsOfJoy]

How 'bout that new Night Ranger album?

The Night Ranger album was sort of what I had expected Eclipse to sound like. Straight ahead rock and roll, like early 80s Def Leppard (before Pyromania).

Meh...so far I've passed on it...sounds more dated that Journey's Eclipse sound...

Then again, in the darkest recesses of my heart you all don't wanna know what kind of sounds I'd like to hear Journey experiment with and fold into their style...but it'll never happen so no need for anyone to worry...lol...

On a more serious note though, and since this thread is as good as it will get for this to not sound too mischievous: I'm sort of over Kevin Shirley too (actually have been since Arrival). Since Jon lives in Nashville now and since I think stylistically he's a guy with taste and with a serious guitarist's sensibility, I'd (seriously) like to nominate the following as Producer of the next Journey record:

Dan Huff.

Thoughts and flames?

[slucero]

I was gonna say Mutt Lange...

[Don]

How 'bout that new Night Ranger album?

The Night Ranger album was sort of what I had expected Eclipse to sound like. Straight ahead rock and roll, like early 80s Def Leppard (before Pyromania).

Meh...so far I've passed on it...sounds more dated that Journey's Eclipse sound...

Then again, in the darkest recesses of my heart you all don't wanna know what kind of sounds I'd like to hear Journey experiment with and fold into their style...but it'll never happen so no need for anyone to worry...lol...

On a more serious note though, and since this thread is as good as it will get for this to not sound too mischievous: I'm sort of over Kevin Shirley too (actually have been since Arrival). Since Jon lives in Nashville now and since I think stylistically he's a guy with taste and with a serious guitarist's sensibility, I'd (seriously) like to nominate the following as Producer of the next Journey record:

Dan Huff.

Thoughts and flames?

Well, seeing as the next all new Journey record (if there is one) will probably be financed by the band themselves, I think it's safe to assume that Shirley or any producer who can command a high payday will be out of the equation.

I think Shirley got a "GET OUT OF JAIL FREE" card when Neal and Jon added their names to the production credits for Eclipse. With the album tanking at retail, Kevin can just play it off as too many fingers in the pie.

[Rick]

How 'bout that new Night Ranger album?

The Night Ranger album was sort of what I had expected Eclipse to sound like. Straight ahead rock and roll, like early 80s Def Leppard (before Pyromania).

Meh...so far I've passed on it...sounds more dated that Journey's Eclipse sound...

Then again, in the darkest recesses of my heart you all don't wanna know what kind of sounds I'd like to hear Journey experiment with and fold into their style...but it'll never happen so no need for anyone to worry...lol...

On a more serious note though, and since this thread is as good as it will get for this to not sound too mischievous: I'm sort of over Kevin Shirley too (actually have been since Arrival). Since Jon lives in Nashville now and since I think stylistically he's a guy with taste and with a serious guitarist's sensibility, I'd (seriously) like to nominate the following as Producer of the next Journey record:

Dan Huff.

Thoughts and flames?

Country producer? She's a Mystery is closer to Country than I want Journey to ever venture again. I'm kind of guessing that may be along the lines of what you were being cryptic about being in those recesses.

I have a feeling you're going to see something like that on the next record though. Being that Jon is now in Nashville, and will be much more heavily influenced in that direction there, than he was in CA. Back in 2008 or 2009 when I saw them in Oklahoma, they did some kind of shit kickin thing with a harmonica.

[StringsOfJoy]

Country producer? She's a Mystery is closer to Country than I want Journey to ever venture again. I'm kind of guessing that may be along the lines of what you were being cryptic about being in those recesses.

I have a feeling you're going to see something like that on the next record though. Being that Jon is now in Nashville, and will be much more heavily influenced in that direction there, than he was in CA. Back in 2008 or 2009 when I saw them in Oklahoma, they did some kind of shit kickin thing with a harmonica.

Look deeper into his resume and you'll see where he was at in the 1980s.

And since you insisted about my "cryptic recesses," I wasn't thinking country at all...although I think She's a Mystery is an epic track (and don't hear anything country about it unless you automatically assume acoustic guitars and Hammond B3s = country). Actually, I was thinking sounds out of shoegaze, sludge metal, stoner rock, and hardcore/experimental rock...in the context of Journey's "classic" style. Not to "redefine" the Journey sound...just think of it as new contemporary accessories to a classic outfit: hard to describe, but the sound is in my head even if I can't exactly share it with you!

[Rick]

Country producer? She's a Mystery is closer to Country than I want Journey to ever venture again. I'm kind of guessing that may be along the lines of what you were being cryptic about being in those recesses.

I have a feeling you're going to see something like that on the next record though. Being that Jon is now in Nashville, and will be much more heavily influenced in that direction there, than he was in CA. Back in 2008 or 2009 when I saw them in Oklahoma, they did some kind of shit kickin thing with a harmonica.

Look deeper into his resume and you'll see where he was at in the 1980s.

And since you insisted about my "cryptic recesses," I wasn't thinking country at all...although I think She's a Mystery is an epic track (and don't hear anything country about it unless you automatically assume acoustic guitars and Hammer B3s = country). Actually, I was thinking sounds out of shoegaze, sludge metal, stoner rock, and hardcore/experimental rock...in the context of Journey's "classic" style. Not to "redefine" the Journey sound...just think of it as new contemporary accessories to a classic outfit: hard to describe, but the sound is in my head even if I can't exactly share it with you!

I did some Googling on Huff. He does have an impressive resume. It's just that lately, most of the folks he's worked with are Country.

I hear some Country twang in the guitar playing in She's a Mystery. Maybe it's just me.

As to the rest of what you said, I guess I would have to hear it. If it has them rocking harder, I'm already on board.

[StringsOfJoy]

I did some Googling on Huff. He does have an impressive resume. It's just that lately, most of the folks he's worked with are Country.

I hear some Country twang in the guitar playing in She's a Mystery. Maybe it's just me.

As to the rest of what you said, I guess I would have to hear it. If it has them rocking harder, I'm already on board.

I am definitely a member of of the Rocking Harder Party lol...although occasionally a ballad will sneak in an surprise me...

I think Huff's done a great job tastefully spotlighting some pretty hot fretwork in Keith Urban's recordings...and I actually think that fits solidly into the "California Country/Country-Rock" category of music. In any case, in my imagination the combination of some him with some of those other ideas could make everyone stretch and be challenged to come out with something fresh and rockin'...

[Rockindeano]

State of grace is defined as the state of being in God's grace in Christian theology.
Its no surprise to me that someone feeling their faith in the spirit would repeat the expression.
I have no idea if JC is a Christian or not but regardless of labels, anyone with belief in the spirit could describe it the same.
What is said in Eclipse is that belief in spirit is inclusive of all faiths, not exclusive for any one as it is belief in the same spirit by all.

In other words, to me, being in grace is walking in the light and love of spirit.
Spirit meaning God, Allah, Yahweh, Savior, Jehovah, Adonai, Elohim, etc. Regardless of the name affixed by man, they are all one in the same.

Not so fast Slingblade. You are lumping Allah in with God? Back away from the pipe and give it a rest. Too many bucket hits for your brain today.. Allah and God? Yeah I can see those two tooling around the golf course arguing over Allah's illegal drops and cheating, while God is breaking Tiger's records left and right. Allah has enough and drives the golf cart into the beer cart in a form of miniature terrorist. probably not Bsky.

Deano as always you have NO idea what you are talking about.

I am sorry, for you are correct. I am bankrupt all things Journey. Having NO idea regarding journey sounds about right. Carry on and again, I am Sorry.

[SYNCH]

Like ?Don said, Journey = God talk/Religion/Spiritual = FAIL, see how this turned out? This is the one of the reasons why there is a Church and a Government separated in the first place. Ceasar is for Ceasar, God is for God, Journey is for Journey. However, I like Tantra Anyway... carry on

[Rick]

I don't give a crap about this forum and it's popularity or not from knocking others down like you want to get started again. My only concern right now is you! If you think I've enjoyed any of this over the years you are sadly mistaken. If you think I enjoy your pain in any way you are sadly mistaken. I could go about my business and not say a thing. Think about it. Really think about why I may respond at all and put my head on the potential chopping block in way of attack?

I see because I've seen the pain youre in up close and personal from the day I was born until the day my mother took her own life! She is a big part of how I can see through peoples bullshit for their behavior now! Celebrate your death??? I want to prevent it!!! You have no idea the pain I experienced growing up watching my mom suffer through constant episodes of manic depression and attempts to commit suicide. One of my earliest memories is of the ambulance coming to the house because she took a bottle of pills. She could never see herself honestly either and was in denial of her problems for years and took everyone through crap with the paranoia in thinking everyone was against her. I was in college when she finally did the deed, taking psychology courses so I could try to understand her better and to understand the affect she had on me and the rest of the family. I have spent most of my own life contemplating what happened and recovering from the effects of growing up with her. She affected everyone. You are also affecting everyone in your life so its not all about you. The pain is not yours alone.

Celebrate your death??? Dude, you have no idea of where I've been in life and of what I've seen and went through. I found my mother in the garage at her house in the car! I even tried to revive her! I had not heard from her the day before and had gotten worried and after my sons and I got out of school that day I loaded them in the car and went over to her house to check on her because I sensed something was wrong so I had my 3 little boys with me when I found her dead!! I see the same patterns of self destruction in others that I grew up seeing in her. I see it in you without need of a camera. I observe and have a recall ability of conversation and have seen the pattern in you. You have shown much more on this forum then you think you have. No, Dean, I find absolutely no enjoyment from others pain that I see and I most definitely would not celebrate yours or anyone else's death. The only thing I've ever really done to you is try to help you. I know other people have tried to help you and you've pushed them away too.

You aren't completely honest with anyone because youre not even completely honest with yourself. You have a mental health problem. Its a chemical imbalance in your brain, it is not your fault, its like any other physical disability and there is no shame in having an affliction. You admit much but also cover up much. My mom never got properly diagnosed and the right combination of medication and therapy to help her. She would even deny everything and not talk to the doctors when we as a family had to hospitalize her a few times to try to save her life when she would get in even worse shape then we could handle. I can't even count the number of times she would try to commit suicide or say she was going to kill herself. Your pain can not be covered up with over medicating and getting drunk. The booze is a depressant and the last thing you need. Your brand of self help isn't going to help you any more than her coping mechanisms did. The booze and abusing the wrong meds only makes things worse not better.

Why did I say something bluntly to you today? Because I care. Why would I stick my neck out here in the open to have others judge me on my mothers actions and her mental problems? People do you know...something else I've had to deal with in life is the stigma of having a mom who had mental problems and killed herself. People judge me on it. Realize what your kids will go through if you kill yourself. Thats why I'm saying as much as I have already here. It's not only genuine concern for you but also for your children because I know exactly what they are going through now and what they would go through if you commit suicide. So, I'm sticking my neck out and offering you a hand once again by way of an ear to listen if you want from someone who's been there, seen it before. If you want to talk, the offer is there. I'll pm my number and you can call anytime you like if you need to talk to someone who really does understand much more than you know. So celebrate? Think again.

Nice post. I was able to read it in its entirety because you somehow had it broken into paragraphs.

It was an excellent post. Sorry about your loss Phyllis.

[Blueskies]

I appreciate that, Rick, thanks. It's all still hard to talk about but I get myself over that difficulty hump and will speak openly about it if I think my mom's life and death can help even one person in some way.

[Blueskies]

I tried to talk to Dean this morning. He responded one time with a message reading very familiar to me in what he said similiar to my moms many notes over the years..which frightened me. He then closed the door on me and would not call or message any further. He thinks I hate him and am only trying to make fun...which couldn't be farther from the truth. He needs to really face this crisis and deal with it by getting the proper medical help and not just in mentioning it here and there on this forum like he's been doing and in only talking about it to a couple people who live very far away from him. I'm saying this in the open because I don't know who here has his trust and may be able to reach him since I can't. So will someone who is friends with him please try to talk to him. He may be trying to get attention..or he may be seriously contemplating it....either way is a cry for help. So please, any that know him well and talk to him on a regular basis.. will you try to contact him and/or try to contact a friend or relative that lives nearby him. Please.

[youkeepmewaiting]

My father is going through depression at the moment, but no one near as severe as yours. I hope you do what you can and get through this.

[youkeepmewaiting]

My father is going through depression at the moment, but no one near as severe as yours. I hope you do what you can and get through this.

[yulog]

State of grace is defined as the state of being in God's grace in Christian theology.
Its no surprise to me that someone feeling their faith in the spirit would repeat the expression.
I have no idea if JC is a Christian or not but regardless of labels, anyone with belief in the spirit could describe it the same.
What is said in Eclipse is that belief in spirit is inclusive of all faiths, not exclusive for any one as it is belief in the same spirit by all.

In other words, to me, being in grace is walking in the light and love of spirit.
Spirit meaning God, Allah, Yahweh, Savior, Jehovah, Adonai, Elohim, etc. Regardless of the name affixed by man, they are all one in the same.

Not so fast Slingblade. You are lumping Allah in with God? Back away from the pipe and give it a rest. Too many bucket hits for your brain today.. Allah and God? Yeah I can see those two tooling around the golf course arguing over Allah's illegal drops and cheating, while God is breaking Tiger's records left and right. Allah has enough and drives the golf cart into the beer cart in a form of miniature terrorist. probably not Bsky.

Perhaps if your brain wasn't addeled from drink and drugs and if your heart wasn't addeled by self hate instead of love, then maybe you would have understood my post. Seriously, Dean, it's been like watching a train wreck in slow motion for years now with you....are you going to continue down the line until your completely smashed to bits and there wont be enough of you left to even bury??? Deep down in you, I still feel there is some good, but it will never be used in the way it should if you don't do something now!. Face it! You are an addict!

and to the rest of y'all......

If some of you think you're going to jump me now for saying this and think you will be showing you care about this man if you do. Think again. For the last 5 years I've watched people enable this guy, not help him by condoning his bad behavior and coddling him and some even contributing to his dependency further by suppling him in one way or another. If y'all really gave a shit about him you would tell him straight what he needs to hear, not what he wants to hear. Theres time for gentle care and compassion with folks but there also has to come a time for some tough love and he's needed someone to tell it to him straight and give him a good firm kick in the ass to wake him up and get him moving in the right direction for years! Some of y'all make me sick! You are just as much of a wuss as he is when you enable him instead of helping him in the way he really needs! It doesn't take any guts at all to come on a forum and degrade others and call names like a juvenile along with him. It takes courage to stand up to him and tell him what he really needs to hear! For real, don't any of y'all have any integrity left to stand firm in your convictions? Where's the strength in character to take a stand and do the right thing by speaking against the bullying he and some others have done for so long on here? Where's the strength to tell him what he needs to hear to save his life??? Oh the hell with it, go ahead and play your games and attack me but it won't hurt me at all...the denial by covering up the problems will only continue to help this man into an early grave. You can't cover for him and you can't cover his pain...it's been too clear to see all along.


Oh and Ed, I know you'll be reading...you need to face the truth as well. You may be functioning but you are still an alcoholic too. Your friends only enable you as well by sitting back and quietly condoning your dependence by their silence or by joining in and encouraging you to drink....when what you also need is someone to tell you straight what you need to hear and not what you want to hear and give you a good swift kick in the ass to get you in gear as well! You and Dean both need a wake up call! You both can deny you have a dependency problem to others but you know inside what the truth is. Don't deny yourselves and don't deny your families of a father.

Whatever, I'm done here because nothing and no one will change so I'm wasting my breath. Go ahead and call me names or whatever...I won't respond to the nonsense and waste my time on it. I prefer to spend my time where there isn't group denial, coverup and enabling like there has been here in so many ways. I'll be spending my time somewhere where people actually care about themselves and truly do care about each other. Somewhere where some actual good can come out of trying to help someone help themselves. Somewhere where folks can recognize true care and a helping hand when they see it! Adios!

Thats right folks , any time blueskies opens here mouth not only will she provide proof that she is a hypocrite, she also provides an example for websters dictionary when they are trying to clarify the definition for the word Idiot.

[fredinator]

... Perfect example- Red13JoePa. Is there a nicer guy on here than he? Yeah, he ia a touch gay for his Augeri man love and his forgiveness of tapegate, but we need to get his ilk back on here and fight off the BT maggots who have come here...

You have such a gift of throwing in a big chuckle in the middle of either a passionately angry or sad post... I felt such a pall while reading your comments and then got to "a touch gay for his Augeri man love" LOL... I miss HOTS, too. Even that crazy FyreWyngz... Such entertainment, sigh.

[whirlwind]

State of grace is defined as the state of being in God's grace in Christian theology.
Its no surprise to me that someone feeling their faith in the spirit would repeat the expression.
I have no idea if JC is a Christian or not but regardless of labels, anyone with belief in the spirit could describe it the same.
What is said in Eclipse is that belief in spirit is inclusive of all faiths, not exclusive for any one as it is belief in the same spirit by all.

In other words, to me, being in grace is walking in the light and love of spirit.
Spirit meaning God, Allah, Yahweh, Savior, Jehovah, Adonai, Elohim, etc. Regardless of the name affixed by man, they are all one in the same.

Not so fast Slingblade. You are lumping Allah in with God? Back away from the pipe and give it a rest. Too many bucket hits for your brain today.. Allah and God? Yeah I can see those two tooling around the golf course arguing over Allah's illegal drops and cheating, while God is breaking Tiger's records left and right. Allah has enough and drives the golf cart into the beer cart in a form of miniature terrorist. probably not Bsky.

Deano as always you have NO idea what you are talking about.

I am sorry, for you are correct. I am bankrupt all things Journey. Having NO idea regarding journey sounds about right. Carry on and again, I am Sorry.

Hey Dean!
You crack me up. Back when you first started posting here, you didn't know shit for shinola about Journey or the guys in the band. You were just being brainwashed about Perry's so called distruction of the band and didn't know that Schon had the habit of saying "I Do" and not meaning it. You took it on as a pet project and and learned as you went but you do not have a history of being a long time Journey fan. You would have known that Lula was not Lulu when you nailed her about her reverance for Cain, big Journey fan that she always was. Comparing to most posters here, you don't go that far back so leave the Backtalk folks alone as they are all true Journey fans and you are but a clingon.

[S2M]